| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive 22:17 - Jul 16 with 7999 views | XYZ |
Good luck with freedom day |  | | |  |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 07:59 - Jul 17 with 1156 views | PrideOfTheEast |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 04:15 - Jul 17 by DeepBlueSea |
I just want to say, as an airway specialist, the issue is not the spread of the virus. It’s the proportion of people who need ITU and mechanical ventilation. In my career (I’m 41 now) I’ve never ever seen intensive care as stretched as it was last year, it was truly awful, the worst few months of my career and possibly my life. Here’s hoping that the huge rise in cases does not equate to a huge rise in itu admissions like the last two waves. We literally can’t do it.,I have to be careful what I say on a public forum but anyone who wants to can DM me for me to give more detail. Just to give you an idea, I’m on the crash team that gets called to respiratory and cardiac arrests. In 2020 we went from 2-3 resp failures per week attending A&E to maybe 10 per day. The survival rate was around 45%. Of the 10 patients on average who attended A&E per day, we knew 5-6 would die. Every single day. For months. |
Thank you for all that you do. | | | |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 08:12 - Jul 17 with 1131 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 23:27 - Jul 16 by pointofblue |
I agree - it's how to educate effectively to get the remaining population vaccinated but we cannot stay with some restrictions in place forever more because of them. Interestingly the number of cases has dropped from a 34% week-on-week increase to a 17% week-on-week increase this time around so perhaps the current level would have an affect if they would just stick to it for a bit longer, to try and get more people vaccinated. |
It seems to me that the current ‘Plan’ is go for herd immunity and it also seems this is reluctantly supported by the experts guiding Boris.
Educating everyone on the importance of being vaccinated would help but so would educating people to adjust their life style. So many of those who attended these so called trial events really need to ask if it was the wise thing to do. Euros, Wimbledon and this weekend Silverstone are all gifts to the virus. Looking forward you could add Latitude and Portman Road to the list of events/places you need to think twice before attending.
The virus moves through the community in waves, the more people local to you the more likely you are to get if you don’t behave sensibly. The overall figures hide the fact cases are dropping in some areas but rising steeply in others. You can always find a statistic to support your approach, to worry or seek comfort.
There really in no need for Makin, or the other usual suspects , to make things up. |  |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 08:43 - Jul 17 with 1086 views | mikeybloo88 |
Most intelligent people know that the vaccines don't stop you getting covid but the risk of it getting passed between double vaccinated people is much, much less....but don't assume you can't catch it even in a gathering of fully jabbed people and behave sensibly. If you catch it, it will most likely be from non or single vaccinated people, so be especially careful if in close contact situations with them or people you just dont know. It's sensible to keep distancing and mask wearing and avoiding indoor congestion for a while yet, but unfortunately there will be many who will just go for it from Monday, many won't be protected fully or at all, and some will suffer. |  | | |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 09:03 - Jul 17 with 1055 views | vapour_trail |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 04:15 - Jul 17 by DeepBlueSea |
I just want to say, as an airway specialist, the issue is not the spread of the virus. It’s the proportion of people who need ITU and mechanical ventilation. In my career (I’m 41 now) I’ve never ever seen intensive care as stretched as it was last year, it was truly awful, the worst few months of my career and possibly my life. Here’s hoping that the huge rise in cases does not equate to a huge rise in itu admissions like the last two waves. We literally can’t do it.,I have to be careful what I say on a public forum but anyone who wants to can DM me for me to give more detail. Just to give you an idea, I’m on the crash team that gets called to respiratory and cardiac arrests. In 2020 we went from 2-3 resp failures per week attending A&E to maybe 10 per day. The survival rate was around 45%. Of the 10 patients on average who attended A&E per day, we knew 5-6 would die. Every single day. For months. |
That sounds incredibly traumatic. This sounds glib, but look after yourself. |  |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 09:42 - Jul 17 with 995 views | dickie |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 07:14 - Jul 17 by DeepBlueSea |
I also say that as someone had to wrongly (it turns out) self isolate, and not see my baby boy while I waited for the PCR. It ducking sucked but there are thousands of people in the UK who are alive now who wouldn’t be if we didn’t do these regular lateral flow tests, as accurate ((or not) as they may be.
Extreme example but If you took a test that said you had a 75% chance of being HIV positive surely that’s better than nothing? |
The other problem with LF is that the accuracy figures apply to when the tests are correctly conducted. I know plenty of people who just wiggle the swab about it and hope for the best | | | |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:02 - Jul 17 with 974 views | BlueBadger |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 23:17 - Jul 16 by pointofblue |
I suppose the question is how do we get out of this. Obviously halt the lifting of the final restrictions on Monday and legalise the wearing of masks but is that enough considering cases are increasing horrifically with the current restrictions in place? |
Herd immunity level vaccination. It varies from disease to disease but around 52% of the population(as it is at present), isn't sufficient.
