| Theresa defeated.... 19:30 - Dec 13 with 40322 views | ElderGrizzly |
Whoops :)
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/13/tory-brexit-rebels-inflict-majo
Theresa May has lost a Brexit vote in the Commons for the first time.
MPs voted to back the Dominic Grieve amendment by 309 votes to 305 - a majority of four.
The amendment will curb some of the powers the government is giving itself in the EU withdrawal bill. Specifically, it means that although clause 9 of the bill gives ministers powers to implement the Brexit withdrawal agreement by order, the amendment that has been passed means says they can only exercise these powers “subject to the prior enactment of a statute by parliament approving the final terms of withdrawal of the United Kingdom from the European Union.”
Opposition MPs also claim the amendment gives parliament a “meaningful vote” on the withdrawal agreement. This is contested because ministers say parliament is already going to get a meaningful vote. But what it will mean is that ministers will not be able to use the powers in clause 9 to implement the EU withdrawal bill by order until the Commons has passed the bill allowing this. See
Around a dozen Tory MPs rebelled, according to Labour. [Post edited 13 Dec 2017 19:33]
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:35 - Dec 13 with 8849 views | Herbivore |
Let's just call the whole thing off. That way government can get on with the important business of, you know, governing the country. |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:39 - Dec 13 with 8821 views | StokieBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:35 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Let's just call the whole thing off. That way government can get on with the important business of, you know, governing the country. |
Too late though, won't be getting our rebate back or keeping the pound now article 50 has been triggered.
Nothing in it for the Europeans to give us those concessions again really.
SB |  |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:41 - Dec 13 with 8818 views | Herbivore |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:39 - Dec 13 by StokieBlue |
Too late though, won't be getting our rebate back or keeping the pound now article 50 has been triggered.
Nothing in it for the Europeans to give us those concessions again really.
SB |
Well we've managed to bring the pound down sufficiently that it's worth nearly the same as the Euro, can't think of a better time to go all in. | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:41 - Dec 13 with 8821 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:35 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Let's just call the whole thing off. That way government can get on with the important business of, you know, governing the country. |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:46 - Dec 13 with 8786 views | StokieBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:41 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Well we've managed to bring the pound down sufficiently that it's worth nearly the same as the Euro, can't think of a better time to go all in. |
It's a little more complex than just having an equivalent value though (as I am very sure you know).
Being able to control one's currency allows far more monetary and economic freedom. Look at the cases of default where debt is issued in a currency which the country doesn't control.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:53 - Dec 13 with 8760 views | factual_blue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:35 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Let's just call the whole thing off. That way government can get on with the important business of, you know, governing the country. |
Are you from the EU-run Rand Corporation? |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 19:56 - Dec 13 with 8760 views | clive_baker |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:35 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Let's just call the whole thing off. That way government can get on with the important business of, you know, governing the country. |
I’m inclined to think this is a sizeable step towards that very eventuality. Brexit ain’t happening folks. |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 21:03 - Dec 13 with 8631 views | StNeotsBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:53 - Dec 13 by factual_blue |
Are you from the EU-run Rand Corporation? |
I always thought the Rand Corporation was a made up thing in the Marvel Universe. Does this mean Iron Fist is real?!?! |  | | |
| Theresa defeated.... on 21:14 - Dec 13 with 8603 views | J2BLUE |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:35 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Let's just call the whole thing off. That way government can get on with the important business of, you know, governing the country. |
Let's just call the whole thing off.
I'm intrigued. How would that work? What consequences do you see coming of such a move? |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 21:24 - Dec 13 with 8554 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 21:03 - Dec 13 by StNeotsBlue |
I always thought the Rand Corporation was a made up thing in the Marvel Universe. Does this mean Iron Fist is real?!?! |
Yes. And the EU is a front for the Hand. |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 21:28 - Dec 13 with 8557 views | StNeotsBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 21:24 - Dec 13 by GlasgowBlue |
Yes. And the EU is a front for the Hand. |
Sh1tbags. Bit worried now. | | | |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:18 - Dec 13 with 8467 views | Herbivore |
| Theresa defeated.... on 21:14 - Dec 13 by J2BLUE |
Let's just call the whole thing off.
I'm intrigued. How would that work? What consequences do you see coming of such a move? |
The referendum was advisory only so they can call it off whenever they like. A few thick racists will be annoyed but that'll be about it. | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 22:24 - Dec 13 with 8443 views | StokieBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:18 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
The referendum was advisory only so they can call it off whenever they like. A few thick racists will be annoyed but that'll be about it. |
Only by going all in as you said earlier, something I wouldn't be totally happy with.
I wouldn't want to move to the EUR at the moment.
SB | |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 22:28 - Dec 13 with 8438 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:18 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
The referendum was advisory only so they can call it off whenever they like. A few thick racists will be annoyed but that'll be about it. |
Staggering.......your tendency to arrogance has reached new heights. |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 22:38 - Dec 13 with 8413 views | lloydy84 |
| Theresa defeated.... on 19:56 - Dec 13 by clive_baker |
I’m inclined to think this is a sizeable step towards that very eventuality. Brexit ain’t happening folks. |
Wrong. This is an irrelevance and cannot be implemented.
