| Wild speculation but … 19:38 - Sep 18 with 6687 views | NorthLondonBlue2 |
… I’m torn between wanting Town to go up to the PL as soon as possible and the fear of being the PL whipping boys. Sensible me thinks promotion in a couple of years would be best. Yet that means we have to lose games and I can’t want that.
Anyone confident that, if promoted this season it wouldn’t be a disaster and swift relegation? Would it be a leap too far, too soon? |  | | |  |
| Wild speculation but … on 09:09 - Sep 19 with 1569 views | Asa |
You take absolutely everything you can.
As much as Luton are mocked, I still think they'll do alright once they get those first points, Burnley and Sheffield United were as ready as you can be. Both funded by parachute money. Both miles clear of the rest of the division for most of the season.
They have 2 points between them from a possible 27.
We could be in a position that Burnley were, miles clear of everyone, have a team that looks like a mid-table Premier League side and then take 1 point from 12 on promotion.
You're never sure if you're ready. What we would have is plenty of money, an outstanding manager and very clever recruitment. That would give us the best chance any promoted side could have. | | | |
| Wild speculation but … on 09:36 - Sep 19 with 1521 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
Going up with a manager with a better than 50% win record, with a team who, by definition, would have made the jump from on league to another already and absolutely creamed it, is the best possible foundation.
Belief, systems that work, total trust in the Manager and Coach.
No better platform.
BUT
This is incredibly premature, and we would say it was arrogant if Wednesday were in our position after a handful of wins and were talking about whether they actually wanted Promotion or not.
Top half is a decent performance for a newly promoted Championship team. McKenna just wants to win tonight, and then Saturday, and so on, and let the League Table take care of itself. | | | |
| Wild speculation but … on 10:04 - Sep 19 with 1497 views | Dyland |
| Wild speculation but … on 09:09 - Sep 19 by Asa |
You take absolutely everything you can.
As much as Luton are mocked, I still think they'll do alright once they get those first points, Burnley and Sheffield United were as ready as you can be. Both funded by parachute money. Both miles clear of the rest of the division for most of the season.
They have 2 points between them from a possible 27.
We could be in a position that Burnley were, miles clear of everyone, have a team that looks like a mid-table Premier League side and then take 1 point from 12 on promotion.
You're never sure if you're ready. What we would have is plenty of money, an outstanding manager and very clever recruitment. That would give us the best chance any promoted side could have. |
Agree that promotion would be fantastic, regardless of what happens next season. As someone else said, it's ridiculously premature to be thinking about it, but it's an online forum so posters gonna post. Wait until we lose two in a row, Morsy gets sent off, and we get more injuries (Leif is already a massive loss)... there will be the usual groaning and moaning about how we haven't done this right, we haven't strengthened there right, we've been found out etc. :)
Burnley have looked half decent though, whereas Luton have looked like a lower division team. Imho. I really don't think Luton will "do alright". |  |
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| Wild speculation but … on 10:35 - Sep 19 with 1464 views | HighgateBlue |
Yes and I don't fancy winning the FA Cup either, because our Europa League campaign may be a disaster and end in swift elimination.
You should want to win the competitions that you're in, I think it's that simple.
Granted, some competitions you'd prioritise over others in terms of resting players, but in terms of a supporter 'wanting' their team to win a competition they're in, for me it's a no brainer. See also "wanting Town to lose a match in order to relegate Norwich" for some proper agonising. But getting promotion should be our key aim rather than something we're not fussed about. |  | | |
| You're overthinking this on 10:39 - Sep 19 with 1461 views | Wickets |
| You're overthinking this on 20:45 - Sep 18 by Dyland |
Imagine a double promotion, to the top tier.
A DOUBLE PROMOTION!
