| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours 13:23 - Jun 4 with 6568 views | ElderGrizzly |
Calling for the burqa to be banned in her first ever comment at PMQs claiming it's an issue of 'public safety' [Post edited 4 Jun 13:25]
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:40 - Jun 4 with 821 views | Jon_456 |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:27 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
I've already given you a list of European countries where it is banned, including a couple where the ban has been challenged and upheld in the ECHR. Is "public safety" not a good enough reason for you? Without pouring over the court rulings I dont know the ins and outs of the arguments that were put forward, and to be honest I don't have the time!
The thread was started as "oh look Reform are saying fascist things again". They haven't said anything fascist but merely quoted the same reasons on which the burka has been banned in other countries. |
I’m all for the ban but that would be for all face coverings. Why is the Burka a security risk but young males wearing balaclavas isn’t? |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:41 - Jun 4 with 810 views | blueasfook |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:32 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
Yeah, I replied to that saying why the burkha and not balaclavas? That was ages ago!
I also then asked for possible reasons why someone would be pro a ban on Burkhas?
At no point have I been rude or argumentative but for some reason you're playing the victim
I'm not asking for the ECHR's views. I'm asking for yours or anyone else's who might support a ban. I promise not to use the word fascist (I don't think I ever have on here to be fair), honest! |
I don't have either pro or anti views to be honest. But I am happy with the public safety reason for it to be banned and don't see it as islamophobic. You will doubtless come back with "why not balaclavas or other face coverings?" I expect? |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:42 - Jun 4 with 795 views | blueasfook |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:40 - Jun 4 by Jon_456 |
I’m all for the ban but that would be for all face coverings. Why is the Burka a security risk but young males wearing balaclavas isn’t? |
Well I am all for banning balaclavas too for that reason. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:46 - Jun 4 with 789 views | NedPlimpton |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:41 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
I don't have either pro or anti views to be honest. But I am happy with the public safety reason for it to be banned and don't see it as islamophobic. You will doubtless come back with "why not balaclavas or other face coverings?" I expect? |
You know it!
That's what I don't get and why I feel like singling out the Burka has a whiff of Islamophobia. I think that's fair
It was this particular Reform MPs first question at PMQs and it's about the Burka. I could be wrong but I can't imagine it's the top priority for her constituency. So to me it feels more like a culture war issue rather than anything of substance |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:48 - Jun 4 with 783 views | Jon_456 |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:42 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
Well I am all for banning balaclavas too for that reason. |
That’s the reason it comes across as Islamphobic.
If it’s a safety issue then why isn’t the MP calling for a ban on all face coverings? | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:52 - Jun 4 with 762 views | blueasfook |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:46 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
You know it!
That's what I don't get and why I feel like singling out the Burka has a whiff of Islamophobia. I think that's fair
It was this particular Reform MPs first question at PMQs and it's about the Burka. I could be wrong but I can't imagine it's the top priority for her constituency. So to me it feels more like a culture war issue rather than anything of substance |
I dare say there are many people whose reasons are Islamaphoic for wanting it banned. But my argument is that there are other more valid reasons. If it could be proven it was merely an act of Islamaphobia then I don't think the bans by other countries would have held up to ECHR scrutiny. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:02 - Jun 4 with 725 views | J2BLUE |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 14:53 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
What are the security concerns? Why the Burkha and not Balaclavas? [Post edited 4 Jun 14:53]
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How many people have you seen in person wearing a balaclava? |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:04 - Jun 4 with 713 views | NedPlimpton |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:02 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
How many people have you seen in person wearing a balaclava? |
Quite a lot. Probably more than a burka to be honest
I live in York and whilst it's bloomin' lovely, there's definitely a trend for younger people to have their faces covered more and more
Not entirely sure what point you're trying to make? | | | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:06 - Jun 4 with 702 views | Jon_456 |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:04 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
Quite a lot. Probably more than a burka to be honest
I live in York and whilst it's bloomin' lovely, there's definitely a trend for younger people to have their faces covered more and more
Not entirely sure what point you're trying to make? |
Same where I live in East Suffolk, certainly more teenagers on bikes with balaclavas than Muslim women in our area. | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:07 - Jun 4 with 701 views | blueasfook |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:04 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
Quite a lot. Probably more than a burka to be honest
I live in York and whilst it's bloomin' lovely, there's definitely a trend for younger people to have their faces covered more and more
Not entirely sure what point you're trying to make? |
I was in York a few months ago, and I am pretty sure I didnt see a single person wearing a balaclava. and it was winter! | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:08 - Jun 4 with 694 views | J2BLUE |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:04 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
Quite a lot. Probably more than a burka to be honest
I live in York and whilst it's bloomin' lovely, there's definitely a trend for younger people to have their faces covered more and more
Not entirely sure what point you're trying to make? |
I was just curious.
