| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues 15:42 - Jul 6 with 3087 views | Darth_Koont |
Whether it be child poverty, disease, famine, environmental disaster etc. we're very good at paying lip service to the cause but pretty awful at actually sacrificing anything to make the necessary changes.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jul/06/black-lives-matter-protest
I also like it when people are surprised that a movement complaining about systemic racism wants to dismantle the current system. Ummm what did you think was the answer? Just posting a picture of you kneeling on social media?
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 15:56 - Jul 6 with 1802 views | Half_Idiot |
I find it astounding that people can't get their heads round the fact that systemic racism is a very prevalent thing across the globe. Unfortunately it means i'm not surprised that they also don't understand what defunding the police would actually mean and just take it as a blanket "no police at all". |  | | |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 with 1724 views | lowhouseblue |
extremists try to push their agenda by taking over good and popular campaigns. same old same old. its the only way these people get any attention. let's over throw capitalism and de-fund the police - everyone else then wanders off to worry about real stuff. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 with 1718 views | hampstead_blue |
another good read in the Sunday Times about a number of these groups.
Funded and run by hard left socialists.
My problem with that is that politics is hijacking an argument which resonates across the entire political spectrum.
I'll dig out the piece if you wanted a list (memory not good at present, no bitching people I'm serious). I wasn't so much surprised more disappointed as I'd love to support these groups more but won't if the people running it are hard left socialists. |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:00 - Jul 6 with 1706 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
Unfortunately I feel like BLM has been hijacked by people with alternative agenda.
It is the perfect excuse for those that oppose equality. Now it is difficult to tell who objects for good reason and who objects because they are racist. I liked what F1 did where all drivers clearly opposed racism although a number felt unable to take the knee. |  |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:02 - Jul 6 with 1700 views | Darth_Koont |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 by lowhouseblue |
extremists try to push their agenda by taking over good and popular campaigns. same old same old. its the only way these people get any attention. let's over throw capitalism and de-fund the police - everyone else then wanders off to worry about real stuff. |
That is real stuff, you empty shell.
I get it, you hate change unless there's political gain. | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:05 - Jul 6 with 1695 views | Darth_Koont |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 by hampstead_blue |
another good read in the Sunday Times about a number of these groups.
Funded and run by hard left socialists.
My problem with that is that politics is hijacking an argument which resonates across the entire political spectrum.
I'll dig out the piece if you wanted a list (memory not good at present, no bitching people I'm serious). I wasn't so much surprised more disappointed as I'd love to support these groups more but won't if the people running it are hard left socialists. |
The problem is that "hard left socialists" want change. Others are extremely against it, even if the change is beneficial, let alone long overdue.
If someone stood up today and pushed for a national health service they'd be called a communist, just as Nye Bevin was. | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:13 - Jul 6 with 1674 views | Swansea_Blue |
'Defund the police' is always going to be a hard sell. It sounds too radical, especially given that underfunding of the police and cutting police numbers has been a stick to beat the government with for the last 10 years.
They should be a bit cleverer about that and focus on the positive changes they're calling for; so emphasise the need to focus more on preemptive steps like supporting mental health and community support efforts.
Fundamentally, they have a very strong case for change, just that the messaging is completely wrong to win over majority support. |  |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:28 - Jul 6 with 1636 views | eireblue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 by hampstead_blue |
another good read in the Sunday Times about a number of these groups.
Funded and run by hard left socialists.
My problem with that is that politics is hijacking an argument which resonates across the entire political spectrum.
I'll dig out the piece if you wanted a list (memory not good at present, no bitching people I'm serious). I wasn't so much surprised more disappointed as I'd love to support these groups more but won't if the people running it are hard left socialists. |
You are either racist or anti-racist.
Suggest a couple of anti-racist policies that help correct systematic and institutional racism that has existed for decades, that a right winger won’t call hard left.
Your third sentence is nonsensical.
BTW, dismissing people, from a position of power and privilege, i.e. a white middle class male, by simply labelling a group and using derogatory terms, is the same technique racists use. |  | | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:28 - Jul 6 with 1637 views | Darth_Koont |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:13 - Jul 6 by Swansea_Blue |
'Defund the police' is always going to be a hard sell. It sounds too radical, especially given that underfunding of the police and cutting police numbers has been a stick to beat the government with for the last 10 years.
They should be a bit cleverer about that and focus on the positive changes they're calling for; so emphasise the need to focus more on preemptive steps like supporting mental health and community support efforts.
Fundamentally, they have a very strong case for change, just that the messaging is completely wrong to win over majority support. |
Ironically "defund the police" is just as much a free-market response as defunding the NHS and filling the gaps with PFI.
Obviously I don't believe in that either, compared to a much more objective approach to improving the service and getting more social benefit out of public funds.
