| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down 12:31 - Apr 16 with 3201 views | NotSure |
No major lockdown, Cafes, Bars still open.
Are they just healthier in Sweden? |  | | |  |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:35 - Apr 16 with 2429 views | itfcjoe |
Are you sure? A couple of days ago they were trending quite badly especially compared to those with early lock down like neighbours Norway |  |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:36 - Apr 16 with 2413 views | Chutney |
It's hard to make comparisons because population density and demographics etc makes a huge difference, as well as health care capabilities etc. Having said that it's very interesting to see that Sweden doesn't appear any worse off than near neighbours Norway or Denmark who have taken much more radical lockdown measures. |  | | |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:37 - Apr 16 with 2419 views | itfcjoe |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:39 - Apr 16 with 2389 views | Chutney |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:35 - Apr 16 by itfcjoe |
Are you sure? A couple of days ago they were trending quite badly especially compared to those with early lock down like neighbours Norway |
I hate talking in such terms, it feels so callous, but on a 'death per 1m of population' basis they're much of a muchness.
Edit: It's also worth noting its early days. The benefits of lockdown / risks of not probably wont truly be felt until a few weeks given the time between infection and ultimate fatalities. [Post edited 16 Apr 2020 12:43]
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:43 - Apr 16 with 2359 views | eireblue |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:36 - Apr 16 by Chutney |
It's hard to make comparisons because population density and demographics etc makes a huge difference, as well as health care capabilities etc. Having said that it's very interesting to see that Sweden doesn't appear any worse off than near neighbours Norway or Denmark who have taken much more radical lockdown measures. |
What statistic are you using for comparison?
In terms of deaths per million, they are doing worse, as an example. |  | | |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:43 - Apr 16 with 2351 views | NotSure |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:36 - Apr 16 by Chutney |
It's hard to make comparisons because population density and demographics etc makes a huge difference, as well as health care capabilities etc. Having said that it's very interesting to see that Sweden doesn't appear any worse off than near neighbours Norway or Denmark who have taken much more radical lockdown measures. |
Scandinavia doesn't seem as badly affected as UK, France or Italy.
Even the death rates in Germany aren't as bad as the above 3.
And the way the deaths in China just stopped is very strange, so strange in fact that not many people believe it.
To me the current statistics just don't make any sense. | | | |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:44 - Apr 16 with 2345 views | Chutney |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:43 - Apr 16 by eireblue |
What statistic are you using for comparison?
In terms of deaths per million, they are doing worse, as an example. |
You're quite right - I stand corrected on that.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries | | | |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:46 - Apr 16 with 2333 views | Chutney |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:43 - Apr 16 by NotSure |
Scandinavia doesn't seem as badly affected as UK, France or Italy.
Even the death rates in Germany aren't as bad as the above 3.
And the way the deaths in China just stopped is very strange, so strange in fact that not many people believe it.
To me the current statistics just don't make any sense. |
I saw a report that suggested as many as 40,000 people have died in Wuhan alone. It wouldn't surprise me at all, given its a huge city of 11m people. Local workers in the mortuaries etc and providers of urns have suggested there's zero chance the govt stats can be accurate. | | | |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:57 - Apr 16 with 2283 views | Ryorry |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:39 - Apr 16 by Chutney |
I hate talking in such terms, it feels so callous, but on a 'death per 1m of population' basis they're much of a muchness.
Edit: It's also worth noting its early days. The benefits of lockdown / risks of not probably wont truly be felt until a few weeks given the time between infection and ultimate fatalities. [Post edited 16 Apr 2020 12:43]
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Sweden's entire population is only 10.23 million; Stockholm's population about 1.5 million, Gothenburg about 600K, and the rest spread out over numerous smuch maller towns/cities, so they're in effect much more socially distanced already by geography than countries like Italy and the UK!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_Sweden_by_population
"The population is measured by Statistics Sweden. The statistics bureau uses the term tätort (locality or urban area), which is defined as a continuous built-up area with a maximum distance of 200 m between residences. The localities are geographical and statistical units". |  |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:04 - Apr 16 with 2229 views | monytowbray |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:57 - Apr 16 by Ryorry |
Sweden's entire population is only 10.23 million; Stockholm's population about 1.5 million, Gothenburg about 600K, and the rest spread out over numerous smuch maller towns/cities, so they're in effect much more socially distanced already by geography than countries like Italy and the UK!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_Sweden_by_population
"The population is measured by Statistics Sweden. The statistics bureau uses the term tätort (locality or urban area), which is defined as a continuous built-up area with a maximum distance of 200 m between residences. The localities are geographical and statistical units". |
I was going to say this.