The end. |
Well yes we are allowed to dream . |  | | |
| Wild speculation but … on 10:58 - Sep 19 with 1455 views | GavTWTD |
I totally understand the OP point of view. If we were to be promoted this season I think we'd need a lot of transfers that may break the spirit of the camp. I think 3 more transfer windows of gradual first team upgrades could be very exciting and would set us up for a longer period in the premiership. We still believe in evolution rather than revolution and replacing 3 or 4 players each window would be preferable. After the start we've had, we can definately finish in the top 6 which would be a remarkable and exciting season. If we do the ridiculous and keep this form up then what an amazing season it would have been.
At what point does GameChanger sell up? A second premiership season? On promotion? If we don't go up this season does KM get poached?
Last season was amazing and this one isn't too shabby either. I'm just enjoying football again and I know that people at the club are competant enough to get us where we want to be, if not this season, then next. |  |
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| Wild speculation but … on 12:50 - Sep 19 with 1371 views | jayessess |
| Wild speculation but … on 10:58 - Sep 19 by GavTWTD |
I totally understand the OP point of view. If we were to be promoted this season I think we'd need a lot of transfers that may break the spirit of the camp. I think 3 more transfer windows of gradual first team upgrades could be very exciting and would set us up for a longer period in the premiership. We still believe in evolution rather than revolution and replacing 3 or 4 players each window would be preferable. After the start we've had, we can definately finish in the top 6 which would be a remarkable and exciting season. If we do the ridiculous and keep this form up then what an amazing season it would have been.
At what point does GameChanger sell up? A second premiership season? On promotion? If we don't go up this season does KM get poached?
Last season was amazing and this one isn't too shabby either. I'm just enjoying football again and I know that people at the club are competant enough to get us where we want to be, if not this season, then next. |
Big question marks over whether more windows means better team, isn't there?
In the Summer we struggled to make permanent acquisitions that increased the quality of our strongest eleven. It is part of the lot of the Championship team to regularly sell your Premier League quality players. Every season you're also likely to see a turnover of loan players.
In any given window there's a good chance you finish it weaker than you started it. |  |
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| Wild speculation but … on 13:37 - Sep 19 with 1338 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Wild speculation but … on 20:13 - Sep 18 by Dubtractor |
Yep. If we were to get promoted this season I suspect it would come a bit too soon for us on the pitch, but the financial benefit would be huge and allow us to get the club in a much better position. And you just never know, we might scrape 17th! Forest did it despite getting promoted and needing to change most of their team. |
But just imagine the grinding negativity on here week in week out! |  |
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| Wild speculation but … on 13:38 - Sep 19 with 1339 views | Exiled2Surrey |
| Wild speculation but … on 10:58 - Sep 19 by GavTWTD |
I totally understand the OP point of view. If we were to be promoted this season I think we'd need a lot of transfers that may break the spirit of the camp. I think 3 more transfer windows of gradual first team upgrades could be very exciting and would set us up for a longer period in the premiership. We still believe in evolution rather than revolution and replacing 3 or 4 players each window would be preferable. After the start we've had, we can definately finish in the top 6 which would be a remarkable and exciting season. If we do the ridiculous and keep this form up then what an amazing season it would have been.
At what point does GameChanger sell up? A second premiership season? On promotion? If we don't go up this season does KM get poached?
Last season was amazing and this one isn't too shabby either. I'm just enjoying football again and I know that people at the club are competant enough to get us where we want to be, if not this season, then next. |
I think the Gamechanger point is very relevant - every chance they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to?
But the obvious answer is that we all want promotion, surely? | | | |
| Wild speculation but … on 13:39 - Sep 19 with 1335 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Wild speculation but … on 21:36 - Sep 18 by Swansea_Blue |
Yep. And I think we’re in as good a position as any to make the step up. It would be super hard and we’d need some quality additions, but don’t rule out the edge that a good setup, with excellent understanding across the team plays. We’re putting the structure in place that means we can add the extra quality when we’re ready.
It still might be a step too far too soon to go up, but imagine even dreaming about it 2-3 years ago. People would have thought we were nuts! |
"Super hard."
