| Interesting thread re the General Election 15:19 - Oct 29 with 6935 views | itfcjoe |
By Glen O'hara on Twitter @gsoh31
Really think the Tories are in the midst of the most terrible error. Huge risks in a GE. Remainers' last chance - they may well coalesce around Labour, and vote tactically.
Corbyn the campaigner. Just like in 2017, they're riding to his rescue when he's at his lowest ebb. He wants to get out and give speeches about austerity. It will re-energise him. They've got him hemmed in, and they're about to let him out of his box.
SNP and Lib Dem risk. Tories may do better in Scotland than they fear, but they're going to lose at least 5, maybe up to 10/11 seats there - and c15-20 in suburban London/ England to the LDs.
Sticky Labour voters. As soon as the GE is announced, Lab numbers will rise as d/k and won't vote return 'home'. And are the people of Wrexham, Blackpool, Grimsby really going to compensate BoJo for losing 30 seats to SNP/ LD? I doubt it.
Labour campaigning. The public like nationalisation and the abolition of tuition fees. Yes #Brexit election, but those policies will now get another airing. And 400k+ members will make a splash.
Huge uncertainty. Look at any proper evidence, and it says 'the public don't know what to think'. Massive % of don't know. You're about to force them to decide. I'm willing to bet that a pretty detested ten-year-old govt won't come off well.
This is the *classic* bully's error - overconfidence, sloppiness, lack of empathy, failure to prepare, big picture guff. I have to say that I don't give the Tories more than a 30%, 40% chance of holding on.
Think it's quite interesting, Tories will have to win a majority to stay in Government and can anyone see anything but a Hung parliament? Some sort of Labour, Lib Dem, SNP, Green 'Progressive Coalition' could get the numbers and then we are in a much better position |  |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:26 - Oct 29 with 982 views | Steve_M |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:17 - Oct 29 by footers |
Because of traditional Labour seats oop norf wanting to leave. They just can't please everyone in the party, which is how we've come to a bit of a fudge on it. Can Labour risk alienating those voters? Think a second referendum is a sensible, democratic way of settling it, tbh. But of course the Brexit wags will call it treachery etc. [Post edited 29 Oct 2019 16:17]
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Except there is plenty of good evidence that Labour voters in those seats are still pro-remain and those that many of those that aren't will still vote Labour for tribal reasons.
It's this fallacy which leads Kinnock, Flint, Nandy et al into supporting any deal now however bad it is. |  |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:28 - Oct 29 with 973 views | GaryCooper |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:23 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
I think Footers attempt at explaining the situation is better than yours. |
Sorry missed that. |  | | |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:31 - Oct 29 with 959 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:28 - Oct 29 by GaryCooper |
Sorry missed that. |
Maybe doesn't matter anyway (for now)...
[Post edited 29 Oct 2019 16:31]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:36 - Oct 29 with 939 views | sparks |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:31 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
Maybe doesn't matter anyway (for now)...
[Post edited 29 Oct 2019 16:31]
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Don't follow. ... |  |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:36 - Oct 29 with 939 views | Guthrum |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:14 - Oct 29 by itfcjoe |
They did in 2017, and tactical voting very much a thing now (sure it always has been) |
LibDems stronger, have a more dynamic leader and are much more clearly defined as a Remain party than in 2017. Whereas Labour's vacillation on Brexit has become more pronounced. |  |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:39 - Oct 29 with 938 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:36 - Oct 29 by sparks |
Don't follow. ... |
Classic Dom is allegedly claiming they will simply pull the bill should the tabled amendment to allow EU nationals in the UK to vote in a General Election be voted on and passed.
Therefore, if true, there would no general election for the time being. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:42 - Oct 29 with 922 views | sparks |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:39 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
Classic Dom is allegedly claiming they will simply pull the bill should the tabled amendment to allow EU nationals in the UK to vote in a General Election be voted on and passed.
