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Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 09:55 - Jul 13 by dickie
Odd that this is resurfacing now, she posted this months ago I believe. She's bang on though!
All Muslims are collectively responsible for the actions of Islamic terrorists, and Muslims should condemn atrocities carried out by those groups and this should be shouted from every mosque in the world.
Anyone who thinks the above statement is Islamophobic but agrees with what Miriam Margoyles has said is probably an anti semite.
The only part of her statement that one could agree with is that “what the state of Israel is currently doing in Gaza is wrong and evil and it’s not antisemitic to say so”.Then again, nobody ever said it was.
Edit. You are correct about the timing of this link. After a period of relative harmony on the board I believe this was started to get a reaction. There is a long running thread on the situation in Gaza which would have been the appropriate place to link these comments which were made some time ago.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 10:11 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue
All Muslims are collectively responsible for the actions of Islamic terrorists, and Muslims should condemn atrocities carried out by those groups and this should be shouted from every mosque in the world.
Anyone who thinks the above statement is Islamophobic but agrees with what Miriam Margoyles has said is probably an anti semite.
The only part of her statement that one could agree with is that “what the state of Israel is currently doing in Gaza is wrong and evil and it’s not antisemitic to say so”.Then again, nobody ever said it was.
Edit. You are correct about the timing of this link. After a period of relative harmony on the board I believe this was started to get a reaction. There is a long running thread on the situation in Gaza which would have been the appropriate place to link these comments which were made some time ago.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 10:19]
I watched 50 seconds before turning it off. Complete and utter rubbish.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 10:11 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue
All Muslims are collectively responsible for the actions of Islamic terrorists, and Muslims should condemn atrocities carried out by those groups and this should be shouted from every mosque in the world.
Anyone who thinks the above statement is Islamophobic but agrees with what Miriam Margoyles has said is probably an anti semite.
The only part of her statement that one could agree with is that “what the state of Israel is currently doing in Gaza is wrong and evil and it’s not antisemitic to say so”.Then again, nobody ever said it was.
Edit. You are correct about the timing of this link. After a period of relative harmony on the board I believe this was started to get a reaction. There is a long running thread on the situation in Gaza which would have been the appropriate place to link these comments which were made some time ago.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 10:19]
She also makes the assumption that the vast majority of Jews outside Israel don't already abhor & oppose Israel's actions.
No amount of speaking out by those outside Israel is going to change Netanyahu's mmindset anyway, he doesn't even take any notice of protests within the country.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 10:11 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue
All Muslims are collectively responsible for the actions of Islamic terrorists, and Muslims should condemn atrocities carried out by those groups and this should be shouted from every mosque in the world.
Anyone who thinks the above statement is Islamophobic but agrees with what Miriam Margoyles has said is probably an anti semite.
The only part of her statement that one could agree with is that “what the state of Israel is currently doing in Gaza is wrong and evil and it’s not antisemitic to say so”.Then again, nobody ever said it was.
Edit. You are correct about the timing of this link. After a period of relative harmony on the board I believe this was started to get a reaction. There is a long running thread on the situation in Gaza which would have been the appropriate place to link these comments which were made some time ago.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 10:19]
It’s a video of a Jew addressing fellow Jews. It’s not really for gentiles to agree or disagree with.
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Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 12:00 - Jul 13 with 4534 views
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 11:38 - Jul 13 by Ryorry
She also makes the assumption that the vast majority of Jews outside Israel don't already abhor & oppose Israel's actions.
No amount of speaking out by those outside Israel is going to change Netanyahu's mmindset anyway, he doesn't even take any notice of protests within the country.
For those up arrowing the op, this is how holding Jews collectively responsible for the actions of Israel ends up*.
*These are just a selection of antisemitic incidents relating to the ongoing conflict in Gaza from the pst few weeks that I would normally post on the ONLY TWTD antisemitism running thread. I'd rather be posting about our latest signings but hey ho.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 12:02 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue
For those up arrowing the op, this is how holding Jews collectively responsible for the actions of Israel ends up*.
*These are just a selection of antisemitic incidents relating to the ongoing conflict in Gaza from the pst few weeks that I would normally post on the ONLY TWTD antisemitism running thread. I'd rather be posting about our latest signings but hey ho.
Have they tried just not feeling like they are under threat?
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 10:11 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue
All Muslims are collectively responsible for the actions of Islamic terrorists, and Muslims should condemn atrocities carried out by those groups and this should be shouted from every mosque in the world.
Anyone who thinks the above statement is Islamophobic but agrees with what Miriam Margoyles has said is probably an anti semite.
