On Saturday, standing in my usual place, my season ticket seat in the North/Sir Bobby lower, which I have held for a long while (not caring to think how much money has been spent in it over the 10 years), I was in earshot of what I consider the club's biggest problem.

Saturday's game against Swansea merited a better result in my opinion, but I will never boo an Ipswich team, I can't it's not in me, but that wasn't my issue, my problem was earlier, around the 70th minute.

After a few on-off spells of excitement throughout the game, moments of both teams threatening, there had been some singing, some noise generated and then the match took a down turn and the noise, like usual died off. A small group of fans a little way along from me (not Section 6 I hasten to add), tried to get the crowd going.

It worked sporadically but I feel it's the action on the pitch that generally pulls the crowd round. Anyway, after the third or fourth attempt one of the group, the smallest one in fact, I don't know if Small Man Syndrome kicked in, decided to shout something really rather offensive at the crowd, "Come on you $£%&s sing", which I take exception to as I sing when I choose to, talk to the people around me when I choose to and generally believe it is my right to do so as I pay my ticket like everyone else.

Then the real problem statement came, he shouted "That's what's wrong, there's no f*****g passion here any more!". I turned again to look, I am not an old person, in fact I turn 29 next month, but this chap must have been younger than me or if not had definitely not suffered a hard life, his youthful but spiteful appearance surrendered no obvious life trauma.

I felt annoyed about this as passion cannot be measured, certainly not by singing, shouting or being offensive, and then I started to think, when was the last regular noisy period for our fans, if it is noise that grades passion. Obviously derby games have their passion, but if it was to be looked at, Alex Ferguson claimed our 22,000 fans were a 12th man and sounded like 40,000 in 2000 when Fabian scored against Man Utd. That season, we were a noisy fanbase, and I was a lot younger and probably noisier.

I made a statement to a pseudo-Newcastle fan on the way home from our 4-0 capitulation that the Upper north overhang seems to stop the sound from below reaching the higher tier, because the pseudo-Geordie claimed Portman Road was a library.

He then went on to make a few conversational slips to reveal he was born in Sprowston and is actually a Norwich fan who wanted to be a Geordie fan on Sir Bobby's day (I berated him for the strange changing of colours he had shown, and how I would never wear another team's shirt) .

So anyway, I finish with a question, did the capacity expansion of Portman Road remove the passion? Or is the noise still there, and the design just stopping it from being heard? Or is all of it pure coincidence and none of it matters, especially as we don't win games at present?

Manic_Blue added 11:49 - Oct 19 The noise has definitely dropped since the North/SBR Stand was rebuilt, but have a different idea as to why this is. Think about how small and cramped the old North was, meaning everyone who was inclined to sing was packed together and generating a wall of noise. Now we're much more spaced out, most in the lower tier, some in the upper and a few moved elsewhere during the rebuilding and stayed there. There's still the same number of people singing - maybe even more - but as we're spread over a larger area, we don't have the same impact.

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blueoveru added 12:07 - Oct 19 more to do with the level/quality of football being played,scoring against Man Utd v scraping a 1-1 draw with Swansea is not a fair comparison. Plus back then there was a waiting list for season tickets with many near capacity crowds so fans could consider themselves fortunate to be there, so thats it,play some decent football & Portman Rd will roar !
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borge added 12:20 - Oct 19 I sit in a relatively passionate area of Britannia (as passionate as an area of Britannia can get) and what is interesting in relation to the 'new' stand and the accoustics is that on the rare occassions when the upper tier sings, the sound appears to be significantly louder than when the lower tier sings. I think this actually relates to the roof, with the noise from the lower tier being lost, but the noise from the upper tier being 'held in' and 'reflected' by the roof. Short of moving everyone upstairs (not something I think people would want to do!), not sure there is much that can be done, but I do feel that as a collective we absolutely lack passion or the desire to really create an atmosphere. I can't see that changing until we have something to celebrate. Shame. Also, the atmosphere also seems to be better the lower the crowd....or is that just me...?!