From early stats and also the fact outbreaks unsurprisingly hit cities worse population density is a huge factor, the list of worse hit areas make sense.
Herd immunity will need to be a part of the strategy in the long run anyway, but it needs to be juggled with healthcare capacity and protecting the vulnerable.
Still hasn't stopped does desperate to defend how p1ss poor our early choices were to delay lockdown using the line as a defence without context though. Had we of done Sweden's approach our NHS would be crippled several times over and we'd see more deaths from that. |  |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:17 - Apr 16 with 2164 views | WeWereZombies |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:43 - Apr 16 by NotSure |
Scandinavia doesn't seem as badly affected as UK, France or Italy.
Even the death rates in Germany aren't as bad as the above 3.
And the way the deaths in China just stopped is very strange, so strange in fact that not many people believe it.
To me the current statistics just don't make any sense. |
Norway seemed to have the worst situation (in numbers of cases, not deaths) until the end of March and then, as far as the Scandinavian countries go, Sweden is where things ramped up:
https://interactive.aljazeera.com/aje/2020/coronavirus-making-sense-of-the-numbe
But, as the attached interactive page points out, there are so many variables so it is best to take all statistics as the roughest of rough guides at the moment. |  |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:25 - Apr 16 with 2132 views | itfcjoe |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:39 - Apr 16 by Chutney |
I hate talking in such terms, it feels so callous, but on a 'death per 1m of population' basis they're much of a muchness.
Edit: It's also worth noting its early days. The benefits of lockdown / risks of not probably wont truly be felt until a few weeks given the time between infection and ultimate fatalities. [Post edited 16 Apr 2020 12:43]
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Death per capita not a good measure, look at somewhere like the US where NYC the hardest hit place in the world but there are places in the country that it won't even touch | |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:28 - Apr 16 with 2115 views | Chutney |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:04 - Apr 16 by monytowbray |
I was going to say this.
From early stats and also the fact outbreaks unsurprisingly hit cities worse population density is a huge factor, the list of worse hit areas make sense.
Herd immunity will need to be a part of the strategy in the long run anyway, but it needs to be juggled with healthcare capacity and protecting the vulnerable.
Still hasn't stopped does desperate to defend how p1ss poor our early choices were to delay lockdown using the line as a defence without context though. Had we of done Sweden's approach our NHS would be crippled several times over and we'd see more deaths from that. |
On the basis that the NHS still claims to have capacity, is there not an argument that our lock down was timed correctly? It was of course a shift from a would-be disastrous initial strategy. | | | |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:31 - Apr 16 with 2099 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:25 - Apr 16 by itfcjoe |
Death per capita not a good measure, look at somewhere like the US where NYC the hardest hit place in the world but there are places in the country that it won't even touch |
I agree but then you get all the weirdos coming on here and stating Ireland as an example of what can be achieved when Ireland has about half the population as our capital city. |  |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:41 - Apr 16 with 2046 views | WeWereZombies |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:31 - Apr 16 by Lord_Lucan |
I agree but then you get all the weirdos coming on here and stating Ireland as an example of what can be achieved when Ireland has about half the population as our capital city. |
But about ten times as many Guinness drinkers...coincidence? | |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:43 - Apr 16 with 2032 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
Correct answer is population density. | | | |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:49 - Apr 16 with 2006 views | Darth_Koont |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 12:36 - Apr 16 by Chutney |
It's hard to make comparisons because population density and demographics etc makes a huge difference, as well as health care capabilities etc. Having said that it's very interesting to see that Sweden doesn't appear any worse off than near neighbours Norway or Denmark who have taken much more radical lockdown measures. |
It's worse in Sweden compared to other Scandinavian countries but a lot of that is down to Stockholm and its size and international connections compared to the other countries.
