| The irony of MM 19:44 - Jan 7 with 5395 views | WestSussexBlue |
The very open and honest communication from PL is so refreshing and his willingness to involve everyone from former players, fans and the fearless approach now with ME is just what our club has needed for a number of years.
This made me realise, for all the positive traits of MM he has left as much of a mess through being potentially a Yes man to Evans.
How many transfer windows was he happy to work with what he had?
How often was it a case of “ We won’t be held to ransom”
PL is showing he’s not taking this lying down and do you know what if he’s backed financially he could Well keep us up. |  | | |  |
| The irony of MM on 19:51 - Jan 7 with 4329 views | GluedtoBlue |
Except MM never had this situation to face. If PL had the summer here I doubt very much this would have come out.
It's making it clear that it's not him. He needs it to workout at town as much as we need it to. | |
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| The irony of MM on 19:51 - Jan 7 with 4331 views | LeagueOne |
Equally you cannot blame him for what happened towards the end.
It was a mad situation to dismiss him while having him still be manager here and the support grow more and more angry, we should have acted to bring a new man in then and have them build much earlier when we were safe to lose a few games and not allow an ex-Rotherham player to run a sledge hammer through the remains of the club, and thats after Evans had sent the likes of Smith, Didz, Hyam, Bru packing (all of which would walk into this team) and before Evans had saw the money coming first for Garner and Waghorn.
It's been an absolute cock up. |  |
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| The irony of MM on 19:53 - Jan 7 with 4316 views | Darth_Koont |
MM was building sustainably so no need.
Now we're having to throw the sustainable model out of the window to stay up. |  |
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| The irony of MM on 19:56 - Jan 7 with 4297 views | tractorboy7777 |
| The irony of MM on 19:53 - Jan 7 by Darth_Koont |
MM was building sustainably so no need.
Now we're having to throw the sustainable model out of the window to stay up. |
I’m not sure what MM was ever building in the last 18 months of his reign. Everything was falling apart | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:04 - Jan 7 with 4238 views | homer_123 |
| The irony of MM on 19:56 - Jan 7 by tractorboy7777 |
I’m not sure what MM was ever building in the last 18 months of his reign. Everything was falling apart |
Well, that's simply not true. |  |
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| The irony of MM on 20:07 - Jan 7 with 4229 views | WestSussexBlue |
| The irony of MM on 19:53 - Jan 7 by Darth_Koont |
MM was building sustainably so no need.
Now we're having to throw the sustainable model out of the window to stay up. |
I’m not convinced MM built anything other than a mediocre mid table team with the exception of one season. Don’t get me wrong, some of players that we’re brought here by MM we’re great for usand I had a lot of time for him, I just feel 5 years under a PL style approach towards Evans would produce a lot more than one flirt in the play offs. | | | |
| The irony of MM on 20:09 - Jan 7 with 4208 views | homer_123 |
| The irony of MM on 20:07 - Jan 7 by WestSussexBlue |
I’m not convinced MM built anything other than a mediocre mid table team with the exception of one season. Don’t get me wrong, some of players that we’re brought here by MM we’re great for usand I had a lot of time for him, I just feel 5 years under a PL style approach towards Evans would produce a lot more than one flirt in the play offs. |
Yep, a mediocre mid table team is spot on.
On top of that, all on a budget of a League 1 team, shocking really. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:10 - Jan 7 with 4209 views | BlueBadger |
The last time MM was open and honest a lot of divs started crying about how he was being nasty to 'the fans'... [Post edited 7 Jan 2019 23:49]
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| The irony of MM on 20:11 - Jan 7 with 4203 views | Superfrans |
| The irony of MM on 20:04 - Jan 7 by homer_123 |
Well, that's simply not true. |
I’m a big Mick fan and recognise that he was trying to live within his means, a budget laid down by Evans.
But... the strategy which Lambert says was madness (4/5 loans a season, changing 7/8 players every summer) was Mick’s strategy. Sure, he would say it was necessary because of the budgets he was working within, but why didn’t he flag to Evans the inevitable long-term dangers? And/or why didn’t he demand more money to spend?
