| Ever feel like we're being played. 08:39 - Oct 11 with 1951 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/oct/11/labour-carbon-capture-clim
'Starmer campaigned on a platform of “change”. But there has been no change from this demented Tory policy, no change in the influence of the fossil fuel industry, no change in the perverse justifications. And, I suspect, there will be no change from £50bn for this profligate CCS scheme.
The chancellor, Rachel Reeves, talks of a fiscal “black hole” of £21.9bn. But this is a real black hole: a long tunnel into the rocks, down which £21.7bn and more will be poured. A more reliable and cost-effective means of sequestering carbon would be to bundle up the money (roughly 1,100 tonnes in £20 notes) and shove it down the pipe.'
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 08:59 - Oct 11 with 1863 views | NthQldITFC |
I must first confess that I don't know enough about the various forms of CCS to have any firm opinions, but my gut feel based on instinct and casual reading is that it's a load of bollox, primarily because of scale issues, also lifetime of equipment and energy costs of maintenance.
It seems to be a politician's or industrialist's perfect way of saying "Ooh, look at the exciting, clever (useless) thing we're doing and don't watch while we keep raping the planet to death, because we're certainly not going to stop doing that, suckers."
I'd be delighted to be put right on that if I'm talking out of my sinkhole.
I was (and still am to some extent) prepared to give Starmer some time and leeway, but he's certainly not impressing me on most of the big issues so far. |  |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 09:47 - Oct 11 with 1782 views | Guthrum |
There's always been a problem with getting these technologies to scale effectively, but I also can't help feeling that a lot of the anger is down to fears (perhaps not unfounded) that it would to an extent invalidate long-term campaigns for reduction in motor vehicles, promotion of renewables and the like, into which people have invested much time and energy.
The reality is all other forms of CO2 sequestration (e.g. reforestation) are immensely slow. It takes millennia to lay down coal seams, or peat beds. We need to reduce atmospheric CO2 now.
The push has to be a parallel one of developing these ideas along with continuing to cut CO2 output. In that, I agree with Monbiot's concerns that it will be used as an excuse not to do the latter. |  |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 09:58 - Oct 11 with 1734 views | wrightsrightglove |
I don’t know enough about the subject but you want something to remove carbon from the atmosphere and store it? That’s trees right? That’s literally what they do? That amount of money could go into dramatically cutting down the carbon footprint of every state owned building in the country alongside a monumental planting programme.
As I said, I don’t know enough about it, but it seems like a ludicrous idea to me |  | | |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 10:03 - Oct 11 with 1713 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 09:58 - Oct 11 by wrightsrightglove |
I don’t know enough about the subject but you want something to remove carbon from the atmosphere and store it? That’s trees right? That’s literally what they do? That amount of money could go into dramatically cutting down the carbon footprint of every state owned building in the country alongside a monumental planting programme.
As I said, I don’t know enough about it, but it seems like a ludicrous idea to me |
The problem with trees os that they come down, sooner or later, and return co2 back to the atmosphere.... managed forests have to be thinned etc. | | | |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:23 - Oct 11 with 1522 views | Dubtractor |
Yeah, this isn't quite as silly as it seems, and needs to be considered alongside the renewables infrastructure that this government is supporting, plus the UK emissions trading scheme, which ultimately makes burning fossil carbon more expensive, and therefore should stimulate growth in alternatives. |  |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:29 - Oct 11 with 1496 views | Help |
Are you saying that massive global mega rich industries have a disproportionate influence on national governments across the world. Influencing policy.
Well I never. |  |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:31 - Oct 11 with 1494 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 10:03 - Oct 11 by redrickstuhaart |
The problem with trees os that they come down, sooner or later, and return co2 back to the atmosphere.... managed forests have to be thinned etc. |
“return co2 back to the atmosphere”
Especially when we burn them at power stations and call it renewable energy… | | | |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:34 - Oct 11 with 1472 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
Yeah but the version of Labour Bankster doesn't like did it... |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:35 - Oct 11 with 1474 views | WeWereZombies |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:23 - Oct 11 by Dubtractor |
Yeah, this isn't quite as silly as it seems, and needs to be considered alongside the renewables infrastructure that this government is supporting, plus the UK emissions trading scheme, which ultimately makes burning fossil carbon more expensive, and therefore should stimulate growth in alternatives. |
Indeed, carbon sequestration is in its infancy whereas renewable energy is really coming of age now. But there are also considerable advantages in popularising the threat of a consumption addicted society, a much more difficult 'sell' to industry and to consumers. |  |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 11:42 - Oct 11 with 1441 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 08:59 - Oct 11 by NthQldITFC |
I must first confess that I don't know enough about the various forms of CCS to have any firm opinions, but my gut feel based on instinct and casual reading is that it's a load of bollox, primarily because of scale issues, also lifetime of equipment and energy costs of maintenance.
It seems to be a politician's or industrialist's perfect way of saying "Ooh, look at the exciting, clever (useless) thing we're doing and don't watch while we keep raping the planet to death, because we're certainly not going to stop doing that, suckers."
I'd be delighted to be put right on that if I'm talking out of my sinkhole.
I was (and still am to some extent) prepared to give Starmer some time and leeway, but he's certainly not impressing me on most of the big issues so far. |
My gut is with your gut, Oz comes to mind. Imagine an industrial rebirth based on shoving an invisible gas into the ground!! | |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 15:31 - Oct 11 with 1246 views | Ftnfwest |
the public wants what the public gets |  | | |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 16:08 - Oct 11 with 1167 views | DanTheMan |
The problem is, CCS has been around the corner for ages and nobody has managed to make it work at scale. It's the same thing that was promised about "clean coal" that didn't work either.
As someone else mentioned, the fear is that we'll put all our eggs in this basket but we cannot bank on this ever working. This has to be considered a "nice to have".
Much like we can't bank on getting fusion power any time soon. |  |
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| Ever feel like we're being played. on 16:31 - Oct 11 with 1118 views | Cafe_Newman |
There's been more of an acceleration than a change.
That said, did anyone actually ask Sir Keir what he meant by "change"? Did he give any specifics? |  | | |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 18:35 - Oct 11 with 1033 views | bournemouthblue |
| Ever feel like we're being played. on 16:31 - Oct 11 by Cafe_Newman |
There's been more of an acceleration than a change.
That said, did anyone actually ask Sir Keir what he meant by "change"? Did he give any specifics? |
Change of Leadership I guess? |  |
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