| Reflections on yesterday 07:54 - Jan 2 with 1344 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
There have been a few comments along the lines of "if we play slow from the back, the fans get frustrated and the atmosphere suffers" - as though the fans in the stadium come to be entertained, and if the entertainment factor isn't a 9 out of 10, then we sit silently.
Personally, I think that is a really sad reflection on the fans. Oxford fans singing "football in a library" in the first 5 minutes, and they weren't wrong.
I would be very interested to hear the views of a deaf supporter. Because i think we played really well in the 1st half, so from a visual point of view it would have been great. But it seemed flat and tense because there was no noise. As fans, we create the atmosphere, there was more than enough good play to rouse us and generate noise, but hardly anyone seems bothered. After really good passages of play, hardly any one applauds, people just sit silently waiting for a rasping shot on goal before uttering so much as a muffled "Ooooh".
We will get what we deserve. If we don't create a good atmosphere, it must be demoralising for the players. And why would top players want to join in January if there is no atmosphere in the stadium. So why, oh why don't more people get it in their heads that they need to gasp, roar, applaud, sing and really get behind the boys.
Final thought is about playing out from the back La Pausa as it is known. The concept of La Pausa was to bring opposition players on to you, creating more space in the middle of the pitch to then make a sudden fast move. We seem to have forgotten the last bit. I loved the way we did it during the promotion season, but I think we're just playing around at the back too much now, and not using it to launch a fast attack. As a consequence, it does create nervousness in the crowd, so I'd like to see that part of our play changed up a bit.
Job done yesterday, credit to the players, we're 2nd, but we do need to play a bigger part as fans. [Post edited 2 Jan 7:58]
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| Reflections on yesterday on 09:30 - Jan 2 with 1121 views | Basuco |
teams have started to change their press against us, if they press high and hard we have the ability to just pass through them, they now seem to wait for us to move the ball before they move the press, which makes the first goal of the game so important to us. Also presents a different challenge for the coaching team to get around. It was very funny at Coventry when Walton just stood with the ball waiting for them to move towards him, this works better away from home though. |  | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:41 - Jan 2 with 1081 views | StokieBlue |
I think the section about not creating a fast attack is harsh.
Oxford weren't willing to commit to the press yesterday so it was hard to launch fast attacks after drawing them in. Cajuste was used a few times to break the lines to do this but in general if they aren't coming onto the press then you need to play the ball around to find a space. Some thing are simply not in our control.
Passing it around at the back shouldn't create nervousness in the crowd, some people just like complaining. One guy near me kept yelling we were "boring".
I also think a lot of context is forgotten when the promotion season is mentioned. We were surprise packages, teams came to take us on and there was miles more space available to play into that we have now. If teams played the same way against us now as they did that season we would smash them.
Thus, direct comparisons to that season are a tad unfair.
SB |  | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:45 - Jan 2 with 1048 views | SheffordBlue |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:41 - Jan 2 by StokieBlue |
I think the section about not creating a fast attack is harsh.
Oxford weren't willing to commit to the press yesterday so it was hard to launch fast attacks after drawing them in. Cajuste was used a few times to break the lines to do this but in general if they aren't coming onto the press then you need to play the ball around to find a space. Some thing are simply not in our control.
Passing it around at the back shouldn't create nervousness in the crowd, some people just like complaining. One guy near me kept yelling we were "boring".
I also think a lot of context is forgotten when the promotion season is mentioned. We were surprise packages, teams came to take us on and there was miles more space available to play into that we have now. If teams played the same way against us now as they did that season we would smash them.
Thus, direct comparisons to that season are a tad unfair.
SB |
We're also top of the league by quite some way for 'direct attacks' which Opta defines as:
A direct attack is an open‑play sequence that:
Starts from just inside the team’s own half.
Has at least 50% of the ball movement directed towards the opposition goal (i.e., it progresses mainly vertically rather than sideways/back).
Ends in either a shot or at least one touch in the opposition penalty area.
We're on 55 for the season while 2nd placed team is Boro on 44.
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| Reflections on yesterday on 09:47 - Jan 2 with 1030 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:41 - Jan 2 by StokieBlue |
I think the section about not creating a fast attack is harsh.
Oxford weren't willing to commit to the press yesterday so it was hard to launch fast attacks after drawing them in. Cajuste was used a few times to break the lines to do this but in general if they aren't coming onto the press then you need to play the ball around to find a space. Some thing are simply not in our control.