I was a big fan of lots of the things that Mick brought to the club, but he massively failed us by not highlighting the risks in our strategy. |  |
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| The irony of MM on 20:14 - Jan 7 with 4186 views | homer_123 |
| The irony of MM on 20:11 - Jan 7 by Superfrans |
I’m a big Mick fan and recognise that he was trying to live within his means, a budget laid down by Evans.
But... the strategy which Lambert says was madness (4/5 loans a season, changing 7/8 players every summer) was Mick’s strategy. Sure, he would say it was necessary because of the budgets he was working within, but why didn’t he flag to Evans the inevitable long-term dangers? And/or why didn’t he demand more money to spend?
I was a big fan of lots of the things that Mick brought to the club, but he massively failed us by not highlighting the risks in our strategy. |
We don't know that he didn't flag these things though, do we?
Maybe PLs comments take things a step further than Mick did, I.e. Public. Which in fairness to Mick was only ever something he did in extreme cases.
I think PL is now seeing the absolute reality of how the club is run, as evidenced by the Jan transfer business to date. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:18 - Jan 7 with 4178 views | Superfrans |
| The irony of MM on 20:14 - Jan 7 by homer_123 |
We don't know that he didn't flag these things though, do we?
Maybe PLs comments take things a step further than Mick did, I.e. Public. Which in fairness to Mick was only ever something he did in extreme cases.
I think PL is now seeing the absolute reality of how the club is run, as evidenced by the Jan transfer business to date. |
If he did flag them, he clearly didn’t assert himself strongly enough if he thought they were important.
He was our most senior football man for five years. He had plenty of leverage with Evans and could have demanded changes be made, if he had wanted to.
Contrast this with Hurst, who walked through the door, threw the pre-season tour to Ireland out the window, made changes at the ground, refused to use Bowman’s list of transfer prospects and got to spend more in one summer than Mick ever did.
Not saying Mick was totally to blame, but he shouldn’t get off Scot free either. He did leave us in a right mess. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:23 - Jan 7 with 4152 views | LankHenners |
| The irony of MM on 20:18 - Jan 7 by Superfrans |
If he did flag them, he clearly didn’t assert himself strongly enough if he thought they were important.
He was our most senior football man for five years. He had plenty of leverage with Evans and could have demanded changes be made, if he had wanted to.
Contrast this with Hurst, who walked through the door, threw the pre-season tour to Ireland out the window, made changes at the ground, refused to use Bowman’s list of transfer prospects and got to spend more in one summer than Mick ever did.
Not saying Mick was totally to blame, but he shouldn’t get off Scot free either. He did leave us in a right mess. |
He didn't leave us "in a right mess". I can't be bothered to rehash what I said the other day but it wasn't some major operation that needed doing over the summer and if we had someone competent in (like Lambert) we wouldn't be anywhere near this position. |  |
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| The irony of MM on 20:24 - Jan 7 with 4135 views | homer_123 |
| The irony of MM on 20:18 - Jan 7 by Superfrans |
If he did flag them, he clearly didn’t assert himself strongly enough if he thought they were important.
He was our most senior football man for five years. He had plenty of leverage with Evans and could have demanded changes be made, if he had wanted to.
Contrast this with Hurst, who walked through the door, threw the pre-season tour to Ireland out the window, made changes at the ground, refused to use Bowman’s list of transfer prospects and got to spend more in one summer than Mick ever did.
Not saying Mick was totally to blame, but he shouldn’t get off Scot free either. He did leave us in a right mess. |
And look where Hurst left us?!
He spent more by selling assets, Evans made it clear that financially the Club would remain taking the same approach under any new manager after Mick.
Mick isn't blameless but he left a core squad of very decent quality.
As good a pair of keepers as any in this division.
Chambers, Webster, Knudsen, Skuse, Huws, Ward, Didz, Waghorn, Garners
Throw in Downes, Bish, Kenlock, Woolfenden, Emmanuelle, Dozzell etc. that's more than a half decent core of a squad. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:31 - Jan 7 with 4106 views | Superfrans |
| The irony of MM on 20:23 - Jan 7 by LankHenners |
He didn't leave us "in a right mess". I can't be bothered to rehash what I said the other day but it wasn't some major operation that needed doing over the summer and if we had someone competent in (like Lambert) we wouldn't be anywhere near this position. |
I can’t be bothered to rehash what I posted the other day either, but very quickly...
