| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:33 - Feb 11 with 2850 views | chicoazul |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 21:07 - Feb 10 by jeera |
Someone who came here as a kid and has lived for, say, 17 years since, doesn't have to be grateful.
It's their home.
Be reminded these are people who have paid for their crimes with prison sentences.
To then want to ruin their lives on top of that is not much short of sadistic. |
Well I don't think anyone should be grateful no, but the law is the law after all and we are all equal under it. I think you're probably right on all other counts here and I am inclined to agree with you emotionally. But I can't agree that it's ethnic cleansing as per OP, nor should it be conflated with Windrush. |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:58 - Feb 11 with 2801 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:14 - Feb 11 by Herbivore |
Looking at who is running the show, I think there's a fair chance of there being an error or a failing in these cases. |
It’s possible but that’s just speculation
Patel’s response yesterday was absolutely shameful though |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:59 - Feb 11 with 2798 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:03 - Feb 11 by BackToRussia |
You voted Labour then? Because this is a two party state. If you didn't vote Labour, you knew you'd be voting in Boris. |
That’s not true though
A vote for another candidate is a vote for that candidate. By your logic, any tree-hugging hippy (to be candid) who voted Green was really voting for Boris
I don’t think it’s particularly helpful to encourage people to vote based on who they don’t want rather than who they do want, and ultimately that sort of attitude only serves to reinforce said two party system | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:06 - Feb 11 with 2787 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:25 - Feb 11 by BackToRussia |
12 months is absolutely nothing. You could deal one baggie of cocaine and get done for that. |
Or you could snort your way through a bag as a member of the cabinet and not face any charges at all...
Anyway, update - they've ignored the courts and gone ahead with the flight - https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/feb/11/deportation-flight-leaves-uk-for
This government is operating outside of the law (again). That thread re creeping towards being a fascist state? Might need an update. |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:08 - Feb 11 with 2768 views | BackToRussia |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:59 - Feb 11 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
That’s not true though
A vote for another candidate is a vote for that candidate. By your logic, any tree-hugging hippy (to be candid) who voted Green was really voting for Boris
I don’t think it’s particularly helpful to encourage people to vote based on who they don’t want rather than who they do want, and ultimately that sort of attitude only serves to reinforce said two party system |
No, what reinforces the 2 party state is FPTP. And yes, anyone voting Green essentially voted for Boris. |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:08 - Feb 11 with 2780 views | Steve_M |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:33 - Feb 11 by chicoazul |
Well I don't think anyone should be grateful no, but the law is the law after all and we are all equal under it. I think you're probably right on all other counts here and I am inclined to agree with you emotionally. But I can't agree that it's ethnic cleansing as per OP, nor should it be conflated with Windrush. |
"we are all equal under it"
Well, to punish someone a second time for a solitary offence perhaps suggests that some are less equal than others. Deporting people years after they have served a sentence for a crime does not strike me as fair. |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:09 - Feb 11 with 2772 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 21:36 - Feb 10 by artsbossbeard |
What the hell have we become? |
Small-minded, nationalistic little feckwits.
Or throughly disenchanted with ME's running of the club.
Depending on the subject of that question  | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:09 - Feb 11 with 2769 views | tractordownsouth |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 08:03 - Feb 11 by BackToRussia |
You voted Labour then? Because this is a two party state. If you didn't vote Labour, you knew you'd be voting in Boris. |
I voted Lib Dem is a Tory/ LD marginal... Labour finished with 3000 votes in my constituency, does that mean I voted in Boris? It’s a silly argument. |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:09 - Feb 11 with 2754 views | BackToRussia |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:06 - Feb 11 by Swansea_Blue |
Or you could snort your way through a bag as a member of the cabinet and not face any charges at all...
Anyway, update - they've ignored the courts and gone ahead with the flight - https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/feb/11/deportation-flight-leaves-uk-for
This government is operating outside of the law (again). That thread re creeping towards being a fascist state? Might need an update. |
Exactly mate. Mini Trump loves it doesn't he. We'll be building a wall next. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:10 - Feb 11 with 2751 views | BackToRussia |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:09 - Feb 11 by tractordownsouth |
I voted Lib Dem is a Tory/ LD marginal... Labour finished with 3000 votes in my constituency, does that mean I voted in Boris? It’s a silly argument. |
Obviously if you lived in the few places the LDs had a standing MP or had a strong chance of winning then I wasn't referring to you. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:10 - Feb 11 with 2760 views | chicoazul |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:08 - Feb 11 by Steve_M |
"we are all equal under it"
Well, to punish someone a second time for a solitary offence perhaps suggests that some are less equal than others. Deporting people years after they have served a sentence for a crime does not strike me as fair. |
But that is the law nonetheless which is the point. If it were someone from Eritrea, Indonesia, New Zealand or Canada then it applies to them too (I think unless there is some Commonwealth exemption...). | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:11 - Feb 11 with 2743 views | BackToRussia |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:08 - Feb 11 by Steve_M |
"we are all equal under it"
Well, to punish someone a second time for a solitary offence perhaps suggests that some are less equal than others. Deporting people years after they have served a sentence for a crime does not strike me as fair. |
Deporting them to a country many of them haven't lived since they were children. With no family. Despite a court ruling. This is a national disgrace. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:17 - Feb 11 with 2716 views | gordon |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:10 - Feb 11 by chicoazul |
But that is the law nonetheless which is the point. If it were someone from Eritrea, Indonesia, New Zealand or Canada then it applies to them too (I think unless there is some Commonwealth exemption...). |
I appreciate compassion might not be your strong suit, but I'm still pretty shocked you're trying to defend this.
