| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue 10:55 - Aug 29 with 2312 views | Darth_Koont |
The first Greens in national government in the UK seems to be a small but important step in the right direction.
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 12:35 - Aug 29 with 1668 views | Ryorry |
You're "not one for political statements" ??! 🤣
Nevertheless, agree with the rest of your post :) |  |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 14:01 - Aug 29 with 1615 views | Ftnfwest |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 12:35 - Aug 29 by Ryorry |
You're "not one for political statements" ??! 🤣
Nevertheless, agree with the rest of your post :) |
Dear lady, even I almost bit at that, but fully aware he had tongue well and truly in cheek! Did you get to any of the test match? |  | | |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 14:09 - Aug 29 with 1594 views | Ryorry |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 14:01 - Aug 29 by Ftnfwest |
Dear lady, even I almost bit at that, but fully aware he had tongue well and truly in cheek! Did you get to any of the test match? |
Hah, I don't mind falling to a well-executed whoosh!
Sadly not, just felt I couldn't risk it - am on 2nd tier immunosuppressants & have chronic lung probs. Going to see if I can get an antibodies test to find out how much the jabs worked (or not) for me. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 14:24 - Aug 29 with 1556 views | Ftnfwest |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 14:09 - Aug 29 by Ryorry |
Hah, I don't mind falling to a well-executed whoosh!
Sadly not, just felt I couldn't risk it - am on 2nd tier immunosuppressants & have chronic lung probs. Going to see if I can get an antibodies test to find out how much the jabs worked (or not) for me. |
All the best with that. Want to get up to Harrogate (killinghall) with the dog sometime but might be a year or two away | | | |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 15:49 - Aug 29 with 1497 views | El_Fenix |
Greens want to save the planet and to stop participating in elective wars of imperial aggression. Regrettably, there is little support for either position ... |  |
| ITFC shall rise like a phoenix from the ashes of its long decline! |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 16:04 - Aug 29 with 1469 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 12:35 - Aug 29 by Ryorry |
You're "not one for political statements" ??! 🤣
Nevertheless, agree with the rest of your post :) |
No, I meant it.
I really don’t want to hear rhetoric and platitudes, I want policies and actions.
I’ll make an exception for this announcement because it’s part of a necessary mind shift. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:29 - Aug 29 with 1413 views | Ryorry |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 16:04 - Aug 29 by Darth_Koont |
No, I meant it.
I really don’t want to hear rhetoric and platitudes, I want policies and actions.
I’ll make an exception for this announcement because it’s part of a necessary mind shift. |
Ah, I thought you meant political statements as in coming from yourself.
Do agree with you actually re wanting policies & actions - the rhetoric & platitudes had their day & it's too late for them now.
Am guessing you probably won't want to do this, but I'm all in favour -
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:44 - Aug 29 with 1392 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:29 - Aug 29 by Ryorry |
Ah, I thought you meant political statements as in coming from yourself.
Do agree with you actually re wanting policies & actions - the rhetoric & platitudes had their day & it's too late for them now.
Am guessing you probably won't want to do this, but I'm all in favour -
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No, I’m all for it. A Green New Deal and PR are what the country needs to bring it into the 21st century.
That and the current Labour Party are awful and pretty unelectable on their own “merits”. They Just want to be seen as the Establishment’s B team and trusted protectors of capital. Which is a waste of space as a supposed opposition. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:58 - Aug 29 with 1364 views | mutters |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:29 - Aug 29 by Ryorry |
Ah, I thought you meant political statements as in coming from yourself.
Do agree with you actually re wanting policies & actions - the rhetoric & platitudes had their day & it's too late for them now.
Am guessing you probably won't want to do this, but I'm all in favour -
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Idealistically sounds like a plan.
Realistically not going to happen. Politicians are generally too entrenched and selfish for something like this to happen pre election. It's only when there is the potential of power or getting something that they want that they come to the table. That's always post election. |  |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 18:12 - Aug 29 with 1345 views | Ryorry |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:44 - Aug 29 by Darth_Koont |
No, I’m all for it. A Green New Deal and PR are what the country needs to bring it into the 21st century.
