| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:22 - Apr 30 with 749 views | StokieBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:01 - Apr 30 by itfcjoe |
The marches get out of hand, some of the stuff said and chanted on them is a disgrace and they have been allowed to go on too long without a grip being taken of them.
Freedom of protest has been pushed too far on this one; a line has been crossed |
By a minority.
You don't think the far right protests are the same?
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:23 - Apr 30 with 749 views | BlueSmoke |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:06 - Apr 30 by positivity |
the free palestine marches or the divide the kingdom ones? |
The ones that normal jewish people just getting on with their lives are terrified about? |  | | |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:23 - Apr 30 with 741 views | NthQldITFC |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:01 - Apr 30 by itfcjoe |
The marches get out of hand, some of the stuff said and chanted on them is a disgrace and they have been allowed to go on too long without a grip being taken of them.
Freedom of protest has been pushed too far on this one; a line has been crossed |
Whilst that is undeniably true, and is also true for most large scale marches, if we shut down the right to protest completely in this specific instance we're effectively condoning ongoing war crimes and genocide.
It may be difficult to do, but the only just way to deal with the problem is to try to target the specific law breakers in the act, not silence democratic protest - that way lies an authoritarian nightmare and the death of accountability. We can't afford that in our seriously threatened democracy. |  |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:24 - Apr 30 with 732 views | StokieBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:23 - Apr 30 by BlueSmoke |
The ones that normal jewish people just getting on with their lives are terrified about? |
There are quite a few Jewish people on those marches.
The media are extremely unhelpful in the reporting. Some things said are clearly wrong and unacceptable but you're making out it's everyone.
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:25 - Apr 30 with 725 views | StokieBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:18 - Apr 30 by BlueSmoke |
I guess this is what the intifada looks like. |
Who exactly is this directed at?
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:26 - Apr 30 with 718 views | StokieBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:23 - Apr 30 by NthQldITFC |
Whilst that is undeniably true, and is also true for most large scale marches, if we shut down the right to protest completely in this specific instance we're effectively condoning ongoing war crimes and genocide.
It may be difficult to do, but the only just way to deal with the problem is to try to target the specific law breakers in the act, not silence democratic protest - that way lies an authoritarian nightmare and the death of accountability. We can't afford that in our seriously threatened democracy. |
That's far too nuanced.
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:32 - Apr 30 with 690 views | positivity |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:23 - Apr 30 by BlueSmoke |
The ones that normal jewish people just getting on with their lives are terrified about? |
both then |  |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:34 - Apr 30 with 674 views | positivity |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:21 - Apr 30 by Benters |
I’d say the Free Palestine marches. |
if you truly believe that, look at some of the speakers at the divide the kingdom march! | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:36 - Apr 30 with 662 views | itfcjoe |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:22 - Apr 30 by StokieBlue |
By a minority.
You don't think the far right protests are the same?
SB |
How big does a minority doing it on every one, every week have to go on for before it's decided that it can't continue?
I haven't mentioned the far right protests; but they seem to be bigger one off events (and are awful) as opposed to just regular ones every week |  |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:37 - Apr 30 with 660 views | itfcjoe |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:23 - Apr 30 by NthQldITFC |
Whilst that is undeniably true, and is also true for most large scale marches, if we shut down the right to protest completely in this specific instance we're effectively condoning ongoing war crimes and genocide.
It may be difficult to do, but the only just way to deal with the problem is to try to target the specific law breakers in the act, not silence democratic protest - that way lies an authoritarian nightmare and the death of accountability. We can't afford that in our seriously threatened democracy. |
Ok, so my point that they have been going on too long without a grip having been got on them so they are now totally out of hand is fair - because there isn't the active policing and arrests made each week during them to stop the bad behaviour
So it's tacitly accepted, just like shoplifting is these days | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:58 - Apr 30 with 613 views | giant_stow |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 17:33 - Apr 29 by GlasgowBlue |
Not at all. Reform and the Tories are irrelevant to this thread. Polanski is not. These stabbings have come in the same week Polanski stated "there's a conversation to be had about whether it's a perception of unsafety or whether it's actual unsafety, but neither is acceptable."
