| Foreign players 00:08 - Apr 6 with 2980 views | nshearman1 |
Scowcroft made this point before the home Palace game. Unless we invest in foreign players we cannot compete at PL level. You get better technical skills for less money if you buy cleverly, Look at Cajuste (sadly probably lost to us now). We've been weirdly obsessed with English speakers. But mostly we need to sort out our defence - Greaves, anyone? |  | | |  |
| Foreign players on 05:30 - Apr 6 with 2673 views | ITFCSG |
I have repeated this many times here but people have been accusing me of blasphemy against McK and MA. The lack of an international scouting network and McK’s inability? unwillingness? to tap the foreign market for better value and players is killing us. Which other PL side have as many home nations players in their starting XI compared to us? Of course we aren’t going to attract or afford top home grown players like Grealish and Foden so we make do with the U21s who aren’t fit for purpose in the PL (yet). If Philogene was so fantastic he would have featured for Villa instead. Ditto Hutchinson. Greaves, J Clarke aren’t PL quality as well. [Post edited 6 Apr 5:35]
| | | |
| Foreign players on 06:50 - Apr 6 with 2568 views | IPSWICHFANITFC |
I hope it’s something that the club will look towards now. Perhaps the infrastructure isn’t there yet because of how quick our rise has been my League 1 to the PL. But if we do end up in the PL again, it’s a market we can’t ignore if we want to stay up. Scowcroft is right.
I don’t think the problem is necessarily English players. If they’re playing for England U21s then they do have something about them. But buying them and pinning all hopes and expectations on them whilst they’re still developing their game and into a new league is a tough balance to find. If Delap hadn’t come on tenfold, then it really would have looked like a very poor strategy in the summer.
Some players from the EFL go on and do well in the PL - Eze, Maddison, Olise, Wharton etc to name a few off the top of my head. Some work and some don’t and that’s football. |  |
| |
| Foreign players on 07:17 - Apr 6 with 2502 views | itfcjoe |
It’s not a weird obsession it’s just an area where we were best prepared for the recruitment from - Mick Mills was talking post game about how he speaks regularly to Brian Talbot (head of recruitment at Fulham) and how they are trying to get into the South American market now - but they are over 18 months behind Brighton and trying to close that gap.
We will have been years behind everyone else, let alone Fulham who are years behind Brighton. This year will have helped us close the gap but it’s not something that can be done in one window. Most of these deals are worked on across windows to finally get their man as we can see even from us going back in for the same players time and time again [Hirst, Taylor, Philogene, Scarlett, Hutchinson, Delap]. |  |
| |
| Foreign players on 07:41 - Apr 6 with 2388 views | bsw72 |
We need to concede less goals, and were able to score ourselves out of trouble last season but this does not work in the PL.
It’s not sorting out the defence in isolation it is addressing the challenge we have in transition from attack to defence, starting with how the attacking players and midfield switch and support the defence. Too often defence been left exposed on the counter attack.
As for foreign players, it’s partly true, but more about finding the right players at the right price but by having an effective scouting network both at home and overseas addresses this. It’s true you can pick up bargains with imports but can also end up with duffers. Worth noting that English league football takes more adjusting to than European which adds to the challenge.
For every foreign signing that proves to be a gem—like Oleksandr Zinchenko at Man City or Gabriel Martinelli at Arsenal—there are usually a couple that don’t quite live up to expectations. Clubs often look for value in the market, but cheaper deals come with their own risks. Players Guilherme at West Ham or Kalajdzic at Wolves, arrived with promise but struggled to make a real impression.
It’s very easy to say we need to bring in foreign players, but executing successfully is very different. |  | | |
| Foreign players on 08:28 - Apr 6 with 2192 views | CopfordBlue |
There were no complaints about our reliance on English-based, English speaking signings prior to this season. Our scouting and recruitment resources have been focused on the English league for years and this was a factor in why we secured the signings of Broadhead, Chaplin, Burns, Davis, Harry Clarke, Luongo, Tuanzebe, Hladky, Walton, Taylor etc etc.
Plenty of EFL clubs sign a lot of players from all corners of the globe. For every success story there are multiple failures. I doubt we’d have gained back to back promotions if the signings in summer 2023 and January 2024 had needed to adapt to English football, our climate, complex style of play and so on. We can’t have it all ways.