The only part of her statement that one could agree with is that “what the state of Israel is currently doing in Gaza is wrong and evil and it’s not antisemitic to say so”.Then again, nobody ever said it was.
Edit. You are correct about the timing of this link. After a period of relative harmony on the board I believe this was started to get a reaction. There is a long running thread on the situation in Gaza which would have been the appropriate place to link these comments which were made some time ago.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 10:19]
This was posted because I saw it this morning, watched it and thought that it provided a sensible comment on the situation from a respected person.
I don’t think it’s islamophobic at all and merely posted it as I hadn’t seen it before.
4 downvotes so far, I wonder which bits of her comments those people disagree with?
All forms of racism are wrong
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 12:41]
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Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 12:56 - Jul 13 with 4191 views
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 12:39 - Jul 13 by BLUEGOLD
This was posted because I saw it this morning, watched it and thought that it provided a sensible comment on the situation from a respected person.
I don’t think it’s islamophobic at all and merely posted it as I hadn’t seen it before.
4 downvotes so far, I wonder which bits of her comments those people disagree with?
All forms of racism are wrong
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 12:41]
Which bits of her comments do I object to? Where to start? As I’m on my phone, just with the pretty basic one that hitler hasn’t changed me from being a “compassionate and caring” person into a monster.
Edit: If you don’t get it, it’s her use of “us” - all Jews all over the world, as if we’re no different from members of the monstrous Israeli government.
She’s also been rather insulting in her seeming assumption that millions of Jewish people haven’t already spoken out and protested against Israel’s policies and atrocities.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 12:00 - Jul 13 by Blueschev
It’s a video of a Jew addressing fellow Jews. It’s not really for gentiles to agree or disagree with.
But not all citizens of Israel are Jews (and not all citizens of the Occupied Territories of Palestine are Muslim, for that matter.) She calls on people to appeal to their communities, as well as their rabbis, eventually the interweaving of communities crosses national borders (especially in these times of ever widening diasporas) and affects us all. She is quite right in saying that the events of seventh of October last year should never have happened and that no hostages should still be held. Also quite right in saying that a military response at the scale perpetrated by the Israeli Defence Force should never have happened with its unforgivable death toll amongst civilians, especially those too young to determine their own place and position in such a deeply fractured society.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 12:39 - Jul 13 by BLUEGOLD
This was posted because I saw it this morning, watched it and thought that it provided a sensible comment on the situation from a respected person.
I don’t think it’s islamophobic at all and merely posted it as I hadn’t seen it before.
4 downvotes so far, I wonder which bits of her comments those people disagree with?
All forms of racism are wrong
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 12:41]
Seems absolutely fine to me. The atrocities should be condemned and the only way they’ll stop the killing is through a ceasefire. I’m not sure why anyone would be against either of those points. Doesn’t matter whether Jewish or Muslim, or any other group. Decent people who value life should speak out against what’s happening in Gaza (all of it).
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 13:49 - Jul 13 by Swansea_Blue
Seems absolutely fine to me. The atrocities should be condemned and the only way they’ll stop the killing is through a ceasefire. I’m not sure why anyone would be against either of those points. Doesn’t matter whether Jewish or Muslim, or any other group. Decent people who value life should speak out against what’s happening in Gaza (all of it).
I think it's because she speaks as if all Jewish people are complicit in the actions of the Israeli government and army. Which is nonsense at best
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Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:02 - Jul 13 with 3899 views
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 13:49 - Jul 13 by Swansea_Blue
Seems absolutely fine to me. The atrocities should be condemned and the only way they’ll stop the killing is through a ceasefire. I’m not sure why anyone would be against either of those points. Doesn’t matter whether Jewish or Muslim, or any other group. Decent people who value life should speak out against what’s happening in Gaza (all of it).
“Seems absolutely fine to me”. I think some replies here indicate that maybe you and others haven’t listened to the clip really carefully the whole way through (apols in advance if that’s incorrect) - as tbh, neither had I the first time I heard it when it first came out months ago.
It’s easy to be swept away by her emotional pleas, which of course are very well-intentioned, but reading GB’s transposition of it to a Muslim equivalence made me think about and listen to it again a lot more carefully; had to agree with his conclusion that she’s conflated being Jewish with Israel’s ghastly behaviour.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 13:54 - Jul 13 by reusersfreekicks
I think it's because she speaks as if all Jewish people are complicit in the actions of the Israeli government and army. Which is nonsense at best
But the wider Jewish diasporas (some of whom may aspire to become Israeli citizens although I suspect that many now do not) are affected by how Israel acts. So they have a right to voice their opinions about the actions of the Israeli government and the Israeli defence force. Elsewhere in this thread Saudi Arabia has been brought up as the equivalence of Israel in a Muslim comparison but this is not appropriate in my view, for a start although Israel is a flawed democracy it is a democracy, but more importantly it is the only Jewish majority population state whereas Saudi Arabia is one of many (and it appears as if it picked out to make an example of all Muslim nations when it should be treated as a limit case.)