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prozach added 12:35 - Oct 19 I think that when the North Stand/SBR was rebuilt in 2001/2002, they should have had just one big tier, rather than split into two. If we were to make the premiership again, I am sure the noise would be there
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EastKentBlue added 12:44 - Oct 19 The design of the ground doesn't help, but there are far too many people in the North that are waiting with anticipation to boo or shout abuse at a player when things are not going our way. Those guys were trying to start a bit of an atmosphere and help push the team along. Sadly it fell on deaf ears.
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badgeritfc added 12:46 - Oct 19 Was it a small group on the back row of the north stand??
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denhamblue added 12:52 - Oct 19 in a nutshell,ive been a ipswich fan for 35 years,and basicaly think,that if u have on average more female fans than other champ clubs(thats a fact,as a survey revealed 2 seasons ago),and sometimes i look around and see 65 year olds spreading pate,on bread,and handing out mini batenbourg cakes,like its some picnic,combine that with suffolk people ,on the whole being timid,and lets just say,not the most passionate people in the world,what do you expect.But hey,thats the kind of fans the club wants,not common old ex duncon era,rif raf,with limited dosh to waste .im just not sexy enough for this club anymore!,who might dare shout out,the odd naughty word,and god forbid get excited!

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tort63 added 12:55 - Oct 19 I agree that a single tier design would have been preferable from the perspective of creating a better atmosphere but the reason the SBR Stand was rebuilt as 2 tiers on top of one another is very simply because it was the only way to increase the capacity without encroaching onto the road. As somebody who has pretty much always been in the top tier of the stand since it was rebuilt I couldn’t agree more with the article. The design of the stand means that the lower tier may be singing their hearts out but we simply cannot hear anything because there is a considerable chunk of reinforced concrete between us. As a result I’m afraid the days of the SBR Stand singing as one will only ever be a fond memory henceforth.

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TractorRoyNo1 added 13:14 - Oct 19 As the ad insuranc ad says 'scchimmple'. If the team play exciting football, the crowd will become excited. Or if you look at the other way, the team are lucky we are not all boo'ing and shouting at the rubbish we have had to watch for months.
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elburro3 added 13:37 - Oct 19 Sitting in the lower bobby myself this Saturday, I feel I was equally as annoyed by this guy, I remember turning around in amazement at a comment along the lines of "Just because Sir Bobbys dead doesn't mean the crowd has to be"... I couldn't believe what kind of an idiot would shout something like this, to be honest the crowd wasn't even that bad on Saturday.
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sotd78 added 13:44 - Oct 19 In my youth, when we could stand, we used to turn up as little groups of three or four and congregate until we had a group that would sing, or fight, or more likely run away. I used to stand in Churchmans - it was never as passionate as the North but when you got the whole stand going - which we often did it really was grand. Now there is no way (apart from Section 6) to let people gather ad hoc. I suggested to the club that they opened Cobbold A to walk up tickets for anyone aged under 25. A tenner and sit anywhere. That has fallen on deaf ears. Want atmosphere and want the casual 16-25 support that cannot afford a season ticket. There's one answer; short of bringing back standing! As for the North - even when it is singing nowadays it cannot be heard well from the other end of the ground. I now sit in Lower Britannia where the most noise usually comes from the geezer in the back moaning at Trotter or whoever preceded him as the whipping boy.

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WeWereZombies added 13:53 - Oct 19 It is not just singing that makes crowd noise - cheers, hand clapping, gasps - and, yes, even muttering and booing - all go together to form an animated backdrop to what is happening on the pitch. Singing is the icing on the cake, the spur to starting the noise is decent football on the pitch. Any team that plays just to win (or prevent a loss) are amateurs masquerading as professionals - we pay money to watch and deserve entertainment. When we are well entertained then we are more likely to generate some noise.

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dobbie73 added 14:18 - Oct 19 I think several factors have contributed to the falling away of 'atmosphere' and 'noise' in the ground. 1. All-seater stadia - some may argue, but I always find it easier to get excited and shouty when I am STANDING. Sitting down just makes my bum hurt and I feel sleepy. 2. Rebuilding the North/Sir Bobby Robson Stand - the old stand was small and rickety, but by Christ it echoed! The acoustics are bad in the new stand, and short of building a roof-type thing between the tiers (to reverberate the sound from the lower tier), maybe strategically-placed mics/speakers to echo the noise may help? Not sure how that would affect those secret farts that seem to make an appearance occasionally though ... could be a bit thunderous! 3. The North/Sir Bobby Robson Stand has traditionally been the Ipswich 'Kop' and hotbed of noise and rowdiness down the years. Since it was rebuilt, there has been an increase in 'family' supporters. Now don't get me wrong - its great that kids and families go to watch games. But I would have thought they would be best off in some of the other family-orientated areas. In the SBR Stand you SHOULD be able to mouth off a bit and chant without the tut tutting from certain members of society who find themselves being offended by it (the picnic comment by Denhamblue is spot on) 4. Away fans and banter - for goodness sake, let's get the away fans down the SBR end of the ground! There is no security issue that I can see, at least no worse than there is currently. The back-and-forth banter increases the atmosphere and crowd noise REGARDLESS of what's going on on the pitch, which will probably raise the players! Win-win situation as far as I can see. I know there would be complaints from existing season ticket holders (the few that there seem to be there), but as long as they were fully involved in any discussions and ideas, I'm sure there wuold be a deal reached. 5. Game quality - ultimately fans and players feed off each other. Crap football = crap crowd atmosphere, and vice versa. As supporters we need to lift the team to help them do better, but the players also need to do their bit. We want to be entertained, and we want to see some passion from the players!

