| Somebody my wife manages 09:49 - Sep 20 with 3746 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
Doesn't want or need a passport, and doesn't drive.
What a fine upstanding woman- she has way less impact on the environment than those who do.
Of course, she won't be able to vote in the next General Election as things currently stand, because National photo ID is now required by law.
Unless a contract for National Identity Cards has been given to Group4 Security and I missed it?
Oh no, it's one of those things the Government is "going to get done", like Brexit.
Here is the laughable situation that Councils are now in, a random English Council trying to advise:
https://www.middlesbrough.gov.uk/elections/elections-act-2022-what-you-need-know
To paraphrase: "Once we know what the fck is going on, we will let you know how many hoops you will have to jump through in order to be allowed to vote."
Of course some Councils haven't bothered to even update their websites and let people know that they have been deliberately disenfranchised:
https://www.ipswich.gov.uk/elections
https://www.eastsuffolk.gov.uk/elections/election-types/uk-parliamentary-general
Many Parliamentary seats swing on 2 to 3 percent of the electorate. This deliberate voter suppression measure could make that difference, along with gerrymandering boundaries, under our corrupt First Past the Post system.
At least we have an independent Electoral Commission to oversee it all and guarantee free and fair elections, though:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/electoral-commission-elections-bi
Oh well, at least we have a robust charity sector who can campaign effectively against Government corruption:
https://www.civilsociety.co.uk/news/new-anti-protest-legislation-to-curb-chariti
Oh well at least we have an independent BBC which is free from Government interference, and wouldn't spend all summer giving unrestricted air time to Liz Truss and Rishi Sunak without giving equal air time to opposition parties, right?
https://www.thenational.scot/news/20744753.emily-maitlis-alleges-bbc-board-membe
There's loads more... |  | | |  |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:04 - Sep 20 with 2882 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
Much of Scandinavia and indeed continental Europe require voters to have photo ID, I don’t see it is that controversial.
Surely just a free ID card scheme could be set up for those with no passport/driving license? | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:08 - Sep 20 with 2855 views | BloomBlue |
Let me get this right.. we moan about potential corruption/fraud in life and prevention with things like voting and ID cards are aimed at preventing it and now people are moaning about that.. hmmm |  | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:21 - Sep 20 with 2795 views | Guthrum |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:08 - Sep 20 by BloomBlue |
Let me get this right.. we moan about potential corruption/fraud in life and prevention with things like voting and ID cards are aimed at preventing it and now people are moaning about that.. hmmm |
Compared with other forms of corruption (e.g. donations to political parties, cash for honours, Covid contracts), voter fraud is an infinitesmially tiny problem. Usually less than half-a-dozen cases per election, among millions of ballots cast.
Even if not deliberate manipulation, it's using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, when the nut is like a pistachio and already open. |  |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 10:23 - Sep 20 with 2769 views | SomethingBlue |
There is absolutely no chance of a fair election next time out and this stuff will be merely the tip of the iceberg, people need to wake up fast, those in power at the moment will stop at nothing. | |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 10:24 - Sep 20 with 2766 views | earlsgreenblue |
My elderly parents had an equally elderly friend who’s husband that did everything died, the relevance is, she to had no passport or driving license.
The problems start when you then need to take over the bank account etc, no recognised ID, I think sometimes it’s a case of what you need as opposed to what you’d like. | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:25 - Sep 20 with 2744 views | Guthrum |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:04 - Sep 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Much of Scandinavia and indeed continental Europe require voters to have photo ID, I don’t see it is that controversial.
Surely just a free ID card scheme could be set up for those with no passport/driving license? |
But that free ID card system needs to be set up (currently the only option is to pay to get one of sort of card teenagers have to prove their age in the pub).
Then it needs to function, be easily, quickly accessible and the data not to be lost/stolen. Preferably wants to be cost-effective, too. None of those things government schemes involving IT are good at. | |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 10:34 - Sep 20 with 2685 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:04 - Sep 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Much of Scandinavia and indeed continental Europe require voters to have photo ID, I don’t see it is that controversial.
Surely just a free ID card scheme could be set up for those with no passport/driving license? |
There is no scheme. There has been no communication.
It's classic early 21st centuryToryism: make up a populist bandwagon, legislate it and give no thought to implementation or logistics.
It is an obstacle, an extra hurdle to jump before somebody can vote, and it will deter many.
A "Free" ID card scheme you say? Currently it is said that "Councils" will implement it. What budget is being allocated to it? It's an extra cost for Councils at a time when nost are absolutely straining to meet their legal obligations within their budgets.