I think it is wrong and antisemitic to hold Jewish people responsible for the actions of the state of Israel, just as it is wrong and Islamophobic to hold Muslim people responsible for the actions of Islamic State, but it is not wrong for Jewish people to hold or express views in relation to the state of Israel.
I speak as someone who knows well both a Jewish person whose views on Israel accord with Miriam Margoyles and a Jewish person supportive of Israel.
I would not condemn either view because to do so would seem to me to be straying into antisemitism.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 15:56]
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Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:30 - Jul 13 with 3699 views
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:22 - Jul 13 by WeWereZombies
But the wider Jewish diasporas (some of whom may aspire to become Israeli citizens although I suspect that many now do not) are affected by how Israel acts. So they have a right to voice their opinions about the actions of the Israeli government and the Israeli defence force. Elsewhere in this thread Saudi Arabia has been brought up as the equivalence of Israel in a Muslim comparison but this is not appropriate in my view, for a start although Israel is a flawed democracy it is a democracy, but more importantly it is the only Jewish majority population state whereas Saudi Arabia is one of many (and it appears as if it picked out to make an example of all Muslim nations when it should be treated as a limit case.)
If all she had done was give an unfavourable opinion of the Israeli government there would be no debate.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:30 - Jul 13 by J2BLUE
If all she had done was give an unfavourable opinion of the Israeli government there would be no debate.
And debate is needed to bring out the arguments and nuances in this thorny problem. But even more than debate it is action that is needed to bring a halt to the genocide and to see the hostages released. And that is what Margolyes is calling for.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 10:11 - Jul 13 by GlasgowBlue
All Muslims are collectively responsible for the actions of Islamic terrorists, and Muslims should condemn atrocities carried out by those groups and this should be shouted from every mosque in the world.
Anyone who thinks the above statement is Islamophobic but agrees with what Miriam Margoyles has said is probably an anti semite.
The only part of her statement that one could agree with is that “what the state of Israel is currently doing in Gaza is wrong and evil and it’s not antisemitic to say so”.Then again, nobody ever said it was.
Edit. You are correct about the timing of this link. After a period of relative harmony on the board I believe this was started to get a reaction. There is a long running thread on the situation in Gaza which would have been the appropriate place to link these comments which were made some time ago.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2024 10:19]
Yeah tbf there is no way that those of the Jewish faith around the World have any sense of emotional connection to Israel and might therefore feel any sense of wanting to express their outrage at what that country's government and military are doing. And there is also no way that the notion of a dual loyalty trope has been created specifically to prevent people from suggesting there is any reason they should. Shame on Margoyles.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:35 - Jul 13 by WeWereZombies
And debate is needed to bring out the arguments and nuances in this thorny problem. But even more than debate it is action that is needed to bring a halt to the genocide and to see the hostages released. And that is what Margolyes is calling for.
Your first post cherry picked evidence and your second ignored the point.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:40 - Jul 13 by J2BLUE
Your first post cherry picked evidence and your second ignored the point.
Cherry picking around a thorny problem, very good...however, you have made a category error here. My post had no evidence in it, it was all reasoning. But to the point reasoning. Please go back and read it again.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:43 - Jul 13 by WeWereZombies
Cherry picking around a thorny problem, very good...however, you have made a category error here. My post had no evidence in it, it was all reasoning. But to the point reasoning. Please go back and read it again.
So you replied to a post about what she said without watching it?
No one is disagreeing with criticism of Israel. If that is all she did she would be getting more support. Her words are going to do nothing but make things worse for Jews in this country. She's just made herself a useful idiot for the more extreme pro Palestine element.
Miriam Margolyes telling it like it is on 14:51 - Jul 13 by J2BLUE
So you replied to a post about what she said without watching it?
No one is disagreeing with criticism of Israel. If that is all she did she would be getting more support. Her words are going to do nothing but make things worse for Jews in this country. She's just made herself a useful idiot for the more extreme pro Palestine element.
Of course I watched the video (and the one that was posted of her interview with David Baddiel) and I then formed an opinion of whether she was justified in calling on Jews around the World to denounce the unbalanced response. When I read your post that suggested that she went too far in doing that I was moved to defend the first video and explain why. I think she made very persuasive arguments in the Channel Four one too.
You do not agree with me and that is your prerogative.
Unfortunately you are wrong in the conclusions you have so far taken in this matter though.
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