| Is it okay to punch Nazis? 10:23 - Aug 14 with 20540 views | monytowbray |
Like actual Nazis, who do Nazi salutes, use the Swatstika and promote/follow the believes of Hitler?
Discuss. |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 21:52 - Aug 14 with 2022 views | Superfrans |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 15:51 - Aug 14 by itfcjoe |
And to your edit - that if you can't buy a house etc it is because you aren't working hard enough and that there is plentiful opportunities to earn more and buy a house.
Most first time buyers need help from the Bank of Mum and Dad, either by being given cash or free rent for a significant period of time. Saving a deposit whilst in the rental market is next to impossible |
A two bedroom basement flat in Hackney these days costs £700,000.
That's a 25 year mortgage with annual payments of £28,000 plus compound interest (so, in practical terms, £40,000 to £50,000).
The standard starting salary for a London worker is £16,500 (living wage) to around £25,000.
"Screwed" isn't a strong enough word. |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 21:55 - Aug 14 with 2008 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 21:52 - Aug 14 by Superfrans |
A two bedroom basement flat in Hackney these days costs £700,000.
That's a 25 year mortgage with annual payments of £28,000 plus compound interest (so, in practical terms, £40,000 to £50,000).
The standard starting salary for a London worker is £16,500 (living wage) to around £25,000.
"Screwed" isn't a strong enough word. |
That entirely depends on the area of Hackney.
But I agree, it's incredibly hard for people trying to get on the ladder now. I also don't see how it's can/will change.
SB |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 22:11 - Aug 14 with 1983 views | Superfrans |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 21:55 - Aug 14 by StokieBlue |
That entirely depends on the area of Hackney.
But I agree, it's incredibly hard for people trying to get on the ladder now. I also don't see how it's can/will change.
SB |
Hackney Downs. So, not Stoke Newington, Victoria Park, Dalston, Shoreditch or any of the upmarket areas. And, even if you consider Hackney Downs as some kind of aspirational area (which would be weird) there isn't much differential for a similar flat in Hackney Wick, Homerton or Lower Clapton. There really isn't.
This, btw, is a concrete example, not a fluffy theoretical example. It's utterly screwed.
The reason is because vast tracts of property have been bought up by overseas interests as investments, as we all know. The knock on implication is that London will soon be largely uninhabited within the central 2/3 zones, certainly not inhabited by the people who work there, putting increasing pressure on the transport infrastructure.
The reason the Tubes are getting fuller and fuller, busier and busier, and requiring ever more investment, like Crossrail and the newly proposed North-South Crossrail, is not because of immigration (as certain people would have you believe) but because so few people who work in the centre of London (shop workers, cleaners, builders, office workers, etc) can afford to live there. | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:20 - Aug 15 with 1931 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 22:11 - Aug 14 by Superfrans |
Hackney Downs. So, not Stoke Newington, Victoria Park, Dalston, Shoreditch or any of the upmarket areas. And, even if you consider Hackney Downs as some kind of aspirational area (which would be weird) there isn't much differential for a similar flat in Hackney Wick, Homerton or Lower Clapton. There really isn't.
This, btw, is a concrete example, not a fluffy theoretical example. It's utterly screwed.
The reason is because vast tracts of property have been bought up by overseas interests as investments, as we all know. The knock on implication is that London will soon be largely uninhabited within the central 2/3 zones, certainly not inhabited by the people who work there, putting increasing pressure on the transport infrastructure.
The reason the Tubes are getting fuller and fuller, busier and busier, and requiring ever more investment, like Crossrail and the newly proposed North-South Crossrail, is not because of immigration (as certain people would have you believe) but because so few people who work in the centre of London (shop workers, cleaners, builders, office workers, etc) can afford to live there. |
Cambridge is reaching the same levels, just without the London level wages.
I've just seen a new 2 bedroom apartment in the development near Addenbrookes on for 'only' £525k, or a 5 bed town house for £1.25m.
I'm one of the lucky ones, or contributor to the problem i'll admit having various properties, but the price levels even outside London are unsustainable. [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 7:20]
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:28 - Aug 15 with 1912 views | Benters |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 21:52 - Aug 14 by Superfrans |
A two bedroom basement flat in Hackney these days costs £700,000.
That's a 25 year mortgage with annual payments of £28,000 plus compound interest (so, in practical terms, £40,000 to £50,000).
The standard starting salary for a London worker is £16,500 (living wage) to around £25,000.
"Screwed" isn't a strong enough word. |
Why would you want to live there ?
Many other cheaper areas are available? |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:29 - Aug 15 with 1916 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:20 - Aug 15 by ElderGrizzly |
Cambridge is reaching the same levels, just without the London level wages.
I've just seen a new 2 bedroom apartment in the development near Addenbrookes on for 'only' £525k, or a 5 bed town house for £1.25m.
I'm one of the lucky ones, or contributor to the problem i'll admit having various properties, but the price levels even outside London are unsustainable. [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 7:20]
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What's the solution? I honestly don't know.
