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I knew from the secrecy surrounding the show and the production company involved that this was clearly not going to be a game show. The fact it was a one off programme on at 9pm on channel 4 being the other giveaway.
Could tell after literally two minutes that this was an anti gambling show the second they had the first bloke saying he’s got £1000 with him and that ‘it’s all I’ve got left’. Very obvious. The agenda is real.
And then five minutes in the fella saying he can bet more by going into his overdraft and credit cards having borrowed from his mates. Never a show like this about drinking. Funny that.
I didn’t watch it and was totally unaware of the show until I saw your post and then googled ‘million pound shot’.
From reading a brief overview of it, it sounded to me like quite a good idea which highlighted the dangers of gambling.
You mentioned that shows like these are never about alcohol but over the years, there have been quite a lot of fictional shows as well as soap opera characters that have detailed the perils of alcoholism - most people know about the risks.
Gambling addiction is probably still fairly new to the public subconscious in the sense that you don’t have to go inside a shop to become addicted - you can simply download various apps. But when the fun stops, it’s already too late. And I’m guessing that most people are unaware of how predatory gambling firms can be.
Right I’m going to ask a few questions - they might well be totally unfair so please feel free to ignore and apologies if you feel that they are too aggressive.
As a gambler who works inside that industry, do you think that it’s the individuals responsibility to not get addicted? Is there a lot of sympathy inside gambling (from what you’ve seen) for such addiction?
Do you think that most gambling firms do all that is possible not to prey on people? Are most gambling firms too persistent in their targeting?
And in your opinion is gambling too assessable? Should ads be banned as well as most mobile apps?
Thanks.
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Million Point Shot on 11:16 - Nov 2 with 1149 views
Million Point Shot on 07:59 - Nov 2 by MattinLondon
I didn’t watch it and was totally unaware of the show until I saw your post and then googled ‘million pound shot’.
From reading a brief overview of it, it sounded to me like quite a good idea which highlighted the dangers of gambling.
You mentioned that shows like these are never about alcohol but over the years, there have been quite a lot of fictional shows as well as soap opera characters that have detailed the perils of alcoholism - most people know about the risks.
Gambling addiction is probably still fairly new to the public subconscious in the sense that you don’t have to go inside a shop to become addicted - you can simply download various apps. But when the fun stops, it’s already too late. And I’m guessing that most people are unaware of how predatory gambling firms can be.
Right I’m going to ask a few questions - they might well be totally unfair so please feel free to ignore and apologies if you feel that they are too aggressive.
As a gambler who works inside that industry, do you think that it’s the individuals responsibility to not get addicted? Is there a lot of sympathy inside gambling (from what you’ve seen) for such addiction?
Do you think that most gambling firms do all that is possible not to prey on people? Are most gambling firms too persistent in their targeting?
And in your opinion is gambling too assessable? Should ads be banned as well as most mobile apps?
Thanks.
I watched it, was quite obviously a 'hoax' show from the off but that's by the by really. Probably drew more eyeballs and media coverage than a documentary on the perils of gambling, so in that respect job done.
There was a part of me that found it a little rich of Bradley Walsh to be presenting the show when his career has largely been built on elements of the tactics this was purporting to critique. 'Move 1 step closer to the chaser for X amount more money' etc. Not gambling contestants own money admittedly, and not a format I have an issue with personally, but the dangly carrot technique is a similar principle. Also a little rich of C4, who regularly sell their advertising space to gambling firms, using such techniques that this show was highlighting. But then is it the role of C4 or any other media outlet to prevent that? Probably not. Should we even expect these big gambling firms to have any sense of morality when it comes to praying on addicts? You would like to think so, but again probably not. Ultimately has to come down to regulation IMO.
Its a sensitive one for me, I lost a family member to suicide when I was a child. He had got himself into so much gambling debt that he didn't see a way out. The perils exist in other areas like drink, I do think it's different though. Theoretically I could lose huge amounts of money in seconds from my own bedroom gambling. I could lose everything in 2 minutes should I be inclined to risk it. It's very hidden, very quick, and very easy to do. Despite my own experiences, I do also think there needs to be personal responsibility, like with any things in life. Call me old fashioned but as a society I do think we're a bit quick to blame others. We're all here on this rock navigating life, you do also have to be responsible for your own actions. Personal responsibility, education, tighter regulations, it needs to be a combination of all of these things.