That and the current Labour Party are awful and pretty unelectable on their own “merits”. They Just want to be seen as the Establishment’s B team and trusted protectors of capital. Which is a waste of space as a supposed opposition. |
Have said a few times that the LP was created 120 years ago to deal with conditions as they were then, & for the rest of the 20thC, which was all well & good, but obviously conditions & the world generally has changed so fundamentally since then - whilst the LP hasn't - that it's no longer fit for purpose.
Needs completely re-drawing.
Meanwhile, the GA seems the immediate way forward to GTTO & get PR accepted (could be a huge task selling latter to apathetic public tho). If only there could be a GE in early 2022 - that's when I think Brexit will really be biting, & ppl will be most fed up with Johnson & cronies, particularly if Delta or other variant is still causing major problems. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 18:24 - Aug 29 with 1329 views | Darth_Koont |
And for a laugh here’s Andrew Neil being Andrew Neil. The utter balloon. 😂
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 18:37 - Aug 29 with 1301 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 18:12 - Aug 29 by Ryorry |
Have said a few times that the LP was created 120 years ago to deal with conditions as they were then, & for the rest of the 20thC, which was all well & good, but obviously conditions & the world generally has changed so fundamentally since then - whilst the LP hasn't - that it's no longer fit for purpose.
Needs completely re-drawing.
Meanwhile, the GA seems the immediate way forward to GTTO & get PR accepted (could be a huge task selling latter to apathetic public tho). If only there could be a GE in early 2022 - that's when I think Brexit will really be biting, & ppl will be most fed up with Johnson & cronies, particularly if Delta or other variant is still causing major problems. |
I think the underlying arguments still remain that a democracy needs an opposition that fights for the rights of those who are otherwise powerless and who aren’t served by the interests of the Establishment and/or of capital.
I think losing sight of that and trading any genuine sense of social and economic justice for Establishment approval and political power explains why Labour have generally lost their way since 1997. They’re just a void nowadays, almost by design.
Unfortunately it’s a void that still takes up space in our FPTP system. But other parties should leverage their ideas and appeal to force the issue. Much like UKIP did with the Tories, only this time for what is right not what’s idiotically hare-brained and xenophobic. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 19:08 - Aug 29 with 1257 views | El_Fenix |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:44 - Aug 29 by Darth_Koont |
No, I’m all for it. A Green New Deal and PR are what the country needs to bring it into the 21st century.
That and the current Labour Party are awful and pretty unelectable on their own “merits”. They Just want to be seen as the Establishment’s B team and trusted protectors of capital. Which is a waste of space as a supposed opposition. |
Our species is trapped by self-inflicted wounds associated with resource depletion, environmental degradation and ecological overshoot. The Green New Deal is a unicorn born of wishful thinking. The remaining possibilities are collapse or extinction. | |
| ITFC shall rise like a phoenix from the ashes of its long decline! |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 20:28 - Aug 29 with 1208 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 19:08 - Aug 29 by El_Fenix |
Our species is trapped by self-inflicted wounds associated with resource depletion, environmental degradation and ecological overshoot. The Green New Deal is a unicorn born of wishful thinking. The remaining possibilities are collapse or extinction. |
Good point. Let's not even try and do anything about it. Let's start the Collapse or Extinction Party now! |  | | |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 21:35 - Aug 29 with 1167 views | HARRY10 |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:44 - Aug 29 by Darth_Koont |
No, I’m all for it. A Green New Deal and PR are what the country needs to bring it into the 21st century.
That and the current Labour Party are awful and pretty unelectable on their own “merits”. They Just want to be seen as the Establishment’s B team and trusted protectors of capital. Which is a waste of space as a supposed opposition. |
Utter nonsense - the same pious twaddle as spouted by Bruce Kent and CND way back. Wars were OK as long as bombs that made alot of noise were not used.
Like garlic to a vampire Greens shrink away from economic reality and have that not much more is needed than sitting round a camp fire singing Kum ba ya my lord. Pious waffle about "support the less industrialised countries in adopting appropriate development strategies " is meaningless when you accept the profit motive that underpins such 'development strategies.
Just as CND who accepted war, but could not grasp that if you do then you are going to have to accept that those involved will use the most 'effective' methods possible
Similarly, with the quack 'cure all' twaddle about proportional representation. That is nonsense of stilts should not be in question. Where it's danger lies is in telling the not too bright that it can resolve the current political woes,
PR (as known) would not have stopped the blatant corruption of the current Johnson governmenet, nor provided any redress or sanctions.
