| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts 08:31 - Feb 9 with 8387 views | Mullet |
Lots of discussion with Snr, lots of dissection.
Andy Warren's interview with Bart compared to Watson's with Lee O'Neil tells us so much. Both men stopped themselves from saying too much, you could hear them hold back, but every Town fan should listen to them. The self-inflicted damage that got Hurst in was really painful to hear again.
Bart's treatment and how he touches on not being alone within the squad, was widely shared on here at the time and dismissed. Even when it became too loud and from too many places to ignore. Some people clearly still target Chambers and Skuse as they are the last remnants of an era that causes so much embarrassment to them now. But yesterday both did more good than bad even when they are clearly on their last proper seasons. That's very worrying.
Lee O'Neil talks in complete candy floss. It's well presented, but utterly doesn't tell us a single thing. I'm not expecting the minutes of the meetings, but mentioning them and then telling us everything is in hand only makes me think the opposite.
Bart on the other hand clearly shows how hurt he still is, the "you only care about money" gambit by Hurst after only a couple of games is stunning and the toxic culture Evans let sweep through the club is frankly unforgivable.
O'Neil insists Evans offered Mick everything in January 15, Bart suggests the opposite. We have all these great young players but they only exist in theory. How long since we had players like Nydam or Kenlock being blooded? They're now injured alongside so many others or look totally shot and out of contention even at this level.
On the way home the Athletic have a podcast called something like "Going up, going down" they did 5 minutes previewing the game. Listening to it afterwards was painful. They pretty much predicted how the game would go. Pointing out how wasteful we have been with the opportunity to go back up etc.
It feels like the outside world has once again caught on to how bad things are at the club and maybe the fans will be more in line or more receptive to that.
There was a telling comparison with Blackpool who are really struggling under a manager who you'd trust to do better in Grayson. They got the Oystons out, got the fans back and have a saviour like owner in a local boy done good, but it's not working out. They brought in 20 odd players and gone nowhere.
I think we could be in danger of doing similar in the next few years. This league sucks teams in and doesn't let them go easily. Yesterday felt like we have tipped into just not keeping enough pace with the pack to go up, it'll be luck if at all now most likely. Getting Evans out might help, it might even feel good, but it also leaves us open to so many external factors while we lose ground on the rest of the football league all getting richer and further away from us than ever.
Even going up puts us in a position of begging for scraps and hoping to survive with a manager that just can't make the best of what he's got. Bleak to say the least. |  |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 08:22 - Feb 10 with 2500 views | NewcyBlue |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 08:01 - Feb 10 by BrixtonBlue |
Football supporters in 'having hope' shocker.We got into the play-offs once under Mick - 6th place on goal difference I believe - despite losing and getting into them because other teams fecked up.
The joke was always "15th place is our natural home". To suggest Mick had us regularly pushing for the play-offs is nonsense and rewriting history. |
Let’s hope we do better than scrape into the playoffs this time.... although we are a division lower. |  |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 09:10 - Feb 10 with 2485 views | JimmyJazz |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 08:22 - Feb 10 by NewcyBlue |
Let’s hope we do better than scrape into the playoffs this time.... although we are a division lower. |
Despite Stuart Watson saying the opposite yesterday, if we do get into the play offs, who do you fancy us to overcome?
He reckons Rotherham and Peterborogh will be the top 2
Oxford?
Sunderland?
Portsmouth?
Wycombe?
Coventry?
At this point in time i wouldn't be over confident that we could come out victorious of a home/away battle against any of the above |  |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 09:59 - Feb 10 with 2472 views | crossyitfc |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 09:10 - Feb 10 by JimmyJazz |
Despite Stuart Watson saying the opposite yesterday, if we do get into the play offs, who do you fancy us to overcome?
He reckons Rotherham and Peterborogh will be the top 2
Oxford?
Sunderland?
Portsmouth?
Wycombe?
Coventry?
At this point in time i wouldn't be over confident that we could come out victorious of a home/away battle against any of the above |
Maybe Wycombe. That's about it though. |  | | |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:08 - Feb 10 with 2463 views | Bluebell |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 08:01 - Feb 10 by BrixtonBlue |
Football supporters in 'having hope' shocker.We got into the play-offs once under Mick - 6th place on goal difference I believe - despite losing and getting into them because other teams fecked up.
