| Morsy benched 18:40 - Jan 20 with 9256 views | Zx1988 |
PLEASE let's not applaud him on to the pitch if/when he gets subbed on. |  |
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| Morsy benched on 13:56 - Jan 22 with 863 views | Libero |
| Morsy benched on 13:36 - Jan 22 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
"Signing for a club which might then later change its sponsorship/shirt logos isn’t a player’s choice."
No, but choosing to wear it is. He could have chose not to. |
Indeed, it’s common practise for players with Muslim beliefs to have altered shirts that don’t involve alcohol/betting sponsorship, etc.
Morsy is clearly flexible with his beliefs, as many Muslims I know are - it was a personal choice not to extend that flexibility to the LGBTQ community, as is his prerogative.
It’s just that, that choice is discriminatory against LGBTQ people and as such, homophobic. |  | | |
| Morsy benched on 13:59 - Jan 22 with 849 views | bartyg |
| Morsy benched on 13:41 - Jan 22 by Ryorry |
What a bizarre take - how on earth can a player play for the club and not wear the same shirt as other team members??! |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo
It's actually quite common!
I really thought you were a reasonable poster but you've disappointed me here, simply downvoting my posts rather than responding. [Post edited 22 Jan 13:59]
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| Morsy benched on 14:03 - Jan 22 with 835 views | bartyg |
| Morsy benched on 13:30 - Jan 22 by redrickstuhaart |
Thats the tricky bit though isnt it?
He can have all the personal discriminatory views he likes, if he doesn;t act on them.
And whilst he was representing the club publically, he wasnt employed to wave a flag for LGBTQ causes. Big difference between actively coming out with some awful statement and declining to promote something having been put in an awkward position by a league wide campaign.
I dont think many people really noticed outside of this board, so Im not sure it was a stain. |
Of course he wasn't employed for that, but there are always clauses in employment contracts relating to representing the company, and surely especially with regard to such public facing employees.
Disagree on your last point also, there were definitely articles on this on mainstream news sites, and more on specifically LGBTQ+ news sites. | | | |
| Morsy benched on 14:18 - Jan 22 with 796 views | DanTheMan |
| Morsy benched on 13:30 - Jan 22 by redrickstuhaart |
Thats the tricky bit though isnt it?
He can have all the personal discriminatory views he likes, if he doesn;t act on them.
And whilst he was representing the club publically, he wasnt employed to wave a flag for LGBTQ causes. Big difference between actively coming out with some awful statement and declining to promote something having been put in an awkward position by a league wide campaign.
I dont think many people really noticed outside of this board, so Im not sure it was a stain. |
For what it's worth, on your last point, people definitely noticed. People over on /r/championship were bringing it up when he signed for Bristol so it wasn't just us.
Think J2 is right though, this is just one issue where people are going to agree or aren't, probably not worth talking too much about at this point.
Although I do think some people are putting their heads in the sand a bit... |  |
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| Morsy benched on 15:40 - Jan 22 with 695 views | Ryorry |
| Morsy benched on 13:59 - Jan 22 by bartyg |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo
It's actually quite common!
I really thought you were a reasonable poster but you've disappointed me here, simply downvoting my posts rather than responding. [Post edited 22 Jan 13:59]
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I didn’t actually know that re the shirt choices available.
I downvoted you twice because you supported a derogatory judgement of someone without any actual evidence that they were what they were accused of being.
Sorry to disappoint you, but I’ll support till I die anyone’s right to not be judged guilty of something unless there is actual hard evidence of it. Not supposition, inference, trying to read the person’s mind, guessing what their general actions or lack of them might mean.
Probably stems from my first two hours in secondary school age 10, when I was accused by a couple of other girls of something I hadn’t done (it was a staged set-up by them), judged ‘guilty’, and then shunned by the rest of the class for years. Possibly because I had black frizzy hair, glasses, and a funny name, ie different to all of them. It so badly damaged my confidence that it still affects me to this day; but on the plus side it shaped my entire life into being a 100% strong, passionate stand up fighter for justice against injustice, and spent my career working as a probation officer and social worker. |  |
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| Morsy benched on 20:04 - Jan 22 with 593 views | Benters |
| Morsy benched on 13:07 - Jan 22 by bartyg |
He didn't keep schtum, it's a political statement in itself. There is no neutral option in this binary.