The current lifting of our current, very minimal, restrictions is utter, utter madness. Doubly so when you consider that cases, hospitalisations and the subsequent risk of the development of vaccine resistant strains are on the rise.
Quoting The Medical Registrar on Facebook:
'If you wanted to create a COVID variant which could escape the immune protection generated by the vaccines currently available and run riot all over again, how would you do it?
Well, firstly you need a decent proportion of your population vaccinated, but not too many. You don’t want to be at the point of herd immunity but a decent number vaccinated means a lot of contacts between infections and vaccinated individuals means the virus is being tested many times a day and eventually a mutation may cause a variant to arise which passes those tests and is therefore ‘selected for’ as it has a whole new population to infect (the vaccinated but no longer protected)
Then you make sure you have a number of different variants circling to ensure a varied playing field from the start.
Then you allow/encourage as high a rate of new infections as possible to generate all the new mutations you need.
What you’d really like is for some people with weaker immune systems who have been vaccinated to catch it, because then the virus can really mutate against selective pressures and find a way past the defence generated by the vaccine.
But no Government would be so stupid to do this would they. I mean. You’d have to be the stupidest, most irresponsible government in the world. A Government of None of the talents. It couldn’t happen. It would be a criminal dereliction of responsibility.' [Post edited 17 Jul 2021 10:17]
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:03 - Jul 17 with 971 views | Cotty |
If they were doubling every day we’d all be in hospital within a couple of weeks. |  | | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:06 - Jul 17 with 953 views | BlueBadger |
Trouble with 'letting rip' now in a time of rising cases is increasing the possibility of a vaccine resistant strain developing quickly. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:12 - Jul 17 with 934 views | BlueBadger |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 07:56 - Jul 17 by PrideOfTheEast |
Agreed. The numbers suggest a significant increase in hospitalisations in the short term so surely it’s the wrong time to “open up”.
I think we’ll be locked down again within 2 months unfortunately. |
Winter will again be likely extremely tough, if not not disastrous. I don't think we'll have one as catastrophic in the same sense as we did this one just gone but we've seen a large number of experienced clinical staff burn out, retire or move to no-clinical positions, citing 'I can't do another winter like that' at [redacted].
With pointing out that most A&E's are currently running at higher-than-average attendances for the time of year at the moment at well. A surge now will be disastrous. | |
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| [Redacted] on 10:14 - Jul 17 with 936 views | victorywilhappen |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:06 - Jul 17 by BlueBadger |
Trouble with 'letting rip' now in a time of rising cases is increasing the possibility of a vaccine resistant strain developing quickly. |
[Redacted] |  | | |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:19 - Jul 17 with 913 views | BlueBadger |
If there's one thing we can be sure of, it's that I'll be giving oxygen to anti-vaxxers pretty soon... | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:30 - Jul 17 with 886 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 22:52 - Jul 16 by StokieBlue |
Unfortunately being double-dosed still means you have at least a 1 in 10 chance of catching C19. Given enough contacts it's likely a vaccinated person will catch it at some point.
You're totally right, the government "strategy" is awful and has been declared so by 1200 scientists:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/16/englands-covid-unlocking-a-threat-
SB |
But that's only 1200 experts.
We've had enough of experts and ...
You can't put a price on freedom (even if he has apologised for saying it once he had a screenshot to prove that the context was number of deaths). |  |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:34 - Jul 17 with 870 views | BlueBadger |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 04:15 - Jul 17 by DeepBlueSea |
I just want to say, as an airway specialist, the issue is not the spread of the virus. It’s the proportion of people who need ITU and mechanical ventilation. In my career (I’m 41 now) I’ve never ever seen intensive care as stretched as it was last year, it was truly awful, the worst few months of my career and possibly my life. Here’s hoping that the huge rise in cases does not equate to a huge rise in itu admissions like the last two waves. We literally can’t do it.,I have to be careful what I say on a public forum but anyone who wants to can DM me for me to give more detail. Just to give you an idea, I’m on the crash team that gets called to respiratory and cardiac arrests. In 2020 we went from 2-3 resp failures per week attending A&E to maybe 10 per day. The survival rate was around 45%. Of the 10 patients on average who attended A&E per day, we knew 5-6 would die. Every single day. For months. |
I don't know where you work, but my experience as both a senior ITU nurse and Outreach nurse attending cardiac arrests ad 'escalation' calls on he wards, my experience reflects this as well. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:37 - Jul 17 with 868 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
Please quote the source of that statistic because published ones, I believe are many hundreds of times higher than that. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:42 - Jul 17 with 852 views | positivity |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:37 - Jul 17 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Please quote the source of that statistic because published ones, I believe are many hundreds of times higher than that. |
could be wrong, but it might be chances of death, rather than chances of getting it (bad).
it's massively important to get double jabbed it increases your protection (and those around you), but it's not a magic bullet which makes you invincible | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:44 - Jul 17 with 846 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:42 - Jul 17 by positivity |
could be wrong, but it might be chances of death, rather than chances of getting it (bad).
it's massively important to get double jabbed it increases your protection (and those around you), but it's not a magic bullet which makes you invincible |
Indeed, double vaccination reduces hospitalisation and death - reduces not eliminates. And only up until a variant has developed resistance. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:07 - Jul 17 with 810 views | pointofblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:02 - Jul 17 by BlueBadger |
Herd immunity level vaccination. It varies from disease to disease but around 52% of the population(as it is at present), isn't sufficient.