The joke was always "15th place is our natural home". To suggest Mick had us regularly pushing for the play-offs is nonsense and rewriting history. |
To be honest Dolly I would much rather be sitting 15th in the Championship than 7th in league 1 at this moment in time! [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 10:15]
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:18 - Feb 10 with 2454 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:08 - Feb 10 by Bluebell |
To be honest Dolly I would much rather be sitting 15th in the Championship than 7th in league 1 at this moment in time! [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 10:15]
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So would I. So would all of us. Not really sure what your point is. |  |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:45 - Feb 10 with 2428 views | J4ck22 |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 08:01 - Feb 10 by BrixtonBlue |
Football supporters in 'having hope' shocker.We got into the play-offs once under Mick - 6th place on goal difference I believe - despite losing and getting into them because other teams fecked up.
The joke was always "15th place is our natural home". To suggest Mick had us regularly pushing for the play-offs is nonsense and rewriting history. |
Between 2013 and 2016 we finished 9th, 6th and 7th. What is your definition of 'pushing for the play-offs' if it's not coming close and ultimately just missing out? |  | | |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:56 - Feb 10 with 2422 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:45 - Feb 10 by J4ck22 |
Between 2013 and 2016 we finished 9th, 6th and 7th. What is your definition of 'pushing for the play-offs' if it's not coming close and ultimately just missing out? |
Another re-writer of history. In those years, despite the final league placing looking close, in reality we weren't that close. As Mick's detractors would have told you at the time.
We were never in the play-off places in the years we finished 9th and 7th (except maybe at the very start of the season) and certainly never looked like being in them come the end. No-one was worrying their holiday clashed with the play-off final.
I liked Mick, he did a great job just keeping us afloat, but he didn't have us pushing for the play-offs every year. He just didn't. | |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 11:16 - Feb 10 with 2407 views | J4ck22 |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:56 - Feb 10 by BrixtonBlue |
Another re-writer of history. In those years, despite the final league placing looking close, in reality we weren't that close. As Mick's detractors would have told you at the time.
We were never in the play-off places in the years we finished 9th and 7th (except maybe at the very start of the season) and certainly never looked like being in them come the end. No-one was worrying their holiday clashed with the play-off final.
I liked Mick, he did a great job just keeping us afloat, but he didn't have us pushing for the play-offs every year. He just didn't. |
I love that every person who disagrees with you is suddenly a re-writer of history.
I remember quite a bit of buzz in each of those seasons about making the play-offs, but I guess your memory is the only valid one here.
No, Mick didn't have us pushing for the playoffs every year, that would be a silly suggestion. However I disagree that those three years weren't pushing for it. | | | |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 11:37 - Feb 10 with 2385 views | NewcyBlue |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 09:10 - Feb 10 by JimmyJazz |
Despite Stuart Watson saying the opposite yesterday, if we do get into the play offs, who do you fancy us to overcome?
He reckons Rotherham and Peterborogh will be the top 2
Oxford?
Sunderland?
Portsmouth?
Wycombe?
Coventry?
At this point in time i wouldn't be over confident that we could come out victorious of a home/away battle against any of the above |
I wouldn’t fancy us to overcome anyone at the moment.
If I think we are going to win, we lose. If I think we are going to lose, we lose.
Not going back up would be a massive failure. | |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 11:51 - Feb 10 with 2371 views | Facefacts |
We don't have the quality to score goals at this level (Norwood, Jackson and Keane can't take the chances the team works so hard to create) and we sleepwalked through the January transfer window while all our rivals did something. Garbutt, our best player, is injured just when we needed him to settle two big games. If we were to scrape up to the Championship we would have zero chance of staying up. We would probably need to spend 40 to 50 million to guarantee staying in the Championship. The only interpretation that can be put on keeping Paul Lambert after his Boxing Day meltdown and even ridiculously extending his contract is that Marcus Evans is happy to stay at this level now. He has no appetite for the championship and the level of investment that would be required. |  | | |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:04 - Feb 10 with 2358 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:56 - Feb 10 by BrixtonBlue |
Another re-writer of history. In those years, despite the final league placing looking close, in reality we weren't that close. As Mick's detractors would have told you at the time.
We were never in the play-off places in the years we finished 9th and 7th (except maybe at the very start of the season) and certainly never looked like being in them come the end. No-one was worrying their holiday clashed with the play-off final.