Passing it around at the back shouldn't create nervousness in the crowd, some people just like complaining. One guy near me kept yelling we were "boring".
I also think a lot of context is forgotten when the promotion season is mentioned. We were surprise packages, teams came to take us on and there was miles more space available to play into that we have now. If teams played the same way against us now as they did that season we would smash them.
Thus, direct comparisons to that season are a tad unfair.
SB |
Thought the crowd were okay. At least where I sat, we’ve had enough of these games to know it will be a grind with the oppo wasting time and sitting back.
The difference from earlier games say Derby and Charlton for me is we actually looked like scoring and there was definitely less tension in the crowd. Some of the one touch stuff and patterns in the first half were a joy to watch and we repeatedly broke through their low block.
Second half was scrappy but we got it done. | | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:59 - Jan 2 with 967 views | TheBlueGnu |
got bored reading this after the first couple of lines. We won, we're 2nd, we've taken 10 points out of 12 over Christmas, 2nd fewest goals conceded in the league, doubled the leaders. | |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 10:11 - Jan 2 with 924 views | BloomBlue |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:41 - Jan 2 by StokieBlue |
I think the section about not creating a fast attack is harsh.
Oxford weren't willing to commit to the press yesterday so it was hard to launch fast attacks after drawing them in. Cajuste was used a few times to break the lines to do this but in general if they aren't coming onto the press then you need to play the ball around to find a space. Some thing are simply not in our control.
Passing it around at the back shouldn't create nervousness in the crowd, some people just like complaining. One guy near me kept yelling we were "boring".
I also think a lot of context is forgotten when the promotion season is mentioned. We were surprise packages, teams came to take us on and there was miles more space available to play into that we have now. If teams played the same way against us now as they did that season we would smash them.
Thus, direct comparisons to that season are a tad unfair.
SB |
I think your point about teams played more open against us last time in the Championship is constantly overlooked. Too many fans forget most 'experts' expected us to be one of the struggling teams that season. I'm not saying one of the favourites for relegation, but certainly bottom half of the table. As many said, teams dont come up from L1 and immediately challenge for promotion again.
That meant most teams came to PR and played open football, expecting 3 points - well certainly in the first half of the season. Now this season we're favourites for promotion and teams are coming to PR to sit deep with the aim of a 0-0, and/or hitting us on the break, sneaking a goal from a dead ball situation.
Yesterday a classic example when Walton got the ball at his feet i the first 5 minutes Oxford forwards were happy to stand off him. They would have stood there all game if they could. Last championship season you would have an opposition forward immediately closing down Walton. |  | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 10:52 - Jan 2 with 807 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
| Reflections on yesterday on 09:41 - Jan 2 by StokieBlue |
I think the section about not creating a fast attack is harsh.
Oxford weren't willing to commit to the press yesterday so it was hard to launch fast attacks after drawing them in. Cajuste was used a few times to break the lines to do this but in general if they aren't coming onto the press then you need to play the ball around to find a space. Some thing are simply not in our control.
Passing it around at the back shouldn't create nervousness in the crowd, some people just like complaining. One guy near me kept yelling we were "boring".
I also think a lot of context is forgotten when the promotion season is mentioned. We were surprise packages, teams came to take us on and there was miles more space available to play into that we have now. If teams played the same way against us now as they did that season we would smash them.
Thus, direct comparisons to that season are a tad unfair.
SB |
I'm a big fan of La Pausa. Love to see it being passed slickly between oppo players who are chasing shadows, and I will applaud when we do it well. But there does have to be a point, and to recognize when to hit the go button. The danger of it is that too many supporters just don't get it. The old fella who sits next to me in SAR is almost 90, and he just keeps yelling "kick it forward". There are lots who are like him, and that creates a lot of nervous energy (dark energy?) in the stadium, and it is abundantly clear that the nervousness transmits to the players. For that reason, if the fans can't understand what is happening and applaud (or stay silent rather than groan or shout abuse) then we ought to reconsider how much we play it around at the back. | |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 11:06 - Jan 2 with 712 views | NthQldITFC |
| Reflections on yesterday on 10:11 - Jan 2 by BloomBlue |
I think your point about teams played more open against us last time in the Championship is constantly overlooked. Too many fans forget most 'experts' expected us to be one of the struggling teams that season. I'm not saying one of the favourites for relegation, but certainly bottom half of the table. As many said, teams dont come up from L1 and immediately challenge for promotion again.
