| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? 17:04 - May 3 with 2138 views | GeoffSentence |
The Premier League is changing the financial rules next season, squad cost ratio rules mean that clubs can spend a maximum of 85% of their football-related revenue on player costs, which includes wages, amortised transfer fees, and agents' fees.
Last time in the premier league we had a turnover of 155m , 85% of that is 131.75 m
Our wage bill was 77m
Assuming similar figures this time that would leave headroom of 53m for amortised transfer fees and agents fees.
How does that work out? If we pay say 30m for a player with a 3 year contract does that mean that only 10m is counted in this years SCR? |  |
| |  |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 17:11 - May 3 with 2074 views | Metal_Hacker |
I always thought that £30m over the suggested 3 years would only subtract a 33% of the purchase price of the player so you’d simply deduct only £10m from the 85% left to spend
I’ve been wrong before |  |
| |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 17:31 - May 3 with 1987 views | Swansea_Blue |
It looks like these new rules make it harder for a club like us to upgrade the squad quickly? Fine for the big boys of course. |  |
| |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 17:33 - May 3 with 1968 views | GeoffSentence |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 17:31 - May 3 by Swansea_Blue |
It looks like these new rules make it harder for a club like us to upgrade the squad quickly? Fine for the big boys of course. |
Yep, makes it difficult for a smaller club with a wealthy backer, like say Manchester City a few years ago, to break into the big time. | |
| |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 17:38 - May 3 with 1929 views | FlittonBlue |
Our Womens side is on the up, sell them back to ourselves to top up the figures? |  | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:09 - May 3 with 1818 views | Daninthecampo |
Yes correct and that's why players get 4 or 5 year contracts to spread the costs
The 77m wage bill is that for all staff? I believe it's only players wages, 77m seems high for 20ish players | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:14 - May 3 with 1790 views | GeoffSentence |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:09 - May 3 by Daninthecampo |
Yes correct and that's why players get 4 or 5 year contracts to spread the costs
The 77m wage bill is that for all staff? I believe it's only players wages, 77m seems high for 20ish players |
Says there, with playing wages increasing to £77.1 million (£44.5 million 2023/24). | |
| |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:17 - May 3 with 1775 views | LankHenners |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo
You do in effect have an extra 30% wiggle room as the fine for going over the limit is something that clubs can take the hit on if necessary.
Expect the commercial arm of the club to be in full swing with price increases for replica shirts and other tat they flog in the club shop. |  |
| |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:19 - May 3 with 1749 views | Swansea_Blue |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 17:33 - May 3 by GeoffSentence |
Yep, makes it difficult for a smaller club with a wealthy backer, like say Manchester City a few years ago, to break into the big time. |
Not that they want it to be a closed shop or anything. It’s hard not to be cynical. | |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 21:56 - May 3 with 1473 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:09 - May 3 by Daninthecampo |
Yes correct and that's why players get 4 or 5 year contracts to spread the costs
The 77m wage bill is that for all staff? I believe it's only players wages, 77m seems high for 20ish players |
No, not only players. The £77M is all staff costs, NI contributions and pension contributions. | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 22:05 - May 3 with 1411 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
SCR probably makes little difference for most clubs for a variety of reasons.
1. Any clubs involved in Europe are already capped at 70%
2. It’s not a hard cap - exceeding it one year is allowed, but reduces it for subsequent years
3. It’s really not sensible for clubs to have wage bills that are close to their revenue
The changes are intended to ensure a sustainable business model (in conjunction with the introduction of SSR), and allow faster responses to clubs failing the tests. | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 22:06 - May 3 with 1400 views | Cheltenham_Blue |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 18:17 - May 3 by LankHenners |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo
You do in effect have an extra 30% wiggle room as the fine for going over the limit is something that clubs can take the hit on if necessary.
Expect the commercial arm of the club to be in full swing with price increases for replica shirts and other tat they flog in the club shop. |
Closing the loophole to all clubs after a handful of clubs have already done it gives an unfair competitive advantage to those clubs. They should be forced to spread the money or the PL should remove TV money from them until the balance is redressed. |  |
| |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 05:14 - May 4 with 1196 views | shady |
Well, this is rather disturbing. However, we only have 9 weeks to act as our transfer budget has been snipped; totally financially handcuffed.
We all agree that football finances need a radical change immediately; but this is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
In order to curtail certain large clubs it’s the small aspirational clubs that face the biggest hit. And I’m not speaking of Brighton/Brentford and other established EPL teams but of the newly promoted.
Now, some back of envelope possibilities …
Last time in the EPL we had income of 155 million, which was superb;
However, can’t see this rising much… to say a max of 180m
With the SCR rules we can only spend 85% of this on wages and agents and transfers …back of envelope say 160m is left for transfer budget/wages/agents
Well, wages then were the lowest in the EPL at 77m and agents 11m …let’s call this a 105m cost allowing for 2 years inflation.
