| Andre Dozzell 19:05 - Jul 20 with 8057 views | Terry_Nutkins |
Been thinking on Dozzell and i think Lambert just has to make the call that he's playing and go with it. He's a big asset to the club and one of a few players that has potential to hold a lot of value (both playing but quite frankly financial as well). I'm all for winning the right to play and up to now its fair enough BUT we are going with youth and we're at the do it or not point now with Dozzell and the only way we'll know is if we just give him 20 games to get in and find his form. I think we've got to take the calculated gamble on him. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 15:35 - Jul 21 with 3218 views | Herbivore |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:26 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
Start the season like this
-------------------------Holy-------------------
KVY-----Chambers----Woolfie----Kenlock
-------------Skuse---------Downes----------
-Jackson----------Judge-----------Sears--
-------------------Norwood--------------------
With loads of pressure being put on them by the youngsters and squad players but fitting in to that shpe
Jackson and Sears getting around Norwood with a solid base of Skuse and Downes |
Drop Judge for one of Bishop, Dobra or Lankester for me. Judge doesn't do enough and he's had plenty of opportunities. Time to give someone else a run. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 15:58 - Jul 21 with 3191 views | itfcjoe |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:28 - Jul 21 by Libero |
You know I'm a big Skuse fan, but can he really hold down a starting eleven place these days?
I like the look of that side though. |
We had our only decent spell last year with those 2 in CM, until someone can grab that shirt of him I don’t see why he wouldn’t start - and I’m not a massive fan |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 16:22 - Jul 21 with 3168 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:35 - Jul 21 by Herbivore |
Drop Judge for one of Bishop, Dobra or Lankester for me. Judge doesn't do enough and he's had plenty of opportunities. Time to give someone else a run. |
Yeah, I'd rather invest the time and effort into Dobra in that position. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 08:31 - Jul 22 with 3112 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:26 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
Start the season like this
-------------------------Holy-------------------
KVY-----Chambers----Woolfie----Kenlock
-------------Skuse---------Downes----------
-Jackson----------Judge-----------Sears--
-------------------Norwood--------------------
With loads of pressure being put on them by the youngsters and squad players but fitting in to that shpe
Jackson and Sears getting around Norwood with a solid base of Skuse and Downes |
But we’ve tried this, many tines. It’s produced nothing of note, and to read that team is quite uninspiring.
Skuse can’t be a starter. Surely. I won’t pick holes in the other selections. |  | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 09:20 - Jul 22 with 3087 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Unusually I agree with you. It’s firmly make or break time and we need to give him every opportunity to make it given his pedigree and talent
However, the big problem with that is that we have a manager who can ill afford to start the season slowly - therefore the chance of giving someone like Dozzell a run in the team to find his feet is minimal. And that’s why all the arguments about keeping Lambert for the sake of stability and looking long term is folly - as in reality it’s an incredibly short sighted move |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 09:55 - Jul 22 with 3072 views | itfcjoe |
| Andre Dozzell on 08:31 - Jul 22 by OsborneOneNil |
But we’ve tried this, many tines. It’s produced nothing of note, and to read that team is quite uninspiring.
Skuse can’t be a starter. Surely. I won’t pick holes in the other selections. |
When have we tried this?
I know you have an irrational dislike of Skuse, and I’m not his biggest fan, but who was CM when we had our only food run of the season? And who has actually pushed him to get ahead of him in pecking order | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 10:47 - Jul 22 with 3036 views | rickw |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:26 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
Start the season like this
-------------------------Holy-------------------
KVY-----Chambers----Woolfie----Kenlock
-------------Skuse---------Downes----------
-Jackson----------Judge-----------Sears--
-------------------Norwood--------------------
With loads of pressure being put on them by the youngsters and squad players but fitting in to that shpe
Jackson and Sears getting around Norwood with a solid base of Skuse and Downes |
To many of this team are already in their prime or past their best.
Judge for one I'd hope would move on, he was tried and failed last season, I'd start with Bishop in his place with El Miz also getting plenty of gametime when Bishop is injured!
I don't mind starting the season with experience but I would hope players like Dozzell, Lankester, Dobra, Nydam and Morris will be given a good opportunity over the season to oust those in their positions. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:05 - Jul 22 with 3015 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Andre Dozzell on 09:55 - Jul 22 by itfcjoe |
When have we tried this?
