| Season Over. 11:18 - Feb 23 with 3757 views | itfcsuth |
For me the season is now done - not because of yesterday, but yesterday all but confirms that imo.
Cannot fault the players application, their endeavours and desire to be the best version of themselves every single week is clear. We have competed in so many games, but ultimately just not quite good enough for this level right now.
Whether you like it or not it feels like a wasted opportunity with our recruitment. The opportunity to spend £170m+ on a squad building exercise is a luxury, but to rip apart the soul of squad that had been on a journey with us, to replace them, but not upgrade on them is devastating. For that there is a responsibility to KMc, Werhun, Probert & Ashton.
Next objective is to return to the Championship, settle on a group of players that we can find that real connection with as fans once again, to take us on the next step of the journey, and WHEN we return to the PL, learn lessons about our recruitment and add real upgrades to that group, rather than tear it apart.
I think KMc is one of the brightest young managers in Europe, I hold him in the highest regard. He is still young, he is still learning himself, there are things he has got right and things he’ll probably wish he’d done differently. But make no mistake, Kieran McKenna is absolutely untouchable in my opinion!
COYB! |  | | |  |
| Season Over. on 11:19 - Feb 23 with 3212 views | bournemouthblue |
Southampton was the killer, we really needed to be winning that
This is just the icing on the cake really |  |
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| Season Over. on 11:54 - Feb 23 with 3091 views | Garv |
| Season Over. on 11:19 - Feb 23 by bournemouthblue |
Southampton was the killer, we really needed to be winning that
This is just the icing on the cake really |
I think the psychological effect of that Southampton defeat was even more damaging than the materiality of not getting 1 or 3 points. It just took away any confidence we had that we could hurt teams, if we can't beat Southampton, or even score more than one goal against them, frankly what hope have we got? |  |
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| Season Over. on 14:18 - Feb 23 with 2933 views | itfcsuth |
| Season Over. on 11:19 - Feb 23 by bournemouthblue |
Southampton was the killer, we really needed to be winning that
This is just the icing on the cake really |
Southampton was a killer - KMc will know that.
There’s been a few sucker punches this season - Fulham (A), Leicester (H), Bournemouth (H), but Southampton the knock out blow. | | | |
| Season Over. on 15:13 - Feb 23 with 2834 views | Smoresy |
We'll have a better idea if we've upgraded the team next season, should the new signings stay, or otherwise in how they fare across their careers at other clubs.
The gulf between leagues leaves little doubt, to me at least, that a newly promoted team could easily sign players who are 30% better than the ones they replace, and the outcome would still be no tangible gain at this level. The replacements needed to be much, much better straight away and they haven't mostly been that. In the Championship though, a 30% better player would amount to a big improvement. I'm genuinely excited to see how they do, if we can keep most of them.
Last season's points haul will be tough to improve on but no so much the manner of victories; we won so many by a single goal and they were mostly nail-biters. I can only think of three games that we won by three goals or more, off the top of my head. Leeds must be close to double figures already. If we can dominate in both points and performances next season, we'll have improved a lot. |  | | |
| Season Over. on 15:21 - Feb 23 with 2777 views | FrimleyBlue |
Personally think KM has shown alot of his rawness this season.
The needless dropping of some players. The return of others who then got dropped again.
The classic like for like subs.
Some very late subs
The refusal to test a different left side
Despite many signings the way we concede goals hasn't really been address despite promotions.
The midfield duo being strict and not trying a third.
He's also the one behind building this side and hasn't had the luxury of using players purchased by the previous manager and his signings are all very samey and imo He's not made the most of signing one of the hottest scorers in the champ in Sammy. Same with j clarke. And he's brought in two fullbacks who are as bad as each other and not even upgrades on the right back he's loaned out.
He's done a cracking job but he's made alot of mistakes. As young managers do. |  |
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| Season Over. on 16:08 - Feb 23 with 2712 views | bournemouthblue |
| Season Over. on 14:18 - Feb 23 by itfcsuth |
Southampton was a killer - KMc will know that.