This means our transfer budget can only be 45m (160-105) A small 30% allowance for our excellent FPP position could bring it up to about 60m
So how does any newly promoted club cope with such a small transfer budget. Last time we spent 113m and it wasn’t enough.
1) Sell anyone that’s possible… Muric,Szmodics plus one of Clarke/Jaden and anyone else, but can’t see this bringing in more than 40m
2) Reduce squad size to 23 and have 5 loan players. Means less to buy and wages of 23 not 25.
3) Can’t afford to buy the EFL over-priced players.
4) Buy players just missing out on World Cup with something to prove
5) Can’t afford Akpom(although could sell on?!) Cajuste(would like if miracle extra funds) Kipre 2m is great.
This brings us to 60+40=100million transfer budget if optimistic.
Now for the fun part. Remember: do we have a choice?
a) Can we sell and lease-back the new training ground? Shock Horror! And the Ladies team?
b) Can our sponsors bring in 50m? ( probably on a fixed year deals so highly improbable but could desperately re-negotiate a 1 year special)
c) Would investors stump up another 150m ( would that count?)
d) Get the best lawyers and accountants
e) Top load some incomings this year as before July 1st not counted?
Means a few early signings.
f) Stadium naming rights could bring in a substantial sum.
Break the rules and take a 6 point penalty hit.
Really impractical as this year’s 17th EPL place may be on 40+ points
But we are not alone Coventry and A.N. Other also in these handcuffs.
Well done to Sunderland and Leeds; they just squeezed through before these unscrupulous changes.
We can only hope that a team competing in Europe for the first time becomes over-stretched as we did in 2001 and the other 2 promoted teams struggle more than us.
Also, the club has been aware of these changes for a year and been monitoring throughout so let’s hope they come up with a cunning plan.
(Otherwise, will need to bribe the refs/ VAR room a lot.)
OK that was facetious and apologies Phil. |  | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 07:12 - May 4 with 1050 views | Dennyx4 |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 05:14 - May 4 by shady |
Well, this is rather disturbing. However, we only have 9 weeks to act as our transfer budget has been snipped; totally financially handcuffed.
We all agree that football finances need a radical change immediately; but this is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
In order to curtail certain large clubs it’s the small aspirational clubs that face the biggest hit. And I’m not speaking of Brighton/Brentford and other established EPL teams but of the newly promoted.
Now, some back of envelope possibilities …
Last time in the EPL we had income of 155 million, which was superb;
However, can’t see this rising much… to say a max of 180m
With the SCR rules we can only spend 85% of this on wages and agents and transfers …back of envelope say 160m is left for transfer budget/wages/agents
Well, wages then were the lowest in the EPL at 77m and agents 11m …let’s call this a 105m cost allowing for 2 years inflation.
This means our transfer budget can only be 45m (160-105) A small 30% allowance for our excellent FPP position could bring it up to about 60m
So how does any newly promoted club cope with such a small transfer budget. Last time we spent 113m and it wasn’t enough.
1) Sell anyone that’s possible… Muric,Szmodics plus one of Clarke/Jaden and anyone else, but can’t see this bringing in more than 40m
2) Reduce squad size to 23 and have 5 loan players. Means less to buy and wages of 23 not 25.
3) Can’t afford to buy the EFL over-priced players.
4) Buy players just missing out on World Cup with something to prove
5) Can’t afford Akpom(although could sell on?!) Cajuste(would like if miracle extra funds) Kipre 2m is great.
This brings us to 60+40=100million transfer budget if optimistic.
Now for the fun part. Remember: do we have a choice?
a) Can we sell and lease-back the new training ground? Shock Horror! And the Ladies team?
b) Can our sponsors bring in 50m? ( probably on a fixed year deals so highly improbable but could desperately re-negotiate a 1 year special)
c) Would investors stump up another 150m ( would that count?)
d) Get the best lawyers and accountants
e) Top load some incomings this year as before July 1st not counted?
Means a few early signings.
f) Stadium naming rights could bring in a substantial sum.
Break the rules and take a 6 point penalty hit.
Really impractical as this year’s 17th EPL place may be on 40+ points
But we are not alone Coventry and A.N. Other also in these handcuffs.
Well done to Sunderland and Leeds; they just squeezed through before these unscrupulous changes.
We can only hope that a team competing in Europe for the first time becomes over-stretched as we did in 2001 and the other 2 promoted teams struggle more than us.
Also, the club has been aware of these changes for a year and been monitoring throughout so let’s hope they come up with a cunning plan.