I know you have an irrational dislike of Skuse, and I’m not his biggest fan, but who was CM when we had our only food run of the season? And who has actually pushed him to get ahead of him in pecking order |
It is now impossible for me to mention Skuse without it being noted that I have some odd dislike of the guy. I don't think he's a starter, that's what I said. And, if you check the board, many more now agree that he's had his best time (inc Herbie).
That side you put up has too many past their best. Chambers, Skuse, Judge, Sears. I'd be amazed if that side did anything other than mid table, at best. | | | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:08 - Jul 22 with 3007 views | Herbivore |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:05 - Jul 22 by OsborneOneNil |
It is now impossible for me to mention Skuse without it being noted that I have some odd dislike of the guy. I don't think he's a starter, that's what I said. And, if you check the board, many more now agree that he's had his best time (inc Herbie).
That side you put up has too many past their best. Chambers, Skuse, Judge, Sears. I'd be amazed if that side did anything other than mid table, at best. |
Yep, I do tend to agree that he shouldn't be a starter next season. Certainly not every week. Some games and line ups will suit him playing but I'd be looking to phase him out, especially if we manage to keep Downes. If Downes goes it might change things as none of our other CMs offer much defensively. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:09 - Jul 22 with 3008 views | Libero |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:05 - Jul 22 by OsborneOneNil |
It is now impossible for me to mention Skuse without it being noted that I have some odd dislike of the guy. I don't think he's a starter, that's what I said. And, if you check the board, many more now agree that he's had his best time (inc Herbie).
That side you put up has too many past their best. Chambers, Skuse, Judge, Sears. I'd be amazed if that side did anything other than mid table, at best. |
I'm a big Skuse fan, he's undeniably been one of our most consistent performers in recent years, that being said I think his days as a regular starter are done unless the system plays specifically to his strengths and can mask his weaknesses. (although I take Joe's points on board and respect what he has to say, in all honesty he's probably a better judge than you or I)
That being said, you're one of 2/3 posters who has had an irrational hatrid of Skuse since day dot and has consistently refused to acknowledge his worth to the team. [Post edited 22 Jul 2020 11:10]
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:12 - Jul 22 with 3006 views | Dyland |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:26 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
Start the season like this
-------------------------Holy-------------------
KVY-----Chambers----Woolfie----Kenlock
-------------Skuse---------Downes----------
-Jackson----------Judge-----------Sears--
-------------------Norwood--------------------
With loads of pressure being put on them by the youngsters and squad players but fitting in to that shpe
Jackson and Sears getting around Norwood with a solid base of Skuse and Downes |
From the older heads there I agree with Chambers as regular starter, but probably rotate Skuse with Dozzers (or another). Don't agree with Judge, his head (and legs) just not in it. It would be an understatement that Judge, Huws and Nolan were disappointing last season. |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 11:42 - Jul 22 with 2984 views | PJH |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:05 - Jul 22 by OsborneOneNil |
It is now impossible for me to mention Skuse without it being noted that I have some odd dislike of the guy. I don't think he's a starter, that's what I said. And, if you check the board, many more now agree that he's had his best time (inc Herbie).
That side you put up has too many past their best. Chambers, Skuse, Judge, Sears. I'd be amazed if that side did anything other than mid table, at best. |
I think that you have been saying that about Skuse for most if not all of the five and a bit years that I have been on here so you are bound to be right one day.  |  | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:49 - Jul 22 with 2976 views | itfcjoe |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:05 - Jul 22 by OsborneOneNil |
It is now impossible for me to mention Skuse without it being noted that I have some odd dislike of the guy. I don't think he's a starter, that's what I said. And, if you check the board, many more now agree that he's had his best time (inc Herbie).
That side you put up has too many past their best. Chambers, Skuse, Judge, Sears. I'd be amazed if that side did anything other than mid table, at best. |
But past their best doesn’t mean too much when their best has been more than good enough for this division.
Chambers is still easily in our best 2 centre backs, and will deservedly start, defensively there weren’t many issues last year
Skuse, I personally don’t want to see start, but in that deeper lying role has Nolan or Huws done enough to oust him? On paper we’d all say Huws, but is he going to ever get back to where he was?
Judge - poor last season, but a player with undoubted quality who played lots of different roles and was one who suffered with how many changes we made. Never got going after pre season - I’d happily see him be ousted by Dobra, El Miz or Bishop.