The scouting network shortcomings are a direct consequence of progressing too quickly as we don’t have a full Premier League infrastructure. Having a manager who has spent his entire career in England is another factor.
It’s also worth remembering that during our last spell in the premier league, the departure of British players to be replaced by those from overseas didn’t work well at all. It’s not done much for Leicester or Southampton this season either.
We’ve come up short this season and there are multiple factors. Overall though it’s just that we ‘ve come too far, too soon. We’ve made 10 steps forward compared to where we were in 2021 and are now taking one backwards. I’m sure that our approach in the transfer market will change slightly this summer and there will be an element of overseas recruitment. | |
| |
| Foreign players on 08:50 - Apr 6 with 2095 views | ArnieM |
| Foreign players on 08:28 - Apr 6 by CopfordBlue |
There were no complaints about our reliance on English-based, English speaking signings prior to this season. Our scouting and recruitment resources have been focused on the English league for years and this was a factor in why we secured the signings of Broadhead, Chaplin, Burns, Davis, Harry Clarke, Luongo, Tuanzebe, Hladky, Walton, Taylor etc etc.
Plenty of EFL clubs sign a lot of players from all corners of the globe. For every success story there are multiple failures. I doubt we’d have gained back to back promotions if the signings in summer 2023 and January 2024 had needed to adapt to English football, our climate, complex style of play and so on. We can’t have it all ways.
The scouting network shortcomings are a direct consequence of progressing too quickly as we don’t have a full Premier League infrastructure. Having a manager who has spent his entire career in England is another factor.
It’s also worth remembering that during our last spell in the premier league, the departure of British players to be replaced by those from overseas didn’t work well at all. It’s not done much for Leicester or Southampton this season either.
We’ve come up short this season and there are multiple factors. Overall though it’s just that we ‘ve come too far, too soon. We’ve made 10 steps forward compared to where we were in 2021 and are now taking one backwards. I’m sure that our approach in the transfer market will change slightly this summer and there will be an element of overseas recruitment. |
Starting with Cajuste, hopefully! |  |
| |
| Foreign players on 09:01 - Apr 6 with 2040 views | tonybied |
| Foreign players on 08:28 - Apr 6 by CopfordBlue |
There were no complaints about our reliance on English-based, English speaking signings prior to this season. Our scouting and recruitment resources have been focused on the English league for years and this was a factor in why we secured the signings of Broadhead, Chaplin, Burns, Davis, Harry Clarke, Luongo, Tuanzebe, Hladky, Walton, Taylor etc etc.
Plenty of EFL clubs sign a lot of players from all corners of the globe. For every success story there are multiple failures. I doubt we’d have gained back to back promotions if the signings in summer 2023 and January 2024 had needed to adapt to English football, our climate, complex style of play and so on. We can’t have it all ways.
The scouting network shortcomings are a direct consequence of progressing too quickly as we don’t have a full Premier League infrastructure. Having a manager who has spent his entire career in England is another factor.
It’s also worth remembering that during our last spell in the premier league, the departure of British players to be replaced by those from overseas didn’t work well at all. It’s not done much for Leicester or Southampton this season either.
We’ve come up short this season and there are multiple factors. Overall though it’s just that we ‘ve come too far, too soon. We’ve made 10 steps forward compared to where we were in 2021 and are now taking one backwards. I’m sure that our approach in the transfer market will change slightly this summer and there will be an element of overseas recruitment. |
How dare you bring sensible debate to this conversation. We want the best foreign players at pennies, and we want them NOW! It's easy in FM, in fact I won the Champions League after 3 seasons in charge of ITFC. McKenna has had 3 seasons in charge and hasn't even managed to qualify for the Champions League yet. McKenna and Ashton are a disgrace and should be sacked off before the end of the season. I reckon we should poach Guardiola, as his clearly not happy at City now. |  | | |
| Foreign players on 09:10 - Apr 6 with 2006 views | Whos_blue |
| Foreign players on 07:17 - Apr 6 by itfcjoe |
It’s not a weird obsession it’s just an area where we were best prepared for the recruitment from - Mick Mills was talking post game about how he speaks regularly to Brian Talbot (head of recruitment at Fulham) and how they are trying to get into the South American market now - but they are over 18 months behind Brighton and trying to close that gap.