(Otherwise, will need to bribe the refs/ VAR room a lot.)
OK that was facetious and apologies Phil. |
Even if it is £60m for next years accounts, that is still likely to mean a £100m+ outlay, as the transfer fees will be spread across the length of the contract given.
In all honesty, we are probably in a similar situation as the last time we were promoted. |  | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 07:13 - May 4 with 1043 views | bluefunk |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 05:14 - May 4 by shady |
Well, this is rather disturbing. However, we only have 9 weeks to act as our transfer budget has been snipped; totally financially handcuffed.
We all agree that football finances need a radical change immediately; but this is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
In order to curtail certain large clubs it’s the small aspirational clubs that face the biggest hit. And I’m not speaking of Brighton/Brentford and other established EPL teams but of the newly promoted.
Now, some back of envelope possibilities …
Last time in the EPL we had income of 155 million, which was superb;
However, can’t see this rising much… to say a max of 180m
With the SCR rules we can only spend 85% of this on wages and agents and transfers …back of envelope say 160m is left for transfer budget/wages/agents
Well, wages then were the lowest in the EPL at 77m and agents 11m …let’s call this a 105m cost allowing for 2 years inflation.
This means our transfer budget can only be 45m (160-105) A small 30% allowance for our excellent FPP position could bring it up to about 60m
So how does any newly promoted club cope with such a small transfer budget. Last time we spent 113m and it wasn’t enough.
1) Sell anyone that’s possible… Muric,Szmodics plus one of Clarke/Jaden and anyone else, but can’t see this bringing in more than 40m
2) Reduce squad size to 23 and have 5 loan players. Means less to buy and wages of 23 not 25.
3) Can’t afford to buy the EFL over-priced players.
4) Buy players just missing out on World Cup with something to prove
5) Can’t afford Akpom(although could sell on?!) Cajuste(would like if miracle extra funds) Kipre 2m is great.
This brings us to 60+40=100million transfer budget if optimistic.
Now for the fun part. Remember: do we have a choice?
a) Can we sell and lease-back the new training ground? Shock Horror! And the Ladies team?
b) Can our sponsors bring in 50m? ( probably on a fixed year deals so highly improbable but could desperately re-negotiate a 1 year special)
c) Would investors stump up another 150m ( would that count?)
d) Get the best lawyers and accountants
e) Top load some incomings this year as before July 1st not counted?
Means a few early signings.
f) Stadium naming rights could bring in a substantial sum.
Break the rules and take a 6 point penalty hit.
Really impractical as this year’s 17th EPL place may be on 40+ points
But we are not alone Coventry and A.N. Other also in these handcuffs.
Well done to Sunderland and Leeds; they just squeezed through before these unscrupulous changes.
We can only hope that a team competing in Europe for the first time becomes over-stretched as we did in 2001 and the other 2 promoted teams struggle more than us.
Also, the club has been aware of these changes for a year and been monitoring throughout so let’s hope they come up with a cunning plan.
(Otherwise, will need to bribe the refs/ VAR room a lot.)
OK that was facetious and apologies Phil. |
Several points re the rules.
Transfer fees will continue to amortised over the length of the players contract a maximum of 5 years.
Squad costs are exactly that, wages of the playing staff and team manager only, it does not include the costs of any other staff members, (assistant coaches for example)
There are individual club thresholds above the 85% level which increase the potential spend before risking sporting sanctions, and promoted clubs specifically are mentioned recognising the increased revenue from promotion.
This explains the rules, if not the financial detail at a club level.
https://www.premierleague.com/ [Post edited 4 May 7:14]
|  | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 08:38 - May 4 with 853 views | shady |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 07:13 - May 4 by bluefunk |
Several points re the rules.
Transfer fees will continue to amortised over the length of the players contract a maximum of 5 years.
Squad costs are exactly that, wages of the playing staff and team manager only, it does not include the costs of any other staff members, (assistant coaches for example)
There are individual club thresholds above the 85% level which increase the potential spend before risking sporting sanctions, and promoted clubs specifically are mentioned recognising the increased revenue from promotion.
This explains the rules, if not the financial detail at a club level.
https://www.premierleague.com/ [Post edited 4 May 7:14]
|
Whoops. Thanks Dennyx4 and bluefunk for enlightening me.
Had neglected to account for the wonders of amortising.
Amortising is our best friend; although we still have 20% of 113m leftover plus some from 24/5. Maybe a total of 35m? | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 08:57 - May 4 with 813 views | WubbleU |
The knock on effect on supporters is that every £ of revenue becomes critical. So a tourist in hospitality paying maybe £250 for their day becomes much more vital than a season ticket holder spending £30.
