| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration 08:13 - May 21 with 2220 views | StokieBlue |
Even though this isn't the case and net migration has fallen a lot as have the number of small boat crossings, voters across the political spectrum believe that isn't the case [1].
In the specific case of asylum seekers:
"The researchers found that people believe individuals seeking asylum account for 33% of immigration, when in reality it is about 9%."
Going to be very hard for anyone to cut through that narrative by the looks of it, especially when Farage lies about the subject:
"The party’s leader, Nigel Farage, has falsely claimed the drop in net migration was largely the result of British emigration – not the fall in overseas arrivals."
SB
[1]. https://www.theguardian.com/wo |  |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:03 - May 21 with 727 views | Herbivore |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 12:10 - May 21 by lowhouseblue |
i posted on the other immigration thread. this one's a bit repetitious. but the sight of you lecturing others on critical thinking skills was just too good to miss. i know, i know, everyone who disagrees with you is thick. |
Ah, so you did pop on to do your usual of pointlessly having a pop at posters on the opposite end of the political spectrum to you. Excellent, at least we've established that you're a troll then. Trolling and wilful dishonesty, your other stock in trade, do go well together I guess. |  |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:12 - May 21 with 692 views | EddyJ |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:01 - May 21 by Herbivore |
But net migration has come down, that is a fact. Whether it is now at an acceptable level is something different people will hold different views about but it is true that net migration has come down. |
It is a fact. Nobody is denying that. The point is that net migration measured in yearly increments is not the thing people really care about. It is a poor metric.
Its the same with GDP per capita. That can go up, but if people don't "feel" richer, they won't be happy about it. |  | | |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:16 - May 21 with 687 views | Herbivore |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:12 - May 21 by EddyJ |
It is a fact. Nobody is denying that. The point is that net migration measured in yearly increments is not the thing people really care about. It is a poor metric.
Its the same with GDP per capita. That can go up, but if people don't "feel" richer, they won't be happy about it. |
Data doesn't capture feels though and that's not what it's there for. | |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:20 - May 21 with 677 views | EddyJ |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:16 - May 21 by Herbivore |
Data doesn't capture feels though and that's not what it's there for. |
The title of this thread is literally about "perception" of net migration.
The perception of migration is not captured in 1 year increments. But the data is. That creates a disconnect between perception and data. [Post edited 21 May 14:27]
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:26 - May 21 with 659 views | Freddies_Ears |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 09:28 - May 21 by Radlett_blue |
We have become far more cynical as a society. This is actually very unhealthy for society - many people don't trust others, let alone politicians, people perceive violent crime is commonplace (it isn't) and given the clickbait nature of the internet driven media, it only seems likely to get worse. |
But there's a difference between cynical and ignorant. Ignorant is having all the information available to you but not bothering to look. Or, being shown it yet not caring. "Don't confuse me with facts, I've made up my mind" | | | |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:37 - May 21 with 623 views | chicoazul |
Yes indeed, Labour are literally that bad at communicating to what was once their core vote. |  |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:42 - May 21 with 614 views | Herbivore |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:20 - May 21 by EddyJ |
The title of this thread is literally about "perception" of net migration.
The perception of migration is not captured in 1 year increments. But the data is. That creates a disconnect between perception and data. [Post edited 21 May 14:27]
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I think that's a really generous interpretation of why there's a disconnect between the data on immigration and people's feelings about immigration. | |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:48 - May 21 with 600 views | JakeITFC |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:42 - May 21 by Herbivore |
I think that's a really generous interpretation of why there's a disconnect between the data on immigration and people's feelings about immigration. |
If I may, I think net migration is a measure of how many people came here last year but it doesn't tell us anything about how many migrants are here already and have stayed.
I imagine that most people who are anti-immigration are in fact anti-immigrant and therefore any positive net migration is fairly irrelevant to them (in that the horse has already bolted, so to speak).
That's why 'Stop the Boats' was always performative nonsense. |  | | |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:51 - May 21 with 596 views | Herbivore |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:48 - May 21 by JakeITFC |
If I may, I think net migration is a measure of how many people came here last year but it doesn't tell us anything about how many migrants are here already and have stayed.
I imagine that most people who are anti-immigration are in fact anti-immigrant and therefore any positive net migration is fairly irrelevant to them (in that the horse has already bolted, so to speak).
That's why 'Stop the Boats' was always performative nonsense. |
I don't disagree, I think a lot of the "we want lower immigration" folk don't really want lower immigration, they want no immigration and to ship some brown folk out of the country for good measure. A few of them are even bold enough to be up front about that these days but many are not. No serious political party would go down that route though but some unserious ones are promising something close and seem to be doing quite well out of it. | |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 15:30 - May 21 with 562 views | FoghornGleghorn |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 08:21 - May 21 by Herbivore |
Hardly surprising when immigration has dominated media coverage and politics for years now, often based on half-truths or outright lies. When you create a moral panic over an issue it shouldn't come as a surprise when people hold distorted beliefs about an issue. That said, it's worrying that people's beliefs persist even when shown demonstrable evidence that shows those beliefs to be wrong. We see it on here fairly frequently. I would assume many of the people surveyed here simply haven't looked at the data so are going purely off feels, what's really worrying is when people continue to go off their feels when they've been shown evidence to the contrary. That's when a society is truly lost. |
Very well put. What's even worse is that in a lot of cases (as seen on here practically daily) it doesn't even seem to be people's own "feels", but just what they've been told they should "feel". You ask what they're actually seeing that backs up their refusal to believe the same data they believed when it said the problem was growing...nothing. You ask what they've actually seen of these millions of "fighting-age men" coming off "small boats" and disappearing into the fabric of society...nothing. You ask why there's no sign of them in the long queues at the doctors' surgeries that apparently they're directly causing...you get told that it's because when doctors' surgeries are closed for training days, it's not that they're engaged in mandatory training to keep up with the evolution of medicine, it's because those days are actually set aside for the treatment of illegal immigrants. The far right can literally say anything and they'll buy it. | | | |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 18:09 - May 21 with 476 views | DJR |
Interesting profile of Makerfield from Rob Ford of the University of Manchester.
https://swingometer.substack.c
The seat is 97% white and 96% British born, with 97% offering only British forms of national identity.