Therefore, if true, there would no general election for the time being. |
Hadn't seen that amendment. Sounds ridiculous. | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:46 - Oct 29 with 909 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:42 - Oct 29 by sparks |
Hadn't seen that amendment. Sounds ridiculous. |
There's also one aimed at allowing 16 and 17 year old citizens to vote. They don't like that one either.
I don't have a problem with either fwiw. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:49 - Oct 29 with 902 views | Freddies_Ears |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:46 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
There's also one aimed at allowing 16 and 17 year old citizens to vote. They don't like that one either.
I don't have a problem with either fwiw. |
But the alt-right Tories would have a big problem with both. |  | | |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:50 - Oct 29 with 900 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:49 - Oct 29 by Freddies_Ears |
But the alt-right Tories would have a big problem with both. |
Well of course. I mean, they wouldn't ever attempt to meddle with the young person vote by doing something like, I don't know, deliberately holding an election during a period of time when students would find it extremely difficult to vote. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:50 - Oct 29 with 899 views | sparks |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:46 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
There's also one aimed at allowing 16 and 17 year old citizens to vote. They don't like that one either.
I don't have a problem with either fwiw. |
1. They would be blatant election gerrymandering
2. 16 year olds have no life experience or knowledge of work
3. No one else in the eu gives other citizens the vote. | |
| The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
(Sir Terry Pratchett) | | Poll: | Is Fred drunk this morning? |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:54 - Oct 29 with 895 views | ElderGrizzly |
Off his timeline too. Looks like the work of a splinter group, not Labour HQ but “don’t mention remain” sums up the distrust in Labour for many
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:56 - Oct 29 with 891 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:50 - Oct 29 by sparks |
1. They would be blatant election gerrymandering
2. 16 year olds have no life experience or knowledge of work
3. No one else in the eu gives other citizens the vote. |
1) Well, yes. But that seems to be all the rage these days. One side does it, so another does too. It's an arms race. The timing of it is what makes it gerrymandering though, not the overall concept.
2) You can't make a blanket statement like that . There are many adults who lack both of those aspects anyway. So that point doesn't stand up.
3) We already give Irish folk the vote. Should be extended to the other EU citizens who live here and add to the country's prosperity. [Post edited 29 Oct 2019 16:58]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:56 - Oct 29 with 889 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:50 - Oct 29 by sparks |
1. They would be blatant election gerrymandering
2. 16 year olds have no life experience or knowledge of work
3. No one else in the eu gives other citizens the vote. |
I support the idea, but even if it was voted through it wouldn’t be there for December. | | | |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:56 - Oct 29 with 887 views | footers |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:50 - Oct 29 by sparks |
1. They would be blatant election gerrymandering
2. 16 year olds have no life experience or knowledge of work
3. No one else in the eu gives other citizens the vote. |
On your point about 16-year-olds, should we extend that to people who have never worked too? Only seems fair based on that criterion. |  |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:59 - Oct 29 with 876 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:56 - Oct 29 by footers |
On your point about 16-year-olds, should we extend that to people who have never worked too? Only seems fair based on that criterion. |
What about people who have never gone anywhere or done anything of note? How are we judging 'life experience' experience anyway? Sounds like a course on offer at the University of Life.
Or how about people who only exist and operate within their narrow social bubble? People like JRM? What does he know of my life experience?
I'm surprised Bully would make that argument to be honest. Seems riddled with holes. [Post edited 29 Oct 2019 17:00]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:02 - Oct 29 with 865 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:56 - Oct 29 by footers |
On your point about 16-year-olds, should we extend that to people who have never worked too? Only seems fair based on that criterion. |
Considering a 16 year old can leave school, work full time, join the forces (with parental consent), consent to medical treatment, join a union, get jiggy with a partner, get married, bet, apply for a passport and, most importantly........fly a glider, I'd have thought having the right to vote is entirely reasonable.