Only known one person to own a balaclava and they worked on boats at Felixstowe docks in the winter. Can't remember ever seeing anyone wearing one in person either. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:08 - Jun 4 with 696 views | leitrimblue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:52 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
I dare say there are many people whose reasons are Islamaphoic for wanting it banned. But my argument is that there are other more valid reasons. If it could be proven it was merely an act of Islamaphobia then I don't think the bans by other countries would have held up to ECHR scrutiny. |
So what about the MP in question then Blueas?
You think she doesn't have a Islamophobic bone in her body, just genuine health and safety concerns?  |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:10 - Jun 4 with 682 views | giant_stow |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:08 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
I was just curious.
Only known one person to own a balaclava and they worked on boats at Felixstowe docks in the winter. Can't remember ever seeing anyone wearing one in person either. |
Its definitely a thing with some younguns to cover up their faces, although from what I see, more usually with a snood thingy pulled up high from the Neck |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:11 - Jun 4 with 673 views | NedPlimpton |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:08 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
I was just curious.
Only known one person to own a balaclava and they worked on boats at Felixstowe docks in the winter. Can't remember ever seeing anyone wearing one in person either. |
Fair enough
I can totally understand a nervousness around groups of younger people with their faces covered and assuming they're up to no good. I can't understand a nervousness towards burkas
Would love to know how many crimes have been committed by Burka wearers. Just to have some stats to back up the security concerns [Post edited 4 Jun 16:49]
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:11 - Jun 4 with 671 views | J2BLUE |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:10 - Jun 4 by giant_stow |
Its definitely a thing with some younguns to cover up their faces, although from what I see, more usually with a snood thingy pulled up high from the Neck |
In that case a ban on all face coverings is a different argument. That's three people now who have said it's a problem with younger people covering their faces. That is concerning. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:16 - Jun 4 with 641 views | Swansea_Blue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:13 - Jun 4 by NedPlimpton |
Not sure where i've labelled anyone a fascist
Exactly how would you like someone to engage in a conversation? |
You clearly said “ but it at least makes some sense from a fascist recognition POV”.  |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:17 - Jun 4 with 635 views | bluelagos |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:02 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
How many people have you seen in person wearing a balaclava? |
I wear one every time I ride a motorbike in the cold. Banning them would be both absurd and unenforceable. |  |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:19 - Jun 4 with 619 views | NedPlimpton |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:16 - Jun 4 by Swansea_Blue |
You clearly said “ but it at least makes some sense from a fascist recognition POV”. |
Can't go 2mins without being labelled a fascist nowadays! | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:19 - Jun 4 with 614 views | J2BLUE |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:17 - Jun 4 by bluelagos |
I wear one every time I ride a motorbike in the cold. Banning them would be both absurd and unenforceable. |
Bit different though as I assume you are also wearing a helmet. | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:20 - Jun 4 with 614 views | StokieBlue |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 15:19 - Jun 4 by blueasfook |
Well the whole thread is geared toward labelling bans on the burka as Islamophobic. What are the "true colours" the OP speaks of exactly when other countries have banned the item on the exact same premise of "public safety". |
The French law includes all face coverings, even helmets so it's not really the same.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_ban_on_face_covering
However, it seems the Reform MP didn't say face coverings, she said (from the Guardian and BBC):
"Given the prime minister’s desire to strengthen strategic alignment with our European neighbours, will he in the interests of public safety follow the lead of France, Denmark, Belgium and others and ban the burqa?"
Not hard to see why some might consider that Islamophobic.
SB |  | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:20 - Jun 4 with 606 views | NedPlimpton |
Reform really are living in the past if they're worried about something that happened in 2016! | | | |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:20 - Jun 4 with 606 views | bluelagos |
I'd be willing to wager that Burka wearing women in the UK are statistically less likely to commit crimes than the general population.
Unless I've missed a crime wave from wronguns dressing up in Burkas to evade detection? | |
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| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:26 - Jun 4 with 578 views | bluelagos |
| New Reform MP not wasting any time to show her true colours on 16:19 - Jun 4 by J2BLUE |
Bit different though as I assume you are also wearing a helmet. |
But if people are arguing against wearing a burka (for security reasons - namely that someone could mask their identity) - then how is that any difference from all face coverings and say hoodies or baseball caps?
It just doesn't stack up as a position to ban burkas but not worry about other clothing that also hides people's faces.
Seems clear that those proposing it are far more interested in targeting Muslim women rather than having a genuine concern re public safety. If the police were arguing for a ban - on the back of increased crimes by burka clad criminals - I could see the argument. But as far as I know- they're not! | |
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