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dreamteam added 14:21 - Oct 19 Other clubs have modernised their stadiums and still generate some noise. Having the away fans close to the home fans helps build and maintain an atmosphere. On that matter why do ITFC allow so few away fans when the home fans dont fill the ground.
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Moots_Ranuva added 14:52 - Oct 19 <Quote>4. Away fans and banter - for goodness sake, let's get the away fans down the SBR end of the ground! There is no security issue that I can see, at least no worse than there is currently. The back-and-forth banter increases the atmosphere and crowd noise REGARDLESS of what's going on on the pitch, which will probably raise the players! Win-win situation as far as I can see. I know there would be complaints from existing season ticket holders (the few that there seem to be there), but as long as they were fully involved in any discussions and ideas, I'm sure there wuold be a deal reached.</Quote> Exactly. Banter = good atmosphere = 12th man on pitch. The SBR stand haven't lost the ability to make a sh*t load of noise, but without any inspiration coming from the pitch you turn to banter with the away fans who, oh, are about as far away as you can get. It's not rocket science, if the club wants a better atmosphere they can try all they like with various songs before kick off, h/t entertainment etc., but all that's needed is getting the 2 sets of vociferous fans closer together.

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townfan added 14:57 - Oct 19 I remember as a young teenager sitting in the old JJ block in the then pioneer stand. me and my mates would work the saturday morning for our dads just to earn the £5 it cost to buy a ticket. it was the closest we could get to the north stand back in the mid-late 90's. i used to look across at all the mid 20 plus guys signing, laughing and drinking wishing i was old enough to be over there with them. i finally got to that age and spent my time there during the recent golden years. great memories. i've moved away now and don't get to as many home games as i would like, but i can recall two incidents recently that answered my question: why is there no longer an atmosphere? 1st. a couple of us got tickets in the section off the old JJ block for old times sake and were shocked to see how the NS/SBS has changed in terms of it's personnel. everywhere i looked there were girls/women and children that were far too young to appreciate what they were seeing. i didn't really think much of it during this game, but then for my next game i sat behind the goal and was horrified. "can you stop swearing please", " can you sit down pelase", "wow, he looks great in shorts" to name but a few. this is when it occurred to me that the passion and soul of the NS had been sucked dry. i don't condone aggressive swearing/abuse, nor am i suggesting that women, kids or the more mature generation are the only cause, however, i do feel it's a massive factor. like they have every right to be there, others have every right to express their views any way they like, within reason. i know this post will seriously pi** a few people off. i don't want to seem against anyone who is not male and in their 20's should not go to football. the fact is, the NS/SBS was once the voice of PR and like myself, most people wanted to be a part of that, but it seems that for whatever reason they got there and made it worse.

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RevAdrian added 15:20 - Oct 19 I am not suggesting that this is a major cause of lack of atmosphere - but a contributory one. I remember the days when there was a real buildup of atmosphere AMONGST THE FANS in the 10 t0 15 mts before Kick off. Actually it tended to start with the first formal team news after 30 mts before. The atmosphere built to a crescendo by kick off and some of what was generated carried over into the match. Nowadays the 'match day presentation' with the 'atmosphere' being pumped up by the PA system simply doesn't allow any pre-match chanting, singing, or whatever to be heard. The PA system goes silent on the sound of the starting whistle and you find yourself sitting in the quietest atmosphere you've been in for at least half an hour as the match begins! That surely is not a good start!