I really don't understand why people are so aggressively defending him. I can make the reasonable assumptions that he is homophobic whilst still thinking he was an asset to the football club. My personal gripes are that the club didn't handle the situation better- there should have been repercussions for Morsy, and a statement standing by LGBTQ+ town stakeholders. |
It wasn’t a political statement it was his religious views why he wouldn’t wear the armband. |  |
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| Morsy benched on 20:16 - Jan 22 with 606 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Morsy benched on 20:04 - Jan 22 by Benters |
It wasn’t a political statement it was his religious views why he wouldn’t wear the armband. |
political with a small "p". | |
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| Morsy benched on 20:16 - Jan 22 with 571 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Morsy benched on 20:04 - Jan 22 by Benters |
It wasn’t a political statement it was his religious views why he wouldn’t wear the armband. |
There is a fine balance between the political and the religious. For example, Sharia Law is a religious legal system of Islam but an issue that has political implications.
Some of the people using Sam's religious beliefs to excuse his discrimination against the LGBTQ+ community would not be so forgiving if he was an advocate of Sharia Law. |  |
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| Morsy benched on 21:15 - Jan 22 with 555 views | Bigalhunter |
| Morsy benched on 10:11 - Jan 22 by Ryorry |
Signing for a club which might then later change its sponsorship/shirt logos isn’t a player’s choice.
Even if a betting company were the sponsor at the time of signing, if the player wasn’t being offered any other contract with alternative clubs, what are they supposed to do - jack in their career? |
I doubt we were Morsy’s only option, so that doesn’t apply in this instance.
The only way this could ever have been satisfactorily proven one way or the other would have been to have LGBTQ+ as our shirt sponsor for the rest of the season and see if he refused to play… |  |
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| Morsy benched on 21:24 - Jan 22 with 541 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Morsy benched on 13:59 - Jan 22 by bartyg |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/fo
It's actually quite common!
I really thought you were a reasonable poster but you've disappointed me here, simply downvoting my posts rather than responding. [Post edited 22 Jan 13:59]
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There is difference here tho
The FA changed the rules around 2024 to enable players to refuse to wear shirts with betting logos on them. Before this rule a player couldn't refuse. They could refuse to play of course but that opens them up to losing money going against their contract etc. |  |
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| Morsy benched on 21:53 - Jan 22 with 505 views | Libero |
| Morsy benched on 21:24 - Jan 22 by FrimleyBlue |
There is difference here tho
The FA changed the rules around 2024 to enable players to refuse to wear shirts with betting logos on them. Before this rule a player couldn't refuse. They could refuse to play of course but that opens them up to losing money going against their contract etc. |
That’s not true, it’s been happening long before the rule change- see Papis Cisse in 2013 for example. | | | |
| Morsy benched on 22:03 - Jan 22 with 472 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Morsy benched on 21:53 - Jan 22 by Libero |
That’s not true, it’s been happening long before the rule change- see Papis Cisse in 2013 for example. |
Indeed with permission yes. But he was also left out by Newcastle from pre season training camp because of it.
Now tho the player can refuse without the need of clubs approval and with no fear of any issues of doing so. [Post edited 22 Jan 22:04]
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| Morsy benched on 22:17 - Jan 22 with 452 views | Libero |
| Morsy benched on 22:03 - Jan 22 by FrimleyBlue |
Indeed with permission yes. But he was also left out by Newcastle from pre season training camp because of it.
Now tho the player can refuse without the need of clubs approval and with no fear of any issues of doing so. [Post edited 22 Jan 22:04]
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Point is, this isn’t new and those with strong beliefs and the courage of their convictions have done this for some time- Morsy hasn’t objected to wearing a betting sponsor, as is his prerogative. | | | |
| Morsy benched on 22:23 - Jan 22 with 442 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Morsy benched on 22:17 - Jan 22 by Libero |
Point is, this isn’t new and those with strong beliefs and the courage of their convictions have done this for some time- Morsy hasn’t objected to wearing a betting sponsor, as is his prerogative. |
You'd have a point if cisse didnt then appear with it on and caved into the clubs requirments. He clearly felt forced to do so to enable him to play football and earn his wage.
Now there are no consequences and its more of a free choice. | |
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| Morsy benched on 22:38 - Jan 22 with 408 views | Libero |
| Morsy benched on 22:23 - Jan 22 by FrimleyBlue |
You'd have a point if cisse didnt then appear with it on and caved into the clubs requirments. He clearly felt forced to do so to enable him to play football and earn his wage.