We will have been years behind everyone else, let alone Fulham who are years behind Brighton. This year will have helped us close the gap but it’s not something that can be done in one window. Most of these deals are worked on across windows to finally get their man as we can see even from us going back in for the same players time and time again [Hirst, Taylor, Philogene, Scarlett, Hutchinson, Delap]. |
I thought Mick spoke very well on this subject.
There was no need for an international scouting network in L1 and arguably the Championship too.
Without everything else going on throughout the Championship season (remember promotion wasn't secured until the very end of the season. We could have just as easily dropped into the playoffs and missed out), I doubt an international scouting network was on the top of the list. We need to mindful of rewriting history after the fact.
We're all hurting and some of us will want to play the blame game, the simple fact is that we have just come up short this season as have two other teams too. I can't say I've enjoyed the prem that much this time around but I remain proud of what we've achieved since Gamechanger and KM came on board.
None of us can predict with certainty the ins and outs over the summer, but we stick together and back the club. |  |
| Distortion becomes somehow pure in its wildness. |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Foreign players on 09:43 - Apr 6 with 1905 views | Axeldalai_lama |
| Foreign players on 09:10 - Apr 6 by Whos_blue |
I thought Mick spoke very well on this subject.
There was no need for an international scouting network in L1 and arguably the Championship too.
Without everything else going on throughout the Championship season (remember promotion wasn't secured until the very end of the season. We could have just as easily dropped into the playoffs and missed out), I doubt an international scouting network was on the top of the list. We need to mindful of rewriting history after the fact.
We're all hurting and some of us will want to play the blame game, the simple fact is that we have just come up short this season as have two other teams too. I can't say I've enjoyed the prem that much this time around but I remain proud of what we've achieved since Gamechanger and KM came on board.
None of us can predict with certainty the ins and outs over the summer, but we stick together and back the club. |
Spot on with the blame thing. I think we are all hurting a little and all a bit shocked at just how big a step up it has been. Frustration and not enjoying being beaten more often than not are obviously fair and normal reactions.
But the big thing that gets more pragmatic fans annoyed is the blame game. As if there was a way we could and should have obviously done it and we dropped the ball, football manager style.
'McKenna should have somehow flicked a switch and tactically beaten them', or we magically should have just gone and bought from far flung places, or competed with bigger clubs for 'better' players a lot of whom are now having seasons where they've played in Europe.
We've done okay, the premier league was a step too far, we gave it a good go, some signings worked better than others, there was no catastrophic overall failing. We go again. |  | | |
| Foreign players on 11:11 - Apr 6 with 1748 views | stonojnr |
Greaves was excellent for the first quarter of the season till he got injured, and has either been carrying a niggle since or lost confidence, not that having a new defensive line up every game helps settle you.
equally its back to the same deal about keepers, if the opposition end up spending alot of their ball possession in your last 3rd of the pitch, you will concede goals, whoever the keeper is, whoever the defenders are.
the best way to stop the other side scoring, is make sure the ball stays down the other end of the pitch.
and this has been our issue, the midfield/attack holding the ball. How many times did Palmer punt the ball down the pitch towards Delap, who doesnt win the header, but even when he does who picks up the 2nd ball, that would be the opposition who then stroll towards our goal and create another chance.
whether signing more foreign players would help? no idea, name a bunch who would fit in the team/squad ? for sensible amounts of money such that we dont get relegated and be left with crippling contracts on players we cant afford anymore, which I believe we have successfully managed to avoid this time. | | | |
| Foreign players on 11:19 - Apr 6 with 1725 views | Axeldalai_lama |
| Foreign players on 11:11 - Apr 6 by stonojnr |
Greaves was excellent for the first quarter of the season till he got injured, and has either been carrying a niggle since or lost confidence, not that having a new defensive line up every game helps settle you.
equally its back to the same deal about keepers, if the opposition end up spending alot of their ball possession in your last 3rd of the pitch, you will concede goals, whoever the keeper is, whoever the defenders are.
the best way to stop the other side scoring, is make sure the ball stays down the other end of the pitch.
and this has been our issue, the midfield/attack holding the ball. How many times did Palmer punt the ball down the pitch towards Delap, who doesnt win the header, but even when he does who picks up the 2nd ball, that would be the opposition who then stroll towards our goal and create another chance.