Sears - think it’s a bit unfair, he was one who looked very good under Lambert in the Chanpionship, and we haven’t seen him since his injury. As long as he hasn’t lost his pace then his brain and quality will see him as key for us next year.
The young players need the opportunities to take their places if they aren’t performing, of course, but they are going to need to do something special in pre season | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 14:54 - Jul 22 with 2928 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:09 - Jul 22 by Libero |
I'm a big Skuse fan, he's undeniably been one of our most consistent performers in recent years, that being said I think his days as a regular starter are done unless the system plays specifically to his strengths and can mask his weaknesses. (although I take Joe's points on board and respect what he has to say, in all honesty he's probably a better judge than you or I)
That being said, you're one of 2/3 posters who has had an irrational hatrid of Skuse since day dot and has consistently refused to acknowledge his worth to the team. [Post edited 22 Jul 2020 11:10]
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Yes, I have definitely been less of a fan of Skuse than others have. I accept that. Stand by my opinions too, and that's also fair.
Whether Joe has a better judge of player than yo or I, couldn't say. I have a good background on the game, but then so does PRP and look what he does. | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:57 - Jul 22 with 2925 views | BiGDonnie |
| Andre Dozzell on 11:05 - Jul 22 by OsborneOneNil |
It is now impossible for me to mention Skuse without it being noted that I have some odd dislike of the guy. I don't think he's a starter, that's what I said. And, if you check the board, many more now agree that he's had his best time (inc Herbie).
That side you put up has too many past their best. Chambers, Skuse, Judge, Sears. I'd be amazed if that side did anything other than mid table, at best. |
Skuse is sh*t. Always has been, always will be. Don't sugarcoat it for these goons, he's sh*t and you know it! |  |
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| Andre Dozzell on 15:13 - Jul 22 with 2911 views | Libero |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:57 - Jul 22 by BiGDonnie |
Skuse is sh*t. Always has been, always will be. Don't sugarcoat it for these goons, he's sh*t and you know it! |
LOL. | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:04 - Jul 22 with 2877 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Andre Dozzell on 14:57 - Jul 22 by BiGDonnie |
Skuse is sh*t. Always has been, always will be. Don't sugarcoat it for these goons, he's sh*t and you know it! |
Haaaaaaaaaaa!!!
POTD | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:07 - Jul 22 with 2879 views | StokieBlue |
| Andre Dozzell on 15:26 - Jul 21 by itfcjoe |
Start the season like this
-------------------------Holy-------------------
KVY-----Chambers----Woolfie----Kenlock
-------------Skuse---------Downes----------
-Jackson----------Judge-----------Sears--
-------------------Norwood--------------------
With loads of pressure being put on them by the youngsters and squad players but fitting in to that shpe
Jackson and Sears getting around Norwood with a solid base of Skuse and Downes |
That's essentially the team that failed last year.
Why on earth would we want to go with that again?
Sears and Judge shouldn't play for starters. Those positions should be between Lankester, Dobra and El Mizouni with Jackson and Norwood fighting for the striking position.
If we are going to get anywhere the youngsters need near enough a full seasons worth of experience.
SB |  | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:32 - Jul 22 with 2861 views | itfcjoe |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:07 - Jul 22 by StokieBlue |
That's essentially the team that failed last year.
Why on earth would we want to go with that again?
Sears and Judge shouldn't play for starters. Those positions should be between Lankester, Dobra and El Mizouni with Jackson and Norwood fighting for the striking position.
If we are going to get anywhere the youngsters need near enough a full seasons worth of experience.
SB |
Why shouldn't Sears play? He was playing well in the Championship, a bright spark under PL, and then he got injured - he hasn't been fit since but will be for the start of the season. | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 16:43 - Jul 22 with 2849 views | StokieBlue |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:32 - Jul 22 by itfcjoe |
Why shouldn't Sears play? He was playing well in the Championship, a bright spark under PL, and then he got injured - he hasn't been fit since but will be for the start of the season. |
He shouldn't play because he isn't the long-term future of the club and we have excellent talents in that position.
I do like Sears and would have him on the bench though.
You've not addressed the fact that the team is essentially the one which failed this year?
SB | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 17:26 - Jul 22 with 2821 views | itfcjoe |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:43 - Jul 22 by StokieBlue |
He shouldn't play because he isn't the long-term future of the club and we have excellent talents in that position.
