| Any gangs smashed yet? on 09:56 - Aug 13 with 1680 views | bluejacko |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 09:46 - Aug 13 by Pencilpete |
As alot of you will know i've been pretty vocal on the immigration numbers - if you really want to stop the small boats (in my opinion) then we need to do the following:
1. make it so that anyone crossing on the small boats are immediately returned with no exception
2. set up a processing unit in Calais where people can go and apply for a temporary Asylum visa in the UK then an agreed number (i'd go for 250 a week) are given these 90 day Visas and we (along with the French) arrange a proper Boat to bring those 250 people over - once here, their 90 day visa gives them a bed, food and the chance to look for work ETC
3. those people are then given a proper application process at the end of their 90 day period and either given permanent asylum OR they are returned to France if they are rejected.
4. One of the big concerns i have (for security reasons) is with people tossing phones and their papers into the channel - why would you do this unless it's so you can't be identified ? so the final rule would be no papers, no asylum.
We need to stop the boats, we need to get the numbers under control and keep ourselves safe whilst also helping those who need it and for those who do need it the passage needs to be a proper and safe one ... i think the above idea achieves all those things. |
How much did we pay the French over the last year to combat the boats£500 M I believe? If they just stand on a beach and let overcrowded small boats leave and then give them a escort out of French waters (all videoed) what hope is there of them rounding up migrants and taking them to Calais? None I would hazard a guess!
Turn this around and say these people were leaving our shores in the above circumstances I would expect the majority of posters on here would rightly be outraged and yet not a word is levelled at our ‘friends’ across the ditch for letting lives be risked in the channel! |  | |  |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:03 - Aug 13 with 1660 views | NeedhamChris |
Did you prefer the previous of approach, which was the equivalent of threatening 2000 kids at a secondary school that 1 of them would get detention if they misbehaved.
You can identify the intellectually challenged quite easily - not from the moral issues with the Rwanda scheme but the actual logistics. | |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:12 - Aug 13 with 1630 views | noggin |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 09:42 - Aug 13 by bluejacko |
Never heard of the vikings then? |
Were they a Norwegian military? Norway wasn't even an independent country until 1906. [Post edited 13 Aug 2024 10:20]
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:16 - Aug 13 with 1601 views | bluejacko |
We can only hope👍 | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:31 - Aug 13 with 1549 views | Pencilpete |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 09:56 - Aug 13 by bluejacko |
How much did we pay the French over the last year to combat the boats£500 M I believe? If they just stand on a beach and let overcrowded small boats leave and then give them a escort out of French waters (all videoed) what hope is there of them rounding up migrants and taking them to Calais? None I would hazard a guess!
Turn this around and say these people were leaving our shores in the above circumstances I would expect the majority of posters on here would rightly be outraged and yet not a word is levelled at our ‘friends’ across the ditch for letting lives be risked in the channel! |
The people are jumping on dingys because there is no safe passage. If you create one and then say if you get on a dingy then the second you land in the UK border force will take you back to France then there is NO incentive for them to attempt it.
I agree the French have taken the p155 which is why we need to get tougher with them as well, and say you either take them back or we stop the payments - even tho as Reform have pointed out we are actually entitled to return them under international law ! | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:46 - Aug 13 with 1510 views | noggin |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:31 - Aug 13 by Pencilpete |
The people are jumping on dingys because there is no safe passage. If you create one and then say if you get on a dingy then the second you land in the UK border force will take you back to France then there is NO incentive for them to attempt it.
I agree the French have taken the p155 which is why we need to get tougher with them as well, and say you either take them back or we stop the payments - even tho as Reform have pointed out we are actually entitled to return them under international law ! |
"even tho as Reform have pointed out we are actually entitled to return them under international law !"