Now there are no consequences and its more of a free choice. |
How is any of this relevant? Feels like a dilution of the point-
Cisse made an active choice, he changed his mind for *whatever* reason- we’re talking about Sam Morsy and his choices.
From the moment you mentioned the year the rule changed it seemed like you were conflating things- what am I missing here? How is any of this relevant to the conversation at hand?
Apologies if it’s something obvious, but it’s not clicking- it’s been a long day. [Post edited 22 Jan 22:46]
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| Morsy benched on 23:00 - Jan 22 with 387 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Morsy benched on 22:38 - Jan 22 by Libero |
How is any of this relevant? Feels like a dilution of the point-
Cisse made an active choice, he changed his mind for *whatever* reason- we’re talking about Sam Morsy and his choices.
From the moment you mentioned the year the rule changed it seemed like you were conflating things- what am I missing here? How is any of this relevant to the conversation at hand?
Apologies if it’s something obvious, but it’s not clicking- it’s been a long day. [Post edited 22 Jan 22:46]
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Imo theres a big difference between having a 'choice' and having a free choice.
The cisse situation at the time was a sign that sure you had a choice but that choice came with consequences. Now however you are free to make that choice and know that it wont effect your ability to carry on with your job.
According to reports in cisses case the club reminded him that breaking contract wss throwned upon in Islam.. cisse after these talks then agreed to wear the shirt and was then back in the team.
I too a little while ago felt the same about morsy and the logo thing. But looking at it again altho yes he had a choice imo that was like giving someone a choice of shooting your mum or dad. Its a choice but not a free choice without consequences.
I appreciate that last point is a bit ott. But I hope that puts my point across the right way. | |
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| Morsy benched on 01:16 - Jan 23 with 343 views | Libero |
| Morsy benched on 23:00 - Jan 22 by FrimleyBlue |
Imo theres a big difference between having a 'choice' and having a free choice.
The cisse situation at the time was a sign that sure you had a choice but that choice came with consequences. Now however you are free to make that choice and know that it wont effect your ability to carry on with your job.
According to reports in cisses case the club reminded him that breaking contract wss throwned upon in Islam.. cisse after these talks then agreed to wear the shirt and was then back in the team.
I too a little while ago felt the same about morsy and the logo thing. But looking at it again altho yes he had a choice imo that was like giving someone a choice of shooting your mum or dad. Its a choice but not a free choice without consequences.
I appreciate that last point is a bit ott. But I hope that puts my point across the right way. |
Ah right, I see what you’re trying to get across - I don’t personally agree and I respect your alternative point of view, but I think your comparison of it being like being asked to shoot your parents is *wild* - however it’s gone 1am, so will let that slide.
Cheers for offering clarification! | | | |
| Morsy benched on 05:55 - Jan 23 with 267 views | TownieRob |
Look at the title of the Post thread and where we are at now..
This place is 'wild' at times.
Would be great to stick to football in this section. [Post edited 23 Jan 5:56]
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| Morsy benched on 06:55 - Jan 23 with 243 views | Churchman |
| Morsy benched on 05:55 - Jan 23 by TownieRob |
Look at the title of the Post thread and where we are at now..
This place is 'wild' at times.
Would be great to stick to football in this section. [Post edited 23 Jan 5:56]
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There’s certainly been a lot of ‘mission creep’.
Personally I think the club did ok in how it dealt with Morsy’s stance a couple of years ago. Whatever the rights and wrongs, it’s done. Finished.
I don’t know the bloke or anything about him beyond the player on the pitch. All I know is that he was a good player and an even better captain who was integral in a very successful period for the club. He deserved his applause and it was right the crowd showed their appreciation. I would have done had I been there.
There’s no harm in it, no motivation either way. It is what it is. Bobby Robson’s first game back at PR as a club manager was in 2001 when Newcastle visited. He got a standing ovation from the whole crowd. Rightly so. But it didn’t stop us beating them (1-0 Stewart penalty after Solano batted one off the line at NS end).
The following season he was treated pretty much as just another manager - again rightly so. The same applies to Morsy, should he line up against us again. Beyond that his views are his own and I have no problem with him working in some capacity for this club in the future as long as he’s good at it. I hope he’s bunged in the ‘hall of fame’ sooner rather than later too. [Post edited 23 Jan 6:56]
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