Would you support a law that deported British citizens who had served 12 months to countries they had visited a couple of times on holiday? |  | | |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:20 - Feb 11 with 2685 views | Herbivore |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:17 - Feb 11 by gordon |
I appreciate compassion might not be your strong suit, but I'm still pretty shocked you're trying to defend this.
Would you support a law that deported British citizens who had served 12 months to countries they had visited a couple of times on holiday? |
Chico just likes to be contrary, you can pretty much guarantee that whatever the consensus view is he will decide to make a case for the opposite, usually very badly. |  |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:21 - Feb 11 with 2691 views | lowhouseblue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:17 - Feb 11 by gordon |
I appreciate compassion might not be your strong suit, but I'm still pretty shocked you're trying to defend this.
Would you support a law that deported British citizens who had served 12 months to countries they had visited a couple of times on holiday? |
I have no problem with deporting people who have come here as adults and have committed serious crimes here. but clearly it is wrong to deport people who came here as children and therefore have no knowledge of living anywhere else. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:21 - Feb 11 with 2695 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:10 - Feb 11 by chicoazul |
But that is the law nonetheless which is the point. If it were someone from Eritrea, Indonesia, New Zealand or Canada then it applies to them too (I think unless there is some Commonwealth exemption...). |
They're also in breach of the law by breaking a court order preventing the deportation pending review as to whether the deportees had access to legal advice (so another potential breach of law). If law has primacy it should for everything; picking and choosing which laws to obey and which to flaunt isn't an option.
There was absolutely no reason why they couldn't pause this to ensure the process was legal. None at all. Except this is simply another shallow gesture to appeal to the government's core audience. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:24 - Feb 11 with 2680 views | chicoazul |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:17 - Feb 11 by gordon |
I appreciate compassion might not be your strong suit, but I'm still pretty shocked you're trying to defend this.
Would you support a law that deported British citizens who had served 12 months to countries they had visited a couple of times on holiday? |
You're confusing defending with explaining. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:38 - Feb 11 with 2641 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:21 - Feb 11 by lowhouseblue |
I have no problem with deporting people who have come here as adults and have committed serious crimes here. but clearly it is wrong to deport people who came here as children and therefore have no knowledge of living anywhere else. |
Ditto. There needs to be something else there doesn't there, whatever the current legal position is? I don't know what though.
And ideally you'd deport people at point of sentencing, not round up historical cases for what is effectively populist propaganda. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:39 - Feb 11 with 2639 views | BloomBlue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:08 - Feb 11 by Steve_M |
"we are all equal under it"
Well, to punish someone a second time for a solitary offence perhaps suggests that some are less equal than others. Deporting people years after they have served a sentence for a crime does not strike me as fair. |
But the law for foreign nationals is deportation as introduced by Labour Gov in 2007. May I suggest if Labour were against the law they should have included removing it in their last manifesto.
You talk about punishd twice I can assure you when an individual is raped that's a life sentence. They weren't forced to rape if they had stayed within the law this wouldn't be a problem for them |  | | |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:49 - Feb 11 with 2613 views | gordon |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:24 - Feb 11 by chicoazul |
You're confusing defending with explaining. |
It's not clear what you're saying then. Do you think it's OK to deport people to countries they have no meaningful connection with? | | | |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:50 - Feb 11 with 2609 views | BloomBlue |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:38 - Feb 11 by Swansea_Blue |
Ditto. There needs to be something else there doesn't there, whatever the current legal position is? I don't know what though.
And ideally you'd deport people at point of sentencing, not round up historical cases for what is effectively populist propaganda. |
But some of the cases have been going on for many years because they have (as is their right) been challenging it in the courts and the courts eventually decided the Government wasn't breaking the law by deporting them. | | | |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:59 - Feb 11 with 2578 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:08 - Feb 11 by BackToRussia |
No, what reinforces the 2 party state is FPTP. And yes, anyone voting Green essentially voted for Boris. |
Absolutely agree re FPTP, however even within FPTP another party could theoretically prosper. Telling people that voting for those parties is actually voting for someone else just reinforces it
Taking the Green point to its conclusion, by existing the Greens are actually Tories as it’s likely a chunk of their votes could otherwise go to Labour | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 10:00 - Feb 11 with 2576 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:09 - Feb 11 by tractordownsouth |
I voted Lib Dem is a Tory/ LD marginal... Labour finished with 3000 votes in my constituency, does that mean I voted in Boris? It’s a silly argument. |
Damn those 3000 Labour voters voting Tory | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 10:07 - Feb 11 with 2553 views | Herbivore |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:50 - Feb 11 by BloomBlue |
But some of the cases have been going on for many years because they have (as is their right) been challenging it in the courts and the courts eventually decided the Government wasn't breaking the law by deporting them. |
You do realise that "not breaking the law" is a pretty low ethical standard to hold our government to? I mean, they've not been averse to breaking the law either, but I'd rather hoped we might aspire to be a bit better than that. | |
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| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 10:22 - Feb 11 with 2533 views | chicoazul |
| Disgusting that we're still doing this: on 09:49 - Feb 11 by gordon |
It's not clear what you're saying then. Do you think it's OK to deport people to countries they have no meaningful connection with? |
No, it's very clear what i'm saying, I am explaining why this isnt Windrush nor is it "ethnic cleansing". As to your second question here is my answer; I think it depends on the offence and the length of time a criminal in question has been in this country. If for e.g. they are convicted of multiple counts of burglary and have been in the UK for 4 years that's one thing. | |
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