| A broad church. on 13:33 - May 30 with 2172 views | DJR |
| A broad church. on 13:17 - May 30 by itfcjoe |
It always felt that a group like the Socialist Campaign Group could get themselves into a nice position by being a group larger than any Labour majority and some power in that regard, but just doesn't feel possible if the purge as been as strong as you are saying.
I do understand the need for total discipline etc, but there does need to be a bit of variety at some level in the party as I am still hoping that it is a centrist party that leans left - and people may think that is naive but is still what I believe will happen. |
I remember Michael Crick saying a couple of years ago saying that a lack of plurality within Labour was a danger because for policies to be successful there needed to be a variety of views involved including those prepared to challenge. Without it, there is a danger of groupthink and policies that just don't stand up to scrutiny. [Post edited 30 May 2024 13:35]
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| A broad church. on 13:47 - May 30 with 2136 views | giant_stow |
I don't blame her for speaking up about a bad decision - Starmer needs to row back quick time (or his cronies do).
Please don't fck this now Labour.... please!!! |  |
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| A broad church. on 13:58 - May 30 with 2084 views | Whos_blue |
| A broad church. on 13:47 - May 30 by giant_stow |
I don't blame her for speaking up about a bad decision - Starmer needs to row back quick time (or his cronies do).
Please don't fck this now Labour.... please!!! |
This. |  |
| Distortion becomes somehow pure in its wildness. |
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| A broad church. on 13:59 - May 30 with 2071 views | GlasgowBlue |
| A broad church. on 13:58 - May 30 by Whos_blue |
This. |
Sunak must be sitting in number 10 with a bag of popcorn. |  |
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| A broad church. on 14:47 - May 30 with 2030 views | Whos_blue |
| A broad church. on 13:59 - May 30 by GlasgowBlue |
Sunak must be sitting in number 10 with a bag of popcorn. |
Sweet?
Salted?
Sweet and Salted?
Edited to include pickle flavour.
It's a taste sensation.
Apparently. [Post edited 30 May 2024 16:43]
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| Distortion becomes somehow pure in its wildness. |
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| A broad church. on 14:56 - May 30 with 1995 views | Zapers |
| A broad church. on 14:47 - May 30 by Whos_blue |
Sweet?
Salted?
Sweet and Salted?
Edited to include pickle flavour.
It's a taste sensation.
Apparently. [Post edited 30 May 2024 16:43]
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Sweet always gets my attention;) |  | | |
| A broad church. on 16:24 - May 30 with 1918 views | footers |
| A broad church. on 16:17 - May 30 by wkj |
Don't forget the other category...
Fantastic flavour of chip too, and even now we have pickle flavoured ketchup. |
Tsamina mina zangalewa.
Gosh darn pickle-suited n*****s.
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| A broad church. on 16:26 - May 30 with 1912 views | wkj |
| A broad church. on 16:24 - May 30 by footers |
Tsamina mina zangalewa.
Gosh darn pickle-suited n*****s.
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Sounds like a back handed condiment to me |  |
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| A broad church. on 16:27 - May 30 with 1901 views | footers |
| A broad church. on 16:26 - May 30 by wkj |
Sounds like a back handed condiment to me |
Couldn't agree more.
Let's ketchup soon, old friend. | |
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| A broad church. on 16:30 - May 30 with 1890 views | wkj |
| A broad church. on 16:27 - May 30 by footers |
Couldn't agree more.
Let's ketchup soon, old friend. |
For sure, I will let you see the saucy little number I just bought with my returned security deposit from my old rental. Landlord tried to make a big deal about me making the carpets dirty - naturally. Shake and Vac indeed put the freshness back, and a nice £3000 back in my pocket. | |
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| A broad church. on 16:32 - May 30 with 1879 views | GlasgowBlue |
| A broad church. on 16:17 - May 30 by wkj |
Don't forget the other category...
