| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... 13:51 - Jul 9 with 12669 views | bluelagos |
Jump to 55 seconds in:
What is your appeal going to be to the people of Clacton?
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:20 - Jul 10 with 613 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:15 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Centrist Dads exist.
They are a problem because they represent the lack of curiosity, complacency and sanctimony of modern liberalism. |
Dude, you don't half talk a lot of nonsense. I generally don't get involved in political discussions, but I'm not sure the answer to extremism is more extremism.
But sure, you do you. |  |
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:21 - Jul 10 with 608 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:20 - Jul 10 by TheMoralMajority |
Dude, you don't half talk a lot of nonsense. I generally don't get involved in political discussions, but I'm not sure the answer to extremism is more extremism.
But sure, you do you. |
Where did I say the answer was extremism? |  | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:23 - Jul 10 with 592 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:21 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Where did I say the answer was extremism? |
You may want to look up what the opposite of centrism is. | |
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:25 - Jul 10 with 587 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:23 - Jul 10 by TheMoralMajority |
You may want to look up what the opposite of centrism is. |
You're rather proving Graeber's point about liberals being the least tolerant people with comments like that! | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:36 - Jul 10 with 545 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:13 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Adam Curtis puts it far more eloquently than I ever could.
But okay here you go!
Liberalism which was the dominant ideology of the last 50 years plus is no longer able to explain the world we live in. It doesn't believe in anything.
Neoliberal politics has produced the world we live in today. Austerity, failing services and infrastructure, a feckless political class who have ceded control and a deep hopelessness.
Trump, Brexit, austerity, the modern state of things are SYMPTOMS of liberalism's failure to imagine a future.
Unable to accept this, liberals blame Trump etc on anything other than themselves. Russia or fake news etc.
The Kamala is brat stuff was the distilled example. The Dems couldn't understand the gap between them and ordinary people.
When things don't go their way, the libs show no curiosity or desire to understand. Instead it's easier to blame people being 'stupid' or 'hoodwinked'.
Trump isn't the bogeyman. He's just a symptom.
Until liberals wake up to all this we will sleepwalk into dark times. |
“ Neoliberal politics has produced the world we live in today. Austerity, failing services and infrastructure.”
Let’s have some actual facts shall we, tax take as a %of GDP in UK is at a post war high (I.e largely in line with the post war period. Government spending as % of GDP is actually HIGHER than the post war period, and bear in mind they don’t fund water, energy etc anymore - we are spending more on the services we have. However, it’s not enough as we have an ageing population, and not enough taxpayers to fund that increase in pensioners, (and typically older people will use rhe NHS more).
So we don’t have austerity as you see it, we are taxing and spending more than ever - unfortunately we need to tax and spend more to fund those who aren’t economically active. Current workers cannot afford much more tax, we have half as many people paying tax as a proportion of the population - how would you deal with this demographic crisis since you said you were against pension reform? |  | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:37 - Jul 10 with 541 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:25 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
You're rather proving Graeber's point about liberals being the least tolerant people with comments like that! |
With facts? Ok, mate. Like I say, you do you. | |
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:43 - Jul 10 with 518 views | grow_our_own |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:15 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Centrist Dads exist.
They are a problem because they represent the lack of curiosity, complacency and sanctimony of modern liberalism. |
Your/Graeber's fundamental notion that liberty is bad blows my mind. That people who like liberty are somehow elitist and aloof causes my brain to crash. It's a universal value! Only extreme neoliberals believe liberty should be untampered or not counterbalanced by the other great virtue: building a compassionate society, but if the last few hundred years of human progress has taught us anything it's that to deny liberty is a virtue in and of itself is plain wrong. [Post edited 10 Jul 22:45]
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:43 - Jul 10 with 519 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:37 - Jul 10 by TheMoralMajority |
With facts? Ok, mate. Like I say, you do you. |
Saying that any other political stance other than centrism is extremist is not a fact. | | | |
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:44 - Jul 10 with 514 views | eireblue |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:15 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Centrist Dads exist.