How does that work, considering, everyone has the right to seek asylum in the country of their choosing? It's not true that they must apply for asylum in the first safe country, and there are no legal routes from France to the UK. | |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:52 - Aug 13 with 1486 views | bluejacko |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 07:09 - Aug 13 by noggin |
A small island that has invaded and pillaged from most of the world. But hey, Rule Britannia. [Post edited 13 Aug 2024 7:15]
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I take it you are having a pop at the empire? If you actually take the time to look there was very little of what you describe in creating the empire it was very much done by the diplomatic means and trade! True it benefited us bur the British army was much to small to go cavorting around the world raping and pillaging as you put it. | | | |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:53 - Aug 13 with 1466 views | noggin |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:52 - Aug 13 by bluejacko |
I take it you are having a pop at the empire? If you actually take the time to look there was very little of what you describe in creating the empire it was very much done by the diplomatic means and trade! True it benefited us bur the British army was much to small to go cavorting around the world raping and pillaging as you put it. |
I haven't mentioned rape, although I imagine it did happen. I'm not having a 'pop at the empire', just suggesting that it has to be taken into account when discussing why some refugees might want to live in Britain. [Post edited 13 Aug 2024 11:07]
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 11:19 - Aug 13 with 1421 views | soupytwist |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:52 - Aug 13 by bluejacko |
I take it you are having a pop at the empire? If you actually take the time to look there was very little of what you describe in creating the empire it was very much done by the diplomatic means and trade! True it benefited us bur the British army was much to small to go cavorting around the world raping and pillaging as you put it. |
I'm not really sure where to start with this but even if we accept that "creating the empire it was very much done by the diplomatic means and trade" how do you think that maintaining that lucrative trade was done?
The East India Company didn't have its own army twice the size of the British Army at the time for nothing. |  | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 12:01 - Aug 13 with 1352 views | Pencilpete |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:46 - Aug 13 by noggin |
"even tho as Reform have pointed out we are actually entitled to return them under international law !"
How does that work, considering, everyone has the right to seek asylum in the country of their choosing? It's not true that they must apply for asylum in the first safe country, and there are no legal routes from France to the UK. |
If you read my whole thread and the previous one instead of jumping all over one sentence because i mentioned Reform - you'd see it was part of an idea to create a safe passage first THEN refuse any dingys ..... | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 12:11 - Aug 13 with 1312 views | noggin |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 12:01 - Aug 13 by Pencilpete |
If you read my whole thread and the previous one instead of jumping all over one sentence because i mentioned Reform - you'd see it was part of an idea to create a safe passage first THEN refuse any dingys ..... |
My question was regarding Reform stating that Britain has the right to return asylum seekers to France today. I don't know the answer so hoped you did, as you brought it up. | |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:15 - Aug 13 with 1227 views | Benters |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 07:49 - Aug 13 by tcblue |
With a struggling NHS which has been propped up for years with immigrant talent. I'd thought you of all people would be appreciative of the NHS.
And yes, there's a direct correlation with how we are perceived to be treating those who come here with the numbers of folks who would like to come over here to work in (among other sectors) our healthcare. Numbers are significantly down, and who could blame them watching the news? |
I thought the thread was about illegal immigrants and gangs? |  |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:17 - Aug 13 with 1225 views | Benters |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 09:42 - Aug 13 by bluejacko |
Never heard of the vikings then? |
Yes but that was a long time ago.
Or something. | |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:22 - Aug 13 with 1198 views | tcblue |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:15 - Aug 13 by Benters |
I thought the thread was about illegal immigrants and gangs? |
Well done in avoiding all context, it's a joy having you back | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:25 - Aug 13 with 1166 views | Benters |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:22 - Aug 13 by tcblue |
Well done in avoiding all context, it's a joy having you back |
Thanks,the other thing I’d like to know is if these people are (supposedly) fleeing war and famine where do they get the money from to pay the said gangmasters ?
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:31 - Aug 13 with 1143 views | Buhrer |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:25 - Aug 13 by Benters |
Thanks,the other thing I’d like to know is if these people are (supposedly) fleeing war and famine where do they get the money from to pay the said gangmasters ?
