| more Tory corruption 12:18 - Nov 18 with 2898 views | HARRY10 |
"The mismanagement, the incompetence, the reckless waste — all of this is shocking. But worse, perhaps, is the brazen cronyism involved.
The National Audit Office report on Personal Protective Equipment procurement is a searing indictment of this Government's incompetence."
A truly shocking state of affairs where even if it can be said to be incompetence rather than corruption, those involved need to be held to account.
However, anyone reading the link (below) will see that incompetence may have occurred, but the overall appearance of 'snouts i the trough' is what stands out.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8961343/Fury-18bn-PPE-scandal.html#comm [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 12:20]
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| more Tiry corruption on 12:23 - Nov 18 with 2412 views | You_Bloo_Right |
And if even a rag like the Mail is catching on then one would like to think that there will be a reckoning either soon or in 4 years time.
I doubt it though. |  |
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| more Tiry corruption on 12:34 - Nov 18 with 2385 views | HARRY10 |
| more Tiry corruption on 12:23 - Nov 18 by You_Bloo_Right |
And if even a rag like the Mail is catching on then one would like to think that there will be a reckoning either soon or in 4 years time.
I doubt it though. |
Any reckoning will be in part due to voters being made aware of this scandal,
Which means folk need to get this out there, as the Mail won't be the read of those needing to see this
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8961343/Fury-18bn-PPE-scandal.html#comm
forward the link [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 12:52]
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| more Tory corruption on 13:17 - Nov 18 with 2314 views | Plums |
That’s quite a piece of work! |  |
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| more Tory corruption on 13:22 - Nov 18 with 2311 views | catch74 |
Is it just me or is no one on here trying to defend the government any longer?
GB has returned and is always considered and intelligent in his responses, but even he is not defending the indefensible.
It is very left bumfest on here but we really are being left alone, very noticeable. |  |
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| more Tory corruption on 13:33 - Nov 18 with 2302 views | HARRY10 |
| more Tory corruption on 13:22 - Nov 18 by catch74 |
Is it just me or is no one on here trying to defend the government any longer?
GB has returned and is always considered and intelligent in his responses, but even he is not defending the indefensible.
It is very left bumfest on here but we really are being left alone, very noticeable. |
I don't think that you have to be 'left' to recognise the staggering levels of incompetence and mismanagement of this government.
There is no oven ready deal, as there never was.
No money for kids food. but £12 billion to be divvied out among Johnson's cronies.
Test and trace failure, school exams failure, shortage of medical staff and equipment, wrongly timed lockdowns.....
And as said above, when the Mail is ripping into them, you know just how low things have sunk | | | |
| more Tory corruption on 13:37 - Nov 18 with 2300 views | BlueBadger |
| more Tory corruption on 13:22 - Nov 18 by catch74 |
Is it just me or is no one on here trying to defend the government any longer?
GB has returned and is always considered and intelligent in his responses, but even he is not defending the indefensible.
It is very left bumfest on here but we really are being left alone, very noticeable. |
Most of their more vocal defenders have been banned for various breaches of T&C's now, I think. |  |
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| more Tory corruption on 13:47 - Nov 18 with 2277 views | MonkeyAlan |
Boris is a good egg really. |  | | |
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| more Tory corruption on 14:06 - Nov 18 with 2252 views | factual_blue |
| more Tory corruption on 13:22 - Nov 18 by catch74 |
Is it just me or is no one on here trying to defend the government any longer?
GB has returned and is always considered and intelligent in his responses, but even he is not defending the indefensible.
It is very left bumfest on here but we really are being left alone, very noticeable. |
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| more Tory corruption on 14:10 - Nov 18 with 2244 views | Beckets |
| more Tory corruption on 13:22 - Nov 18 by catch74 |
Is it just me or is no one on here trying to defend the government any longer?
GB has returned and is always considered and intelligent in his responses, but even he is not defending the indefensible.
It is very left bumfest on here but we really are being left alone, very noticeable. |
It's a centrist bumfest according to some. |  | | |
| more Tiry corruption on 14:12 - Nov 18 with 2244 views | factual_blue |
| more Tiry corruption on 12:23 - Nov 18 by You_Bloo_Right |
And if even a rag like the Mail is catching on then one would like to think that there will be a reckoning either soon or in 4 years time.
I doubt it though. |
What's different is the mail's usual headline would be that Civil Servants had wasted all this money. Now they're saying - correctly - it's the government.