That meant most teams came to PR and played open football, expecting 3 points - well certainly in the first half of the season. Now this season we're favourites for promotion and teams are coming to PR to sit deep with the aim of a 0-0, and/or hitting us on the break, sneaking a goal from a dead ball situation.
Yesterday a classic example when Walton got the ball at his feet i the first 5 minutes Oxford forwards were happy to stand off him. They would have stood there all game if they could. Last championship season you would have an opposition forward immediately closing down Walton. |
I don't think you're right about last time in the Championship. As I remember it we were top six odds with the bookies from the off. |  |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 11:09 - Jan 2 with 686 views | ghostofescobar |
My season ticket is in the SAR stand, and second half it was embarrassing when Walton didn’t “get rid” of the ball within 10 seconds how many fans started getting on his back. As my son shouted out, when they don’t have the ball, they can’t score. Our style when playing out from the keeper is to aim not to give the ball away cheaply, and play through the thirds when good opportunities are there to do so. Why the fvck are our own fans shouting, screaming some of them, that Walton hasn’t punted the ball long, or whatever else it is that they think is better than us keeping possession. Footballing ignorance imo. |  |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 11:11 - Jan 2 with 676 views | Reuser_is_God |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:09 - Jan 2 by ghostofescobar |
My season ticket is in the SAR stand, and second half it was embarrassing when Walton didn’t “get rid” of the ball within 10 seconds how many fans started getting on his back. As my son shouted out, when they don’t have the ball, they can’t score. Our style when playing out from the keeper is to aim not to give the ball away cheaply, and play through the thirds when good opportunities are there to do so. Why the fvck are our own fans shouting, screaming some of them, that Walton hasn’t punted the ball long, or whatever else it is that they think is better than us keeping possession. Footballing ignorance imo. |
They’ve obviously not watched us for the past 4 years have they?
Mind boggling isn’t it. |  |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 11:17 - Jan 2 with 623 views | Herbivore |
| Reflections on yesterday on 10:52 - Jan 2 by LegendofthePhoenix |
I'm a big fan of La Pausa. Love to see it being passed slickly between oppo players who are chasing shadows, and I will applaud when we do it well. But there does have to be a point, and to recognize when to hit the go button. The danger of it is that too many supporters just don't get it. The old fella who sits next to me in SAR is almost 90, and he just keeps yelling "kick it forward". There are lots who are like him, and that creates a lot of nervous energy (dark energy?) in the stadium, and it is abundantly clear that the nervousness transmits to the players. For that reason, if the fans can't understand what is happening and applaud (or stay silent rather than groan or shout abuse) then we ought to reconsider how much we play it around at the back. |
Completely disagree. We can't just lump it forward because some of our fans are low wattage bulbs. The same fans will be shouting "What was that?" when they realise that the success rate of long passes is a lot less than short passes and we end up giving the ball back to the opposition constantly. We need to keep playing the way that suits us and that's largely being a possession based side but one that also isn't afraid to ping it a bit longer (thinking O'Shea's diaganols to Leif for example) when needed. |  |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 11:18 - Jan 2 with 620 views | _CliveBaker_ |
The 'get it up the pitch' brigade aren't going to change now, if they're still not understanding after 4 years and 2 promotions I can't see it changing.
The atmosphere has been flat, there's a lot of expectancy which on the one hand is understandable, we've spent a hell of a lot of money compared to others at this level and the economics of the championship are such that you can understand why fans expect us to turn over Oxford at home. The reality is that won't always happen, if we play them 5 times we might win 4. That's no excuse for not supporting the team better though, I don't expect people to sing for 90 minutes as that's their prerogative but the moans and groans are pathetic at times. Even Burns yesterday, he's played 10 minutes of competitive football in the past year and is a modern day hero, his 1st heavy touch was greeted with a load of moans. |  | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:47 - Jan 2 with 511 views | Smoresy |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:06 - Jan 2 by NthQldITFC |
I don't think you're right about last time in the Championship. As I remember it we were top six odds with the bookies from the off. |
Yep, we were hot property that summer. 5th with the bookies on average IIRC. The Second Tier Pod predicted we'd finish 2nd. Not The Top 20 predicted we'd finish 3rd and win the playoffs. FourFourTwo predicted we'd finish 5th. Our own Ben Bloom settled on 5th.
