| Debate time - would you rather.... 08:31 - Feb 26 with 9603 views | Currie10 |
Now I posted about my thoughts on WBA fans getting Pullis the chop.
Would YOU rather -
A - Struggling to stay in the prem for potentially year on year under Pulis - that said he did get WBA very much midtable and the same with Stoke. So lets say managed by Pulis in the prem with the chance every season was going to turn into a dogfight. Style of play you don't agree with.
Obviously get to play the big boys / have great away days see the likes of De Brunye / Lukaku / others.
Potentially have a go at a cup depending on situations.....
OR
B - Play open expansive football in the championship, trying to get promoted. Guaranteed for arguments sake to finish a minimum 8th - triangles galore playing stuff similar to the Royle days for 03 - 05. Cup run - perhaps not due to trying to go up. Give a few more young technical players a chance.
Lets just say this is over a four year window.
With option A - you'd survive every year as Pulis has never taken a side down.
With option B - you might fall just shot or you never know, may go over the line. Auto is very unlikely due to the style played and the occasional blip.
What would you prefer?
I'll kick off - option A for me all day long. |  | | |  |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:46 - Feb 26 with 5785 views | Basuco |
B. Defo. Being able to go to any away game most away games you can decide on the morning of the match and watching many more of our youth players coming through into the first team, the premier league is not for small clubs like us nodge and many others, it is just a money making machine for the top 4 - 6 big clubs with an increasing amount of dull, predictable and boring games. In the Championship a good manager/coach can still make a big difference but in the prem it is all about whoever spends the most of their team will win the league. |  | | |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:49 - Feb 26 with 5775 views | Bluefish |
The answer is B all day long. Perhaps a club our size should consider the same comparison but use championship and league 1 |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:54 - Feb 26 with 5769 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Not to drag this one out to death, but you mentioned cup runs in a). In Pulis’ complete seasons at WBA, the furthest they made in the cups were the 5th round and 3rd round of the FA and League cups respectively. Last season they crashed out of both cups at the first hurdle (having played reserves), and this time around were out of the League Cup in the 3rd round. So your option a) should actually read ‘Accept that cups will not be a priority’
Also to emphasise one other point - but seeing big name players is a nice draw when it’s novel but not when you’re seeing them year in year out trouncing your team. Last season WBA’s record against the top 6 read P12, W1, D2, L9 (scored 6, conceded 21) and at the point Pulis was sacked this season they’d lost all 3, conceding 9 in the process
Option B for me all day long - but the worse case scenario for WBA fans must be that they end up in the Championship grind and it’s still not particularly appealing to watch |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:58 - Feb 26 with 5745 views | Freddies_Ears |
Hull and Sunderland have proved that B is not an option.
A anyway for me. |  | | |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 09:05 - Feb 26 with 5724 views | JimmyJazz |
Option B seems to need a benefactor stumping up 5-6 million a season just to keep it all going. Otherwise you end up selling anyone who is any good and have to start again. Imagine that and consistently finishing 8th and the fans will be moaning that there is no progression and why don't we spend more money to make the final jump.
In the Prem you can gradually attract better players. Stoke as an example with Shaqiri |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 13:25 - Feb 26 with 5606 views | TJS |
If A has to be Pulis I'd take B |  | | |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 13:31 - Feb 26 with 5588 views | Darth_Koont |
Bit similar to us really. I.e. it's not really anything to do with this manager or that manager (although evidently Mick like Pulis is effective at accumulating points).