The mail has for a long time gone after CIvil Servants, even to the extent of tailing a coach taking some on a sports & social outing club to see where they went 'at the taxpayer's expense'. Except of course, these social clubs are paid for and run by employees. | |
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| more Tiry corruption on 16:37 - Nov 18 with 2197 views | You_Bloo_Right |
| more Tiry corruption on 14:12 - Nov 18 by factual_blue |
What's different is the mail's usual headline would be that Civil Servants had wasted all this money. Now they're saying - correctly - it's the government.
The mail has for a long time gone after CIvil Servants, even to the extent of tailing a coach taking some on a sports & social outing club to see where they went 'at the taxpayer's expense'. Except of course, these social clubs are paid for and run by employees. |
You mean those Civil Servants who may have provided the checks and balances the Mail says were missing from the process? | |
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| more Tory corruption on 16:46 - Nov 18 with 2184 views | Swansea_Blue |
Truly excellent - I saw you posted it the other day but I was on my phone, so not the best format. Bit on the compooter, it's quite something. |  |
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| more Tory corruption on 17:00 - Nov 18 with 2163 views | Swansea_Blue |
| more Tory corruption on 13:22 - Nov 18 by catch74 |
Is it just me or is no one on here trying to defend the government any longer?
GB has returned and is always considered and intelligent in his responses, but even he is not defending the indefensible.
It is very left bumfest on here but we really are being left alone, very noticeable. |
I think part of the issue is that most of the tribalism and vocal support was around Brexit, and people aren't that interested in the other political stuff.
It is very lefty bumfest on here, you're right. Which based on current standards means mostly to the left of Mussolini! | |
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| more Tiry corruption on 17:02 - Nov 18 with 2159 views | factual_blue |
| more Tiry corruption on 16:37 - Nov 18 by You_Bloo_Right |
You mean those Civil Servants who may have provided the checks and balances the Mail says were missing from the process? |
Indeed. See also the EU procurement process that we no longer have to follow. | |
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| more Tory corruption on 17:11 - Nov 18 with 2152 views | factual_blue |
| more Tory corruption on 13:37 - Nov 18 by BlueBadger |
Most of their more vocal defenders have been banned for various breaches of T&C's now, I think. |
Quite. 'Offering outside', as the young people say, to somebody with a life-threatening condition is neither big, nor clever, nor edifying. | |
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| more Tiry corruption on 17:52 - Nov 18 with 2114 views | Swansea_Blue |
| more Tiry corruption on 17:02 - Nov 18 by factual_blue |
Indeed. See also the EU procurement process that we no longer have to follow. |
Pah, transparent procurement processes that result in fit for purpose goods are soooooo 2019 darling! | |
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| more Tory corruption on 18:31 - Nov 18 with 2090 views | BlueForYou |
Under the extreme circumstances at the time, with everybody crying & pleading for the basic PPE material, do you really honestly think that a Labour Government would have done any better or any differently? Too many people are too quick & happy to pile in & criticise when they could not have done any better. I'm not not a raging Tory, but a very centre common sense guy. End of the day if you need something immediate & quickly there is little alternative but to use a "fixer" & that always involves a hefty fee. [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 18:34]
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| Good luck (n/t) on 18:38 - Nov 18 with 2063 views | Bloots |
| more Tory corruption on 18:31 - Nov 18 by BlueForYou |
Under the extreme circumstances at the time, with everybody crying & pleading for the basic PPE material, do you really honestly think that a Labour Government would have done any better or any differently? Too many people are too quick & happy to pile in & criticise when they could not have done any better. I'm not not a raging Tory, but a very centre common sense guy. End of the day if you need something immediate & quickly there is little alternative but to use a "fixer" & that always involves a hefty fee. [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 18:34]
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| TWTD Leadership Group/Elite Level Supporter/Anti-Bullying Crusader |
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| more Tory corruption on 18:43 - Nov 18 with 2058 views | You_Bloo_Right |
| more Tory corruption on 18:31 - Nov 18 by BlueForYou |
Under the extreme circumstances at the time, with everybody crying & pleading for the basic PPE material, do you really honestly think that a Labour Government would have done any better or any differently? Too many people are too quick & happy to pile in & criticise when they could not have done any better. I'm not not a raging Tory, but a very centre common sense guy. End of the day if you need something immediate & quickly there is little alternative but to use a "fixer" & that always involves a hefty fee. [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 18:34]
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Is it also a prerequisite that many of the "fixers" are donors to the Tory party and/or related to Conservative MPs or their unelected special advisors?