In addition, Makerfield as a whole is not economically deprived.
The strength of Reform recently suggests an awful lot of influence from the right wing media et al on things like immigration. [Post edited 21 May 18:14]
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 19:18 - May 21 with 438 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 11:35 - May 21 by lowhouseblue |
but funnily enough all this only ever applies to people you disagree with politically. it's a remarkable coincidence.
what i've come to realise in life, helped to some extent by twtd, is that the difference between people on the left and the right is their politics. on average, they don't differ in terms of their intellectual capacity, their empathy, their inherent goodness, or their decency. |
Yeah we saw that with your Democrat / Trump Republicans both as bad as each other angle.
And numerous other examples |  | | |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 19:38 - May 21 with 408 views | lowhouseblue |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 19:18 - May 21 by reusersfreekicks |
Yeah we saw that with your Democrat / Trump Republicans both as bad as each other angle.
And numerous other examples |
i don't think you did, but feel free to make stuff up. or is discussing why the democrats lost unacceptable? |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 19:58 - May 21 with 389 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 19:38 - May 21 by lowhouseblue |
i don't think you did, but feel free to make stuff up. or is discussing why the democrats lost unacceptable? |
This was before the result.
And I am very much not making things up | | | |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:00 - May 21 with 384 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 18:09 - May 21 by DJR |
Interesting profile of Makerfield from Rob Ford of the University of Manchester.
https://swingometer.substack.c
The seat is 97% white and 96% British born, with 97% offering only British forms of national identity.
In addition, Makerfield as a whole is not economically deprived.
The strength of Reform recently suggests an awful lot of influence from the right wing media et al on things like immigration. [Post edited 21 May 18:14]
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Wash your mouth out.
They are all very aware of and impacted by immigration!
Or something like that [Post edited 21 May 20:18]
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:08 - May 21 with 366 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 08:21 - May 21 by Herbivore |
Hardly surprising when immigration has dominated media coverage and politics for years now, often based on half-truths or outright lies. When you create a moral panic over an issue it shouldn't come as a surprise when people hold distorted beliefs about an issue. That said, it's worrying that people's beliefs persist even when shown demonstrable evidence that shows those beliefs to be wrong. We see it on here fairly frequently. I would assume many of the people surveyed here simply haven't looked at the data so are going purely off feels, what's really worrying is when people continue to go off their feels when they've been shown evidence to the contrary. That's when a society is truly lost. |
Quite. And that misplaced belief isn’t changing much. We were in the same boat a year ago when it was data proved net migration was falling and they were predicting the further steep declines announced this week based on the drop of visa applications. As you say, when Reform, Tories and Labour all talk about the need to reduce migration and that message is repeated throughout the press, then it’s hardly surprising the mainstream view is that immigration is growing and causing problems. And we’re not even talking about overt racists here either - it’s being believed, quite reasonably*, by ordinary people.
*”reasonably” if you consider most people aren’t used to independently verifying information they are told for themselves, which is a shame but another issue. |  |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:15 - May 21 with 354 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 14:51 - May 21 by Herbivore |
I don't disagree, I think a lot of the "we want lower immigration" folk don't really want lower immigration, they want no immigration and to ship some brown folk out of the country for good measure. A few of them are even bold enough to be up front about that these days but many are not. No serious political party would go down that route though but some unserious ones are promising something close and seem to be doing quite well out of it. |
Yes, we’re seeing it with Rupert Lowe MP. The first MP we’ve had advocating for remigration* for decades. It’s the stuff of the worst of the NF/BNP that used to be very fringe. For those who are racist, there’s no chance of any accommodations with them that fall short of ‘whites only’. Starmer is going to destroy the Labour Party over this precisely because he seems unaware of that basic truth.
*Remigration is a far-right concept referring to the ethnic cleansing via mass deportation of non-white minority populations, especially immigrants and sometimes including native-born citizens, to their place of racial ancestry. | |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:15 - May 21 with 353 views | lowhouseblue |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 19:58 - May 21 by reusersfreekicks |
This was before the result.
And I am very much not making things up |
no, you very much are. do you hallucinate like ai perhaps. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:26 - May 21 with 322 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:15 - May 21 by lowhouseblue |
no, you very much are. do you hallucinate like ai perhaps. |
I wish I had the oomph to find all your tacit siding with the Trumps and Farages of this world.
But I don't.
However I know what I know.
And I am very much not the only one. | | | |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:30 - May 21 with 304 views | lowhouseblue |
| Interesting study on the public perception of UK net migration on 20:26 - May 21 by reusersfreekicks |
I wish I had the oomph to find all your tacit siding with the Trumps and Farages of this world.
But I don't.
However I know what I know.
And I am very much not the only one. |
you make up what you make up. i have never sided with trump and farage - i am completely opposed to them - but i want to understand why voters have gone to them and rejected far better alternatives. but you'll make up what ever lies you want i guess. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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