| ITFC for SALE 15:26 - Oct 3 with 6003 views | sotd78 |
My daughters who sometimes see the wood for the trees have both suggested this:
Evans wants out. The club is up for sale. What any buyer looks at is current outgoings versus income and what sort of gap they need to fund.
Allowing Hurst to offload high wage earners and replace with hungry but lower cost players reduces the budget deficit.
Instantly the club looks more saleable.
Dropping a division will actually enhance that saleability. Especially as it probably would mean we sold Bart, Andre, Knudsen and any other player of value.
This has all the hallmarks of an owner looking to get out and cut his losses. |  |
| Blue shirts/white shorts - sotd78 |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:28 - Oct 3 with 3618 views | No9 |
So your daughters anticipate the Owner would swallow all the losses? |  | | |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:31 - Oct 3 with 3594 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
But the attendance will drop a further 2/3/4 thousand if we are to relegated.
And we have just spent 8 million pound on players tied to 3 year deals
As well as a manger and an assistant who have also been dealt 3 year deals.
I have to say, it doesn't sound like a good prospect for potential buyers. |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:31 - Oct 3 with 3593 views | StokieBlue |
Anybody who realistically wants to buy the club and fund a real promotion push isn't going to give a monkeys about 6m here or there.
If they do care then they aren't going to be funding a promotion push and everyone will be moaning in 10 years that they are just like Evans.
So, in summary, I don't think it's a great theory.
SB [Post edited 3 Oct 2018 15:32]
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:31 - Oct 3 with 3590 views | FrimleyBlue |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:28 - Oct 3 by No9 |
So your daughters anticipate the Owner would swallow all the losses? |
I suppose he'd have to wake up eventually and realise that we're not going to go up any time soon, so the likelihood is, is that he will lose his £ |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:35 - Oct 3 with 3564 views | sotd78 |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:28 - Oct 3 by No9 |
So your daughters anticipate the Owner would swallow all the losses? |
This is a business. It is losing money. Previous losses are paper losses - not real cash.
Businessmen often have to decide to stay in and add to the paper loss or sell up and cut the loss.
Evans behaviour smacks of someone clearing the decks to maximise the sale price.
Anyone buying will want to know this: - how much for the assets and how much for the liability. Assets are players and anything we own (not much) and liability is contracts. Hence lower wages for lesser players; no contract talks for Knudsen and only recently and drawn out for Bart because it protected the value of the asset.
One of my daughters is on an MBA which looks specifically at this sort of business activity. | |
| Blue shirts/white shorts - sotd78 |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:37 - Oct 3 with 3543 views | Darth_Koont |
But any buyer coming in could lower our costs over a year or two anyway. What will be interesting to them is our league position and our crowd size. If it's a plan to attract a buyer then it's not working at all on those measures.
To me, it looks more like he's in it for the long haul and at least wants to make us sustainable year-on-year and not lose as much as before. |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:37 - Oct 3 with 3542 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:35 - Oct 3 by sotd78 |
This is a business. It is losing money. Previous losses are paper losses - not real cash.
Businessmen often have to decide to stay in and add to the paper loss or sell up and cut the loss.
Evans behaviour smacks of someone clearing the decks to maximise the sale price.
Anyone buying will want to know this: - how much for the assets and how much for the liability. Assets are players and anything we own (not much) and liability is contracts. Hence lower wages for lesser players; no contract talks for Knudsen and only recently and drawn out for Bart because it protected the value of the asset.
One of my daughters is on an MBA which looks specifically at this sort of business activity. |
He doesnt make a loss. He uses the 7m loss to offset against his tax bill, so when he sends in to the tax revenue at the end of the year he can claim a nice 7 million back every year.
He isn't bothered one bit about the club, he's only bothered about using it as a nice little tax saver. | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:38 - Oct 3 with 3524 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:37 - Oct 3 by Darth_Koont |
But any buyer coming in could lower our costs over a year or two anyway. What will be interesting to them is our league position and our crowd size. If it's a plan to attract a buyer then it's not working at all on those measures.
To me, it looks more like he's in it for the long haul and at least wants to make us sustainable year-on-year and not lose as much as before. |
I think the stale nature of the club has meant that regardless whether you lower ticket prices right now, people just are disinterested with Ipswich Town regardless of ticket prices. | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:41 - Oct 3 with 3506 views | footers |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:37 - Oct 3 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
He doesnt make a loss. He uses the 7m loss to offset against his tax bill, so when he sends in to the tax revenue at the end of the year he can claim a nice 7 million back every year.
He isn't bothered one bit about the club, he's only bothered about using it as a nice little tax saver. |
Oh christ, not this again. |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:41 - Oct 3 with 3503 views | jeera |
How does someone see the wood for the trees? |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:44 - Oct 3 with 3470 views | jeera |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:41 - Oct 3 by footers |
Oh christ, not this again. |
Ha.
Yes cos that how tax deduction works!
You simply offset your entire losses directly against your tax bill. Simples.