You only have to see how much money WBA spend year on year in relation to the competition to see what their reality and realistic expectations are. |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 13:33 - Feb 26 with 5575 views | Superfrans |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:49 - Feb 26 by Bluefish |
The answer is B all day long. Perhaps a club our size should consider the same comparison but use championship and league 1 |
So, if we did ask the same question re. Championship and League 1, would you still answer B? In other words, flowing (but ultimately unsuccessful, in terms of promotion) football in League 1 is better than dour football in the Championship? |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 13:34 - Feb 26 with 5574 views | textbackup |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:49 - Feb 26 by Bluefish |
The answer is B all day long. Perhaps a club our size should consider the same comparison but use championship and league 1 |
EVen though I know you are on a wind up, sometimes I read your posts and shout FCK OFF at my phone |  |
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| B (n/t) on 13:36 - Feb 26 with 5562 views | Dyland |
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| B (n/t) on 13:39 - Feb 26 with 5548 views | TJS |
| B (n/t) on 13:36 - Feb 26 by Dyland |
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I'm not answering for Champ / League 1.
Ipswich do not need to play s*** football just to stay in the Championship. | | | |
| B (n/t) on 13:45 - Feb 26 with 5531 views | Darth_Koont |
| B (n/t) on 13:39 - Feb 26 by TJS |
I'm not answering for Champ / League 1.
Ipswich do not need to play s*** football just to stay in the Championship. |
But it helps?
How many Championship games are good football games? They can be hard-fought and exciting but it's the perfect storm of world-class athleticism, organisation, pressure and not quite enough skill to overcome that. | |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:01 - Feb 26 with 5491 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 08:46 - Feb 26 by Basuco |
B. Defo. Being able to go to any away game most away games you can decide on the morning of the match and watching many more of our youth players coming through into the first team, the premier league is not for small clubs like us nodge and many others, it is just a money making machine for the top 4 - 6 big clubs with an increasing amount of dull, predictable and boring games. In the Championship a good manager/coach can still make a big difference but in the prem it is all about whoever spends the most of their team will win the league. |
There's far more dull/boring games in the Championship than the Prem. |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:05 - Feb 26 with 5470 views | SpruceMoose |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:01 - Feb 26 by BrixtonBlue |
There's far more dull/boring games in the Championship than the Prem. |
How would we know? Televised Premier League games must out number Championship games about 6 to 1.
I'm always curious about how people can claim to know so much about football games they haven't seen, between teams they don't follow. |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| B (n/t) on 14:09 - Feb 26 with 5454 views | Dyland |
| B (n/t) on 13:39 - Feb 26 by TJS |
I'm not answering for Champ / League 1.
Ipswich do not need to play s*** football just to stay in the Championship. |
B is guaranteeing fancy football AND a chance of promotion. The option where we grind out a few years in the Prem under someone like Pulis is not enticing at all. | |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:15 - Feb 26 with 5437 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:05 - Feb 26 by SpruceMoose |
How would we know? Televised Premier League games must out number Championship games about 6 to 1.
I'm always curious about how people can claim to know so much about football games they haven't seen, between teams they don't follow. |
I did base that largely on games involving Ipswich to be fair.
But the suggestion that the Prem is poor/dull/boring (that I see quite a lot on here) is just wrong IMO. It seem fashionable to knock the Prem these days, but I see quite a few Prem matches and they can be very exciting and with much better skill/goals than I see in the Champ (including highlights). | |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:15 - Feb 26 with 5436 views | SpruceMoose |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:15 - Feb 26 by BrixtonBlue |
I did base that largely on games involving Ipswich to be fair.
But the suggestion that the Prem is poor/dull/boring (that I see quite a lot on here) is just wrong IMO. It seem fashionable to knock the Prem these days, but I see quite a few Prem matches and they can be very exciting and with much better skill/goals than I see in the Champ (including highlights). |
I'm off the div list!
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:17 - Feb 26 with 5428 views | Superfrans |
This is the issue isn't it? It's incredibly difficult to be a football team which is both successful and playing attractive football in the current game, because most teams/clubs are wracked by fear (for good reason).
If you're Top 5/6 in the Prem, as a manager you have to succeed, or you'll be fired.
There are 1 or 2 who don't care, like Klopp or Guardiola, because they have so much confidence in themselves (and arguably less to lose, given their track records). Klopp has even said words to the effect that he likes his team to take risks. Easy for you to say, fella.