Fantastic flavour of chip too, and even now we have pickle flavoured ketchup. |
FFS. | |
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| A broad church. on 16:36 - May 30 with 1872 views | wkj |
Don't knock it until you try it - really, it just takes like a slightly sweeter monster munch - although I am far too distinguished and successful to be slumming it with maize based snacks these days. | |
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| A broad church. on 16:40 - May 30 with 1850 views | footers |
| A broad church. on 16:36 - May 30 by wkj |
Don't knock it until you try it - really, it just takes like a slightly sweeter monster munch - although I am far too distinguished and successful to be slumming it with maize based snacks these days. |
Maybe I'm a Maized?
Or maybe I wouldn't listen to such boring carb balls.
Who knows.
Waka waka. | |
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| A broad church. on 16:44 - May 30 with 1832 views | DJR |
| A broad church. on 13:21 - May 30 by lowhouseblue |
having labour members in parliament who vote against the labour whip 428 times seems pretty pointless to me. |
Isn't that the issue with the party system, and the three line whip, with MPs being forced to vote for things they don't believe in?
It's not something I could do, and on things like the Iraq War and PFI maybe it would have been better if more MPs had shown a bit of bottle. | | | |
| A broad church. on 16:54 - May 30 with 1791 views | GlasgowBlue |
| A broad church. on 16:36 - May 30 by wkj |
Don't knock it until you try it - really, it just takes like a slightly sweeter monster munch - although I am far too distinguished and successful to be slumming it with maize based snacks these days. |
Popcorn is a sweet snack. Never savory. Whether I eat at home or in the back seat of my car. | |
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| A broad church. on 16:59 - May 30 with 1778 views | Blueschev |
| A broad church. on 16:44 - May 30 by DJR |
Isn't that the issue with the party system, and the three line whip, with MPs being forced to vote for things they don't believe in?
It's not something I could do, and on things like the Iraq War and PFI maybe it would have been better if more MPs had shown a bit of bottle. |
It doesn't matter what individual MPs think, they should submit to the party line at all times. It's called democratic centralism. [Post edited 30 May 2024 17:00]
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| A broad church. on 17:07 - May 30 with 1752 views | wkj |
| A broad church. on 16:54 - May 30 by GlasgowBlue |
Popcorn is a sweet snack. Never savory. Whether I eat at home or in the back seat of my car. |
Horses for courses, but to me it just seems like Sugar Puffs without the milk, or whatever they're called now - Honey Monster puffs.
Gosh, lots of monster based snacks coming to the fore today | |
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| A broad church. on 17:22 - May 30 with 1717 views | DJR |
| A broad church. on 13:33 - May 30 by DJR |
I remember Michael Crick saying a couple of years ago saying that a lack of plurality within Labour was a danger because for policies to be successful there needed to be a variety of views involved including those prepared to challenge. Without it, there is a danger of groupthink and policies that just don't stand up to scrutiny. [Post edited 30 May 2024 13:35]
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Interesting that Chris Mullins has an article in today's Guardian which reiterates this point.
There is another long-term consequence. The realisation that a single unwise tweet, however ancient, or even the mildest dissent from the official line, can be career-ending will have a chilling effect on debate within the party. As the political commentator Michael Crick has observed, all healthy governments need a degree of internal challenge. In governments of all parties, unwise or downright foolish initiatives are often quietly junked before they see the light of day as a result of threatened backbench rebellions. In 1997, New Labour faced an uprising almost immediately when Gordon Brown unwisely decided to implement a decision by the outgoing Tory government to cut benefit for single parents. It was too late to reverse the decision, but it was quietly compensated in the subsequent budget.
And who with the benefit of hindsight can say that the 139 Labour MPs (I was one) who rebelled over the government’s decision to help the US invade Iraq were wrong? Had he listened, Tony Blair’s reputation would not now be stained by the shadow of Iraq.