Ulla, like me, has some skin in this game via his Mrs and child. He's often been vocal on here about the increase in antisemitic attacks on British Jews. So I'm pretty certain he's unhappy with Polanski's words.
People keep bringing up that Polanski is a Jew. He's a Jew who has ben ostracised by the majority of British Jews, including most of his on family, for downplaying antisemitism in his own party and using his Jewishness as a cover for the vile antisemitic creatures who have migrated to the Grens from Corbyn's Labour party.
This is. avery good article by Nick Cohen which covers some of this.
https://www.thejc.com/opinion/ [Post edited 29 Apr 18:12]
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Compare and contrast the following, to Polanski's 'perception of unsafety':
"The government's independent reviewer of terrorism and state threats legislation, Jonathan Hall KC, told the BBC's The World Tonight that attacks on Jewish people in the UK have now become "the biggest national security emergency" since 2017.
"There are Brits in London in particular, Manchester, but probably all around the country, who are now thinking they cannot live a normal life. And it's not one attack, it's multiple attacks," he said."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/liv |  |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 10:06 - Apr 30 with 596 views | NthQldITFC |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:37 - Apr 30 by itfcjoe |
Ok, so my point that they have been going on too long without a grip having been got on them so they are now totally out of hand is fair - because there isn't the active policing and arrests made each week during them to stop the bad behaviour
So it's tacitly accepted, just like shoplifting is these days |
In that case would you demand that all shops are closed?
I totally agree with you that some of the behaviour on 'left wing' marches is unacceptable, but it's bigger picture time and wider context time. | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 10:08 - Apr 30 with 589 views | itfcjoe |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 10:06 - Apr 30 by NthQldITFC |
In that case would you demand that all shops are closed?
I totally agree with you that some of the behaviour on 'left wing' marches is unacceptable, but it's bigger picture time and wider context time. |
No, but would just not let criminality slide - broken windows theory and all that | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 10:49 - Apr 30 with 499 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 10:06 - Apr 30 by NthQldITFC |
In that case would you demand that all shops are closed?
I totally agree with you that some of the behaviour on 'left wing' marches is unacceptable, but it's bigger picture time and wider context time. |
I’ve never attended one of the marches - question for anyone that has, do they typically expel those who turn up in balaclavas waving Hamas flags (or report them?) I would have thought that was an arrestable offence given they are proscribed. I can fully imagine Jewish people would be intimidated by that given they committed the largest genocide of Jews since the Nazi’s?
For clarity though I certainly don’t agree with the proscribing of Palestine Action - another authoritarian move from an authoritarian government. | | | |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 11:05 - Apr 30 with 477 views | Axeldalai_lama |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 10:49 - Apr 30 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
I’ve never attended one of the marches - question for anyone that has, do they typically expel those who turn up in balaclavas waving Hamas flags (or report them?) I would have thought that was an arrestable offence given they are proscribed. I can fully imagine Jewish people would be intimidated by that given they committed the largest genocide of Jews since the Nazi’s?
For clarity though I certainly don’t agree with the proscribing of Palestine Action - another authoritarian move from an authoritarian government. |
And for balance is there anyone on the right wing demos self policing and distancing from the hood up, scarf up, coked up hardcore at the front smashing the police up and singing disgusting anti islam and racist chants?
Not aimed at you and it doesn't have to be exactly balanced every time but for certain posters who only post one side and only see one side it possibly needs spelling out a bit more. |  | | |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 11:08 - Apr 30 with 467 views | Camul123 |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 08:42 - Apr 30 by Ryorry |
Gobsmacking denial by him, I imagine it’s more comfortable for him to live in his cosy little dreamland. |
What utter nonsense.
Those of you seeking to make political capital out of another senseless act of terrorism are contemptible. | | | |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 11:19 - Apr 30 with 441 views | giant_stow |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 06:32 - Apr 30 by BanksterDebtSlave |
" The Palestine situation being the latest ‘reason’ for people to try to justify their antisemitism. I can see his point as surely it’s very easy to disassociate the actions of Netanyahu and his cronies from normal Jews going about their lives in the UK. Yet some people decide not to make that distinction."
