| Game on? 21:50 - Dec 11 with 8063 views | itfcjoe |
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| Game on? on 09:10 - Dec 12 with 1035 views | GeoffSentence |
| Game on? on 22:05 - Dec 11 by jeera |
"yeah but Corbyn" gag reflex.
This, all day f*cking long, this. |
WifeSentence told me, last night, that she was voting Conservative for the first time ever. The reason - Jeremy Corbyn.
I was horrified.
To the point that she could vote for anyone else 'yeah but Corbyn'
That it is a sure fire win for the tories here anyway so she could vote for anyone, even the labour candidate, and it wouldnt help Corbyn into number 10 'yeah but Corbyn'.
I console myself with the knowledge that the point above is correct and WifeSentence voting Conservative wont make a difference electorally, but knowing that she has the capacity to vote for the party of the rich and powerful is a burden I must now bear. |  |
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| Game on? on 09:11 - Dec 12 with 1034 views | chicoazul |
| Game on? on 08:26 - Dec 12 by Darth_Koont |
The answer to our narrow, non-representative political and media landscape is to conform to those expectations? Rather than challenge them and be supported by the independent media for doing so?
What's the point of that and whose interests does that serve?
At its core, this passive attitude to a dodgy status quo is why Scotland should leave the UK. We all need reform of this landscape but it seems it's just not going to happen. |
Wishful thinking. You have zero chance of what you want ever happening. You have the most popular avowed-Socialist in charge of Labour for many years and he is going to lose again today, to one of the most personally unpopular PMs in history. If you want the reform you speak of, you need to think big but act small like Blair did, get the confidence of the electorate you need to get the confidence of. Time and again the country rejects the kind of things you want, so you can either cry about it and hope against hope that you will get a) an Indy referendum and b) you dont cock it up this time, or you can look at recent history, see what works for Labour, and pursue that course.
Getting Corbyn 2 in 6 weeks will get you the same result in 5 years, providing it goes the way everyone seem to think it will today of course. |  |
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| Game on? on 09:18 - Dec 12 with 1009 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Game on? on 08:16 - Dec 12 by Herbivore |
I think you should be embarrassed, mate. You just said someone was a bad choice of leader because they looked a bit funny. When that's the level of political discourse we all suffer. |
That does make them a bad choice of leader though, as public perception is important when it comes to actually winning votes. Whether you think that should be the case is a different question |  |
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| Game on? on 09:25 - Dec 12 with 988 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Game on? on 09:10 - Dec 12 by GeoffSentence |
WifeSentence told me, last night, that she was voting Conservative for the first time ever. The reason - Jeremy Corbyn.
I was horrified.
To the point that she could vote for anyone else 'yeah but Corbyn'
That it is a sure fire win for the tories here anyway so she could vote for anyone, even the labour candidate, and it wouldnt help Corbyn into number 10 'yeah but Corbyn'.
I console myself with the knowledge that the point above is correct and WifeSentence voting Conservative wont make a difference electorally, but knowing that she has the capacity to vote for the party of the rich and powerful is a burden I must now bear. |
Time for a new Mrs Sentence.....!! |  |
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| Game on? on 09:28 - Dec 12 with 989 views | GaryCooper |
| Game on? on 09:11 - Dec 12 by chicoazul |
Wishful thinking. You have zero chance of what you want ever happening. You have the most popular avowed-Socialist in charge of Labour for many years and he is going to lose again today, to one of the most personally unpopular PMs in history. If you want the reform you speak of, you need to think big but act small like Blair did, get the confidence of the electorate you need to get the confidence of. Time and again the country rejects the kind of things you want, so you can either cry about it and hope against hope that you will get a) an Indy referendum and b) you dont cock it up this time, or you can look at recent history, see what works for Labour, and pursue that course.
Getting Corbyn 2 in 6 weeks will get you the same result in 5 years, providing it goes the way everyone seem to think it will today of course. |
Bullseye, it is so simple to see this, so difficult for some to absorb. |  | | |
| Game on? on 09:29 - Dec 12 with 976 views | BackToRussia |
| Game on? on 09:18 - Dec 12 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
That does make them a bad choice of leader though, as public perception is important when it comes to actually winning votes. Whether you think that should be the case is a different question |
Ridiculous post. What should a leader look like? |  |
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| Game on? on 09:31 - Dec 12 with 981 views | chicoazul |
| Game on? on 09:28 - Dec 12 by GaryCooper |
Bullseye, it is so simple to see this, so difficult for some to absorb. |
Because Blair is hated so much. | |
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| Game on? on 09:36 - Dec 12 with 970 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Game on? on 09:29 - Dec 12 by BackToRussia |
Ridiculous post. What should a leader look like? |
Difficult to put into words on a forum but I don’t think it’s ridiculous to say that a leader has to have a certain statesmanlike look and presence to them
People do make judgements based on appearances I’m afraid | |
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| Game on? on 09:37 - Dec 12 with 966 views | Darth_Koont |
| Game on? on 09:11 - Dec 12 by chicoazul |
Wishful thinking. You have zero chance of what you want ever happening. You have the most popular avowed-Socialist in charge of Labour for many years and he is going to lose again today, to one of the most personally unpopular PMs in history. If you want the reform you speak of, you need to think big but act small like Blair did, get the confidence of the electorate you need to get the confidence of. Time and again the country rejects the kind of things you want, so you can either cry about it and hope against hope that you will get a) an Indy referendum and b) you dont cock it up this time, or you can look at recent history, see what works for Labour, and pursue that course.