But how dangerous or undesirable something is clearly depends on whether the Establishment are saying it or the non-Establishment. | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:34 - Jul 6 with 1620 views | lowhouseblue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:02 - Jul 6 by Darth_Koont |
That is real stuff, you empty shell.
I get it, you hate change unless there's political gain. |
and precisely what change have people like you ever brought about …. ?
If i hated change i'd be very content with your pointless posturing. [Post edited 6 Jul 2020 17:34]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:35 - Jul 6 with 1614 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:28 - Jul 6 by Darth_Koont |
Ironically "defund the police" is just as much a free-market response as defunding the NHS and filling the gaps with PFI.
Obviously I don't believe in that either, compared to a much more objective approach to improving the service and getting more social benefit out of public funds.
But how dangerous or undesirable something is clearly depends on whether the Establishment are saying it or the non-Establishment. |
Indeed. Tory policy has been to defund the police (in real terms), along with most public services. Or at least provide the lowest annual increases over a sustained period that there has been.
Again, I think this is another reason why they could be smarter with their messaging. That article criticised exactly what I've said about the slogan being too radical. But I think it's true. We may need radical changes, but they probably need a different message to get people on board. [Post edited 6 Jul 2020 17:35]
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:36 - Jul 6 with 1608 views | Darth_Koont |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:34 - Jul 6 by lowhouseblue |
and precisely what change have people like you ever brought about …. ?
If i hated change i'd be very content with your pointless posturing. [Post edited 6 Jul 2020 17:34]
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That made no sense.
The evolution of mankind has been driven by enlightened and progressive thinking. And we've gone further left every step of the way. | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:39 - Jul 6 with 1589 views | SpruceMoose |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 by lowhouseblue |
extremists try to push their agenda by taking over good and popular campaigns. same old same old. its the only way these people get any attention. let's over throw capitalism and de-fund the police - everyone else then wanders off to worry about real stuff. |
Defunding police is not an extremist position you plum. |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:44 - Jul 6 with 1578 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 by hampstead_blue |
another good read in the Sunday Times about a number of these groups.
Funded and run by hard left socialists.
My problem with that is that politics is hijacking an argument which resonates across the entire political spectrum.
I'll dig out the piece if you wanted a list (memory not good at present, no bitching people I'm serious). I wasn't so much surprised more disappointed as I'd love to support these groups more but won't if the people running it are hard left socialists. |
If you've got a link not behind a paywall, that would be good.
I'm not sure who's to blame for this politicisation, but it happens all the time. There's a nice period when something breaks when people give their own views and then soon enough it becomes polarised.
It happened with coronavirus. There were examples of political rent a gobs (I think it's Julia Hartley-Brewer I've got in mind) who swung 180 degrees in their view over a few weeks to align with the group think on their side. I suspect it happens with every subject (presumably as online interactions are organised into like minded bubbles - dunno, maybe that's too simple). | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:45 - Jul 6 with 1577 views | Darth_Koont |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:35 - Jul 6 by Swansea_Blue |
Indeed. Tory policy has been to defund the police (in real terms), along with most public services. Or at least provide the lowest annual increases over a sustained period that there has been.
Again, I think this is another reason why they could be smarter with their messaging. That article criticised exactly what I've said about the slogan being too radical. But I think it's true. We may need radical changes, but they probably need a different message to get people on board. [Post edited 6 Jul 2020 17:35]
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Fair point. I think the biggest problem with "defund the police" is it sounds the same as "abolish the police". But really it's about using that funding for more socially beneficial solutions for law and order.
I think everyone basically wants more community policing as part of building a community. That would take a major shift in the mentality of US law enforcement and probably even in the UK. And as you say, a lack of funding has made them embattled.
But I don't know how the police reform themselves without some dismantling and rebuilding. | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:52 - Jul 6 with 1555 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:45 - Jul 6 by Darth_Koont |
Fair point. I think the biggest problem with "defund the police" is it sounds the same as "abolish the police". But really it's about using that funding for more socially beneficial solutions for law and order.
I think everyone basically wants more community policing as part of building a community. That would take a major shift in the mentality of US law enforcement and probably even in the UK. And as you say, a lack of funding has made them embattled.
But I don't know how the police reform themselves without some dismantling and rebuilding. |
Yes, it's not clear what it actually means (when you take the effort to find out). If the last 4 years have taught us anything it's that people are either a bit thick or have really short attention spans, so need:
Really Simple Slogans
In Three Words
Emphasising A Positive
Even If Untruthful | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:54 - Jul 6 with 1552 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:39 - Jul 6 by SpruceMoose |
Defunding police is not an extremist position you plum. |
Don't be soft! Of course it's radical to [checks notes] invest money more wisely to reduce the likelihood of lawlessness in the first place.