There’s been a few sucker punches this season - Fulham (A), Leicester (H), Bournemouth (H), but Southampton the knock out blow. |
Downthumbed in error | |
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| Season Over. on 16:56 - Feb 23 with 2633 views | TheBoyBlue |
As others have said, Southampton was the killer. Win that and we still had it in our hands with Wolves still to come here. Sadly that defeat not only lost us 3 points that are about as close to a given as anyone could wish in the Premier League, but probably gave Wolves a massive boost when they played Villa straight after. And they are too good to pass that up with a new manager as well. | |
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| Season Over. on 17:03 - Feb 23 with 2594 views | billlm |
| Season Over. on 11:19 - Feb 23 by bournemouthblue |
Southampton was the killer, we really needed to be winning that
This is just the icing on the cake really |
If any that's the one that done us,
Yesterday's defeat wouldn't have meant that much if we'd beaten saints,
If we're back in the next couple of seasons we should be better equipped hopefully or as a club have more experience,
We could have a similar problem a squad as now probably be very successful in the championship then have to add again, but a better squad than last year's championship one, which I love, |  | | |
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| Season Over. on 17:57 - Feb 23 with 2521 views | TractorWood |
| Season Over. on 14:18 - Feb 23 by itfcsuth |
Southampton was a killer - KMc will know that.
There’s been a few sucker punches this season - Fulham (A), Leicester (H), Bournemouth (H), but Southampton the knock out blow. |
Totally agree. We've administered a couple too. We beat Wolves with the last kick of the game. Morsy scored a deflected goal in 90+7 vs Soton away.
In between this stuff we've largely played OK and created chances but too often squander them and then go onto concede ridiculously soft goals. |  |
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| Season Over. on 17:58 - Feb 23 with 2505 views | FromReuserWithLove |
| Season Over. on 17:57 - Feb 23 by TractorWood |
Totally agree. We've administered a couple too. We beat Wolves with the last kick of the game. Morsy scored a deflected goal in 90+7 vs Soton away.
In between this stuff we've largely played OK and created chances but too often squander them and then go onto concede ridiculously soft goals. |
defensively "woeful" was quite damning from Murphy. |  | | |
| Season Over. on 09:38 - Feb 24 with 2126 views | IPSWICHFANITFC |
I think Wolves will win their game tomorrow too. The 5 point gap is a reach as it is, but 8 points confirms our fate for me.
Wolves look better than us and are more in form than us. 2 more wins for them this season probably see's them safe. We need at least 3 wins with a couple of draws from our remaining 12 to stay up in my opinion - which MUST include taking 3pts from the Wolves game as 1 of those wins. Tough ask looking at the fixtures. |  |
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| Season Over. on 10:07 - Feb 24 with 2040 views | itfcsuth |
| Season Over. on 17:57 - Feb 23 by TractorWood |
Totally agree. We've administered a couple too. We beat Wolves with the last kick of the game. Morsy scored a deflected goal in 90+7 vs Soton away.
In between this stuff we've largely played OK and created chances but too often squander them and then go onto concede ridiculously soft goals. |
For large parts of the season we’ve played quite well within our capability, there is no doubt about that - I think we’ve comfortably looked the best of the 3 teams promoted, we’ve given teams at time a really good game.
Ultimately it has come down to a shortfall in quality and execution in both boxes. | | | |
| Season Over. on 10:09 - Feb 24 with 2022 views | itfcsuth |
| Season Over. on 09:38 - Feb 24 by IPSWICHFANITFC |
I think Wolves will win their game tomorrow too. The 5 point gap is a reach as it is, but 8 points confirms our fate for me.
Wolves look better than us and are more in form than us. 2 more wins for them this season probably see's them safe. We need at least 3 wins with a couple of draws from our remaining 12 to stay up in my opinion - which MUST include taking 3pts from the Wolves game as 1 of those wins. Tough ask looking at the fixtures. |
I looks too much as is for me now, if the gap grows any bigger it just confirms that.
I will also add Wolves have had a really poor season, but you know that they still have that real top PL quality in areas that always made me worry they are going to get out of trouble. | | | |
| Season Over. on 10:10 - Feb 24 with 2011 views | hype313 |
| Season Over. on 11:19 - Feb 23 by bournemouthblue |
Southampton was the killer, we really needed to be winning that
This is just the icing on the cake really |
Yep, in a mini league with us Saints and Leicester, we're bottom. |  |
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| Season Over. on 10:11 - Feb 24 with 1994 views | Pinewoodblue |
How can the season be over when there enough games left to make up the points deficit and just 2 games away from a Wembley appearance. |  |
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| Season Over. on 10:23 - Feb 24 with 1944 views | portmanroadblue |
| Season Over. on 15:13 - Feb 23 by Smoresy |
We'll have a better idea if we've upgraded the team next season, should the new signings stay, or otherwise in how they fare across their careers at other clubs.