I liked Mick, he did a great job just keeping us afloat, but he didn't have us pushing for the play-offs every year. He just didn't. |
In 2013/14 when we finished 9th we were still in the playoff places in January, and within 4 and 5 points in March and April respectively
In 2015/16 when we finished 7th we were in as late as Feb and within a point still in March
Even in 2017/18 we spent most of the first half of the season in the playoff places - we clearly were pushing towards them regularly even if ultimately we fell away more often than not [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 12:05]
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| Ha! (n/t) on 12:15 - Feb 10 with 2337 views | Bloots |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:04 - Feb 10 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
In 2013/14 when we finished 9th we were still in the playoff places in January, and within 4 and 5 points in March and April respectively
In 2015/16 when we finished 7th we were in as late as Feb and within a point still in March
Even in 2017/18 we spent most of the first half of the season in the playoff places - we clearly were pushing towards them regularly even if ultimately we fell away more often than not [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 12:05]
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| Elite Level Poster: Elite Level Supporter: Elite Level Human |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:17 - Feb 10 with 2328 views | J4ck22 |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:04 - Feb 10 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
In 2013/14 when we finished 9th we were still in the playoff places in January, and within 4 and 5 points in March and April respectively
In 2015/16 when we finished 7th we were in as late as Feb and within a point still in March
Even in 2017/18 we spent most of the first half of the season in the playoff places - we clearly were pushing towards them regularly even if ultimately we fell away more often than not [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 12:05]
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Stop re-writing history with those facts! | | | |
| Ha! (n/t) on 12:22 - Feb 10 with 2307 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Ha! (n/t) on 12:15 - Feb 10 by Bloots |
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To be honest it might have been later than that - I couldn’t find one of those league position line graph things so was having a play around on the 11v11 league table generator (a useful resource for anyone inclined to look up league tables as at a certain date), but didn’t have the time or inclination to check every single date! | |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:26 - Feb 10 with 2292 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 10:45 - Feb 10 by J4ck22 |
Between 2013 and 2016 we finished 9th, 6th and 7th. What is your definition of 'pushing for the play-offs' if it's not coming close and ultimately just missing out? |
Paul Jewell second half of the season play off form* shall always be the benchmark of success.
*If you take out results after Easter and midweek games. [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 12:27]
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| As an update, and.... on 13:10 - Feb 10 with 2265 views | Bloots |
| Ha! (n/t) on 12:22 - Feb 10 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
To be honest it might have been later than that - I couldn’t find one of those league position line graph things so was having a play around on the 11v11 league table generator (a useful resource for anyone inclined to look up league tables as at a certain date), but didn’t have the time or inclination to check every single date! |
....quoting history, rather than "rewriting it":
17/04/14 - Goal Difference outside the play offs.
2015 - Play offs
18/03/16 - 1 point outside the play offs.
TWTD | |
| Elite Level Poster: Elite Level Supporter: Elite Level Human |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 13:16 - Feb 10 with 2247 views | JimmyJazz |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:04 - Feb 10 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
In 2013/14 when we finished 9th we were still in the playoff places in January, and within 4 and 5 points in March and April respectively
In 2015/16 when we finished 7th we were in as late as Feb and within a point still in March
Even in 2017/18 we spent most of the first half of the season in the playoff places - we clearly were pushing towards them regularly even if ultimately we fell away more often than not [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 12:05]
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2015/16 is the season we got Pringle in on loan. We were absolutely dire in the second half of that season (not due to Pringle). Although we finished 7th, there is no way that was a push for the play-offs
I mention Pringle because that is how i knew which year it was, in amongst the usual disappointments we seem to have encountered for about 15 years now - since the last playoff defeat under BFJ | |
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| As an update, and.... on 13:17 - Feb 10 with 2240 views | PJH |
| As an update, and.... on 13:10 - Feb 10 by Bloots |
....quoting history, rather than "rewriting it":
17/04/14 - Goal Difference outside the play offs.
2015 - Play offs
18/03/16 - 1 point outside the play offs.
TWTD |
I know that had ANM not given away a late penalty at Bolton on 8th March 2016 and costing us two points we were in the top 6 that night.
edit-AMN even. [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 13:21]
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| 18/03/16 - 1 point outside the play offs...... on 13:21 - Feb 10 with 2218 views | Bloots |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 13:16 - Feb 10 by JimmyJazz |
2015/16 is the season we got Pringle in on loan. We were absolutely dire in the second half of that season (not due to Pringle). Although we finished 7th, there is no way that was a push for the play-offs
I mention Pringle because that is how i knew which year it was, in amongst the usual disappointments we seem to have encountered for about 15 years now - since the last playoff defeat under BFJ |
....fact. | |
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| As an update, and.... on 13:21 - Feb 10 with 2221 views | Dubtractor |
| As an update, and.... on 13:10 - Feb 10 by Bloots |
....quoting history, rather than "rewriting it":
17/04/14 - Goal Difference outside the play offs.