Getting Corbyn 2 in 6 weeks will get you the same result in 5 years, providing it goes the way everyone seem to think it will today of course. |
I think you're wrong about a few things there.
Firstly Boris is more popular than Corbyn ... or at least not as unpopular. It's well documented in surveys. That his policies are more popular than the Conservatives is also true. Which all goes to show how playing the man and not the ball has been the key strategy for the Conservatives and their media supporters.
Did Blair "think big"? Not by my measure. In fact it was thinking small that made him palatable to the previously antagonistic press. Blair bolstered the system.
And we'll see about Scotland. People in England have only recently started to grasp the lack of representation and the long-term risk of the status quo having seen the chaos of Brexit. Scotland's been ahead of that for decades and the latest f@ckwittery of a Johnson-led, hard Brexit government is more of a breaking point than you probably think. |  |
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| Game on? on 09:42 - Dec 12 with 937 views | BackToRussia |
| Game on? on 09:36 - Dec 12 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Difficult to put into words on a forum but I don’t think it’s ridiculous to say that a leader has to have a certain statesmanlike look and presence to them
People do make judgements based on appearances I’m afraid |
So Boris looks statesmanlike yeah? | |
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| Game on? on 09:47 - Dec 12 with 935 views | chicoazul |
| Game on? on 09:37 - Dec 12 by Darth_Koont |
I think you're wrong about a few things there.
Firstly Boris is more popular than Corbyn ... or at least not as unpopular. It's well documented in surveys. That his policies are more popular than the Conservatives is also true. Which all goes to show how playing the man and not the ball has been the key strategy for the Conservatives and their media supporters.
Did Blair "think big"? Not by my measure. In fact it was thinking small that made him palatable to the previously antagonistic press. Blair bolstered the system.
And we'll see about Scotland. People in England have only recently started to grasp the lack of representation and the long-term risk of the status quo having seen the chaos of Brexit. Scotland's been ahead of that for decades and the latest f@ckwittery of a Johnson-led, hard Brexit government is more of a breaking point than you probably think. |
I didnt say Boris wasnt more popular than Corbyn. I simply said he is a very unpopular PM, which he is.
If you compare the country from 1997 to 2007 I think many people would agree that Blair achieved a good chunk of trans formative change, just as the Tories have undone a lot of it via austerity.
And as you may recall, I too hope for an independent Scotland so I hope you're right about that but I believe the SNP will balls it up again sadly (which will of course be someone else's fault). | |
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| Game on? on 10:12 - Dec 12 with 890 views | GeoffSentence |
I did tell her it was the first foot on the path to divorce. | |
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| Game on? on 10:18 - Dec 12 with 874 views | Darth_Koont |
| Game on? on 09:47 - Dec 12 by chicoazul |
I didnt say Boris wasnt more popular than Corbyn. I simply said he is a very unpopular PM, which he is.
If you compare the country from 1997 to 2007 I think many people would agree that Blair achieved a good chunk of trans formative change, just as the Tories have undone a lot of it via austerity.
And as you may recall, I too hope for an independent Scotland so I hope you're right about that but I believe the SNP will balls it up again sadly (which will of course be someone else's fault). |
What transformative change did Blair achieve? Blair's Labour is a cut above even a Cameron-led Conservative government but I think you're getting a bit carried away.
It was a period of global economic growth with a lot of social and economic change from digitalisation and the Internet. That would have happened without him. And he put more money into public services based on the booming economy and to correct some of the underfunding that we'd seen up until then. But what did he actually change? The divisions in society were still growing, ditto the regional disenfranchisement, we didn't build enough houses, didn't do enough for the environment, the political system stayed the same he just changed how Labour played the game. And that's without even getting into how he put his stamp of approval on an already questionable neoliberalist economic outlook and Western imperialist world view.
Real transformative change means a change of direction not a rebadging exercise. | |
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| Game on? on 10:23 - Dec 12 with 852 views | Herbivore |
| Game on? on 09:10 - Dec 12 by GeoffSentence |
WifeSentence told me, last night, that she was voting Conservative for the first time ever. The reason - Jeremy Corbyn.
I was horrified.
To the point that she could vote for anyone else 'yeah but Corbyn'
That it is a sure fire win for the tories here anyway so she could vote for anyone, even the labour candidate, and it wouldnt help Corbyn into number 10 'yeah but Corbyn'.