The gulf between leagues leaves little doubt, to me at least, that a newly promoted team could easily sign players who are 30% better than the ones they replace, and the outcome would still be no tangible gain at this level. The replacements needed to be much, much better straight away and they haven't mostly been that. In the Championship though, a 30% better player would amount to a big improvement. I'm genuinely excited to see how they do, if we can keep most of them.
Last season's points haul will be tough to improve on but no so much the manner of victories; we won so many by a single goal and they were mostly nail-biters. I can only think of three games that we won by three goals or more, off the top of my head. Leeds must be close to double figures already. If we can dominate in both points and performances next season, we'll have improved a lot. |
We have definitely upgraded the team, you do not need to wait until next season to know that, Leicester/Southampton in the champ was by far the superior teams, but we have been far better than both this year, without the results we deserved. |  | | |
| Season Over. on 10:42 - Feb 24 with 1877 views | BseaBlue |
| Season Over. on 10:11 - Feb 24 by Pinewoodblue |
How can the season be over when there enough games left to make up the points deficit and just 2 games away from a Wembley appearance. |
Probably just a sense of realism based on results/performances to date. No doubt we will still give it everything and be preparing for matches in the same manner though. |  | | |
| Season Over. on 10:46 - Feb 24 with 1857 views | itfcpaul |
| Season Over. on 15:21 - Feb 23 by FrimleyBlue |
Personally think KM has shown alot of his rawness this season.
The needless dropping of some players. The return of others who then got dropped again.
The classic like for like subs.
Some very late subs
The refusal to test a different left side
Despite many signings the way we concede goals hasn't really been address despite promotions.
The midfield duo being strict and not trying a third.
He's also the one behind building this side and hasn't had the luxury of using players purchased by the previous manager and his signings are all very samey and imo He's not made the most of signing one of the hottest scorers in the champ in Sammy. Same with j clarke. And he's brought in two fullbacks who are as bad as each other and not even upgrades on the right back he's loaned out.
He's done a cracking job but he's made alot of mistakes. As young managers do. |
I agree, I find it a little weird that when we played Spurs away, we played a solid 3 at the back to counteract Son, which worked really well, but when we played Saturday , yes I know we were at home, but still, we reverted to more of a 4 which left our right back 1 on 1 with Son, which was a little dangerous to say the least, and what I thought strange was it wasn't changed until half time, when we could have been 3 or 4 down, a little strange I thought, it wasn't something that was going to get better was it. Even when he made the change he just stayed with the same formation and hoped O'Shea would be better than Godfrey.
KM has been truly amazing for this club but we need points, even a point every game would get us out of this relegation situation (possibly) but trying to play long standing, experienced world class players with the team we have and hope we can outplay them like we did teams in L1 and Championship is a little nieve.
I will say it's certainly not over as yet there are points out there to get but we much beat Wolves and Leicester and hope that it's enough, but let's see!!! | |
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| Season Over. on 10:56 - Feb 24 with 1796 views | baxterbasics |
The lady of larger physique is not singing for us yet but she's definitely warming up her vocal chords.
Wolves need to implode for us to have a sniff of a chance. Their win this weekend was as damaging as our (not unexpected) loss. |  |
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| Season Over. on 11:07 - Feb 24 with 1731 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Season Over. on 10:46 - Feb 24 by itfcpaul |
I agree, I find it a little weird that when we played Spurs away, we played a solid 3 at the back to counteract Son, which worked really well, but when we played Saturday , yes I know we were at home, but still, we reverted to more of a 4 which left our right back 1 on 1 with Son, which was a little dangerous to say the least, and what I thought strange was it wasn't changed until half time, when we could have been 3 or 4 down, a little strange I thought, it wasn't something that was going to get better was it. Even when he made the change he just stayed with the same formation and hoped O'Shea would be better than Godfrey.
KM has been truly amazing for this club but we need points, even a point every game would get us out of this relegation situation (possibly) but trying to play long standing, experienced world class players with the team we have and hope we can outplay them like we did teams in L1 and Championship is a little nieve.
I will say it's certainly not over as yet there are points out there to get but we much beat Wolves and Leicester and hope that it's enough, but let's see!!! |
I just think some go OTT about his powers.
The main reason we got our promotions were two reasons.
1 - KM players football like a prem side, the transitions, player roles, passing patterns etc, many teams can't counter it, their mangers don't have that knowledge, their teams don't have the fitness levels to cope.
