| Attack on Berlin Pride 22:25 - Jul 25 with 8480 views | Zx1988 |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/art
My heart goes out to all those affected, and to all those in the LGBTQIA+ community for whom the world perhaps feels a little less safe this evening.
My wife and I were at Norwich Pride this afternoon, and seeing this news sent a chill down my spine. [Post edited 25 Jul 22:30]
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 22:32 - Jul 25 with 3540 views | Cheltenham_Blue |
FFS. These absolute arseholes |  |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 22:33 - Jul 25 with 3529 views | The_Major |
Fat thumb upvoted, apologies. Rectified.
Being a Nodge resident myself, I've wandered through the city when it's been Pride weekend, and it's an absolutely joyous occasion. I can only reiterate what was said above for LGBTQIA+ community wherever they are.
Grim times. |  | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 22:34 - Jul 25 with 3514 views | Zx1988 |
N/A [Post edited 25 Jul 22:34]
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 22:47 - Jul 25 with 3410 views | The_Major |
Sky News reporting at least one fatality and many injuries.
Contemptible scumbags. | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:39 - Jul 26 with 2893 views | Benters |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 22:47 - Jul 25 by The_Major |
Sky News reporting at least one fatality and many injuries.
Contemptible scumbags. |
There has been another Sky news update. |  |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:50 - Jul 26 with 2899 views | Perublue |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:39 - Jul 26 by Benters |
There has been another Sky news update. |
Still early but reports saying there was more than one jumped out of the van and people stabbed.
These things have a habit of being sketchy early on but clearly looking targeted rather than accidental |  |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:55 - Jul 26 with 2846 views | Benters |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:50 - Jul 26 by Perublue |
Still early but reports saying there was more than one jumped out of the van and people stabbed.
These things have a habit of being sketchy early on but clearly looking targeted rather than accidental |
I very much doubt it was a accident. | |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:56 - Jul 26 with 2846 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
It just baffles me that someone can be so worked up about someone else's sexuality that they'd want to kill them. In what way does it remotely affect you? And even if it did, murder is the answer?
Some people are actually monsters. |  |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:59 - Jul 26 with 2811 views | Benters |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 07:56 - Jul 26 by The_Flashing_Smile |
It just baffles me that someone can be so worked up about someone else's sexuality that they'd want to kill them. In what way does it remotely affect you? And even if it did, murder is the answer?
Some people are actually monsters. |
Religion buh.
End of. | |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:01 - Jul 26 with 2530 views | GlasgowBlue |
Terrible news. We were in Glasgow last Saturday evening and it was ramped with people celebrating Pride. Could happen anywhere.
Once again we see people's perverse interpretation of a religion manifest in an attack on our liberal society.
Thoughts are with the victims and the wider LGBTQ community. [Post edited 26 Jul 13:02]
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:42 - Jul 26 with 2464 views | RadioOrwell |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:01 - Jul 26 by GlasgowBlue |
Terrible news. We were in Glasgow last Saturday evening and it was ramped with people celebrating Pride. Could happen anywhere.
Once again we see people's perverse interpretation of a religion manifest in an attack on our liberal society.
Thoughts are with the victims and the wider LGBTQ community. [Post edited 26 Jul 13:02]
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It doesn't require a perverse interpretation of Islam to do this. |  | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:53 - Jul 26 with 2441 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:42 - Jul 26 by RadioOrwell |
It doesn't require a perverse interpretation of Islam to do this. |
Yeah it does. It goes against their teachings. Militant islamism is as perverse as the militant arm of any religion.
(Edit - not that Iām a fan of any religion, as they all make it to easy for people to do bad things in the name of religion. Yet strictly speaking they all preach peace and to hurt someone else is a sin. Although itās a bit more complicated than that and there are conflicting messages. LGBTQ+ is a particular area where the messages are conflicting). [Post edited 26 Jul 13:58]
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:08 - Jul 26 with 2373 views | The_Major |
I couldn't give a flying one what this scumbags religion, political persuasion, whatever is.
Catch him, lock him up. It's not complicated. | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:42 - Jul 26 with 2303 views | RadioOrwell |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:53 - Jul 26 by Swansea_Blue |
Yeah it does. It goes against their teachings. Militant islamism is as perverse as the militant arm of any religion.