Also they've talked about the long approach from the start. This is run by epidemiologists and other health experts in their independent national health organisation so they're looking at it from a longer perspective than politicians can probably get away with.
I don't see that much of a clear division between political government and national health management elsewhere. So it will be interesting to see how it all turns out when the final gruesome death statistics are added up. |  |
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| They've got by far the highest..... on 13:59 - Apr 16 with 1969 views | Bloots |
….death rate per mill of pop in Scandinavia.
Maybe if they had a lockdown they'd be doing as well as their neighbours. |  |
| "The sooner he comes back the better, this place has been a disaster without him" - TWTD User (July 2025) |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:05 - Apr 16 with 1937 views | monytowbray |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:28 - Apr 16 by Chutney |
On the basis that the NHS still claims to have capacity, is there not an argument that our lock down was timed correctly? It was of course a shift from a would-be disastrous initial strategy. |
Depends if you think having a death rate still on projectory to match Italy who had less warning and data is considered a result.
A lot of lives could have been saved locking down earlier. | |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:10 - Apr 16 with 1915 views | Bluesquid |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:49 - Apr 16 by Darth_Koont |
It's worse in Sweden compared to other Scandinavian countries but a lot of that is down to Stockholm and its size and international connections compared to the other countries.
Also they've talked about the long approach from the start. This is run by epidemiologists and other health experts in their independent national health organisation so they're looking at it from a longer perspective than politicians can probably get away with.
I don't see that much of a clear division between political government and national health management elsewhere. So it will be interesting to see how it all turns out when the final gruesome death statistics are added up. |
Sweden also has the oldest population in Scandinavia with over 1 million more over 65s than Norway.
Sweden's death count also includes those that died at home and also those that died at care homes, not sure about Norway, Denmark and Finland though who potentially could have higher numbers if they don't include them. [Post edited 16 Apr 2020 14:15]
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:11 - Apr 16 with 1912 views | ElephantintheRoom |
No - they are not that different from other scandanavian countries in the effect - despite a very high immigrant population.... they have fewer hospital beds than the UK but a highly developed community medical and social care system that might be paying dividends - especially as they dont ignore the elderly, nor pretend that dementia is not a disease like we do.
the interesting thing is that their approach does suggest that lockdowns for lockdowns sake... eg in the UK where it was instigated far too late might not be much more than a government trying to put the onus back on the public... time will tell... in the meantime remember to get enthusiastic when told that deaths are plateauing at 700 and something - just dont ask how many deaths there have been in the community... or how many thousands of deaths have happened - but have yet to be recorded. | |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:16 - Apr 16 with 1885 views | monytowbray |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:11 - Apr 16 by ElephantintheRoom |
No - they are not that different from other scandanavian countries in the effect - despite a very high immigrant population.... they have fewer hospital beds than the UK but a highly developed community medical and social care system that might be paying dividends - especially as they dont ignore the elderly, nor pretend that dementia is not a disease like we do.
the interesting thing is that their approach does suggest that lockdowns for lockdowns sake... eg in the UK where it was instigated far too late might not be much more than a government trying to put the onus back on the public... time will tell... in the meantime remember to get enthusiastic when told that deaths are plateauing at 700 and something - just dont ask how many deaths there have been in the community... or how many thousands of deaths have happened - but have yet to be recorded. |
We’ve been told by the powers that be that we’re hitting the peak for two weeks. Those numbers have kept going up. We’re still due the figures from the bank holiday aren’t we?
The WHO seem to think we’ve done a pretty sh1te job still: https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2020/04/16/positive-signs-in-europe- [Post edited 16 Apr 2020 14:22]
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:26 - Apr 16 with 1839 views | monytowbray |
| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 13:31 - Apr 16 by Lord_Lucan |
I agree but then you get all the weirdos coming on here and stating Ireland as an example of what can be achieved when Ireland has about half the population as our capital city. |
There are still heavily populated parts of Ireland though.
And plenty of other larger countries that have done better than us, Germany being an example. | |
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| Sweden: Deaths down, Cases down on 14:33 - Apr 16 with 1811 views | Guthrum |
There was an upturn in the daily cases yesterday. Fluctuations are to be expected.
Also, their testing numbers are tiny, if those figures are correct (doing not many more in a week than we are every day). |  |
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