2 - our finishers hurt sides
But we never saw a tactical masterclass, we've never seen a 2 up top, or 3 man midfielder or a defensive leftback with a flying left winger as apposed to the inverting l10 role.
When we played those 'prem' parachute standard sides, we got controlled ourselves by the likes of Leeds, leicester and struggled against southampton at home..
That is why we've struggled for me this season, we're simply playing prem football like most prem clubs with worse players and not trying anything that these top managers, with top club research facilities haven't learnt about us from our first round of games or previous season.
Only Southampton imo has been a game where we looked better than the first and we still lost.
You can never take away what he achieved, and he's gonna have a cracking career, I don't personally think it will be with us, but lets just say it could be.
But I do think this season has opened up that little bit of doubt about how flexible is McKenna. We know player roles can be tweaked, that's a given, but that's normal.
But when you've got a touchline hugging left winger in your armoury or a central goal scoring 10 in szmodics not being used correctly when hes available, plus signing a host of flairy 10's when you've already got them, it's all a bit weird for me. Broady has looked the most promising of most or our l10 picks, yet benched, even though for me, he was probably the best player against southampton. Wolfy, never done anything wrong, in and out from the cold, when perhaps town keeping the ball and transitioning differently might be a better way for us to go about our business, Moyes has done exactly that at Everton, he's moved the defence higher, presses from the front, but when they have the ball at the back, there now not to quick to get the ball forward, taking their time to work the ball up the pitch and around the playing squad.
With town, it's attempted quick tempo up the pitch, if we don't score, we're on the defence immediately and facing another goal conceded off the back of our own attacks.
People will absolutely blame the gap in the level etc etc, I get it, it's most likely 99% true too, however we've not done anything to counter the issues we've had this season. We have the same fullback issues, the same non passing in the forward line, no ball hold up up top, and just waves and waves of attacks simply because sides are playing against lesser versions of themselves when they play us. | |
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| Season Over. on 11:09 - Feb 24 with 1726 views | joshITFCporter |
| Season Over. on 09:38 - Feb 24 by IPSWICHFANITFC |
I think Wolves will win their game tomorrow too. The 5 point gap is a reach as it is, but 8 points confirms our fate for me.
Wolves look better than us and are more in form than us. 2 more wins for them this season probably see's them safe. We need at least 3 wins with a couple of draws from our remaining 12 to stay up in my opinion - which MUST include taking 3pts from the Wolves game as 1 of those wins. Tough ask looking at the fixtures. |
Wolves also still have to play southampton, so can pretty much chalk that one off as a win straight away. The season itself isn't over, can still breed confidence into the squad if we can pull off a few more wins, and got the FA Cup still, but I feel the players know now that it'd take a miracle to survive.
Saying that, great escapes have happened in the past relatively regularly, so we keep fighting until the fat lady sings |  |
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| Time to view season in a different way, FA Cup, and a series of ‘cup’ games on 11:12 - Feb 24 with 1704 views | unstableblue |
12 games to go
We’re not mathematically relegated so you keep fighting, but treat games in the league as cup games… something to enjoy the spectacle - Man U away, last game at Goodison, West Ham derby, Arsenal at home, give Wolves a black eye.
If you back on Saturday up to Wolfenden disallowed goal it was a great watch, and enjoyable - bar our looseness in defence. We can use the remaining games to be in players even further and continue to improve.
We NEED to avoid a spiral and an embarrassing finish / I think we can do this. Let’s get our first win in 2025 soon. Let’s get some points and some good displays.
I think Jaden and Clarke are good players - let’s bed them in and improve them.
Axel back will be huge.
Let’s improve the system and style ready for a few seasons time. Plan to keep the bulk of the team. Grow. Get the spade in the ground of the training ground.
Get a positive atmosphere and link to players going again.
Try and get through to the next round of the club,
Develop, grow, improve, go out in style.
Still plenty to come form this season. |  |
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| Time to view season in a different way, FA Cup, and a series of ‘cup’ games on 11:18 - Feb 24 with 1681 views | baxterbasics |
| Time to view season in a different way, FA Cup, and a series of ‘cup’ games on 11:12 - Feb 24 by unstableblue |
12 games to go
We’re not mathematically relegated so you keep fighting, but treat games in the league as cup games… something to enjoy the spectacle - Man U away, last game at Goodison, West Ham derby, Arsenal at home, give Wolves a black eye.