Heh. | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:45 - Oct 3 with 3463 views | Deano69 |
Didn't think it was much of a secret that the club could be purchased by the right owner(s) - think thats ME's words |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:46 - Oct 3 with 3458 views | Guthrum |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:37 - Oct 3 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
He doesnt make a loss. He uses the 7m loss to offset against his tax bill, so when he sends in to the tax revenue at the end of the year he can claim a nice 7 million back every year.
He isn't bothered one bit about the club, he's only bothered about using it as a nice little tax saver. |
It doesn't work like that, because the tax rate is not 100%.
Losses can only be offset against profits (not the tax bill). Thus, at a business tax rate of 19%, he is spending an extra £7m to save himself £1.3m on his other businesses. |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:47 - Oct 3 with 3442 views | SomethingBlue |
I don't think a sale is unrealistic but completely disagree that relegation would expedite one. | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:48 - Oct 3 with 3432 views | footers |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:44 - Oct 3 by jeera |
Ha.
Yes cos that how tax deduction works!
You simply offset your entire losses directly against your tax bill. Simples.
Heh. |
Really? I've racked up a debt of nearly a million this year and was hoping to get off paying any tax come April. That's how it works, right? | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:49 - Oct 3 with 3416 views | jeera |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:46 - Oct 3 by Guthrum |
It doesn't work like that, because the tax rate is not 100%.
Losses can only be offset against profits (not the tax bill). Thus, at a business tax rate of 19%, he is spending an extra £7m to save himself £1.3m on his other businesses. |
It's brilliant isn't it?
I am fecking beside myself here! | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:50 - Oct 3 with 3396 views | BOjK |
Utter nonsense. |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:51 - Oct 3 with 3376 views | jeera |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:48 - Oct 3 by footers |
Really? I've racked up a debt of nearly a million this year and was hoping to get off paying any tax come April. That's how it works, right? |
This guy was calling another poster stupid only yesterday.
I haven't been this happy in ages!
I've gotta go. I can barely see through the tears.
Wonderful thread. 'Wood for the trees'/club a better prospect for a buyer in the lower leagues with an empty stadium, but crap players on low wages/ tax breaks...
It's got everything. | |
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| You or whoever told you this doesn't understand tax regs, or the law on 15:52 - Oct 3 with 3378 views | Dyland |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:37 - Oct 3 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
He doesnt make a loss. He uses the 7m loss to offset against his tax bill, so when he sends in to the tax revenue at the end of the year he can claim a nice 7 million back every year.
He isn't bothered one bit about the club, he's only bothered about using it as a nice little tax saver. |
I've seen this argument laid out in great detail on the Comments section by posters who claim to be best mates with some corporate tax guru. The arguments are completely fallacious*. This doesn't mean Evans is in love with ITFC of course, but the suggestion it's "a nice little tax saver" is hilariously wrong.
* this is the term used in logical reasoning to call out utter bollix :) |  |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:53 - Oct 3 with 3365 views | MVBlue |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:48 - Oct 3 by footers |
Really? I've racked up a debt of nearly a million this year and was hoping to get off paying any tax come April. That's how it works, right? |
You can offset landlord house maintenance costs against HMRC rent earnings tax.
You can offset corporation loss against coproration tax.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/corporation-tax-calculating-and-claiming-a-loss
"If your company or organisation is liable for Corporation Tax and makes a loss from trading, the sale or disposal of a capital asset, or on property income, then you may be able to claim relief from Corporation Tax. " [Post edited 3 Oct 2018 15:56]
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:53 - Oct 3 with 3362 views | Deano69 |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:48 - Oct 3 by footers |
Really? I've racked up a debt of nearly a million this year and was hoping to get off paying any tax come April. That's how it works, right? |
That's my pension screwed. Been try to spend money on loss making entities so the Tax man will pay me rather than the other way round. Shoot me now... | |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:53 - Oct 3 with 3359 views | chicoazul |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:44 - Oct 3 by jeera |
Ha.
Yes cos that how tax deduction works!
You simply offset your entire losses directly against your tax bill. Simples.
Heh. |
Then how come i'm a terrible business man who loses money but am not a millionaire? Thats what I want to know. |  |
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| Even better, the IR will actually GIVE you a million back (n/t) on 15:53 - Oct 3 with 3360 views | Dyland |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:48 - Oct 3 by footers |
Really? I've racked up a debt of nearly a million this year and was hoping to get off paying any tax come April. That's how it works, right? |
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| ITFC for SALE on 15:53 - Oct 3 with 3362 views | Steve_M |
It's clear Evans wants to sell, he even hinted at it in his legendary 'interview' this Summer.
You're wrong though that a League 1 club is easier to sell than a Championship one, being one division below the Premier League allows any new buyer to dream about a rapid promotion as Evans did when Sheepy sold the club to him. |  |
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| Indeed on 15:54 - Oct 3 with 3334 views | Dyland |
| ITFC for SALE on 15:47 - Oct 3 by SomethingBlue |
I don't think a sale is unrealistic but completely disagree that relegation would expedite one. |
Cognitive dissonance grinding through the gears. | |
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