The failure to take any action lies with a subservient, and ill informed populace. I have yet to hear a brexiteer give even the most basic answer to what differences are there between the EU Parliament, Council and Commissions - yet they know how 'undemocratic' is it is. Without the slightest idea of how it works.
So how do you inform the populace to start to think for themselves is the real question. Maybe stop peddling nonsense to them might be a good place to start. | | | |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 22:00 - Aug 29 with 1125 views | Meadowlark |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 21:35 - Aug 29 by HARRY10 |
Utter nonsense - the same pious twaddle as spouted by Bruce Kent and CND way back. Wars were OK as long as bombs that made alot of noise were not used.
Like garlic to a vampire Greens shrink away from economic reality and have that not much more is needed than sitting round a camp fire singing Kum ba ya my lord. Pious waffle about "support the less industrialised countries in adopting appropriate development strategies " is meaningless when you accept the profit motive that underpins such 'development strategies.
Just as CND who accepted war, but could not grasp that if you do then you are going to have to accept that those involved will use the most 'effective' methods possible
Similarly, with the quack 'cure all' twaddle about proportional representation. That is nonsense of stilts should not be in question. Where it's danger lies is in telling the not too bright that it can resolve the current political woes,
PR (as known) would not have stopped the blatant corruption of the current Johnson governmenet, nor provided any redress or sanctions.
The failure to take any action lies with a subservient, and ill informed populace. I have yet to hear a brexiteer give even the most basic answer to what differences are there between the EU Parliament, Council and Commissions - yet they know how 'undemocratic' is it is. Without the slightest idea of how it works.
So how do you inform the populace to start to think for themselves is the real question. Maybe stop peddling nonsense to them might be a good place to start. |
So you're anti-CND and anti-Green? You're anti-PR, but pro-EU?
And the only twaddle allowed is yours?
Have I got that right? Or am I not thinking for myself?
Or if I am thinking for myself and come up with conclusions that differ from yours, have I obviously been peddled nonsense? |  | | |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 22:05 - Aug 29 with 1121 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 21:35 - Aug 29 by HARRY10 |
Utter nonsense - the same pious twaddle as spouted by Bruce Kent and CND way back. Wars were OK as long as bombs that made alot of noise were not used.
Like garlic to a vampire Greens shrink away from economic reality and have that not much more is needed than sitting round a camp fire singing Kum ba ya my lord. Pious waffle about "support the less industrialised countries in adopting appropriate development strategies " is meaningless when you accept the profit motive that underpins such 'development strategies.
Just as CND who accepted war, but could not grasp that if you do then you are going to have to accept that those involved will use the most 'effective' methods possible
Similarly, with the quack 'cure all' twaddle about proportional representation. That is nonsense of stilts should not be in question. Where it's danger lies is in telling the not too bright that it can resolve the current political woes,
PR (as known) would not have stopped the blatant corruption of the current Johnson governmenet, nor provided any redress or sanctions.
The failure to take any action lies with a subservient, and ill informed populace. I have yet to hear a brexiteer give even the most basic answer to what differences are there between the EU Parliament, Council and Commissions - yet they know how 'undemocratic' is it is. Without the slightest idea of how it works.
So how do you inform the populace to start to think for themselves is the real question. Maybe stop peddling nonsense to them might be a good place to start. |
Pipe down, Harry.
I don’t know why you’re even talking. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 22:35 - Aug 29 with 1102 views | El_Fenix |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 20:28 - Aug 29 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Good point. Let's not even try and do anything about it. Let's start the Collapse or Extinction Party now! |
If you favor extinction, go ahead and start your Ostrich Party ...
If not, you can advocate for steadily reducing energy consumption, to a level that could sustain a population of 1-2 billion people living simpler lives. | |
| ITFC shall rise like a phoenix from the ashes of its long decline! |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 07:03 - Aug 30 with 1015 views | GlasgowBlue |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 17:58 - Aug 29 by mutters |
Idealistically sounds like a plan.
Realistically not going to happen. Politicians are generally too entrenched and selfish for something like this to happen pre election. It's only when there is the potential of power or getting something that they want that they come to the table. That's always post election. |
It also assumes that all Lib Dens/Greens would place Labour as their second preference vote. Yet based on 2nd preference votes cast in mayoral elections up and down the country in May, Labour got 46% of LD/Green vote. Conservatives 27%.