I found the interview with Patrick Foster pretty powerful at the end. I'd heard him speak before on a Ladbible story on YouTube, his story is obviously extreme but certainly hard hitting. Link for anyone interested:
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Million Point Shot on 11:39 - Nov 2 with 1104 views
Million Point Shot on 07:59 - Nov 2 by MattinLondon
I didn’t watch it and was totally unaware of the show until I saw your post and then googled ‘million pound shot’.
From reading a brief overview of it, it sounded to me like quite a good idea which highlighted the dangers of gambling.
You mentioned that shows like these are never about alcohol but over the years, there have been quite a lot of fictional shows as well as soap opera characters that have detailed the perils of alcoholism - most people know about the risks.
Gambling addiction is probably still fairly new to the public subconscious in the sense that you don’t have to go inside a shop to become addicted - you can simply download various apps. But when the fun stops, it’s already too late. And I’m guessing that most people are unaware of how predatory gambling firms can be.
Right I’m going to ask a few questions - they might well be totally unfair so please feel free to ignore and apologies if you feel that they are too aggressive.
As a gambler who works inside that industry, do you think that it’s the individuals responsibility to not get addicted? Is there a lot of sympathy inside gambling (from what you’ve seen) for such addiction?
Do you think that most gambling firms do all that is possible not to prey on people? Are most gambling firms too persistent in their targeting?
And in your opinion is gambling too assessable? Should ads be banned as well as most mobile apps?
Thanks.
Your penultimate question is one that I've found interesting recently.
A while ago I signed up to BOTB (a prize draw company) to buy a ticket in a raffle for something or other I liked the look of. I was VERY careful (as I always am) to make sure I opted out of all marketing.
Spent my 10p (or whatever it was), didn't win the raffle, and just carried on with life.
Except I kept getting weekly emails from them, advising me of updates to their T&Cs; reminding me of their safety net processes; and also reminding me to use credits I had on my account, which had been put there by them.
I contacted them to unsubscribe from these emails, and they advised me that I couldn't stop these emails, as they apparently fell under the 'legitimate contact' exemptions for the various opt-outs. The only way to stop them spamming me with content designed to try and draw me back in was to ask them to delete my account entirely.
As predatory as it comes, using legal loopholes to keep targeting customers who have expressly asked not to be contacted.
Not a prophet, or a stone-age man; just a mortal with potential of a superman.
Million Point Shot on 11:16 - Nov 2 by _CliveBaker_
I watched it, was quite obviously a 'hoax' show from the off but that's by the by really. Probably drew more eyeballs and media coverage than a documentary on the perils of gambling, so in that respect job done.
There was a part of me that found it a little rich of Bradley Walsh to be presenting the show when his career has largely been built on elements of the tactics this was purporting to critique. 'Move 1 step closer to the chaser for X amount more money' etc. Not gambling contestants own money admittedly, and not a format I have an issue with personally, but the dangly carrot technique is a similar principle. Also a little rich of C4, who regularly sell their advertising space to gambling firms, using such techniques that this show was highlighting. But then is it the role of C4 or any other media outlet to prevent that? Probably not. Should we even expect these big gambling firms to have any sense of morality when it comes to praying on addicts? You would like to think so, but again probably not. Ultimately has to come down to regulation IMO.
Its a sensitive one for me, I lost a family member to suicide when I was a child. He had got himself into so much gambling debt that he didn't see a way out. The perils exist in other areas like drink, I do think it's different though. Theoretically I could lose huge amounts of money in seconds from my own bedroom gambling. I could lose everything in 2 minutes should I be inclined to risk it. It's very hidden, very quick, and very easy to do. Despite my own experiences, I do also think there needs to be personal responsibility, like with any things in life. Call me old fashioned but as a society I do think we're a bit quick to blame others. We're all here on this rock navigating life, you do also have to be responsible for your own actions. Personal responsibility, education, tighter regulations, it needs to be a combination of all of these things.
I found the interview with Patrick Foster pretty powerful at the end. I'd heard him speak before on a Ladbible story on YouTube, his story is obviously extreme but certainly hard hitting. Link for anyone interested:
On the last sentences of your third paragraph, I think that holds some water IF the other parties can be trusted to play fair.
In the example I mentioned above, I opted out of all communication just to avoid getting spammed, but I can imagine that people on the cusp of having an issue (can safely have a gamble now and then, and know how to stop themselves spiralling) might do that in order to keep themselves on the straight and narrow. It's certainly not right then, if they have done all they can to protect themselves, if firms can abuse loopholes in order to try and draw people in.
Not a prophet, or a stone-age man; just a mortal with potential of a superman.
On the last sentences of your third paragraph, I think that holds some water IF the other parties can be trusted to play fair.