The current lifting of our current, very minimal, restrictions is utter, utter madness. Doubly so when you consider that cases, hospitalisations and the subsequent risk of the development of vaccine resistant strains are on the rise.
Quoting The Medical Registrar on Facebook:
'If you wanted to create a COVID variant which could escape the immune protection generated by the vaccines currently available and run riot all over again, how would you do it?
Well, firstly you need a decent proportion of your population vaccinated, but not too many. You don’t want to be at the point of herd immunity but a decent number vaccinated means a lot of contacts between infections and vaccinated individuals means the virus is being tested many times a day and eventually a mutation may cause a variant to arise which passes those tests and is therefore ‘selected for’ as it has a whole new population to infect (the vaccinated but no longer protected)
Then you make sure you have a number of different variants circling to ensure a varied playing field from the start.
Then you allow/encourage as high a rate of new infections as possible to generate all the new mutations you need.
What you’d really like is for some people with weaker immune systems who have been vaccinated to catch it, because then the virus can really mutate against selective pressures and find a way past the defence generated by the vaccine.
But no Government would be so stupid to do this would they. I mean. You’d have to be the stupidest, most irresponsible government in the world. A Government of None of the talents. It couldn’t happen. It would be a criminal dereliction of responsibility.' [Post edited 17 Jul 2021 10:17]
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What’s the solution if not enough of the population want to be double vaccinated to provide herd immunity? Though I’m not sure if that is the case and, given more time, if we will reach that figure. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:11 - Jul 17 with 794 views | positivity |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 23:17 - Jul 16 by pointofblue |
I suppose the question is how do we get out of this. Obviously halt the lifting of the final restrictions on Monday and legalise the wearing of masks but is that enough considering cases are increasing horrifically with the current restrictions in place? |
has anyone developed an injection of common sense yet? that would help immensely with the anti-vaxxers and anti-maskers.
that and properly funding the nhs and developing better therapeutic drugs... | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:13 - Jul 17 with 789 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:07 - Jul 17 by pointofblue |
What’s the solution if not enough of the population want to be double vaccinated to provide herd immunity? Though I’m not sure if that is the case and, given more time, if we will reach that figure. |
I would suggest a combination of waiting until 3 weeks after the vast majority have been doubled jabbed and restricting the freedom of those who won't - e.g. they should still have to wear masks, not be allowed to travel or attend large gatherings. That will soon cause a lot more to choose to get vaccinated. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:18 - Jul 17 with 777 views | pointofblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:13 - Jul 17 by Nthsuffolkblue |
I would suggest a combination of waiting until 3 weeks after the vast majority have been doubled jabbed and restricting the freedom of those who won't - e.g. they should still have to wear masks, not be allowed to travel or attend large gatherings. That will soon cause a lot more to choose to get vaccinated. |
Will they listen or just ignore the instructions? I suppose Covid vaccine passports would push people into having it but, at the same time, have an impact on those who are unable to for medical reasons. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:21 - Jul 17 with 767 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:18 - Jul 17 by pointofblue |
Will they listen or just ignore the instructions? I suppose Covid vaccine passports would push people into having it but, at the same time, have an impact on those who are unable to for medical reasons. |
If someone has a medical reason for not being vaccinated, they would gain an exemption.
The majority of them would not wish to travel or attend large gatherings if at all possible anyway. | |
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| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:24 - Jul 17 with 762 views | StokieBlue |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 11:07 - Jul 17 by pointofblue |
What’s the solution if not enough of the population want to be double vaccinated to provide herd immunity? Though I’m not sure if that is the case and, given more time, if we will reach that figure. |
You have to incentivise them and that would have been via C19 passports to do things (with specific exemptions for people who require them). However the libertarians have ensured that won't happen (see also the complaints on here) so we are now conducting an experiment in genetic optimisation.
SB |  | | |
| [Redacted] on 11:51 - Jul 17 with 713 views | victorywilhappen |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 10:37 - Jul 17 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Please quote the source of that statistic because published ones, I believe are many hundreds of times higher than that. |
[Redacted] | | | |
| Nephew double vacced with pfizer (months ago) tests positive on 12:08 - Jul 17 with 676 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
Not sure of the whole background to that data but it is for Denmark where I suspect cases are lower and restrictions are probably greater and, therefore exposure is much lower. | |
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