I think I could have done better, yes. For a start I would not have thought to offer a multi-million pound contract for the provision of PPE to a pest control company or a group of independent financial advisers. | |
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| more Tory corruption on 18:53 - Nov 18 with 2030 views | catch74 |
| more Tory corruption on 18:43 - Nov 18 by You_Bloo_Right |
Is it also a prerequisite that many of the "fixers" are donors to the Tory party and/or related to Conservative MPs or their unelected special advisors?
I think I could have done better, yes. For a start I would not have thought to offer a multi-million pound contract for the provision of PPE to a pest control company or a group of independent financial advisers. |
Watching Dispatches - feeling angrier. | |
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| more Tory corruption on 19:00 - Nov 18 with 2025 views | Swansea_Blue |
| more Tory corruption on 18:31 - Nov 18 by BlueForYou |
Under the extreme circumstances at the time, with everybody crying & pleading for the basic PPE material, do you really honestly think that a Labour Government would have done any better or any differently? Too many people are too quick & happy to pile in & criticise when they could not have done any better. I'm not not a raging Tory, but a very centre common sense guy. End of the day if you need something immediate & quickly there is little alternative but to use a "fixer" & that always involves a hefty fee. [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 18:34]
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Given a lot of countries with more socialist governments have done better than us, then obviously it's a possibility they could have. But this isn't about left v right. It's about a government with disruption at the core of everything they do. That was Cummings' modus operandi. What it means is that they've either not involved or they've sacked/disbanded the people and groups who needed to be involved. Just take the procurement point - we could have been in a transparent EU-wide procurement scheme, but our government refused because Britain knows best. Or not as it turned out. Or we could have used our regional health board structure, but they outsourced centrally.
Any 'normal' government with some respect for the rule of law, the civil service and for employing and engaging with people with a modicum of talent would have fared better. Be that Labour, traditional Tory, Lib Dem, Green, you name it. Very few governments have fared worse, and they all have more extreme versions of the populist, free libertarian, authoritarian version we have. Spain's the only obvious exception which is under a Coalition, but they also have self-governing regions which complicates the national response (again, the worst hit area in Spain, Madrid, is under a populist conservative regional government). There's a trend emerging.
PS. And I don't think it's healthy to make it tribal. We need an honest appraisal of performance irrespective of whichever political tribe people support. As soon as people are prepared to defend this lot just because it's 'their side' it becomes much harder to make things better for all of us. Which is what we all want at the end of the day. The 'lefties' want Covid to go away just as much as the 'righties', just for different reasons. But we all want to see the back of it. That needs competent government. [Post edited 18 Nov 2020 19:10]
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| more Tory corruption on 19:04 - Nov 18 with 2019 views | Swansea_Blue |
| more Tory corruption on 18:53 - Nov 18 by catch74 |
Watching Dispatches - feeling angrier. |
Bent as a butchers hook and wasting public money left right and centre. Their campaign attack on the Labour party over finances (magic money tree and all that guff) turned out to be just a projection of their own failures. Which is a pretty standard strategy for this lot. | |
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| more Tory corruption on 19:06 - Nov 18 with 2015 views | BlueForYou |
| more Tory corruption on 18:43 - Nov 18 by You_Bloo_Right |
Is it also a prerequisite that many of the "fixers" are donors to the Tory party and/or related to Conservative MPs or their unelected special advisors?
I think I could have done better, yes. For a start I would not have thought to offer a multi-million pound contract for the provision of PPE to a pest control company or a group of independent financial advisers. |
I think you could fairly argue that we could & should have done more to somehow forsee events, but in the grip of a panic its very difficult not to approach known & "trusted" fixers who are offering solid guarantee of actually producing the goods with potentially millions of lives at stake. No-one knew how it would be. An awful lot of hindsight managers around! | | | |
| more Tory corruption on 19:14 - Nov 18 with 2000 views | catch74 |
| more Tory corruption on 19:06 - Nov 18 by BlueForYou |
I think you could fairly argue that we could & should have done more to somehow forsee events, but in the grip of a panic its very difficult not to approach known & "trusted" fixers who are offering solid guarantee of actually producing the goods with potentially millions of lives at stake. No-one knew how it would be. An awful lot of hindsight managers around! |
‘Captain hindsight’ was used by Johnson again today, I recommend you don’t use him as a role model.
No one on here knew at the time a fixer was being paid £21m, we’re finding out now.
The problem is there was £74m pounds of unusable PPE - I hope none of the trusted fixers were used to source that. | |
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