In the example I mentioned above, I opted out of all communication just to avoid getting spammed, but I can imagine that people on the cusp of having an issue (can safely have a gamble now and then, and know how to stop themselves spiralling) might do that in order to keep themselves on the straight and narrow. It's certainly not right then, if they have done all they can to protect themselves, if firms can abuse loopholes in order to try and draw people in.
Very fair point.
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Million Point Shot on 13:21 - Nov 2 with 936 views
You say the agenda is real? What agenda is that? The agenda to highlight the predatory practices of gambling companies?
I know a few people that have had their lives ruined by gambling addiction, one very close to me. It's a mugs game and the more done to highlight the issues with these companies and those that operate within them, the better.
You say the agenda is real? What agenda is that? The agenda to highlight the predatory practices of gambling companies?
I know a few people that have had their lives ruined by gambling addiction, one very close to me. It's a mugs game and the more done to highlight the issues with these companies and those that operate within them, the better.
Clearly is an agenda. Nothing that was said or done in the show they say gambling companies do was illegal. All of which is heavily legislated.
And to suggest 1 in 14 suicides is specifically caused by gambling is an enormous lie. Anyone that gambles and kills themself, gambling is blamed. But drinking or drugs aren’t even if they do those too. Why is that? Because there’s an agenda.
Gambling is an easy target and some people should not be allowed to publicly speak on it as some kind of ‘expert’. Will Prochazka for example who was on the show is an absolute disgrace. That cretin will not stop until the industry is removed as a whole.
There’s no such thing as personal responsibility anymore. It’s always someone else to blame.
Million Point Shot on 12:42 - Nov 2 by TRUE_BLUE123
There has been countless TV storylines about the dangers of Alcohol addiction.
None of which were like this show.
It’s literally not allowed for anyone to bet with a credit card. And yet 3 minutes into the show they’ve got a bloke saying he’s only got £1000 to bet with that he’s borrowed from his mates but that it’s ok because he will use his overdraft and credit cards. F**k off. That isn’t a thing. But the casual viewer will assume that’s standard practice.
Million Point Shot on 18:06 - Nov 2 by BackToRussia
Do you work in the gambling industry by any chance?
Yes - as I’m sure you are awake by asking.
As is my right to defend it.
Some of those examples - the credit card swipe for 3k ffs - are absolutely not something that can actually happen in the real world. The show suggesting it can and does is misleading. It’s the same as the show being about drinking and a bloke who’s just come directly from a liver transplant for alcoholism is allowed to be served in a pub despite everyone knowing he’s an alcoholic and can’t be served. It wouldn’t happen.
But the show suggests this does happen in gambling. It’s massively unfair
You say the agenda is real? What agenda is that? The agenda to highlight the predatory practices of gambling companies?
I know a few people that have had their lives ruined by gambling addiction, one very close to me. It's a mugs game and the more done to highlight the issues with these companies and those that operate within them, the better.
It’s a mugs game to you as you aren’t involved in it.
Some people choose not to gamble. Some choose not to drink. Or do drugs. Or anything else such as that. Fair enough. People can do what they want.
But non gamblers have a tendency to go at the gambling industry in the hope of destroying it for those that do it. Or indeed have a life depending on it. There’s now only 150 jobs in this country doing what I do. 150. If my firm goes bust, that’s 10 of us (2 with my specific set of skills regarding horses) that would almost he forced into working overseas or change industry.
It’s literally not allowed for anyone to bet with a credit card. And yet 3 minutes into the show they’ve got a bloke saying he’s only got £1000 to bet with that he’s borrowed from his mates but that it’s ok because he will use his overdraft and credit cards. F**k off. That isn’t a thing. But the casual viewer will assume that’s standard practice.
I had no idea that people couldn’t bet with a credit card.
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Million Point Shot on 18:40 - Nov 2 with 662 views
Some of those examples - the credit card swipe for 3k ffs - are absolutely not something that can actually happen in the real world. The show suggesting it can and does is misleading. It’s the same as the show being about drinking and a bloke who’s just come directly from a liver transplant for alcoholism is allowed to be served in a pub despite everyone knowing he’s an alcoholic and can’t be served. It wouldn’t happen.
But the show suggests this does happen in gambling. It’s massively unfair
As a recovered alcoholic I can honestly say that I've never been targeted by Stella Artois to have another drink. They haven't called, texted or emailed me. They haven't put free cans in my shopping bag to lure me back. Gambling firms need to stop the targeting of people once they've gone. Its gross.