(Edit - not that Iām a fan of any religion, as they all make it to easy for people to do bad things in the name of religion. Yet strictly speaking they all preach peace and to hurt someone else is a sin. Although itās a bit more complicated than that and there are conflicting messages. LGBTQ+ is a particular area where the messages are conflicting). [Post edited 26 Jul 13:58]
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Traditional Islamic law views same-sex sexual acts as a major sin, and mainstream jurisprudence considers the practice forbidden.
From the Islamic standpoint, homosexuality is a forbidden action; a major sin
and anyone who partakes in it is considered a disobedient servant to Allah
that will acquire His displeasure and disapproval. This is clearly stated in the
three main sources of the Shariah: The Quran, the Sunnah, and the
consensus of all scholars, which extends from the time of the Prophet till
today.
While homosexuality has gained greater social acceptance in many Western societies, it remains
highly stigmatized and, in most cases, forbidden in mainstream Islam. Theologically-based
homophobia has given rise to negative social representations of homosexuality in Muslim
communities around the world. Lesbian, gay and bisexual (LGB) Muslims themselves are acutely
aware of the stigma of homosexuality, and the prejudice and, in some cases, harsh punishment that
they may face if they disclose their sexual identity. | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:50 - Jul 26 with 2276 views | Kievthegreat |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:53 - Jul 26 by Swansea_Blue |
Yeah it does. It goes against their teachings. Militant islamism is as perverse as the militant arm of any religion.
(Edit - not that Iām a fan of any religion, as they all make it to easy for people to do bad things in the name of religion. Yet strictly speaking they all preach peace and to hurt someone else is a sin. Although itās a bit more complicated than that and there are conflicting messages. LGBTQ+ is a particular area where the messages are conflicting). [Post edited 26 Jul 13:58]
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I think other faiths in the mainstream walk away from scripture more than Islam.
"āIf a man also lie with mankind as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death: their blood shall be upon them."
That is extremely black and white. However, most Christians won't be advocating for executing gay men, despite god clearly demanding it and the determination that the gay men would deserve it.
The sooner that scripture becomes a historical curiosity and stops being treated as a moral framework, the better. |  | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:52 - Jul 26 with 2275 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:42 - Jul 26 by RadioOrwell |
Traditional Islamic law views same-sex sexual acts as a major sin, and mainstream jurisprudence considers the practice forbidden.
From the Islamic standpoint, homosexuality is a forbidden action; a major sin
and anyone who partakes in it is considered a disobedient servant to Allah
that will acquire His displeasure and disapproval. This is clearly stated in the
three main sources of the Shariah: The Quran, the Sunnah, and the
consensus of all scholars, which extends from the time of the Prophet till
today.
While homosexuality has gained greater social acceptance in many Western societies, it remains
highly stigmatized and, in most cases, forbidden in mainstream Islam. Theologically-based
homophobia has given rise to negative social representations of homosexuality in Muslim
communities around the world. Lesbian, gay and bisexual (LGB) Muslims themselves are acutely
aware of the stigma of homosexuality, and the prejudice and, in some cases, harsh punishment that
they may face if they disclose their sexual identity. |
Thatās why I mentioned the conflicting messages. Islam (as traditional with most religions) considers same sex relationships a sin, but what it doesnāt do is give people the right to attack LGBTQ+ people. Thatās where the perversion comes in when people take matters into their own hand and punish the so called sinners believing theyāre delivering Godās will. Thatās my reading of it anyway, not that Iām any sort of theological scholar! | |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:53 - Jul 26 with 2271 views | RadioOrwell |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 13:53 - Jul 26 by Swansea_Blue |
Yeah it does. It goes against their teachings. Militant islamism is as perverse as the militant arm of any religion.
(Edit - not that Iām a fan of any religion, as they all make it to easy for people to do bad things in the name of religion. Yet strictly speaking they all preach peace and to hurt someone else is a sin. Although itās a bit more complicated than that and there are conflicting messages. LGBTQ+ is a particular area where the messages are conflicting). [Post edited 26 Jul 13:58]
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https://islamqa.info/en/answer
https://myislam.org/homosexual | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 15:09 - Jul 26 with 2207 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 14:52 - Jul 26 by Swansea_Blue |
Thatās why I mentioned the conflicting messages. Islam (as traditional with most religions) considers same sex relationships a sin, but what it doesnāt do is give people the right to attack LGBTQ+ people. Thatās where the perversion comes in when people take matters into their own hand and punish the so called sinners believing theyāre delivering Godās will. Thatās my reading of it anyway, not that Iām any sort of theological scholar! |
But worth nothing that many Islamic countries have prison, or even death penalties for being gay. Once part of state law then it becomes normalised as a view within society.