whether signing more foreign players would help? no idea, name a bunch who would fit in the team/squad ? for sensible amounts of money such that we dont get relegated and be left with crippling contracts on players we cant afford anymore, which I believe we have successfully managed to avoid this time. |
Agree with your last paragraph about who could have come in. 'Thats not our job' is the usual response from those certain there was an easy and obvious load of much better players we could have brought in for cheaper. | | | |
| Foreign players on 11:29 - Apr 6 with 1698 views | brazil1982 |
Widening the net will definitely help. At what point do we become an overseas-dominated squad - like the majority of PL clubs ? Wolves, Fulham, Chelsea often field a starting 11 of overseas players. Academies become trading businesses. |  | | |
| Foreign players on 12:15 - Apr 6 with 1604 views | Churchman |
| Foreign players on 09:10 - Apr 6 by Whos_blue |
I thought Mick spoke very well on this subject.
There was no need for an international scouting network in L1 and arguably the Championship too.
Without everything else going on throughout the Championship season (remember promotion wasn't secured until the very end of the season. We could have just as easily dropped into the playoffs and missed out), I doubt an international scouting network was on the top of the list. We need to mindful of rewriting history after the fact.
We're all hurting and some of us will want to play the blame game, the simple fact is that we have just come up short this season as have two other teams too. I can't say I've enjoyed the prem that much this time around but I remain proud of what we've achieved since Gamechanger and KM came on board.
None of us can predict with certainty the ins and outs over the summer, but we stick together and back the club. |
You and certain others really need to pack in this sane posting.
This is a time for toy chucking, blame, deployment of hindsight, demanding Gomes, Haaland, Bruno, Tonali, that monster 25 centre half warring with Delap, Onana (best performance from a keeper at PR this season), an international scouting network, domestic scouting network, solar system scouting network right here, right now.
While we are at it why hasn’t Portman Stand been replaced and the toilets at NS end of West Stand where a naked flame would have seen them go up like Krakatoa sorted? God the stench.
What has Ashton been doing? Wafting around in a hard hat waffling on about 100+ measly projects and cobbling together a training ground plan when he should have been sorting out that moon on a stick.
He’s got to go along with McKenna, coaching staff, medical staff, Werhun, Board, pitch side presenter, Bluey and the club cat.
Bring back Evans! Now there was a man who knew how to get things done.
Now I’ve had a cup of tea, I agree 100%. It’s all about perspective. I have found the Premier League interesting but I’ve not enjoyed it. Also shocking in how much more difficult it is than our last time in it 25 years ago. Close up everything about it looks a lot tougher than it does on tv.
Despite my disapproval of most thing Premier League, I want us to be in it. It’s the top of the pyramid. Even if we cannot challenge the top clubs, we can do what Forest, Brighton and tinpots Bournmuff and Brentford are doing, if the desire is still there from the owners and those running the club. |  | | |
| Foreign players on 12:21 - Apr 6 with 1570 views | pointofblue |
Defence isn't the issue. It is, and has always been under McKenna, central midfield. Too easy to play through from League One upwards and why we didn't stroll to the title in 2022/23 - we were caught on on heals too often. It's barely ever offered any support to the back line and yesterday was simply the most obvious example. | |
| |
| Foreign players on 12:53 - Apr 6 with 1492 views | LankHenners |
Think the question about exploring foreign markets has been asked at every fans forum since the ownership group took over and the answer’s always the same - it’s something the club want to be active in but it takes a lot of work and time to set up. I know people are bored of hearing where we’ve come from but before Gamechanger arrived our scouting network was incredibly thin and underdeveloped like every aspect of the club under Evans.
That sort of infrastructure can’t be built overnight but hopefully we’ve been plugging away and can make use of it in the summer. |  |
| |
| Foreign players on 15:30 - Apr 6 with 1264 views | ITFCSG |
| Foreign players on 12:53 - Apr 6 by LankHenners |
Think the question about exploring foreign markets has been asked at every fans forum since the ownership group took over and the answer’s always the same - it’s something the club want to be active in but it takes a lot of work and time to set up. I know people are bored of hearing where we’ve come from but before Gamechanger arrived our scouting network was incredibly thin and underdeveloped like every aspect of the club under Evans.