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FormerlyCGS added 15:42 - Oct 19 KEANE OUT THEN THE NOISE WILL COME!
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brogansnose added 15:50 - Oct 19 There are quite obviously a few reasons for the lack of noise at PR. Certainly there is little noise that comes out of the North that is audible around the rest of the ground despite the singing that may be going on in there. Surely Cleggy can get some acoustic engineers to do a report and to then act on it. I dont see that it has to be that expensive. At the minute the other 3 stands only really join in when there has been a stupid refereeing decision or there is some on field controversy. The stewards dont help with a sit down shut up policy coupled with a post Sky generation that simply dont know how to support a team and when you do try to start some singing look at you like you are a wierdo ( which isnt wholly untrue ). I know people have banged on about this before but the Barnsley match was the first in ages when as a group of fans we cheered and clapped the team off the field even though we were all gutted about loosing in the last 30 seconds. Proper unconditional support. Remember people ' its more fun when you all join in.'

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carsey added 15:51 - Oct 19 I wonered when someone would write about this bloke. He has sat next to me for the past 5 years now with his brother and a couple of mates and yes he does shout some pretty unpleasent stuff at the other North Standers but he has a point. I have been standing in much the same place since I was 14 years old which is around 34years now and there's now doubt in my mind things have changed for the worse. This was always the preserve of the loud noisey younger men and it was they who kept up the atmosphere in the ground. The north stand today is full of old men, women and children who like most of the rest of football supporters around the country just want to sit quietly and watch and perhaps cher/clap when their team scores. The idea that we will ever get back to standing areas is pie in the sky it will never happen and neither will we get the away supporters back in the north stand - the police don't want it and they have the final say on safety. What I would also add having been to Chelsea Man Utd and Newcastle in recent years is that we are no different at Portman Road - all grounds in GB are pretty quiet. Making football a family game is fine for getting bums on seats and getting money ooff people but it has killed the passion inside the grounds. Finally to the TW*Ts that decided to throw coins at the gobby bloke I sit next to remember I and others including women and children at close by and if one of them hits me I won't be reporting it the steward I will come looking for you.

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scottishblue added 16:17 - Oct 19 The reason why there is no atmosphere is firstly we are playing crap and also because there is to many children to busy talking to themselves and not watching the game . I myself am not that old but i watch the game and i am not worried about voicing my comments to the pitch,good or bad. I am passionate about football and ipswich town unfortunately some are not so. Adding to this i myself have sat in the upper tier of the sbrs stand once or twice with my mates and the thing is the view is so bad it is hard to get into the game

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JayITFC added 16:19 - Oct 19 EastKentBlue is spot on. At home games a chap behind me screams "rubbish" at every opportunity he gets - the first one usually comes after 20 minutes when we miss a chance. He just sits quietly for his glorious moment - I've never heard him sing or chant once in 2 or 3 years and this is the case with so many ITFC fans. I think it's just a Suffolk trait - the thought of a good moan and booing appeals more than putting some effort into coming up with a new chant or song. When I first started going half the squad had their own song. Now I can't think of 1 player with a unique chant (walking in a 'insert player x here' wonderland DOES NOT count).

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warwickblue added 17:13 - Oct 19 I cannot understand this obsession that people currently have for what other fans are eating, drinking, saying, wearing or talking about. Likewise their age or gender. Listen ,boys, if we were top of the Championship and winning every game by two or three goals then I don't think the type of cake the old boy next to you was eating at half-time would even register would it? It really is saying something when the most memorable thing after a game is what some kid in the row in front of you has said.

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jas0999 added 17:22 - Oct 19 I also agree that the atmosphere in the ground has reduced since the two new stands have been built. Foul and abusive language has no place at football. I personally don't believe it sets a good example at a so called 'family club'. Equally, what is wrong with going to a match to simply watch? Do we really all need to sing?
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WeWereZombies added 17:28 - Oct 19 Mind you, having waffled on about quality football breeding crowd noise I was in Central America six months ago and went to see Xela FC play Zacapa and now remember that my points are all defeated because: Teams in even the top leagues (except for Mexico - whom everyone else hates) are financially poor so there is no pre-season - I said to the teacher who had taken us to the game "your Xela are playing like strangers" and he said "they are strangers - it is the first game of the season and most of them had never met until three days ago". Yet despite the game being kak five thousand supporters made about ten times the noise of PR - mind you there were about six trumpets, two trombones and fifteen drums on 'El Curvo' where the afficianados sit. So maybe the solution is: 1. Go down the Pompey route and have a catweazel (Simon Clegg can do that instead of sitting around doing nothing) and a brass band in every stand. 2. Have a giant inflatable Pepsi bottle that deflates to become the players tunnel 3. Let off about twenty fire extinguisers filled with coloured smoke so that you do not even realise that the game has kicked for the first five minutes 4. If anyone is worried about the Health and Safety aspect of these proposals would you be pacified by the presence of a bunch of evil looking security guards with metre long night sticks and revolvers?

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