Swanners, please. | |
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| Wild speculation but … on 13:58 - Sep 19 with 1318 views | TheBoyBlue |
I totally get where you're coming from and you may well be right.
However, by just getting into the PL, we're on the gravy train. Of course some clubs have wasted that when they've come back down, but I can't imagine our owners ding that. Whether we stayed up or went down, it would put us in a very good place to help these owners to establish us in the PL. long-term. | |
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| Wild speculation but … on 14:14 - Sep 19 with 1300 views | GavTWTD |
| Wild speculation but … on 12:50 - Sep 19 by jayessess |
Big question marks over whether more windows means better team, isn't there?
In the Summer we struggled to make permanent acquisitions that increased the quality of our strongest eleven. It is part of the lot of the Championship team to regularly sell your Premier League quality players. Every season you're also likely to see a turnover of loan players.
In any given window there's a good chance you finish it weaker than you started it. |
I don't see us weakening our team in any window. One of the reasons we didn't land some targets MAY be that they didn't think we'd cut it in the Championship. I think I'm also right in saying that next season we'll have a better stance with FFP but I don't have the maths to back that up.
I still also think that if we have to lose a player for £10m-15m that will be re-invested in full in new players. The last January window was epic and clinical. I've a lot of faith in our recruitment. | |
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| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 15:04 - Sep 19 with 1257 views | Dyland |
| Wild speculation but … on 13:38 - Sep 19 by Exiled2Surrey |
I think the Gamechanger point is very relevant - every chance they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to?
But the obvious answer is that we all want promotion, surely? |
It will be pretty transparent considering the club is 90% owned by a dour bean counting brigade in charge of an American pension fund. The modus operandi, of which the other stakeholders have to buy into, is sell the club at a profit and only then do you get a (hopefully significant) return. I guess there may be other agreements between the parties as regard options and cash outs or whatever.
I inferred a somewhat nefarious slant in your post, apologies if that was not your intention. | |
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| Wild speculation but … on 15:14 - Sep 19 with 1251 views | FBI |
Accidental downie, sorry.
Don't get me wrong, I'd love to go up although I'm not convinced it should be this year. I'm old enough to remember the Robson years and all that went with them, and to wish it could be like that again.
But I despise the PL and what it's done to the game in many ways and can't help being nervous about what it would do to us. I'm not saying we'd be relegation fodder and would like to think we'd be top half with a decent wind behind us, but there's just so much about the PL that I dislike.
Ah well, footbal eh? |  |
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| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 15:46 - Sep 19 with 1218 views | Exiled2Surrey |
| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 15:04 - Sep 19 by Dyland |
It will be pretty transparent considering the club is 90% owned by a dour bean counting brigade in charge of an American pension fund. The modus operandi, of which the other stakeholders have to buy into, is sell the club at a profit and only then do you get a (hopefully significant) return. I guess there may be other agreements between the parties as regard options and cash outs or whatever.
I inferred a somewhat nefarious slant in your post, apologies if that was not your intention. |
Nothing nefarious - I can see what you were reading into my statement - when I said "who knows who that will be to", I meant we don't know who they will sell to - not who the profits will accrue to!
My point is that there will be a business case for this investment, and the ROI on their investment if they were to sell a newly promoted premier league club after 4 years (say) will likely be considerably higher than if they sell a recently relegated club after six (not saying that will happen, just that this is not an unrealistic scenario).
At the same time, if they were to sell after 4 years, then it is reasonable to assume that whoever they do sell to has even deeper pockets and will see the next stage of growth, so it may not all be bad... Who knows? | | | |
| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 16:00 - Sep 19 with 1197 views | Guthrum |
| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 15:04 - Sep 19 by Dyland |
It will be pretty transparent considering the club is 90% owned by a dour bean counting brigade in charge of an American pension fund. The modus operandi, of which the other stakeholders have to buy into, is sell the club at a profit and only then do you get a (hopefully significant) return. I guess there may be other agreements between the parties as regard options and cash outs or whatever.