That sort of infrastructure can’t be built overnight but hopefully we’ve been plugging away and can make use of it in the summer. |
Yes, our international network is incredibly weak or even non-existent and I hope MA starts giving priority to this area now. Even many Championship clubs with no recent PL history like Blackburn, PNE, Boro, Coventry etc have better overseas recruitment than us. This season (and looking at the squads of other PL clubs) has shown that it’s not possible quality and value-wise to survive in the PL with homegrown, domestic players. | | | |
| Foreign players on 15:37 - Apr 6 with 1240 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Foreign players on 07:17 - Apr 6 by itfcjoe |
It’s not a weird obsession it’s just an area where we were best prepared for the recruitment from - Mick Mills was talking post game about how he speaks regularly to Brian Talbot (head of recruitment at Fulham) and how they are trying to get into the South American market now - but they are over 18 months behind Brighton and trying to close that gap.
We will have been years behind everyone else, let alone Fulham who are years behind Brighton. This year will have helped us close the gap but it’s not something that can be done in one window. Most of these deals are worked on across windows to finally get their man as we can see even from us going back in for the same players time and time again [Hirst, Taylor, Philogene, Scarlett, Hutchinson, Delap]. |
Ashton constantly talks about the model though, even in terms of coaches it’s always young British managers.
How did Forest who has 22 years away go into international markets so quickly? Was it due to their ownership? |  | | |
| Foreign players on 15:43 - Apr 6 with 1203 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Foreign players on 15:37 - Apr 6 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
Ashton constantly talks about the model though, even in terms of coaches it’s always young British managers.
How did Forest who has 22 years away go into international markets so quickly? Was it due to their ownership? |
Most clubs have plenty of foreign players even in the Championship.
We have internationals from Egypt, Australia, Iraq, Indonesia, Kosovo, Paraguay (loan), Sweden (loan), Nigeria and DR Congo.
I am sure we could increase the reach of our international network but we looked at a Greek international and bid for him last summer too.
I can recall a time where there was a limit on foreign players! |  |
| |
| Foreign players on 16:16 - Apr 6 with 1137 views | Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
| Foreign players on 15:43 - Apr 6 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Most clubs have plenty of foreign players even in the Championship.
We have internationals from Egypt, Australia, Iraq, Indonesia, Kosovo, Paraguay (loan), Sweden (loan), Nigeria and DR Congo.
I am sure we could increase the reach of our international network but we looked at a Greek international and bid for him last summer too.
I can recall a time where there was a limit on foreign players! |
This is not very relevant to the thread for obvious reasons. Basically all purchased from British clubs and many even born in the UK.
It was about finding talent in top international leagues once we made the PL. | | | |
| Foreign players on 16:30 - Apr 6 with 1080 views | ITFCSG |
| Foreign players on 16:16 - Apr 6 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
This is not very relevant to the thread for obvious reasons. Basically all purchased from British clubs and many even born in the UK.
It was about finding talent in top international leagues once we made the PL. |
Precisely. What we need is identifying and recruiting a foreign player directly from a foreign club in Europe, S America or Asia.
Like how Brighton signed Enciso from Libertad. Or Mitoma from Kawasake Frontale. Most PL (and even some Championship) clubs are able to do this.
Much better value this way.
Once they are brought up or played in England the price will go up exponentially.
If Muric were to play in any other League in this world there is no way he'd be worth £8 million.
EXAMPLE:
Ao Tanaka was a stand-out player for our "partner club" Fortuna during pre-season, £3 million to Leeds, it beggars belief why we didn't look at him, for a position we really need strengthening, even signing him as a squad player would be very useful now. | | | |
| Foreign players on 16:45 - Apr 6 with 1025 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Foreign players on 16:16 - Apr 6 by Joey_Joe_Joe_Junior |
This is not very relevant to the thread for obvious reasons. Basically all purchased from British clubs and many even born in the UK.
It was about finding talent in top international leagues once we made the PL. |
We do seem to do this less than we did in the past. We have brought Cajuste in from Napoli and looked at Ioanidis. Godfrey came from abroad but was clearly a player with history in English football.
There are Championship clubs who sign plenty from abroad but we have moved away from that model and I guess it takes time to return to it. We have a history of bringing in players from Holland, brought in the first USSR player (which benefitted UK tennis for a bit) and have brought in South Americans in the past. I think it is as much a hangover from Evans' cost-cutting as anything. | |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