Bloody hippies wanting to improve people's lives and reduce crime. Tutt! | |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:04 - Jul 6 with 1532 views | hampstead_blue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 17:05 - Jul 6 by Darth_Koont |
The problem is that "hard left socialists" want change. Others are extremely against it, even if the change is beneficial, let alone long overdue.
If someone stood up today and pushed for a national health service they'd be called a communist, just as Nye Bevin was. |
you've ignored the point and made is political again.
I'm trying to say that BLM et all ought to be led in a neutral way rather than hiding a darker cause.
It can be said for either side of the HoC, not just those highlighted by the piece. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:08 - Jul 6 with 1513 views | SpruceMoose |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:04 - Jul 6 by hampstead_blue |
you've ignored the point and made is political again.
I'm trying to say that BLM et all ought to be led in a neutral way rather than hiding a darker cause.
It can be said for either side of the HoC, not just those highlighted by the piece. |
Yes. A nice palatable, quiet form of protesting for equality (one that inconveniences absolutely nobody) is what will really help win the fight and persuade those people (who only care about enjoying a nice peace life of privilege) that something needs to be done.
Facepalm.
Honestly, your posts make my eyes roll so hard sometimes that I can see Narnia. You'd love to support a movement to tackle racism but you can't because... lefties? Jesus wept man.
You should stop posting about race on here because you either lack the insight and knowledge to fully appreciate and understand the subject, meaning that you're subsequently unable to convey your true thoughts or.... Well. [Post edited 6 Jul 2020 18:17]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:16 - Jul 6 with 1478 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 16:56 - Jul 6 by lowhouseblue |
extremists try to push their agenda by taking over good and popular campaigns. same old same old. its the only way these people get any attention. let's over throw capitalism and de-fund the police - everyone else then wanders off to worry about real stuff. |
Sad to see the hard left has got it's antisemitic claws into BLM UK. You don't fight racism with racism.
https://www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/article/black-lives-matter-antisemitic-tweet
It's because of this sort of stuff that people like Kier Starmer is distancing himself from the movement and calling some of their aims "nonsense". |  |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:18 - Jul 6 with 1465 views | eireblue |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:04 - Jul 6 by hampstead_blue |
you've ignored the point and made is political again.
I'm trying to say that BLM et all ought to be led in a neutral way rather than hiding a darker cause.
It can be said for either side of the HoC, not just those highlighted by the piece. |
Suggest a couple of anti-racist actions that reverse decades of institutional and systematic racism, that will not invoke political policy making and execution. | | | |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:20 - Jul 6 with 1463 views | SpruceMoose |
I didn't think it would take long for you switch from blaming 'middle class white boys' to 'lefties' in an attempt to undermine BLM.
No amount of listening to Luther Vandross can obscure your true motivations. [Post edited 6 Jul 2020 18:21]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:26 - Jul 6 with 1435 views | LankHenners |
It's not at all because of 'that sort of stuff' that he called BLM 'nonsense', as you'd have seen had you watched the clip where he said it. He clearly, and rightfully, feels a bit of a div for saying that as he's referred himself for 'unconscious bias training' as a result.
Several people involved with BLM had a problem with the wording of that tweet and a tweet from one faction of the autonomous movement doesn't mean everything else it stands for is rubbished or pushed aside. If people genuinely cared about racism and what BLM stands for they'd see that. |  |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues (n/t) on 18:28 - Jul 6 with 1419 views | SpruceMoose |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:26 - Jul 6 by LankHenners |
It's not at all because of 'that sort of stuff' that he called BLM 'nonsense', as you'd have seen had you watched the clip where he said it. He clearly, and rightfully, feels a bit of a div for saying that as he's referred himself for 'unconscious bias training' as a result.
Several people involved with BLM had a problem with the wording of that tweet and a tweet from one faction of the autonomous movement doesn't mean everything else it stands for is rubbished or pushed aside. If people genuinely cared about racism and what BLM stands for they'd see that. |
[Post edited 6 Jul 2020 18:30]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:28 - Jul 6 with 1416 views | SpruceMoose |
| Good article and sadly true re: BLM and other important issues on 18:26 - Jul 6 by LankHenners |
It's not at all because of 'that sort of stuff' that he called BLM 'nonsense', as you'd have seen had you watched the clip where he said it. He clearly, and rightfully, feels a bit of a div for saying that as he's referred himself for 'unconscious bias training' as a result.
Several people involved with BLM had a problem with the wording of that tweet and a tweet from one faction of the autonomous movement doesn't mean everything else it stands for is rubbished or pushed aside. If people genuinely cared about racism and what BLM stands for they'd see that. |
Couldn't agree more with your final sentence. Absolutely nailed it. As ever, there are some highly questionable motivations at play here. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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