You'll see. |  | | |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:38 - Dec 13 with 8411 views | J2BLUE |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:18 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
The referendum was advisory only so they can call it off whenever they like. A few thick racists will be annoyed but that'll be about it. |
Interesting. | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 22:54 - Dec 13 with 8368 views | Herbivore |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:28 - Dec 13 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Staggering.......your tendency to arrogance has reached new heights. |
Too easy. | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 22:56 - Dec 13 with 8373 views | tractordownsouth |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:18 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
The referendum was advisory only so they can call it off whenever they like. A few thick racists will be annoyed but that'll be about it. |
Speaking as a Remainer, this is the kind of language that won the referendum for leave in the first place. Throwing insults isn't the way to persuade people of your arguement. A prime example of this was Clinton's 'basket of deplorables' comment in the US, where the left/centre threw away almost certain victory by stereotyping voters. Sure there are a few thick people and a few racists , but nobody has ever been persuaded by being belittled. Taking the moral high ground is always a recipe for electoral disaster.. |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 22:59 - Dec 13 with 8365 views | factual_blue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:38 - Dec 13 by J2BLUE |
Interesting. |
He is absolutely right. The referendum was indeed just advisory. There is no provision in UK law for anything other than an advisory referendum.
The Article 50 process, according to Lord Kerr who helped draft the clause, is reversible and can be halted.
It would be worth doing just to watch people like farage or reeks-smug explode, hopefully literally. | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 23:02 - Dec 13 with 8349 views | Herbivore |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:56 - Dec 13 by tractordownsouth |
Speaking as a Remainer, this is the kind of language that won the referendum for leave in the first place. Throwing insults isn't the way to persuade people of your arguement. A prime example of this was Clinton's 'basket of deplorables' comment in the US, where the left/centre threw away almost certain victory by stereotyping voters. Sure there are a few thick people and a few racists , but nobody has ever been persuaded by being belittled. Taking the moral high ground is always a recipe for electoral disaster.. |
My comment was tongue in cheek. However, I don't buy the notion that the referendum result can realistically be pinned on people on one side calling the others thick. How many people do you think actually based their vote on that? | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 23:37 - Dec 13 with 8300 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:54 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
Too easy. |
Is this an excuse you would have accepted from Benters ? | |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 00:50 - Dec 14 with 8256 views | Ryorry |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:59 - Dec 13 by factual_blue |
He is absolutely right. The referendum was indeed just advisory. There is no provision in UK law for anything other than an advisory referendum.
The Article 50 process, according to Lord Kerr who helped draft the clause, is reversible and can be halted.
It would be worth doing just to watch people like farage or reeks-smug explode, hopefully literally. |
Up-voted for "reeks-smug"! if nothing else (tho the facts were interesting too, assuming they're orrect). |  |
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| Theresa defeated.... on 05:03 - Dec 14 with 8179 views | powinswitch |
| Theresa defeated.... on 22:18 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
The referendum was advisory only so they can call it off whenever they like. A few thick racists will be annoyed but that'll be about it. |
The majority of people who voted opted to leave the EU. That was 17.4 million voters. The majority were not thick racists. Many more than ‘a few’ will be annoyed if they call it off.
The political satirist Johnathan Pie did an excellent piece after Trump won his election - I am sure you have seen it. It holds the left responsible for Clinton’s defeat because of the description of many in the electorate as thick racists or other pejoratives. Simply because they hold a different view. Real political debate has been subsumed by shouting (by all political parties, but it has been particularly mastered by the left leaning).
The left has such an important role to play to ensure that this once great country plays a pivotal role in ensuring tha5 the world is a better place going forward. But it has to listen - really listen. The spat between Gordon Brown and Gillian Duffy, a labour supporter, at the 2010 election was revelatory, and in my opinion proves my point.
The vast majority of the immigrants who have come to this countr6 have been and are awesome. How lucky are we to have had such hard working people come here and contribute. I think people worry because they wonder where it ends, and simply want somebody to be in a position to control numbers. For EU immigration that is not possible. Personally I also have a problem with how our welfare system has developed. That is a welfare system that my widowed mum benefitted from when I was at school in the 70s, so I am extremely grateful and have personal experience of its power.
We have particularly welcomed many immigrants in the last 15 years or so, and have record numbers in employment. But there is a great swathe of generally working class British born, of all colours, who have been left behind. Perhaps because the hard working immigrants are willing to do hard, difficult jobs for meagre pay, while the disaffected pick up their benefit. The benefits system, allied to the uncontrolled immigration has created a massive problem.
I don’t think you’re thick or a racist. But I do think you need to listen to other people’s views and not just think yours is the right one. Oh and McCarthy’s style of football is still awful. Marginally better than last year, but still awful. A lot of people share that view. Are we all thick and ignorant about football too? | | | |
| Theresa defeated.... on 07:45 - Dec 14 with 8094 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Theresa defeated.... on 23:02 - Dec 13 by Herbivore |
My comment was tongue in cheek. However, I don't buy the notion that the referendum result can realistically be pinned on people on one side calling the others thick. How many people do you think actually based their vote on that? |
Ah. The old “I was only trolling” get out.
That would work if it wasn’t for the fact that in the time you have posted here you have shown nothing but contempt for people who hold a view of the world that is different to your own.
I’m not quite sure what you have done in your life that allows you to have this smug, patronising and superior attitude?
Nobody voted leave or for a trump because a smug prat on the internet called them thick or racist. You are just a very small cog in wheel that has isolated people and driven them in that direction. Their attitudes were formed over a long period of time after trying to raise what they believed were genuine concerns over cheap labour or infrastructure at breaking point.
Rather than engage with these people and attempt to explain the positives of immigration and the contribution immigrants have made, people like you took the lazy option and branded them thick racists. Gordon Brown’s bigotgate is a perfect example. Benters on here is example closer to home. Far easier to call him a thick racist than attempt to debate with him and change his views.
When normal decent people are called racist, and their friends and neighbours are called racist then the word loses its meaning. So when real racists like a Trump or that awful woman from Britain First comes on the scene then people are anaesthetised. Bill and a Betty who they have known all their lives are called thick racists for voting UKIP so Trump, Tommy Robinson or the Britain First woman are no different.
So well done. We live in an age of your own creation. | |
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