When Hurst came in, this was our squad. That’s 9 outfield players with any depth of experience, at all.
That’s because we allowed Bru, McGoldrick, Hyam to leave at the nd of their contracts and had patched up our squad with 5 loanees and an out of contract player (Carayol) - that’s 9 players who made 175 appearances for us last season. All gone. And that doesn’t include Tommy Smith who also left halfway through the season. It was a mess.
Gerken / Bart
Knudsen / Kenlock
Spence / Emmanuel
Chambers / Woolfenden
Webster / SIGNING
Skuse / Downes
Ward / Nydam
SIGNING / SIGNING
SIGNING / SIGNING
Waghorn / Morris
Garner / Sears
INJURED/RETURNING:
Dozzell
Bishop
Huws
Rowe
Adeyemi | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:35 - Jan 7 with 4084 views | Superfrans |
| The irony of MM on 20:24 - Jan 7 by homer_123 |
And look where Hurst left us?!
He spent more by selling assets, Evans made it clear that financially the Club would remain taking the same approach under any new manager after Mick.
Mick isn't blameless but he left a core squad of very decent quality.
As good a pair of keepers as any in this division.
Chambers, Webster, Knudsen, Skuse, Huws, Ward, Didz, Waghorn, Garners
Throw in Downes, Bish, Kenlock, Woolfenden, Emmanuelle, Dozzell etc. that's more than a half decent core of a squad. |
Hurst was with us 4 months,
Lambert believes making 7/8 changes every summer, including 5 loans, was madness.
Stop being defensive about Mick. I’m not saying he is solely responsible, but he played his part.
Think of it like this. When Hurst arrived in the June, he had 9 fit, experienced outfield players. That’s not even enough to run a meaningful practice match. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:39 - Jan 7 with 4057 views | gordon |
| The irony of MM on 20:24 - Jan 7 by homer_123 |
And look where Hurst left us?!
He spent more by selling assets, Evans made it clear that financially the Club would remain taking the same approach under any new manager after Mick.
Mick isn't blameless but he left a core squad of very decent quality.
As good a pair of keepers as any in this division.
Chambers, Webster, Knudsen, Skuse, Huws, Ward, Didz, Waghorn, Garners
Throw in Downes, Bish, Kenlock, Woolfenden, Emmanuelle, Dozzell etc. that's more than a half decent core of a squad. |
That's a slightly over-egged pudding!
Our goalkeepers really aren't that good, and nor is Grant Ward. For whatever reason Didz was already leaving, and Huws is only here because he has chronic knee cartilage problems and unfortunately isn't going to come close to fulfilling his potential.
I'm absolutely not defending Hurst who I thought was a complete idiot as well as an awful football manager, but we really weren't in great shape. Having said that, of course a competent manager ought to have been able to take what we had and kept us up for another year. |  | | |
| The irony of MM on 20:41 - Jan 7 with 4051 views | Darth_Koont |
| The irony of MM on 20:07 - Jan 7 by WestSussexBlue |
I’m not convinced MM built anything other than a mediocre mid table team with the exception of one season. Don’t get me wrong, some of players that we’re brought here by MM we’re great for usand I had a lot of time for him, I just feel 5 years under a PL style approach towards Evans would produce a lot more than one flirt in the play offs. |
Midtable with youngsters coming through and saleable assets.
The mediocre part was almost entirely down to having none of our talented midfielders including new summer signings available for almost the entire season. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:43 - Jan 7 with 4034 views | Superfrans |
| The irony of MM on 20:39 - Jan 7 by gordon |
That's a slightly over-egged pudding!
Our goalkeepers really aren't that good, and nor is Grant Ward. For whatever reason Didz was already leaving, and Huws is only here because he has chronic knee cartilage problems and unfortunately isn't going to come close to fulfilling his potential.