I console myself with the knowledge that the point above is correct and WifeSentence voting Conservative wont make a difference electorally, but knowing that she has the capacity to vote for the party of the rich and powerful is a burden I must now bear. |
This might sound drastic, but I think you should file for divorce. |  |
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| Game on? on 10:28 - Dec 12 with 835 views | Steve_M |
| Game on? on 09:47 - Dec 12 by chicoazul |
I didnt say Boris wasnt more popular than Corbyn. I simply said he is a very unpopular PM, which he is.
If you compare the country from 1997 to 2007 I think many people would agree that Blair achieved a good chunk of trans formative change, just as the Tories have undone a lot of it via austerity.
And as you may recall, I too hope for an independent Scotland so I hope you're right about that but I believe the SNP will balls it up again sadly (which will of course be someone else's fault). |
Blair's greatest sin in the eyes of much of the left was winning elections wasn't it? |  |
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| Game on? on 10:30 - Dec 12 with 823 views | BackToRussia |
| Game on? on 10:28 - Dec 12 by Steve_M |
Blair's greatest sin in the eyes of much of the left was winning elections wasn't it? |
Give over. | |
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| Game on? on 10:42 - Dec 12 with 792 views | Herbivore |
| Game on? on 10:28 - Dec 12 by Steve_M |
Blair's greatest sin in the eyes of much of the left was winning elections wasn't it? |
You're better than that, Steve. | |
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| Game on? on 10:46 - Dec 12 with 791 views | Darth_Koont |
| Game on? on 10:28 - Dec 12 by Steve_M |
Blair's greatest sin in the eyes of much of the left was winning elections wasn't it? |
That's a bit cheap.
I'm sure a lot of people "on the left" were a little annoyed that after being told that the important thing is to be elected in the first place that real change wasn't really ever part of that once in power.
Turns out the means and the end were the same thing. With a bit of frightening hawkish foreign policy thrown in for extra lolz.
"Not as bad as the Conservatives" isn't really my vision for how this country moves forward. | |
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| Game on? on 10:51 - Dec 12 with 777 views | Steve_M |
| Game on? on 10:42 - Dec 12 by Herbivore |
You're better than that, Steve. |
There's truth in it though: the minimum wage, devolution, Human Rights Act, proper spending on the NHS and schools.
The only way progressive change happens in this country is through the centre left, that might be structural imbalances in the media but the country is by and large small c conservative. The idea that Blair was not much different to Cameron politically is rather laughable. | |
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| Game on? on 11:06 - Dec 12 with 751 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Game on? on 10:28 - Dec 12 by Steve_M |
Blair's greatest sin in the eyes of much of the left was winning elections wasn't it? |
Blair made the most of the credit cycle....the end....identity bullsh1t politics at its finest. | |
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| Game on? on 11:09 - Dec 12 with 739 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Game on? on 11:06 - Dec 12 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Blair made the most of the credit cycle....the end....identity bullsh1t politics at its finest. |
Furthermore...imagine the reaction if Corbyn had proposed paying everybody to have kids!!!! | |
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| Game on? on 11:10 - Dec 12 with 730 views | BackToRussia |
| Game on? on 10:51 - Dec 12 by Steve_M |
There's truth in it though: the minimum wage, devolution, Human Rights Act, proper spending on the NHS and schools.
The only way progressive change happens in this country is through the centre left, that might be structural imbalances in the media but the country is by and large small c conservative. The idea that Blair was not much different to Cameron politically is rather laughable. |
There's zero truth in it. The above you mention is the minimum Blair should have achieved. Leftists hate Blair because of the Iraq war and that ultimately he didn't get anywhere near reversing Thatcherism. That he got elected three times is meaningless, don't try and make out this is an issue of jealously of success. Its about remaining true to socialism. | |
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| Game on? on 11:15 - Dec 12 with 711 views | giant_stow |
| Game on? on 11:10 - Dec 12 by BackToRussia |
There's zero truth in it. The above you mention is the minimum Blair should have achieved. Leftists hate Blair because of the Iraq war and that ultimately he didn't get anywhere near reversing Thatcherism. That he got elected three times is meaningless, don't try and make out this is an issue of jealously of success. Its about remaining true to socialism. |
A socialist labour party is worse than useless if it can't get in power. |  |
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| Game on? on 11:16 - Dec 12 with 708 views | BackToRussia |
| Game on? on 11:15 - Dec 12 by giant_stow |
A socialist labour party is worse than useless if it can't get in power. |
The thing about lesser evils is that they're still evil. | |
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| Game on? on 11:19 - Dec 12 with 704 views | chicoazul |
| Game on? on 10:28 - Dec 12 by Steve_M |
Blair's greatest sin in the eyes of much of the left was winning elections wasn't it? |
Yep. Things wont be any different though. This will be the second election Milne et al will have lost but their answer will be "More of this sort of thing" rather than embracing what works next time, and the time after that. Meanwhile the useless Tories will continue to inflict misery on our country. | |
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