They are a problem because they represent the lack of curiosity, complacency and sanctimony of modern liberalism. |
Centrist Dad is just a label, like Gammon. You just repeated the label and sneer.
I was hoping for a bit of a better response.
Come on give us a bit of demographic science.
Define that label precisely, and give us the numbers, and explain why they are a problem.
Why is that demographic part of the voter base, stopping the U.K. becoming a better place for humans to live happily?
I need real scientific evidence. And not isn’t just a smeary label invented a few years ago for people that other people dislike.
If Count Binface, can give concrete evidence of why certain hand dryers need relocation, you must be able to give me real numerical and demographic evidence of why this label is any more than calling people gammons. |  | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:44 - Jul 10 with 514 views | naa |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:13 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Adam Curtis puts it far more eloquently than I ever could.
But okay here you go!
Liberalism which was the dominant ideology of the last 50 years plus is no longer able to explain the world we live in. It doesn't believe in anything.
Neoliberal politics has produced the world we live in today. Austerity, failing services and infrastructure, a feckless political class who have ceded control and a deep hopelessness.
Trump, Brexit, austerity, the modern state of things are SYMPTOMS of liberalism's failure to imagine a future.
Unable to accept this, liberals blame Trump etc on anything other than themselves. Russia or fake news etc.
The Kamala is brat stuff was the distilled example. The Dems couldn't understand the gap between them and ordinary people.
When things don't go their way, the libs show no curiosity or desire to understand. Instead it's easier to blame people being 'stupid' or 'hoodwinked'.
Trump isn't the bogeyman. He's just a symptom.
Until liberals wake up to all this we will sleepwalk into dark times. |
A lot of words with no real substance.
The argument that liberalism has created the likes of Brexit and Reform is a valid one. Suggesting centrist dads have caused all the ills by not being curious is a bit of a stretch!
But, as so often, you offer no alternatives, no suggestions of how a different way would work (as has been pointed out, the population is very different to how it was 80 years ago). All you are doing is blaming others. It's no better than those who believe Reform have the answers. | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:46 - Jul 10 with 508 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:43 - Jul 10 by grow_our_own |
Your/Graeber's fundamental notion that liberty is bad blows my mind. That people who like liberty are somehow elitist and aloof causes my brain to crash. It's a universal value! Only extreme neoliberals believe liberty should be untampered or not counterbalanced by the other great virtue: building a compassionate society, but if the last few hundred years of human progress has taught us anything it's that to deny liberty is a virtue in and of itself is plain wrong. [Post edited 10 Jul 22:45]
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But I/Graeber aren't saying that liberty is bad. Quite the opposite!
The irony is that liberalism in its present guise is the thing that is actually attacking notions of liberty.
Look at the present government. One of if not the most authoritarian this country has ever seen! | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:50 - Jul 10 with 488 views | nrb1985 |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:44 - Jul 10 by eireblue |
Centrist Dad is just a label, like Gammon. You just repeated the label and sneer.
I was hoping for a bit of a better response.
Come on give us a bit of demographic science.
Define that label precisely, and give us the numbers, and explain why they are a problem.
Why is that demographic part of the voter base, stopping the U.K. becoming a better place for humans to live happily?
I need real scientific evidence. And not isn’t just a smeary label invented a few years ago for people that other people dislike.
If Count Binface, can give concrete evidence of why certain hand dryers need relocation, you must be able to give me real numerical and demographic evidence of why this label is any more than calling people gammons. |
I suspect the answer you're looking for is that Gary Stevenson told him. | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:52 - Jul 10 with 478 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:46 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
But I/Graeber aren't saying that liberty is bad. Quite the opposite!
The irony is that liberalism in its present guise is the thing that is actually attacking notions of liberty.
Look at the present government. One of if not the most authoritarian this country has ever seen! |
I do actually agree your last line - they are frighteningly authoritarian.
However, that’s exactly why nobody in their right mind would describe them as liberal, compulsory ID, banning VPN’s etc wouldn’t look out of place in Russia. Again, that’s the antithesis of a liberal society, they aren’t a liberal government. | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:53 - Jul 10 with 475 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:44 - Jul 10 by eireblue |
Centrist Dad is just a label, like Gammon. You just repeated the label and sneer.