I make the crux of Bloom's post right mind, like most of us I'm sure; we weren't feared back then and teams are naturally much more cautious in their approach this season (parachute strength and depth, recent history and manager, widely regarded as the team to beat). | | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 13:02 - Jan 2 with 375 views | NthQldITFC |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:47 - Jan 2 by Smoresy |
Yep, we were hot property that summer. 5th with the bookies on average IIRC. The Second Tier Pod predicted we'd finish 2nd. Not The Top 20 predicted we'd finish 3rd and win the playoffs. FourFourTwo predicted we'd finish 5th. Our own Ben Bloom settled on 5th.
I make the crux of Bloom's post right mind, like most of us I'm sure; we weren't feared back then and teams are naturally much more cautious in their approach this season (parachute strength and depth, recent history and manager, widely regarded as the team to beat). |
Yes, I agree with his crux too! | |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 13:16 - Jan 2 with 342 views | lazyblue |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:09 - Jan 2 by ghostofescobar |
My season ticket is in the SAR stand, and second half it was embarrassing when Walton didn’t “get rid” of the ball within 10 seconds how many fans started getting on his back. As my son shouted out, when they don’t have the ball, they can’t score. Our style when playing out from the keeper is to aim not to give the ball away cheaply, and play through the thirds when good opportunities are there to do so. Why the fvck are our own fans shouting, screaming some of them, that Walton hasn’t punted the ball long, or whatever else it is that they think is better than us keeping possession. Footballing ignorance imo. |
Drives me mad too, surely the fans can see and understand what the players are trying to do. We lose possession more from the back when fans panic and scream ‘get it forward’ and the players panics lump it forward and we lose it.
As you say after 4 yours fans should understand and trust the way we play which works well, I mean bloody hell we are 2nd now. | | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 13:25 - Jan 2 with 312 views | stonojnr |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:06 - Jan 2 by NthQldITFC |
I don't think you're right about last time in the Championship. As I remember it we were top six odds with the bookies from the off. |
bookies odds are just based on where people are placing bets, so it just means alot of people were placing bets on Town, its not a reflection of expected outcomes anymore.
so I think youd be hard pushed to find anyone who had predicted promotion at the start of 23/24.
though Im sure if you went back to the TWTD poll at the time you could find some, though based on hope I suspect, not what they realistically thought would happen | | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 13:42 - Jan 2 with 280 views | stonojnr |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:11 - Jan 2 by Reuser_is_God |
They’ve obviously not watched us for the past 4 years have they?
Mind boggling isn’t it. |
it drives me up the wall, its like they think we are playing FIFA or basketball and just must turnover attacks all the team, and no clearly alot of them might have watched us for the past 4 years, but havent learnt a darn thing.
and its more annoying because that little sense of frustration/urgency from the crowd does affect the players who react to do what this section of crowd want, and we invariably then give the ball away quite cheaply.
Im more than happy for Walton to stand there with the ball for the rest of the game, or pass between Kipre and OShea, if we are a goal to the good up, as was said the opposition cant score if we retain possession of the ball, and we often have to be patient to create the space we want.
as for the crowd overall, it was fine for a game on New Years day, when its freezing cold, every away team fans does the library song now,and theyre singing at that corner of Sir Alf, who arent that vocal as a whole, but they are the nearest group of fans to them, because there was apoint Oxford started singing we forgot you were here when a few groups in Sir Alf started singing, but the North had been singing the prior 5mins, block A were doing the Kipre/Oshea song, and its like really you're now doing the we forgot you were here bit.
but thats not a problem, block A were doing their stuff, the North lower sounded in good voice to me. not every game is going to be a cauldron of noise for 90mins. | | | |
| Reflections on yesterday on 13:44 - Jan 2 with 272 views | Churchman |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:18 - Jan 2 by _CliveBaker_ |
The 'get it up the pitch' brigade aren't going to change now, if they're still not understanding after 4 years and 2 promotions I can't see it changing.
The atmosphere has been flat, there's a lot of expectancy which on the one hand is understandable, we've spent a hell of a lot of money compared to others at this level and the economics of the championship are such that you can understand why fans expect us to turn over Oxford at home. The reality is that won't always happen, if we play them 5 times we might win 4. That's no excuse for not supporting the team better though, I don't expect people to sing for 90 minutes as that's their prerogative but the moans and groans are pathetic at times. Even Burns yesterday, he's played 10 minutes of competitive football in the past year and is a modern day hero, his 1st heavy touch was greeted with a load of moans. |
You are right in that the hoof it brigade won’t change. If they don’t understand possession football now they never will. Still, those that yearn for McCarthy Duncan long ball - that’s their prerogative. They pay their money like everyone else.