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If you fled our society, and did your best to liquidate what you had, lock stock and water butt, and took what family elsewhere would give, might you be able to scratch together some payment for passage? And the rest. |  | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:33 - Aug 13 with 1134 views | Benters |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:31 - Aug 13 by Buhrer |
If you fled our society, and did your best to liquidate what you had, lock stock and water butt, and took what family elsewhere would give, might you be able to scratch together some payment for passage? And the rest. |
Interesting thanks. | |
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:44 - Aug 13 with 1114 views | Buhrer |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:33 - Aug 13 by Benters |
Interesting thanks. |
Also I know there's a lot of people trafficked or are coerced/have to sell themselves into a bondage debt to get passage entering slavery when they arrive. The sort of debt you never pay off. Where you expect to be a nail technician and end up a prostitute debts. Or a Vietnamese kid locked in a semi growing weed. Plus I'm assuming there's the people paying for passage funded through crimes, because they're coming to commit crimes, or coming as attached to the criminal gangs themselves. The people that would never use an official means. [Post edited 13 Aug 2024 13:45]
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:54 - Aug 13 with 1088 views | Buhrer |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:54 - Aug 12 by witchdoctor |
what about a task force based on the chanel beaches who’s sole mission is to destroy any vessels attempting the crossing before they set off…? |
If we built the task force itself out of arriving migrants, we must eventually reach a cumulative mass and reverse the trend. Maybe just starting with 100 people in Calais on minimum franc armed with un kitchen fork a la broom stick for popping dinghies.
I read The Wall by John Lanchester recently. A little young adult for me but essentially it's a Britain where the sea has risen and there's a wall around it where the young fight off outsiders.... and for everyone that gets in, one of the defenders is put out on a dinghy. | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 14:06 - Aug 13 with 1047 views | Pencilpete |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 12:11 - Aug 13 by noggin |
My question was regarding Reform stating that Britain has the right to return asylum seekers to France today. I don't know the answer so hoped you did, as you brought it up. |
If you're asking me to quote article 15a, subsection 12, paragraph 2 Lines 5 to 18 of the Mogrants return act 1857 .... i'm afraid you're going to be disapointed.
What i know is Reform have said that we are entitled to return them under international law and on various political shows both Labour and Conservative MPs have confirmed that is the case but they choose not to invoke it to ensure smooth relations with France.
If we created a safe passage as per my earlier thread and put (my suggestion 250) people that had been preliminarily assessed and given 90 day temporary visas in a proper boat on a regular weekly sailing then they wouldn't need to use dingys and if as part of that process we made it clear to everyone and especially France that if people DO come over on dingys they they would be returned then you've just put the gangs out of business | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 14:55 - Aug 13 with 963 views | witchdoctor |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 10:12 - Aug 13 by noggin |
Were they a Norwegian military? Norway wasn't even an independent country until 1906. [Post edited 13 Aug 2024 10:20]
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I’m pretty sure that they used weapons to rape and pillage foreign countries so yeah..I’d call them a military force and their homeland was Norway…or have I got that wrong? [Post edited 13 Aug 2024 17:06]
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| Any gangs smashed yet? on 14:57 - Aug 13 with 956 views | soupytwist |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 14:06 - Aug 13 by Pencilpete |
If you're asking me to quote article 15a, subsection 12, paragraph 2 Lines 5 to 18 of the Mogrants return act 1857 .... i'm afraid you're going to be disapointed.
What i know is Reform have said that we are entitled to return them under international law and on various political shows both Labour and Conservative MPs have confirmed that is the case but they choose not to invoke it to ensure smooth relations with France.
If we created a safe passage as per my earlier thread and put (my suggestion 250) people that had been preliminarily assessed and given 90 day temporary visas in a proper boat on a regular weekly sailing then they wouldn't need to use dingys and if as part of that process we made it clear to everyone and especially France that if people DO come over on dingys they they would be returned then you've just put the gangs out of business |
Let's assume that there are no legal impediments to all that.
How long are you (and the OP on this thread) prepared to give the new government to make the arrangements with France?
And procure and staff all you need for the weekly boat crossings back and forth?
And build the necessary facilities on the other side of the Channel?
And set up the 90 day of bed and board?
How much do you think it would be reasonable to spend on it all? | | | |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 15:20 - Aug 13 with 915 views | Hugoagogo_Reborn |
| Any gangs smashed yet? on 13:25 - Aug 13 by Benters |
Thanks,the other thing I’d like to know is if these people are (supposedly) fleeing war and famine where do they get the money from to pay the said gangmasters ?
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If you are actually asking a genuine question here and genuinely interested in the answer, not angling for a bite, you might find this podcast enlightening.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001z1st?partner=uk.co.bbc&origin=share-mo |  | | |
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