I was hoping for a bit of a better response.
Come on give us a bit of demographic science.
Define that label precisely, and give us the numbers, and explain why they are a problem.
Why is that demographic part of the voter base, stopping the U.K. becoming a better place for humans to live happily?
I need real scientific evidence. And not isn’t just a smeary label invented a few years ago for people that other people dislike.
If Count Binface, can give concrete evidence of why certain hand dryers need relocation, you must be able to give me real numerical and demographic evidence of why this label is any more than calling people gammons. |
Okay when you see 'centrist Dad' just replace with professional managerial class (PMC).
Essentially the only people to be enthusiastic about a Starmer government.
They protect their position against the petit bourgeoisie by shoring up the capitalist status quo whilst at the same time loudly insisting on their progressive principles. But when push comes to shove their self interest trumps any kind of class consciousness.
Dan Evans is very good on this.
https://www.theguardian.com/co | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:53 - Jul 10 with 474 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:43 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Saying that any other political stance other than centrism is extremist is not a fact. |
I'm not saying that at all. You are. You have decided to propose that the issue is purely down to "liberalism" and "centrism" (specifically centrist dads... a fairly meaningless catch-all term).
If that is your view, and I have to accept that it is, seeing as you want to hammer it home at every possible opportunity, then the opposite of centrism IS extremism.
https://www.merriam-webster.co
This is just a fact. It is not labeling your political stance. You have STATED your political stance. You are in opposition to centrism. QED.
Perhaps if you articulated your views better rather than just posting links and soundbites, then I would not have an (apparently erroneous) idea of what your views are. [Post edited 10 Jul 10:57]
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:54 - Jul 10 with 468 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:52 - Jul 10 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
I do actually agree your last line - they are frighteningly authoritarian.
However, that’s exactly why nobody in their right mind would describe them as liberal, compulsory ID, banning VPN’s etc wouldn’t look out of place in Russia. Again, that’s the antithesis of a liberal society, they aren’t a liberal government. |
Agreed.
But they identify as liberals and were supported by people who see themselves as progressive liberals.
So something strange is going on with liberalism.... | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:55 - Jul 10 with 460 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:44 - Jul 10 by naa |
A lot of words with no real substance.
The argument that liberalism has created the likes of Brexit and Reform is a valid one. Suggesting centrist dads have caused all the ills by not being curious is a bit of a stretch!
But, as so often, you offer no alternatives, no suggestions of how a different way would work (as has been pointed out, the population is very different to how it was 80 years ago). All you are doing is blaming others. It's no better than those who believe Reform have the answers. |
The answer is to imagine a different future.
But to do that, some people may have to sacrifice something.
The libs are the very last group to want to do that. | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:57 - Jul 10 with 448 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:53 - Jul 10 by TheMoralMajority |
I'm not saying that at all. You are. You have decided to propose that the issue is purely down to "liberalism" and "centrism" (specifically centrist dads... a fairly meaningless catch-all term).
If that is your view, and I have to accept that it is, seeing as you want to hammer it home at every possible opportunity, then the opposite of centrism IS extremism.
https://www.merriam-webster.co
This is just a fact. It is not labeling your political stance. You have STATED your political stance. You are in opposition to centrism. QED.
Perhaps if you articulated your views better rather than just posting links and soundbites, then I would not have an (apparently erroneous) idea of what your views are. [Post edited 10 Jul 10:57]
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'The opposite of centrism is extremism.'
Right...
So any political ideology to the left or right is extremist?
I'm not sure you've thought this through. | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:57 - Jul 10 with 445 views | grow_our_own |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:46 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
But I/Graeber aren't saying that liberty is bad. Quite the opposite!
The irony is that liberalism in its present guise is the thing that is actually attacking notions of liberty.