The money aspect is very corrosive and a major reason why the dim bulbs are so miserable about the players. You watch it kick off on here Sunday again if we fail to win at Portsmouth. But those fees are nothing to do with the players and they are not robots.
Is it disappointing if say O’Shea, Egeli or Furlong misplaces a pass? Yes, but it’s not a cause for abuse or moans and groans. We are all hacked off about it but wouldn’t a little encouragement or at worst leave them alone have a more positive effect? Maybe that’s cloud cuckoo land and for the north east or Yorkshire clubs.
Good numbers for a medium sized club but poor support sums up Ipswich these days. It’s good period, including the patience shown last season, is over and been replaced by entitlement by too many.
It’s not too bad in the comatose section where I sit, but you can feel it; hear it in the ground. It must be an awful to play in front of and if I was a Walton or an O’Shea knowing I was one mistake from a torrent of abuse, I’d be looking for somewhere else. They’ll all have seen what Muric and AAH received. It’s a short career and who needs that?
I actually thought the crowd was ok yesterday overall. It was a very cold day at a funny time of year and it should not be forgotten this club’s crowd has always been pretty quiet bar odd exceptions.
Edit: the crowd reminds me very much of the end of Curbishley’s time. I went a few times with a couple of work colleagues. On the players’ backs but mainly the manager. ‘He’s taken us as far as he can’, ‘one dimensional’ etc etc. Entitlement. BCWYWF certainly came back to haunt them. [Post edited 2 Jan 13:58]
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| Reflections on yesterday on 14:05 - Jan 2 with 165 views | Vic |
| Reflections on yesterday on 10:52 - Jan 2 by LegendofthePhoenix |
I'm a big fan of La Pausa. Love to see it being passed slickly between oppo players who are chasing shadows, and I will applaud when we do it well. But there does have to be a point, and to recognize when to hit the go button. The danger of it is that too many supporters just don't get it. The old fella who sits next to me in SAR is almost 90, and he just keeps yelling "kick it forward". There are lots who are like him, and that creates a lot of nervous energy (dark energy?) in the stadium, and it is abundantly clear that the nervousness transmits to the players. For that reason, if the fans can't understand what is happening and applaud (or stay silent rather than groan or shout abuse) then we ought to reconsider how much we play it around at the back. |
Do you really think the manager should dictate the style of play to please the fans?
'Kick it forward' was OK 60 years ago, but sounds like you're old fella next to you would rather see us play like Wimbledon in the 90's than we do now.
If the style is consistently not working for some reason then yes, change it, but surely not when it is actually getting the results we want. |  |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 14:15 - Jan 2 with 134 views | Herbivore |
| Reflections on yesterday on 13:25 - Jan 2 by stonojnr |
bookies odds are just based on where people are placing bets, so it just means alot of people were placing bets on Town, its not a reflection of expected outcomes anymore.
so I think youd be hard pushed to find anyone who had predicted promotion at the start of 23/24.
though Im sure if you went back to the TWTD poll at the time you could find some, though based on hope I suspect, not what they realistically thought would happen |
Quite a few pundits tipped us to be right up there. Also, bookies have to price the market before any money has been placed and they do that based on who they think will be up there, they don't start all sides off at 20-1 and then let the flow of bets dictate the odds. | |
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| Reflections on yesterday on 14:55 - Jan 2 with 63 views | Garv |
| Reflections on yesterday on 11:09 - Jan 2 by ghostofescobar |
My season ticket is in the SAR stand, and second half it was embarrassing when Walton didn’t “get rid” of the ball within 10 seconds how many fans started getting on his back. As my son shouted out, when they don’t have the ball, they can’t score. Our style when playing out from the keeper is to aim not to give the ball away cheaply, and play through the thirds when good opportunities are there to do so. Why the fvck are our own fans shouting, screaming some of them, that Walton hasn’t punted the ball long, or whatever else it is that they think is better than us keeping possession. Footballing ignorance imo. |
It think it's because Walton holding onto the ball suggests indecision and a lack of ideas on our part, and maybe that we're giving the opp confidence by dallying on the ball. Sometimes that might be the case but as you say, generally, there is a reason and a method behind it.
It can be annoying but the screaming and shouting from the stands is ridiculous. |  |
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