Some of those examples - the credit card swipe for 3k ffs - are absolutely not something that can actually happen in the real world. The show suggesting it can and does is misleading. It’s the same as the show being about drinking and a bloke who’s just come directly from a liver transplant for alcoholism is allowed to be served in a pub despite everyone knowing he’s an alcoholic and can’t be served. It wouldn’t happen.
But the show suggests this does happen in gambling. It’s massively unfair
That's fair enough, a big broadcaster like C4 shouldn't be making a basic error like that. But the core point that gamblers will and do find any means of getting more funds to continue gambling holds true, doesn't it? For instance, you could open a current account with a £500 overdraft with very few checks pretty quickly, couldn't you?
Fair enough, you're defending something you're close to and rely on financially but surely the right approach is to be balanced about the industry rather than going on the attack and minimising any of the many serious dangers associated with it?
As a recovered alcoholic I can honestly say that I've never been targeted by Stella Artois to have another drink. They haven't called, texted or emailed me. They haven't put free cans in my shopping bag to lure me back. Gambling firms need to stop the targeting of people once they've gone. Its gross.
And they are no longer allowed to advertise at football, or during sports broadcasts...
Incidentally- from the Lancet
Findings Suicide was the leading cause of death among patients with gambling disorder (37 of 148 deaths; 25%). Patients with gambling disorder had a higher suicide risk than the general population (standardized mortality ratio = 5.12, 95% CI [3.71; 7.06]), and 5 of 12 patient groups with other conditions. Suicide risk was not significantly different when compared to that of patients with anxiety disorders, personality disorders, or depression. However, suicide risk was lower among patients with gambling disorder than patients with substance use disorders, alcohol dependence, psychotic disorders, or mood disorders.
And they are no longer allowed to advertise at football, or during sports broadcasts...
Incidentally- from the Lancet
Findings Suicide was the leading cause of death among patients with gambling disorder (37 of 148 deaths; 25%). Patients with gambling disorder had a higher suicide risk than the general population (standardized mortality ratio = 5.12, 95% CI [3.71; 7.06]), and 5 of 12 patient groups with other conditions. Suicide risk was not significantly different when compared to that of patients with anxiety disorders, personality disorders, or depression. However, suicide risk was lower among patients with gambling disorder than patients with substance use disorders, alcohol dependence, psychotic disorders, or mood disorders.
The people who blindly defend gambling firms either make a living out of it or spend a lot of time doing do it. The lack of empathy and selfish concerns about themselves cannot be hidden. Gambling much like drinking has been going on since the dark ages. It would continue without the aggressive targeting. When times are hard it makes it even worse. Just fecking stop. I feel just as sad seeing the the person buying 40 scratch cards as I do seeing someone looking into an empty bottle. What ever the suicide rates are for any addiction or illness, 1 is too many.
The people who blindly defend gambling firms either make a living out of it or spend a lot of time doing do it. The lack of empathy and selfish concerns about themselves cannot be hidden. Gambling much like drinking has been going on since the dark ages. It would continue without the aggressive targeting. When times are hard it makes it even worse. Just fecking stop. I feel just as sad seeing the the person buying 40 scratch cards as I do seeing someone looking into an empty bottle. What ever the suicide rates are for any addiction or illness, 1 is too many.
And if the programme is a fake I couldn't give less of a sh1t if it hits the point.
It’s a mugs game to you as you aren’t involved in it.
Some people choose not to gamble. Some choose not to drink. Or do drugs. Or anything else such as that. Fair enough. People can do what they want.
But non gamblers have a tendency to go at the gambling industry in the hope of destroying it for those that do it. Or indeed have a life depending on it. There’s now only 150 jobs in this country doing what I do. 150. If my firm goes bust, that’s 10 of us (2 with my specific set of skills regarding horses) that would almost he forced into working overseas or change industry.
Seems like you may be the one with an agenda.
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Million Point Shot on 11:56 - Nov 3 with 120 views
My ‘agenda’ is that Channel 4 should not be allowed to broadcast stuff that isn’t factually correct.
The bloke doing 3k bets on his card having already stated to the bookmaker that his affordable amount to lose was 1k is not something that could happen.
Him stating to the bookie that he’s borrowed money from friends to bet above his means and then there being no intervention completed at that exact moment is not something that could happen.
Him using a credit card to continue gambling is not something that could happen.
I could go on. It’s not agenda. It’s the fact this show has deliberately lied throughout to turn those with far less knowledge on the subject deliberately against the gambling industry and allow a platform for radical anti-gambling lobbyists like Will Prochazka a voice. It’s hugely unfair and hugely bias.
But if all you’ve got as a response is ‘you have the agenda’, rather than a balanced counter argument then that’s on you.
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