2015 - Play offs
18/03/16 - 1 point outside the play offs.
TWTD |
I think if Dolly had stuck with "none of us really thought we were good enough to make the playoffs" it would have been a fair reflection of the mood of our support in those seasons.
The thing with Mick's teams though, even though we were on occasion a bit crap to watch, is that they were bloody persistent and managed to grub out results and rarely went on losing streaks. So we had a knack of staying in touch whilst not really convincing that we would make it. But can't really avoid the fact that a win of 2 extra over a season would have seen us in the top 6.
Seems like a golden era compared to now mind you. |  |
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| As an update, and.... on 13:27 - Feb 10 with 2202 views | BrixtonBlue |
| As an update, and.... on 13:21 - Feb 10 by Dubtractor |
I think if Dolly had stuck with "none of us really thought we were good enough to make the playoffs" it would have been a fair reflection of the mood of our support in those seasons.
The thing with Mick's teams though, even though we were on occasion a bit crap to watch, is that they were bloody persistent and managed to grub out results and rarely went on losing streaks. So we had a knack of staying in touch whilst not really convincing that we would make it. But can't really avoid the fact that a win of 2 extra over a season would have seen us in the top 6.
Seems like a golden era compared to now mind you. |
Indeed. This is what I was getting at. Maybe, like you said, I worded it badly. | |
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| It could have been that, yes.... on 13:33 - Feb 10 with 2191 views | Bloots |
| As an update, and.... on 13:27 - Feb 10 by BrixtonBlue |
Indeed. This is what I was getting at. Maybe, like you said, I worded it badly. |
....or you could have just been wrong?
Hold on, I'll check........no, you just "worded it badly".
You are, of course, never wrong. | |
| Elite Level Poster: Elite Level Supporter: Elite Level Human |
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| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 13:37 - Feb 10 with 2175 views | chicoazul |
| Long drive each way allowed for lots of podcasts on 12:04 - Feb 10 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
In 2013/14 when we finished 9th we were still in the playoff places in January, and within 4 and 5 points in March and April respectively
In 2015/16 when we finished 7th we were in as late as Feb and within a point still in March
Even in 2017/18 we spent most of the first half of the season in the playoff places - we clearly were pushing towards them regularly even if ultimately we fell away more often than not [Post edited 10 Feb 2020 12:05]
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Stop being so pedantic!!1!!!!1!!11 |  |
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| As an update, and.... on 13:48 - Feb 10 with 2160 views | marchy |
| As an update, and.... on 13:21 - Feb 10 by Dubtractor |
I think if Dolly had stuck with "none of us really thought we were good enough to make the playoffs" it would have been a fair reflection of the mood of our support in those seasons.
The thing with Mick's teams though, even though we were on occasion a bit crap to watch, is that they were bloody persistent and managed to grub out results and rarely went on losing streaks. So we had a knack of staying in touch whilst not really convincing that we would make it. But can't really avoid the fact that a win of 2 extra over a season would have seen us in the top 6.
Seems like a golden era compared to now mind you. |
Thing is, that may well have lasted into eternity, if a) the Championship around us stayed constant and b) Mick was willing to stick around forever. But more and more money continues to filter into the Championship, and competitors were getting stronger, and whilst Mick was still finding a Waghorn-like diamond every now and then, we were getting left behind. And however popular the party line is that Mick was driven out, do people honestly believe he was going to turn down Ireland in November? The way this club is run was always going to come back to bite us. | | | |
| As an update, and.... on 14:28 - Feb 10 with 2118 views | Dubtractor |
| As an update, and.... on 13:48 - Feb 10 by marchy |
Thing is, that may well have lasted into eternity, if a) the Championship around us stayed constant and b) Mick was willing to stick around forever. But more and more money continues to filter into the Championship, and competitors were getting stronger, and whilst Mick was still finding a Waghorn-like diamond every now and then, we were getting left behind. And however popular the party line is that Mick was driven out, do people honestly believe he was going to turn down Ireland in November? The way this club is run was always going to come back to bite us. |
FWIW I was firmly of the view that it was time for a change, the last 2 seasons under Mick weren't great (yes, it has got MUCH worse since), and there was clearly a rift between him and a large portion of our support.
But the bigger problem, then as now, wasn't the manager it was our disinterested owner. | |
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