Put it this way: given that the Electoral Commission (back when it was independent) said this wasn't a problem and didn't need this solution, would you rather your local Council spent whatever this costs on providing a card people can use every 4 or 5 years, or on fixing potholes?
When a country already has a National ID card, of course there isn't a problem. This is inventing a card for a problem that doesn't exist to any meaningful degree.
Meanwhile the Electoral Commission and the House of Commons Securoty Committee were both gravely concerned about hostile foreign interference in the Brexit Referendum. And the Tory Government obstructed them:
https://www.npr.org/2020/07/21/893443735/u-k-actively-avoided-investigating-russ
Subsequently Russian donors have continued to make substantial donations to the Tory party, and yet legislation that has been passed to address that actual problem is ignored:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/12/world/europe/russian-money-uk-tories.html
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/10/world/europe/uk-boris-johnson-donors-russia.h
For balance, here's a report on the official Tory response from their then leader:
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-pm-johnson-denies-his-party-receives-donatio
So there are real problems with Free and Fair Elections in the UK, and instead the Government has implemented a measure which hits people who can't afford to drive or take foreign holidays, and those with environmental objections to flying and driving.
It's deliberate voter suppression, and the fact that there is no mechanism in place to provide the cards proves it.
See also people complaining about queues at passport control post-Brexit. It takes longer to do things when there are photo ID checks. That will have an impact on queueing times at peak periods on Election day. Fine if someone is retired and drives and can go at any point in the day. Or is a manager and can allow themselves some time to pop out to vote. Not so fine for shift workers. | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:44 - Sep 20 with 2629 views | MattinLondon |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:25 - Sep 20 by Guthrum |
But that free ID card system needs to be set up (currently the only option is to pay to get one of sort of card teenagers have to prove their age in the pub).
Then it needs to function, be easily, quickly accessible and the data not to be lost/stolen. Preferably wants to be cost-effective, too. None of those things government schemes involving IT are good at. |
Personally I feel that any chance of a free ID card being rolled out is dependent on whether the present government will lose out in terms of their traditional demographic not having adequate ID. |  | | |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 11:07 - Sep 20 with 2534 views | itfc_bucks |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:08 - Sep 20 by BloomBlue |
Let me get this right.. we moan about potential corruption/fraud in life and prevention with things like voting and ID cards are aimed at preventing it and now people are moaning about that.. hmmm |
Who's actually moaning about it? Who thinks it's anything approaching a significant problem in the UK?
There you go. | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 11:08 - Sep 20 with 2528 views | itfc_bucks |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:04 - Sep 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Much of Scandinavia and indeed continental Europe require voters to have photo ID, I don’t see it is that controversial.
Surely just a free ID card scheme could be set up for those with no passport/driving license? |
Who's funding it? Free to obtain means there's a cost borne by someone else.
Who?
Who administers it? Who keeps the personal data secure? Who funds that side of it, on an on-going basis? | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 11:24 - Sep 20 with 2443 views | Illinoisblue |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:08 - Sep 20 by BloomBlue |
Let me get this right.. we moan about potential corruption/fraud in life and prevention with things like voting and ID cards are aimed at preventing it and now people are moaning about that.. hmmm |
Election fraud, on any large scale. Is a complete myth. |  |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 11:29 - Sep 20 with 2426 views | blueasfook |
| Somebody my wife manages on 11:24 - Sep 20 by Illinoisblue |
Election fraud, on any large scale. Is a complete myth. |
In which country? I'd say it's a huge problem in countries like Belarus for example. |  |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 12:17 - Sep 20 with 2292 views | chicoazul |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:04 - Sep 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Much of Scandinavia and indeed continental Europe require voters to have photo ID, I don’t see it is that controversial.
Surely just a free ID card scheme could be set up for those with no passport/driving license? |
It is yours mine and every free Englishman’s birthright to simply walk up and vote and has been for many many years. No ID cards; no proof of who we are. Voter fraud does not exist. ID cards are an authoritarian European measure to solve a problem that does not exist. |  |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 12:25 - Sep 20 with 2247 views | Illinoisblue |
| Somebody my wife manages on 11:29 - Sep 20 by blueasfook |
In which country? I'd say it's a huge problem in countries like Belarus for example. |
I’m referring to US and UK where it’s often presented as a problem yet really isn’t. Do you have any evidence to back up your claim about Belarus? | |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 12:25 - Sep 20 with 2241 views | Churchman |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:04 - Sep 20 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
Much of Scandinavia and indeed continental Europe require voters to have photo ID, I don’t see it is that controversial.