As Michael Crick says: “The people running the show are hugely partisan.” The likes of John Prescott, Robin Cook or Angela Rayner could never have been selected under the current management. Crick adds: “My own politics are rightwing Labour, but I am a pluralist. Good governments need internal challenge.” | | | |
| A broad church. on 21:48 - May 30 with 1606 views | DJR |
Interesting development. The Labour Party really have dug themselves into a hole over this, which does not augur well for how they will cope when in government. Indeed, there was never likely to be much of a honeymoon, but even that seems over now.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/30/leading-black-figures-c
Leading Black British actors, professors, authors and broadcasters have urged Labour to “rectify and reverse” the “disrespectful” treatment of Diane Abbott or risk losing the backing of the party’s most loyal supporters.
Lenny Henry, David Harewood, Renni Eddo-Lodge, Misan Harriman, Afua Hirsch, Jackie Kay, Linton Kwesi Johnson, Adrian Lester and Gary Younge are among the prominent Black figures to have signed a damning open letter, classing various briefings and Abbott’s own claim that she has been barred from standing for the party as “disproportionate, undemocratic and vindictive”.
The letter from the group of influential Black figures says: “Sir Keir Starmer’s denials on this matter must be treated with some scepticism. Just last Friday he said the investigation into her conduct had not been resolved even though Abbott had satisfactorily completed the disciplinary process in February.
“Indeed, the fact that the party reached its conclusion several months ago and failed to readmit her to the parliamentary party until earlier this week, after the story broke, indicates a determination to humiliate her. Coming from a community where discrimination is a daily reality, we know unfairness when we see it.”
The signatories claim the party’s inability to make a decision on her future since the investigation concluded last year was an example “of the systemic racism highlighted in the Forde report on factionalism in the Labour party commissioned by Starmer himself”.
The letter adds: “Just two months ago it was revealed that the Tory party’s chief funder [Frank Hester] had told a meeting ‘when you see’ Abbott on television ‘you just want to hate all Black women’ and said the MP ‘should be shot’. In the ensuing furore the Labour party then tried to fundraise on the back of Abbott’s predicament, even as they continued to exclude her from the parliamentary party.
“Given Labour’s recent embrace of others who have championed causes far more objectionable to its core values and its commitment to stamp out antisemitism in its ranks, the treatment of Abbott also smacks of a disgraceful double standard.”
The letter notes the feeling of upset felt by Black communities, saying they have been “among Labour’s most loyal supporters, lifelong and through multiple generations”, but warns “that loyalty has never been unconditional”.
“The Labour party seems to have made a strategic decision that the black and brown vote doesn’t matter. Electorally speaking that won’t be true everywhere. But even if it were, it’s not politically or morally right anywhere,” the letter adds. [Post edited 30 May 2024 21:57]
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| A broad church. on 22:04 - May 30 with 1577 views | footers |
| A broad church. on 21:48 - May 30 by DJR |
Interesting development. The Labour Party really have dug themselves into a hole over this, which does not augur well for how they will cope when in government. Indeed, there was never likely to be much of a honeymoon, but even that seems over now.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/30/leading-black-figures-c
Leading Black British actors, professors, authors and broadcasters have urged Labour to “rectify and reverse” the “disrespectful” treatment of Diane Abbott or risk losing the backing of the party’s most loyal supporters.
Lenny Henry, David Harewood, Renni Eddo-Lodge, Misan Harriman, Afua Hirsch, Jackie Kay, Linton Kwesi Johnson, Adrian Lester and Gary Younge are among the prominent Black figures to have signed a damning open letter, classing various briefings and Abbott’s own claim that she has been barred from standing for the party as “disproportionate, undemocratic and vindictive”.
The letter from the group of influential Black figures says: “Sir Keir Starmer’s denials on this matter must be treated with some scepticism. Just last Friday he said the investigation into her conduct had not been resolved even though Abbott had satisfactorily completed the disciplinary process in February.