On a wider point itās tragic the number of vehicle based attacks that have happened in Germany over the last few years. A liberal tolerant society that now has anti vehicle barriers for many events (albeit must assume there was none in this instance). Suggestions the suspect was known to authorities, I assume they are simply unable to cope with the numbers in n watch lists. | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 16:14 - Jul 26 with 2090 views | J2BLUE |
Such a senseless act. Hopefully those injured recover quickly and the suspect is arrested before doing any further damage. |  | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 16:50 - Jul 26 with 1996 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 15:09 - Jul 26 by SuperKieranMcKenna |
But worth nothing that many Islamic countries have prison, or even death penalties for being gay. Once part of state law then it becomes normalised as a view within society.
On a wider point itās tragic the number of vehicle based attacks that have happened in Germany over the last few years. A liberal tolerant society that now has anti vehicle barriers for many events (albeit must assume there was none in this instance). Suggestions the suspect was known to authorities, I assume they are simply unable to cope with the numbers in n watch lists. |
Thereās a clear distinction between the authorities and its people. The authorities may well be able to lock someone up or kill them, but that doesnāt mean Joe Public can. We have laws against all sorts of behaviours, but itās for the courts to judge and for judges to pass sentence. We are not allowed to carry out our own sentence by being vigilantes and killing people we think have sinned.
Iām not at all disagreeing that Islam prohibits homosexuality or that extreme sentences are dealt out by various Islamic countries. Iām strongly against both points. My original point was that it is a perversion of their faith for people to take matters into their own hands and kill gay people. Iām not aware of anywhere where thatās preached. The Koran is pretty clear about being a good neighbour and not causing physical or mental harm. | |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 17:48 - Jul 26 with 1901 views | RadioOrwell |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 16:50 - Jul 26 by Swansea_Blue |
Thereās a clear distinction between the authorities and its people. The authorities may well be able to lock someone up or kill them, but that doesnāt mean Joe Public can. We have laws against all sorts of behaviours, but itās for the courts to judge and for judges to pass sentence. We are not allowed to carry out our own sentence by being vigilantes and killing people we think have sinned.
Iām not at all disagreeing that Islam prohibits homosexuality or that extreme sentences are dealt out by various Islamic countries. Iām strongly against both points. My original point was that it is a perversion of their faith for people to take matters into their own hands and kill gay people. Iām not aware of anywhere where thatās preached. The Koran is pretty clear about being a good neighbour and not causing physical or mental harm. |
There isn't a clear distinction between the authorities and its people.
Sunni Islam (which makes up 85ā90% of Muslims) has no institutionalized clergy or rigid hierarchy. Any qualified Muslim can lead a prayer or study to become a scholar. Authority rests with collective scholarly consensus.
Shia Islam features a more defined and recognized clerical hierarchy. Authority is vested in the most learned scholars who emerge as spiritual leaders.
In Sufism (the mystical dimension practiced by both Sunnis and Shias), the structure is based on a spiritual guide-disciple relationship.
So just as many States ( currently 12 across the world ) murder Gays, and Jihadist groups do the same, it is by no means a stretch to see how an individual can find a preacher with thoughts and claim the justification for doing it. He's clearly not alone in this either. | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 18:43 - Jul 26 with 1822 views | The_Major |
Suspect killed by the police.
Rushed towards them with a "stabbing weapon",
BBC News - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/liv
Berlin Pride attack suspect shot and killed during police operation - live updates - BBC News | | | |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 18:44 - Jul 26 with 1808 views | Benters |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 18:43 - Jul 26 by The_Major |
Suspect killed by the police.
Rushed towards them with a "stabbing weapon",
BBC News - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/liv
Berlin Pride attack suspect shot and killed during police operation - live updates - BBC News |
Good š | |
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| Attack on Berlin Pride on 18:58 - Jul 26 with 1789 views | Zx1988 |
| Attack on Berlin Pride on 18:44 - Jul 26 by Benters |
Good š |
Not particularly.
I can't see how the police could not have shot him in the circumstances, but his death only turns him into a martyr and a poster-child for the POS who radicalised him in the first place.
Life in prison would have ruined that particular plan. | |
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