I inferred a somewhat nefarious slant in your post, apologies if that was not your intention. |
I think it's a little more complex than that. From a pension fund point of view, might a regular return from the club not be as useful as a big lump sum?
If, for example, they were able to develop a leisure/entertainment/shopping complex in Ipswich (probably jointly with the Council and/or other investors), using a Premier League ITFC as the foothold and centrepiece, that may add far more value over a longer period than simply flogging the club as soon as we get promoted.
Plus, of course, the pension fund are not Town's direct owners. They could partially or fully take their money without Gamechanger necessarily having to sell, so long as the investment could be replaced from elsewhere. Much the same as Aviva didn't "own" the club before Evans took over, we just owed them a lot of money. |  |
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| Wild speculation but … on 16:03 - Sep 19 with 1192 views | ThatMuhrenCross |
I'd take promotion as soon as possible.
But then, if we did get beat every week in the Premier League, I'd expect our fans to be realistic given how far we would have come. Once you get into that Premier League money/parachute payments, you're in a whole new stratosphere of how you can build your team and what kind of player you can attract. |  |
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| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 16:42 - Sep 19 with 1166 views | Dyland |
| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 15:46 - Sep 19 by Exiled2Surrey |
Nothing nefarious - I can see what you were reading into my statement - when I said "who knows who that will be to", I meant we don't know who they will sell to - not who the profits will accrue to!
My point is that there will be a business case for this investment, and the ROI on their investment if they were to sell a newly promoted premier league club after 4 years (say) will likely be considerably higher than if they sell a recently relegated club after six (not saying that will happen, just that this is not an unrealistic scenario).
At the same time, if they were to sell after 4 years, then it is reasonable to assume that whoever they do sell to has even deeper pockets and will see the next stage of growth, so it may not all be bad... Who knows? |
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| a regular return from the club as useful as a big lump sum on 16:44 - Sep 19 with 1167 views | Dyland |
| 'they will want to "take profits" - who knows who that will be to' on 16:00 - Sep 19 by Guthrum |
I think it's a little more complex than that. From a pension fund point of view, might a regular return from the club not be as useful as a big lump sum?
If, for example, they were able to develop a leisure/entertainment/shopping complex in Ipswich (probably jointly with the Council and/or other investors), using a Premier League ITFC as the foothold and centrepiece, that may add far more value over a longer period than simply flogging the club as soon as we get promoted.
Plus, of course, the pension fund are not Town's direct owners. They could partially or fully take their money without Gamechanger necessarily having to sell, so long as the investment could be replaced from elsewhere. Much the same as Aviva didn't "own" the club before Evans took over, we just owed them a lot of money. |
Totally... I was planning on writing about that in my resoonse but got distracted and forgot! | |
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| Wild speculation but … on 17:01 - Sep 19 with 1143 views | Stewart27 |
It’s a little daft. It’s not like it’s something we can “choose” either. Or are you suggesting we forfeit games in order to not go up?
Either way we just want to keep progressing and enjoy the bloody ride if the promised land beckons. | | | |
| Wild speculation but … on 19:22 - Sep 19 with 1098 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Wild speculation but … on 22:31 - Sep 18 by jayessess |
The financial gap is so vast that it's basically impossible to build a Premier League ready team in the Championship.
You can't pay the going rate for Premier League quality players and you can't keep the Premier League quality players you do manage to acquire (via academy, player development, exceptional scouting) for very long. |
How many of Fulham, Bournemouth and Forest went straight back down last season?
Or nodge, Watford and Brentford the season before that?
It is far from impossible to build a team capable of staying up. At least one of Brentford, Fulham, Bournemouth and Forest will still be there after this season and with the way Luton are, probably 2, 3 or maybe even all 4. |  |
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