“Indeed, the fact that the party reached its conclusion several months ago and failed to readmit her to the parliamentary party until earlier this week, after the story broke, indicates a determination to humiliate her. Coming from a community where discrimination is a daily reality, we know unfairness when we see it.”
The signatories claim the party’s inability to make a decision on her future since the investigation concluded last year was an example “of the systemic racism highlighted in the Forde report on factionalism in the Labour party commissioned by Starmer himself”.
The letter adds: “Just two months ago it was revealed that the Tory party’s chief funder [Frank Hester] had told a meeting ‘when you see’ Abbott on television ‘you just want to hate all Black women’ and said the MP ‘should be shot’. In the ensuing furore the Labour party then tried to fundraise on the back of Abbott’s predicament, even as they continued to exclude her from the parliamentary party.
“Given Labour’s recent embrace of others who have championed causes far more objectionable to its core values and its commitment to stamp out antisemitism in its ranks, the treatment of Abbott also smacks of a disgraceful double standard.”
The letter notes the feeling of upset felt by Black communities, saying they have been “among Labour’s most loyal supporters, lifelong and through multiple generations”, but warns “that loyalty has never been unconditional”.
“The Labour party seems to have made a strategic decision that the black and brown vote doesn’t matter. Electorally speaking that won’t be true everywhere. But even if it were, it’s not politically or morally right anywhere,” the letter adds. [Post edited 30 May 2024 21:57]
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I think you'll find Abbott is an idiot, communist and unsuitable to be in the Labour party etc.
All the usual lot lining up to take shots at a 70-year-old leftist veteran who is possibly not all that well.
Nice one, Keir! What a welcoming environment you've created, and what a safe seat you've just lost. | |
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| A broad church. on 22:26 - May 30 with 1548 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/30/purge-of-labour-leftwin
Shaheen said she had been subject to “a systematic campaign of racism, Islamophobia and bullying”. She added: “I have come to the inescapable conclusion that Labour, far from being a broad church encompassing different views, has an ingrained culture of bullying, a palpable problem with black and brown people, and thinks nothing of dragging a person’s good name through the mud in pursuit of a factional agenda, with no thought of the impact on committed members’ mental health and wellbeing.” |  |
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| A broad church. on 23:33 - May 30 with 1473 views | reusersfreekicks |
| A broad church. on 13:19 - May 30 by GlasgowBlue |
I would imagine Starmer is being extra careful after the EHRC report. |
And liking tweets by Caroline Lucas? |  | | |
| A broad church. on 09:11 - May 31 with 1367 views | Swansea_Blue |
| A broad church. on 17:22 - May 30 by DJR |
Interesting that Chris Mullins has an article in today's Guardian which reiterates this point.
There is another long-term consequence. The realisation that a single unwise tweet, however ancient, or even the mildest dissent from the official line, can be career-ending will have a chilling effect on debate within the party. As the political commentator Michael Crick has observed, all healthy governments need a degree of internal challenge. In governments of all parties, unwise or downright foolish initiatives are often quietly junked before they see the light of day as a result of threatened backbench rebellions. In 1997, New Labour faced an uprising almost immediately when Gordon Brown unwisely decided to implement a decision by the outgoing Tory government to cut benefit for single parents. It was too late to reverse the decision, but it was quietly compensated in the subsequent budget.
And who with the benefit of hindsight can say that the 139 Labour MPs (I was one) who rebelled over the government’s decision to help the US invade Iraq were wrong? Had he listened, Tony Blair’s reputation would not now be stained by the shadow of Iraq.
As Michael Crick says: “The people running the show are hugely partisan.” The likes of John Prescott, Robin Cook or Angela Rayner could never have been selected under the current management. Crick adds: “My own politics are rightwing Labour, but I am a pluralist. Good governments need internal challenge.” |
You’re Robin Cook, and I claim my ‘Kieran has signed a new deal’ pin badge.
(He was a rare man of integrity, along with all the rebels back then. RIP). |  |
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