Outside of the Top 6, most Prem teams start the season with a 50 point target, to keep them safe. They're looking to get points, not to entertain. Because going down costs a club 100s of millions of pounds. Most Prem matches are, as a result, pretty dull (despite the hype to the contrary).
In the Championship, its about grinding out results to compete at the top, or to avoid sliding into relegation. There are very very few teams that play open expansive football and make a success of it - Fulham are an exception to this, but Cardiff are not a great football side, they're a functional team. Ditto Wolves when they came to us, Derby (bunch of spoilers) etc.
Before any of the usual suspects jump on me for this appalling train of thought, I'm not saying that we couldn't play *better* football than we do - I personally agree that we could and that Mick's teams will always revert to type, even if he starts with an intention to play expansive football.
But playing attacking football, competing at the top of any division, is an extremely difficult balance to strike. And the desire that many have for a more attractive style of football isn't going to automatically be satisfied if we get a new manager, even a new owner with lots more money. | |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:19 - Feb 26 with 5419 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:15 - Feb 26 by SpruceMoose |
I'm off the div list!
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Literally, just. So watch your step sunshine!
Why did you reply to me if you knew I had you div listed? | |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:25 - Feb 26 with 5392 views | J2BLUE |
B
I'd happily take being a yoyo club with perhaps a few cups. |  |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:26 - Feb 26 with 5390 views | uncle |
B - every time |  | | |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:30 - Feb 26 with 5362 views | SpruceMoose |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:19 - Feb 26 by BrixtonBlue |
Literally, just. So watch your step sunshine!
Why did you reply to me if you knew I had you div listed? |
Just probing to see if you had missed me and caved in.
You can't live without a daily dose of SpruceMoose it seems! | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:31 - Feb 26 with 5356 views | bluehook |
Why did you need to use Pulis as an example? 😩
A for me btw |  | | |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:32 - Feb 26 with 5353 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:17 - Feb 26 by Superfrans |
This is the issue isn't it? It's incredibly difficult to be a football team which is both successful and playing attractive football in the current game, because most teams/clubs are wracked by fear (for good reason).
If you're Top 5/6 in the Prem, as a manager you have to succeed, or you'll be fired.
There are 1 or 2 who don't care, like Klopp or Guardiola, because they have so much confidence in themselves (and arguably less to lose, given their track records). Klopp has even said words to the effect that he likes his team to take risks. Easy for you to say, fella.
Outside of the Top 6, most Prem teams start the season with a 50 point target, to keep them safe. They're looking to get points, not to entertain. Because going down costs a club 100s of millions of pounds. Most Prem matches are, as a result, pretty dull (despite the hype to the contrary).
In the Championship, its about grinding out results to compete at the top, or to avoid sliding into relegation. There are very very few teams that play open expansive football and make a success of it - Fulham are an exception to this, but Cardiff are not a great football side, they're a functional team. Ditto Wolves when they came to us, Derby (bunch of spoilers) etc.
Before any of the usual suspects jump on me for this appalling train of thought, I'm not saying that we couldn't play *better* football than we do - I personally agree that we could and that Mick's teams will always revert to type, even if he starts with an intention to play expansive football.
But playing attacking football, competing at the top of any division, is an extremely difficult balance to strike. And the desire that many have for a more attractive style of football isn't going to automatically be satisfied if we get a new manager, even a new owner with lots more money. |
Small point of order - but there hasn’t been a sacking within the top 6 since the end of the 2015/16 season when Van Gaal was sacked. That could easily continue into next season too with only Conte looking likely to go anywhere and even then it could be of his own accord
Agree re the rest of the division, with the possible exceptions of Everton, West Ham, Southampton and maybe Leicester - and those can quickly change priorities when they get sucked into the fight | |
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| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:33 - Feb 26 with 5349 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Debate time - would you rather.... on 14:31 - Feb 26 by bluehook |
Why did you need to use Pulis as an example? 😩
A for me btw |
Was relevant to a debate me and Currie10 were having in a different thread | |
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