Maybe more visibility for these Jewish voices might help break that negative association....
https://www.theguardian.com/wo
'The UK’s most senior progressive rabbis have warned that Israel’s current political direction risks becoming “incompatible with Jewish values”, while insisting that criticism of the country’s government is “a Jewish obligation” rather than an act of disloyalty.
Rabbi Charley Baginsky and Rabbi Josh Levy, co-leads of Progressive Judaism – the newly formed movement representing around a third of synagogues in the UK – said Israel’s trajectory could pose an “existential threat” not just to the country itself but to Judaism.' |
I read that article and its great to see them stand up and make that point - hats off. | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 11:24 - Apr 30 with 427 views | giant_stow |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 11:08 - Apr 30 by Camul123 |
What utter nonsense.
Those of you seeking to make political capital out of another senseless act of terrorism are contemptible. |
Who's seeking to make political capital out of this though? I don't see any campaigning or "vote X" / "don't vote Y"... | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:05 - Apr 30 with 359 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:22 - Apr 30 by StokieBlue |
By a minority.
You don't think the far right protests are the same?
SB |
Whatbouttery. This is a thread about attacks on Jews. We'v had plenty of threads on the far right protests and the violence that goes along with them.
Most decent people unequivocally condemned them without saying "yeah but what about the pro Palestine marches".
Can people please stop this every time there are attacks against Jews. |  |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:07 - Apr 30 with 356 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 09:24 - Apr 30 by StokieBlue |
There are quite a few Jewish people on those marches.
The media are extremely unhelpful in the reporting. Some things said are clearly wrong and unacceptable but you're making out it's everyone.
SB |
The people on those marches are the Jewish equivalent of "Blacks for Trump".
Tokens that are weaponised by people. Polanski is their latest poster boy. | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:14 - Apr 30 with 316 views | positivity |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:07 - Apr 30 by GlasgowBlue |
The people on those marches are the Jewish equivalent of "Blacks for Trump".
Tokens that are weaponised by people. Polanski is their latest poster boy. |
i know you're rightly keen on non-jews not telling jews how to think.
however even as a jew, i don't think you can tell other jews how they have to react to atrocities committed by the israeli governement. some will want to join marches against this.
what is your suggestion if they want to stand up and say "not in my name"? | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:16 - Apr 30 with 308 views | StokieBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:05 - Apr 30 by GlasgowBlue |
Whatbouttery. This is a thread about attacks on Jews. We'v had plenty of threads on the far right protests and the violence that goes along with them.
Most decent people unequivocally condemned them without saying "yeah but what about the pro Palestine marches".
Can people please stop this every time there are attacks against Jews. |
Protests were was raised by another poster and thus it's been responded to because it was in the view of myself and some others an unfair and overly simplistic view of the situation. You're essentially saying we can't push back on such views.
You always seem to put yourself forward as the arbiter of what is allowed to be discussed where nowadays. That's not the GB I remember who encouraged healthy debate.
I'll leave it there because this certainly isn't the thread to have a disagreement about the above as everyone can agree these are awful events.
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:34 - Apr 30 with 252 views | NthQldITFC |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:07 - Apr 30 by GlasgowBlue |
The people on those marches are the Jewish equivalent of "Blacks for Trump".
Tokens that are weaponised by people. Polanski is their latest poster boy. |
So any Jew whose conscience impels them to join a march in support of the repressed, disenfranchised and systematically butchered people of Palestine is just a weaponised token?
I have to say that really disgusts me. | |
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:40 - Apr 30 with 233 views | Blueschev |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:07 - Apr 30 by GlasgowBlue |
The people on those marches are the Jewish equivalent of "Blacks for Trump".
Tokens that are weaponised by people. Polanski is their latest poster boy. |
Implying that Jews are one monolithic block is what antisemites do. Is B'Tselem a token organisation? [Post edited 30 Apr 12:41]
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| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:43 - Apr 30 with 221 views | StokieBlue |
| Two Jewish bods stabbed on 12:07 - Apr 30 by GlasgowBlue |
The people on those marches are the Jewish equivalent of "Blacks for Trump".
Tokens that are weaponised by people. Polanski is their latest poster boy. |
That's incredibly dismissive of other people's views.
If someone else had posted similar musings you'd be all over it.
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