Besides, some seem to have a lot more sense and deecency than many adults. |  |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:03 - Oct 29 with 860 views | StokieBlue |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:56 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
1) Well, yes. But that seems to be all the rage these days. One side does it, so another does too. It's an arms race. The timing of it is what makes it gerrymandering though, not the overall concept.
2) You can't make a blanket statement like that . There are many adults who lack both of those aspects anyway. So that point doesn't stand up.
3) We already give Irish folk the vote. Should be extended to the other EU citizens who live here and add to the country's prosperity. [Post edited 29 Oct 2019 16:58]
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They will never go for (3) because it's 3.4m people who would immediately vote against Brexit.
The MPs putting forward the amendment know this so it all seems a bit pointless and like they don't actually want a GE either.
SB |  |
| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:04 - Oct 29 with 859 views | footers |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 16:59 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
What about people who have never gone anywhere or done anything of note? How are we judging 'life experience' experience anyway? Sounds like a course on offer at the University of Life.
Or how about people who only exist and operate within their narrow social bubble? People like JRM? What does he know of my life experience?
I'm surprised Bully would make that argument to be honest. Seems riddled with holes. [Post edited 29 Oct 2019 17:00]
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Criteria- at least one of each:
- Serious bereavement
- Trip to EuroDisney/Pleasurewood Hills
- Redundancy
- West End show (excluding Cats)
- Admission to A&E
- Divorce (excluding same-sex divorces)
That should be enough life experience right there. Anything less simply won't do. | |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:05 - Oct 29 with 855 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:02 - Oct 29 by Swansea_Blue |
Considering a 16 year old can leave school, work full time, join the forces (with parental consent), consent to medical treatment, join a union, get jiggy with a partner, get married, bet, apply for a passport and, most importantly........fly a glider, I'd have thought having the right to vote is entirely reasonable.
Besides, some seem to have a lot more sense and deecency than many adults. |
I wish I'd known I could have legally flown a glider to school when I was 16.
We had a prison guard come in to give us a talk about prison life, but they couldn't rustle up some suave and dashing Air Force type to come tell us about the thrill of aeronautical pursuits?
I fecking loved Pilotwings on the SNES too. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:07 - Oct 29 with 850 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:04 - Oct 29 by footers |
Criteria- at least one of each:
- Serious bereavement
- Trip to EuroDisney/Pleasurewood Hills
- Redundancy
- West End show (excluding Cats)
- Admission to A&E
- Divorce (excluding same-sex divorces)
That should be enough life experience right there. Anything less simply won't do. |
I would suggest we accept 'bankruptcy' in place of 'redundancy' for the self employed among us, and also add 'Pregnancy/STI scare after a one night stand' to the list. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:08 - Oct 29 with 846 views | footers |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:05 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
I wish I'd known I could have legally flown a glider to school when I was 16.
We had a prison guard come in to give us a talk about prison life, but they couldn't rustle up some suave and dashing Air Force type to come tell us about the thrill of aeronautical pursuits?
I fecking loved Pilotwings on the SNES too. |
Word to the wise... should've been in the Air Scouts, bruv ;) Swear down. | |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:09 - Oct 29 with 842 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:08 - Oct 29 by footers |
Word to the wise... should've been in the Air Scouts, bruv ;) Swear down. |
I assumed that would have involved nothing but cleaning dirty propellers and folding up maps. If I'd known I'd be cruising round Suffolk at 32,000 feet I'd have been all over it. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:09 - Oct 29 with 840 views | footers |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:09 - Oct 29 by SpruceMoose |
I assumed that would have involved nothing but cleaning dirty propellers and folding up maps. If I'd known I'd be cruising round Suffolk at 32,000 feet I'd have been all over it. |
Ride in a Hercules too :) | |
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| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:12 - Oct 29 with 834 views | SpruceMoose |
| Interesting thread re the General Election on 17:09 - Oct 29 by footers |
Ride in a Hercules too :) |
Oh well, we are born into the lives we are born into I suppose. At least I got to learn that rape was a real possibility in prison, and how to craft a weapon out of a toothbrush. Which was nice. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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