Surely just a free ID card scheme could be set up for those with no passport/driving license? |
I’d go with photo ID. Maybe in a form that you can add a driving licence to, if you have one or even a travel/Oyster. Fraud risk might stop that sort of thing, but the principle of an ID card that does other things or contains other info doesn’t sound entirely daft to me. |  | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:29 - Sep 20 with 2209 views | JimmyJazz |
Genuine question, can't someone get a Provisional Driving Licence even if they have no intention of driving / learning to drive? |  |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 12:42 - Sep 20 with 2163 views | XYZ |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:25 - Sep 20 by Churchman |
I’d go with photo ID. Maybe in a form that you can add a driving licence to, if you have one or even a travel/Oyster. Fraud risk might stop that sort of thing, but the principle of an ID card that does other things or contains other info doesn’t sound entirely daft to me. |
For what purpose?
It can't be voting fraud in the UK because that (effectively) doesn't exist.
So, for what purpose do you want ID cards? | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:47 - Sep 20 with 2138 views | BlueBadger |
| Somebody my wife manages on 10:08 - Sep 20 by BloomBlue |
Let me get this right.. we moan about potential corruption/fraud in life and prevention with things like voting and ID cards are aimed at preventing it and now people are moaning about that.. hmmm |
There were exactly 6 cases of fraud in the last GE.
Matt Hancock alone probably has that many against him.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/matt-hancock-voter-fraud-photo-id |  |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 14:01 - Sep 20 with 1971 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:29 - Sep 20 by JimmyJazz |
Genuine question, can't someone get a Provisional Driving Licence even if they have no intention of driving / learning to drive? |
Yes.
It costs £34.
Anybody who thinks "There you go, problem solved!" clearly has very little to do with anyone who goes without food so that their children can eat. £34 is a lot of money that a significant percentage of the population couldn't find as an extra this month. | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:08 - Sep 20 with 1957 views | XYZ |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:01 - Sep 20 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Yes.
It costs £34.
Anybody who thinks "There you go, problem solved!" clearly has very little to do with anyone who goes without food so that their children can eat. £34 is a lot of money that a significant percentage of the population couldn't find as an extra this month. |
Quite.
This is a bare-faced Trumpian playbook extract intended to stop poor people voting. | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:08 - Sep 20 with 1951 views | blueasfook |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:25 - Sep 20 by Illinoisblue |
I’m referring to US and UK where it’s often presented as a problem yet really isn’t. Do you have any evidence to back up your claim about Belarus? |
Seriously?
Only the widespread civil disorder which had to be quelled by the armed forces yeah! | |
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| Somebody my wife manages on 14:23 - Sep 20 with 1902 views | Churchman |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:42 - Sep 20 by XYZ |
For what purpose?
It can't be voting fraud in the UK because that (effectively) doesn't exist.
So, for what purpose do you want ID cards? |
I suspect voting fraud is rife. It certainly was rumoured to be some years ago with postal voting - but I’ve never bothered to read up on it tbh. Hancock may have said six cases in 2019 but firstly given his lot won they’re hardly going to look and secondly if that waster told me it was daytime I’d check!
I was, in any case, thinking less about electoral fraud and more about other uses. One card to replace others. It could include NI details, driving licence, bank cards, travel cards maybe? Just thoughts.
An interesting commentary on ID cards in Scandinavia
https://www.computerweekly.com/news/252463291/Electronic-ID-in-the-Nordics-a-mod
This is an idea!
https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/05/thousands-of-people-in-sweden-are-embeddi | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:34 - Sep 20 with 1863 views | Bluefields |
Isnt there a community card you can have which is valid photo ID? | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:40 - Sep 20 with 1831 views | longtimefan |
| Somebody my wife manages on 12:29 - Sep 20 by JimmyJazz |
Genuine question, can't someone get a Provisional Driving Licence even if they have no intention of driving / learning to drive? |
Isn't the answer to register for a postal vote, or are they nobbling that too? | | | |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:43 - Sep 20 with 1822 views | JimmyJazz |
| Somebody my wife manages on 14:01 - Sep 20 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Yes.
It costs £34.
Anybody who thinks "There you go, problem solved!" clearly has very little to do with anyone who goes without food so that their children can eat. £34 is a lot of money that a significant percentage of the population couldn't find as an extra this month. |
I would say it's solution offered, rather than problem solved
For anyone in this scenario, why didn't you get some photo ID sorted when times weren't as tough as you unfortunately find yourself currently in.
Is it because us Brits have the God given right not to need ID, so you felt it wasn't necessary? | |
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