That is, don't expect much progress with season ticket queue anytime soon. | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 09:03 - May 4 with 782 views | bluefunk |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 08:38 - May 4 by shady |
Whoops. Thanks Dennyx4 and bluefunk for enlightening me.
Had neglected to account for the wonders of amortising.
Amortising is our best friend; although we still have 20% of 113m leftover plus some from 24/5. Maybe a total of 35m? |
The accounts (linked on this thread by Mr Sentence) quote an FFP surplus of £32m, for the preceding 3 year period, although what I’m not sure of is how the old rules will carry over to the new regime | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 10:30 - May 4 with 652 views | Blue_Moses |
You can't use amortisation from next season, that's why Chelsea are in serious trouble | | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 10:35 - May 4 with 635 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 05:14 - May 4 by shady |
Well, this is rather disturbing. However, we only have 9 weeks to act as our transfer budget has been snipped; totally financially handcuffed.
We all agree that football finances need a radical change immediately; but this is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
In order to curtail certain large clubs it’s the small aspirational clubs that face the biggest hit. And I’m not speaking of Brighton/Brentford and other established EPL teams but of the newly promoted.
Now, some back of envelope possibilities …
Last time in the EPL we had income of 155 million, which was superb;
However, can’t see this rising much… to say a max of 180m
With the SCR rules we can only spend 85% of this on wages and agents and transfers …back of envelope say 160m is left for transfer budget/wages/agents
Well, wages then were the lowest in the EPL at 77m and agents 11m …let’s call this a 105m cost allowing for 2 years inflation.
This means our transfer budget can only be 45m (160-105) A small 30% allowance for our excellent FPP position could bring it up to about 60m
So how does any newly promoted club cope with such a small transfer budget. Last time we spent 113m and it wasn’t enough.
1) Sell anyone that’s possible… Muric,Szmodics plus one of Clarke/Jaden and anyone else, but can’t see this bringing in more than 40m
2) Reduce squad size to 23 and have 5 loan players. Means less to buy and wages of 23 not 25.
3) Can’t afford to buy the EFL over-priced players.
4) Buy players just missing out on World Cup with something to prove
5) Can’t afford Akpom(although could sell on?!) Cajuste(would like if miracle extra funds) Kipre 2m is great.
This brings us to 60+40=100million transfer budget if optimistic.
Now for the fun part. Remember: do we have a choice?
a) Can we sell and lease-back the new training ground? Shock Horror! And the Ladies team?
b) Can our sponsors bring in 50m? ( probably on a fixed year deals so highly improbable but could desperately re-negotiate a 1 year special)
c) Would investors stump up another 150m ( would that count?)
d) Get the best lawyers and accountants
e) Top load some incomings this year as before July 1st not counted?
Means a few early signings.
f) Stadium naming rights could bring in a substantial sum.
Break the rules and take a 6 point penalty hit.
Really impractical as this year’s 17th EPL place may be on 40+ points
But we are not alone Coventry and A.N. Other also in these handcuffs.
Well done to Sunderland and Leeds; they just squeezed through before these unscrupulous changes.
We can only hope that a team competing in Europe for the first time becomes over-stretched as we did in 2001 and the other 2 promoted teams struggle more than us.
Also, the club has been aware of these changes for a year and been monitoring throughout so let’s hope they come up with a cunning plan.
(Otherwise, will need to bribe the refs/ VAR room a lot.)
OK that was facetious and apologies Phil. |
I have your numbers way out 
My quick calculation, based on 24/25 accounts for when we were last in the PL.
Revenue £155M
Total wage bill £77M
Player costs amortised £30M
(estimated to be £27M now, due to Delap and Hutchinson leaving, and accounting for new signings)
Estimated Revenue for 26/27 £180M
At 85% SCR, that gives us £153M to play around with
(There are 'safe' ways to exceed this but reduce future flexibility, so will ignore that)
Remove costs excluding player amortisation (£77M-£27M = £50M) leaves £103M
The signings would of course have to be paid - so let's assume 8 players at £50k/week, so £21M, reducing the headroom to £82M
Signings of players over 4 year contracts would allow £328M, or £410M for 5 years (contracts would of course vary) after amortisation
Now, we would not IMO want to go anywhere near 85% SCR ratio - we were 49% last year, but I don't see SCR being the limiting factor for us - it would be other fiscal responsibility that determines what we're prepared to put into player signing.
This is a quick calculation (so ignore positives such as players leaving), but I think it's about right. [Post edited 10 May 9:16]
| | | |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 10:48 - May 4 with 606 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| SCR rules next season, any accountants able to shed some light on this? on 10:30 - May 4 by Blue_Moses |
You can't use amortisation from next season, that's why Chelsea are in serious trouble |
This is not correct. | | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