Look at the present government. One of if not the most authoritarian this country has ever seen! |
But you're not following through to the reality of Graeber's and other anti-capitalists' ideal. What a world without markets, with little incentive for people to seek their own niche, to innovate, and strive. What do you think that would be like? Central planning means govt intervention in every aspect of your life. That's not liberty.
"Look at the present government. One of if not the most authoritarian this country has ever seen!" - pretty sure before a few hundred years ago, the British absolute monarchs/dictators were fairly authoritarian. [Post edited 10 Jul 11:01]
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:59 - Jul 10 with 441 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:57 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
'The opposite of centrism is extremism.'
Right...
So any political ideology to the left or right is extremist?
I'm not sure you've thought this through. |
You see. This is why I don't get involved in politics here.
Others in this thread have clearly articulated this better. I literally provided you with a link. Not to an opinion piece, but to an actual definition.
I bid you good day. | |
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| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 11:00 - Jul 10 with 438 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:36 - Jul 10 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
“ Neoliberal politics has produced the world we live in today. Austerity, failing services and infrastructure.”
Let’s have some actual facts shall we, tax take as a %of GDP in UK is at a post war high (I.e largely in line with the post war period. Government spending as % of GDP is actually HIGHER than the post war period, and bear in mind they don’t fund water, energy etc anymore - we are spending more on the services we have. However, it’s not enough as we have an ageing population, and not enough taxpayers to fund that increase in pensioners, (and typically older people will use rhe NHS more).
So we don’t have austerity as you see it, we are taxing and spending more than ever - unfortunately we need to tax and spend more to fund those who aren’t economically active. Current workers cannot afford much more tax, we have half as many people paying tax as a proportion of the population - how would you deal with this demographic crisis since you said you were against pension reform? |
We're still bailing out bankers whilst your local library has closed.
It's undeniable that neoliberalism has created this world. It's been the dominant ideology!
We need to reimagine the future.
It's interesting that you pivot immediately to tax and the fear that the only answer is to increase taxes.
Everything is up for grabs in a reimagined world! | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 11:01 - Jul 10 with 430 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:59 - Jul 10 by TheMoralMajority |
You see. This is why I don't get involved in politics here.
Others in this thread have clearly articulated this better. I literally provided you with a link. Not to an opinion piece, but to an actual definition.
I bid you good day. |
You've got yourself in a tangle! | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 11:03 - Jul 10 with 427 views | jasondozzell |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:57 - Jul 10 by grow_our_own |
But you're not following through to the reality of Graeber's and other anti-capitalists' ideal. What a world without markets, with little incentive for people to seek their own niche, to innovate, and strive. What do you think that would be like? Central planning means govt intervention in every aspect of your life. That's not liberty.
"Look at the present government. One of if not the most authoritarian this country has ever seen!" - pretty sure before a few hundred years ago, the British absolute monarchs/dictators were fairly authoritarian. [Post edited 10 Jul 11:01]
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It's interesting that you think automatically that I'm advocating for the total end of markets!
Democratic socialism would do nicely and we can keep private companies 🫡😉 | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 11:04 - Jul 10 with 420 views | eireblue |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 10:53 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
Okay when you see 'centrist Dad' just replace with professional managerial class (PMC).
Essentially the only people to be enthusiastic about a Starmer government.
They protect their position against the petit bourgeoisie by shoring up the capitalist status quo whilst at the same time loudly insisting on their progressive principles. But when push comes to shove their self interest trumps any kind of class consciousness.
Dan Evans is very good on this.
https://www.theguardian.com/co |
Which part of that response isn’t replacing a label with another label.
I asked for real demographic data and science, not another label and someone else’s opinion.
Count Binface was able to make a precise policy based on what the country, and many people noticed on this site. That was to get Emma Hayes out of that Kitchen studio. And many people benefited from her being moved and her being able to have more airtime. She was a joy to listen too.
Now, your words, please explain, with demographic science and precision, why you are not simply name calling. | | | |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 11:05 - Jul 10 with 416 views | TheMoralMajority |
| Count Binface on R4 Today this morning... on 11:01 - Jul 10 by jasondozzell |
You've got yourself in a tangle! |
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