If you back on Saturday up to Wolfenden disallowed goal it was a great watch, and enjoyable - bar our looseness in defence. We can use the remaining games to be in players even further and continue to improve.
We NEED to avoid a spiral and an embarrassing finish / I think we can do this. Let’s get our first win in 2025 soon. Let’s get some points and some good displays.
I think Jaden and Clarke are good players - let’s bed them in and improve them.
Axel back will be huge.
Let’s improve the system and style ready for a few seasons time. Plan to keep the bulk of the team. Grow. Get the spade in the ground of the training ground.
Get a positive atmosphere and link to players going again.
Try and get through to the next round of the club,
Develop, grow, improve, go out in style.
Still plenty to come form this season. |
Yup. As per your comments, would be nice to at least go down with a decent fight, and not have it all but confirmed before March is over. | |
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| Season Over. on 11:31 - Feb 24 with 1608 views | itfcpaul |
| Season Over. on 11:07 - Feb 24 by FrimleyBlue |
I just think some go OTT about his powers.
The main reason we got our promotions were two reasons.
1 - KM players football like a prem side, the transitions, player roles, passing patterns etc, many teams can't counter it, their mangers don't have that knowledge, their teams don't have the fitness levels to cope.
2 - our finishers hurt sides
But we never saw a tactical masterclass, we've never seen a 2 up top, or 3 man midfielder or a defensive leftback with a flying left winger as apposed to the inverting l10 role.
When we played those 'prem' parachute standard sides, we got controlled ourselves by the likes of Leeds, leicester and struggled against southampton at home..
That is why we've struggled for me this season, we're simply playing prem football like most prem clubs with worse players and not trying anything that these top managers, with top club research facilities haven't learnt about us from our first round of games or previous season.
Only Southampton imo has been a game where we looked better than the first and we still lost.
You can never take away what he achieved, and he's gonna have a cracking career, I don't personally think it will be with us, but lets just say it could be.
But I do think this season has opened up that little bit of doubt about how flexible is McKenna. We know player roles can be tweaked, that's a given, but that's normal.
But when you've got a touchline hugging left winger in your armoury or a central goal scoring 10 in szmodics not being used correctly when hes available, plus signing a host of flairy 10's when you've already got them, it's all a bit weird for me. Broady has looked the most promising of most or our l10 picks, yet benched, even though for me, he was probably the best player against southampton. Wolfy, never done anything wrong, in and out from the cold, when perhaps town keeping the ball and transitioning differently might be a better way for us to go about our business, Moyes has done exactly that at Everton, he's moved the defence higher, presses from the front, but when they have the ball at the back, there now not to quick to get the ball forward, taking their time to work the ball up the pitch and around the playing squad.
With town, it's attempted quick tempo up the pitch, if we don't score, we're on the defence immediately and facing another goal conceded off the back of our own attacks.
People will absolutely blame the gap in the level etc etc, I get it, it's most likely 99% true too, however we've not done anything to counter the issues we've had this season. We have the same fullback issues, the same non passing in the forward line, no ball hold up up top, and just waves and waves of attacks simply because sides are playing against lesser versions of themselves when they play us. |
I agree!!
Massive step up, no time to prepare a Prem squad with getting promoted far earlier than expected and not having the parachute payments both Leicester and Southampton has, making it extra difficult, but we are above both of them and no too far away from Wolves, so all is not lost!!
Would have been nice to sign more players with Prem experience and build, rather then reply on the best of the Championship and a huge lump of L1 players, always going to be tough, but if you think back to the way we dug in against Villa, Spurs and Arsenal away, we can defend if set up to defend initially but the ability to break away which we have shown we are capable of.
I like the idea of Hirst up front and Delap on the right, but can see the massive risk that could be with not having a 3rd striker of their mould, but it is getting worrying close to the end of the season and maybe, just maybe, a change may help us force some points from teams we wouldn't do playing as we are? | |
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| Time to view season in a different way, FA Cup, and a series of ‘cup’ games on 11:37 - Feb 24 with 1573 views | unstableblue |
| Time to view season in a different way, FA Cup, and a series of ‘cup’ games on 11:18 - Feb 24 by baxterbasics |
Yup. As per your comments, would be nice to at least go down with a decent fight, and not have it all but confirmed before March is over. |
Treat every game as a one off
A chance to improve as a team
Store up experience for our return in a few seasons
And get some points | |
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