I do like Sears and would have him on the bench though.
You've not addressed the fact that the team is essentially the one which failed this year?
SB |
Those young talents need to prove they are better than Sears is still, hopefully they will but it’s far from a given.
We’ve never played that team set up as that, and the reality is the only one of that XI who ‘failed’ last year was Judge | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 18:36 - Jul 22 with 2800 views | OsborneOneNil |
| Andre Dozzell on 16:07 - Jul 22 by StokieBlue |
That's essentially the team that failed last year.
Why on earth would we want to go with that again?
Sears and Judge shouldn't play for starters. Those positions should be between Lankester, Dobra and El Mizouni with Jackson and Norwood fighting for the striking position.
If we are going to get anywhere the youngsters need near enough a full seasons worth of experience.
SB |
Agree on that. | | | |
| Andre Dozzell on 18:38 - Jul 22 with 2800 views | Radlett_blue |
| Andre Dozzell on 17:26 - Jul 22 by itfcjoe |
Those young talents need to prove they are better than Sears is still, hopefully they will but it’s far from a given.
We’ve never played that team set up as that, and the reality is the only one of that XI who ‘failed’ last year was Judge |
If we only play younger players if they are already better than what we have, we will continue to fail as far as player development. See Rhodes, Marriott, Moore, Hourihane etc.
Dozzell is a prime example of this. Clearly talented, but can he cope with the rough & tumble of League football? There's only one way to find out. loaning out can work e.g. Woolfenden at Swindon, but as we're now in the 3rd tier, that option is a bit trickier. [Post edited 22 Jul 2020 18:40]
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| Andre Dozzell on 19:24 - Jul 22 with 2774 views | itfcjoe |
| Andre Dozzell on 18:38 - Jul 22 by Radlett_blue |
If we only play younger players if they are already better than what we have, we will continue to fail as far as player development. See Rhodes, Marriott, Moore, Hourihane etc.
Dozzell is a prime example of this. Clearly talented, but can he cope with the rough & tumble of League football? There's only one way to find out. loaning out can work e.g. Woolfenden at Swindon, but as we're now in the 3rd tier, that option is a bit trickier. [Post edited 22 Jul 2020 18:40]
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Dozzell is a player I’d make an exception for and try and find a role and run of games for him to play if possible, as it’s now or never and he’s a uniquely talented player with obvious strengths and weaknesses that need to be hidden.
But 99% of players break through because they take opportunity presented to them through luck or that the manager has no choice to play them as they’ve impressed so much. And then they’ve taken the opportunities given - look at the last 3 to break through in Woolfie, Downes and Lankester - they all made themselves undroppable. Even going back further under Mick with Bishop and Nydam who grabbed opportunities with both hands.
I think El Mizouni will do that this season, but he’s going to have to be going some to be starting in day 1, especially with his injury he’s working back from | |
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| Andre Dozzell on 20:52 - Jul 22 with 2739 views | Jermynblue |
Some interesting views of various midfield players. Personally I would not be adverse to two of Dozzell, Bishop, Huws, Nolan and Judge leaving the club this summer allowing us to try to address the balance in the squad. This is on the assumption that their departures would enable other areas of the squad to be improved upon. Those areas would include another left back, a centre back and a defensively minded midfielder for when Skuse cannot perform to the level required across a full season. I would not expect all of these areas to be dealt with by the funds generated from the departure of two of those midfielders, but we could make a start. We need to be realistic that Chambers and Skuse will start deteriorating and making preparations for that.
However, going back to the original post and Dozzell, I struggle to see where he actually fits into a team. He wants to play in front of the back four collecting the ball from them and passing forwards, but such a role requires good defensive awareness, physicality and the ability to tackle. He can't just spray around passes there and not worry about when we don't have the ball. If you played for the opposition and knew that Dozzell would be trying to pick you defensively you would be looking forward to the game. He would definitely need a defensively minded midfielder alongside him. However, I am not keen on a midfield which would have Dozzell collecting the ball from the back four and then someone like Skuse around him who is not really offensively minded. It creates too much pressure on the other midfielders and the strikers. As a full back you would also not be entirely certain that if you got forward that Dozzell would be looking to cover the space you have left behind. I think that it is a problem that Dozzell might have to address if he wants to further his career whether with us or another team. | | | |
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