I'm absolutely not defending Hurst who I thought was a complete idiot as well as an awful football manager, but we really weren't in great shape. Having said that, of course a competent manager ought to have been able to take what we had and kept us up for another year. |
The only factor with Hurst was that (for all the obvious reasons) he joined us so late. He didn’t really get started until the second half of June - he got through the PO final, finished his holiday, went on an LMA course and then decided that he wasn’t interested in any of the transfer options Bowman had out together.
Clearly, it was not a very well thought through, or implemented, transition. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:47 - Jan 7 with 4008 views | homer_123 |
| The irony of MM on 20:35 - Jan 7 by Superfrans |
Hurst was with us 4 months,
Lambert believes making 7/8 changes every summer, including 5 loans, was madness.
Stop being defensive about Mick. I’m not saying he is solely responsible, but he played his part.
Think of it like this. When Hurst arrived in the June, he had 9 fit, experienced outfield players. That’s not even enough to run a meaningful practice match. |
Not defensive at all, made it clear he's not perfect and we needed a change, no doubt. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:54 - Jan 7 with 3988 views | itfcjoe |
| The irony of MM on 20:18 - Jan 7 by Superfrans |
If he did flag them, he clearly didn’t assert himself strongly enough if he thought they were important.
He was our most senior football man for five years. He had plenty of leverage with Evans and could have demanded changes be made, if he had wanted to.
Contrast this with Hurst, who walked through the door, threw the pre-season tour to Ireland out the window, made changes at the ground, refused to use Bowman’s list of transfer prospects and got to spend more in one summer than Mick ever did.
Not saying Mick was totally to blame, but he shouldn’t get off Scot free either. He did leave us in a right mess. |
I'm sorry but Mick did not leave us in a right mess. Yes the squad had some holes, but it did every year and he successfully filled them - as he would have done had he stayed. |  |
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| The irony of MM on 20:55 - Jan 7 with 3977 views | GluedtoBlue |
Anyone that thinks MM left us in a 'right mess' is just miles off the money. He inherited us in a mess and sorted us out.
It was time for him to move on but if he was here now we wouldn't be in the position we are. I'd say that's as close to a fact as an opinion can get.
Blame sits squarely with Evans. Not for his funding (I have little issue with that) or for appointing Hurst as I think most saw him as a decent appointment at the time but letting him tear us apart in one summer went against everything he spoke about in his little video interview. That's the reason a rebuild is needed. | |
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| The irony of MM on 20:57 - Jan 7 with 3964 views | PJH |
| The irony of MM on 20:54 - Jan 7 by itfcjoe |
I'm sorry but Mick did not leave us in a right mess. Yes the squad had some holes, but it did every year and he successfully filled them - as he would have done had he stayed. |
Yep, a reasonable squad that just needed a bit of adding to-then along came Hurst. |  | | |
| The irony of MM on 20:59 - Jan 7 with 3952 views | mrshallisfit |
| The irony of MM on 20:04 - Jan 7 by homer_123 |
Well, that's simply not true. |
Buying in Waghorn and Garner was a good step towards building a front line. | | | |
| The irony of M on 21:17 - Jan 7 with 3903 views | Superfrans |
| The irony of MM on 20:54 - Jan 7 by itfcjoe |
I'm sorry but Mick did not leave us in a right mess. Yes the squad had some holes, but it did every year and he successfully filled them - as he would have done had he stayed. |
“The squad had some holes”. Look at what was left when Hurst came in, Joe.
Nine fit, experienced outfield players.
I accept we / Hurst exacerbated the situation. And that it was a strategy we all got used to. But Lambert believes it was madness. | |
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| The irony of M on 21:21 - Jan 7 with 3887 views | itfcjoe |
| The irony of M on 21:17 - Jan 7 by Superfrans |
“The squad had some holes”. Look at what was left when Hurst came in, Joe.
Nine fit, experienced outfield players.
I accept we / Hurst exacerbated the situation. And that it was a strategy we all got used to. But Lambert believes it was madness. |
Lambert "thought" it was madness
Mick "actually dealt" with that issue every season and generally succeeded.
The madness was the profile of the recruitment, and how many were due to head into season being starters - that is where the 8-9 players was wrong. | |
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