There is no such thing as a progressive alliance and you don’t form governments by being anti one political party.
Edit, And that's before you get to the impact of how progressive unionists would voted faced with the prospect of including the SNP in such an alliance. Look how Tories voted Labour to keep vulnerable Labour MSP’s in their seats and vice versa at the recent Hollywood elections. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 7:20]
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 07:47 - Aug 30 with 962 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 07:03 - Aug 30 by GlasgowBlue |
It also assumes that all Lib Dens/Greens would place Labour as their second preference vote. Yet based on 2nd preference votes cast in mayoral elections up and down the country in May, Labour got 46% of LD/Green vote. Conservatives 27%.
There is no such thing as a progressive alliance and you don’t form governments by being anti one political party.
Edit, And that's before you get to the impact of how progressive unionists would voted faced with the prospect of including the SNP in such an alliance. Look how Tories voted Labour to keep vulnerable Labour MSP’s in their seats and vice versa at the recent Hollywood elections. [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 7:20]
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I think all bets are off here.
If the worst government ever is still polling at 40% no matter what, then the opposition parties need to raise their game. I can’t see Labour doing that on their own – as they seem bereft of ideas, talent or indeed principles to differentiate themselves from the Tories.
They literally need to be part of something that’s bigger than themselves. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 08:29 - Aug 30 with 922 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 20:28 - Aug 29 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Good point. Let's not even try and do anything about it. Let's start the Collapse or Extinction Party now! |
Sounds like a winner!
On a serious note though, I can understand people criticising the current state of the world and our political leaders on climate change and other pressing issues. But to paint the planet’s future as largely hopeless is the definition of a self-fulfilling prophecy.
We have to change – and evolve – quickly of course but I don’t believe for a second that we should be prepping for the end of days instead. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 08:55 - Aug 30 with 888 views | GlasgowBlue |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 07:47 - Aug 30 by Darth_Koont |
I think all bets are off here.
If the worst government ever is still polling at 40% no matter what, then the opposition parties need to raise their game. I can’t see Labour doing that on their own – as they seem bereft of ideas, talent or indeed principles to differentiate themselves from the Tories.
They literally need to be part of something that’s bigger than themselves. |
They were the worst government ever just three months ago when 27% of Lib Dem’s and Greens chose the Tories as their second preference. For your idea of a rainbow alliance to work then you need those 27% to swing the other way. If they didn’t do it three months ago what makes you believe they will suddenly had a Damascene conversion?
What will convince the 52-53% of unionists to vote for an alliance that would include the SNP? | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 09:51 - Aug 30 with 843 views | Darth_Koont |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 08:55 - Aug 30 by GlasgowBlue |
They were the worst government ever just three months ago when 27% of Lib Dem’s and Greens chose the Tories as their second preference. For your idea of a rainbow alliance to work then you need those 27% to swing the other way. If they didn’t do it three months ago what makes you believe they will suddenly had a Damascene conversion?
What will convince the 52-53% of unionists to vote for an alliance that would include the SNP? |
It’ll need some formalised alliance so voters know what they’re voting for. And effectively voting for a government would be very different from local elections.
The SNP wouldn’t necessarily be needed anyway. But I can see a new Indy ref being sorted before the next general election anyway. The current UK government don’t have a leg to stand on.
And who knows? Maybe bringing the SNP into a coalition government might even save the Union?
Something certainly has to change. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 09:55 - Aug 30 with 832 views | GlasgowBlue |
| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 09:51 - Aug 30 by Darth_Koont |
It’ll need some formalised alliance so voters know what they’re voting for. And effectively voting for a government would be very different from local elections.
The SNP wouldn’t necessarily be needed anyway. But I can see a new Indy ref being sorted before the next general election anyway. The current UK government don’t have a leg to stand on.
And who knows? Maybe bringing the SNP into a coalition government might even save the Union?
Something certainly has to change. |
Perhaps they could bring the Northern Independence Party on board to give the alliance some real political heavyweights  .
Anyway, good luck with this latest venture. But I fear that if you can't even get the Labour party to stop their infighting of the past six years then I don't hold out much hope for bringing on board another four or five different parties. | |
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| I’m not one for political statements but this one was overdue on 09:58 - Aug 30 with 824 views | tractordownsouth |
Good to see the Scottish Nationalists relying on their branch office! ;) [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 9:59]
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