I agree it's unsustainable in which case what is the end game? A huge property crash?
The bubble never should have been allowed to inflate in the first place but the government of 1997 onwards was drunk on stamp duty takings and low (or zero) deposit mortgage rules.
SB | |
| Avatar - M51 - The Whirlpool Galaxy - Taken on 29th April 2024 |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:34 - Aug 15 with 1913 views | WeWereZombies |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:29 - Aug 15 by StokieBlue |
What's the solution? I honestly don't know.
I agree it's unsustainable in which case what is the end game? A huge property crash?
The bubble never should have been allowed to inflate in the first place but the government of 1997 onwards was drunk on stamp duty takings and low (or zero) deposit mortgage rules.
SB |
You've transposed 7 and 9 at the end of the year there... |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 08:13 - Aug 15 with 1843 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:20 - Aug 15 by ElderGrizzly |
Cambridge is reaching the same levels, just without the London level wages.
I've just seen a new 2 bedroom apartment in the development near Addenbrookes on for 'only' £525k, or a 5 bed town house for £1.25m.
I'm one of the lucky ones, or contributor to the problem i'll admit having various properties, but the price levels even outside London are unsustainable. [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 7:20]
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The second option !
Edit....but it doesn't make you a nazi ! [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 8:14]
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 08:16 - Aug 15 with 1837 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:29 - Aug 15 by StokieBlue |
What's the solution? I honestly don't know.
I agree it's unsustainable in which case what is the end game? A huge property crash?
The bubble never should have been allowed to inflate in the first place but the government of 1997 onwards was drunk on stamp duty takings and low (or zero) deposit mortgage rules.
SB |
I think you got the solution in one. Not that it will be allowed to happen without a fight as it would also destroy the banks and show them up as the busted flush they really are behind all the smoke and mirrors. [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 8:18]
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 08:25 - Aug 15 with 1834 views | chicoazul |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:29 - Aug 15 by StokieBlue |
What's the solution? I honestly don't know.
I agree it's unsustainable in which case what is the end game? A huge property crash?
The bubble never should have been allowed to inflate in the first place but the government of 1997 onwards was drunk on stamp duty takings and low (or zero) deposit mortgage rules.
SB |
If there is a massive property crash do you think the BoE will bail out people the way they bailed out institutions? |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:00 - Aug 15 with 1826 views | Superfrans |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:29 - Aug 15 by StokieBlue |
What's the solution? I honestly don't know.
I agree it's unsustainable in which case what is the end game? A huge property crash?
The bubble never should have been allowed to inflate in the first place but the government of 1997 onwards was drunk on stamp duty takings and low (or zero) deposit mortgage rules.
SB |
One thing - don't allow properties to lie owned but empty for months a year at a time.
Don't build properties, thousands of them, knowing full well that they will only be affordable to land banking investors.
FFS, even in St Ives in Cornwall, they have building regulations preventing the sale of properties for second homes, for precisely this reason - local people can't afford to live there. Implement something similar in London. And quick.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-37938885 [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 9:02]
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:35 - Aug 15 with 1798 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 07:34 - Aug 15 by WeWereZombies |
You've transposed 7 and 9 at the end of the year there... |
The bubble was larger under the Blair government than the Tory government in real terms.
SB | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:36 - Aug 15 with 1796 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 08:16 - Aug 15 by BanksterDebtSlave |
I think you got the solution in one. Not that it will be allowed to happen without a fight as it would also destroy the banks and show them up as the busted flush they really are behind all the smoke and mirrors. [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 8:18]
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Why would a property crash help?
Surely it would mean nobody would sell due to negative equity, the demand would still outstrip the supply and the prices rise again?
SB | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:38 - Aug 15 with 1791 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:00 - Aug 15 by Superfrans |
One thing - don't allow properties to lie owned but empty for months a year at a time.
Don't build properties, thousands of them, knowing full well that they will only be affordable to land banking investors.
FFS, even in St Ives in Cornwall, they have building regulations preventing the sale of properties for second homes, for precisely this reason - local people can't afford to live there. Implement something similar in London. And quick.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-37938885 [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 9:02]
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I agree entirely with the empty properties point - there should be massive penalties for having an empty property for a length of time without a very good reason.
Also agree on the investors, although I think the government have done well with tackling buy-to-let. The new rules make it much less worthwhile and we should see more of those properties coming back onto the market soon.
SB | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:43 - Aug 15 with 1788 views | WeWereZombies |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:35 - Aug 15 by StokieBlue |
The bubble was larger under the Blair government than the Tory government in real terms.
SB |
I'll take that as an admission that the problem started with Thatcher. | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:46 - Aug 15 with 1785 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:43 - Aug 15 by WeWereZombies |
I'll take that as an admission that the problem started with Thatcher. |
You can take it that way if you wish, prices certainly increased then but they increased by a larger amount under Blair and Brown.
They should not be admonished of blame given they encouraged house buying as much as possible and neither should Thatcher.
SB [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 9:48]
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:55 - Aug 15 with 1771 views | bring_back_Wickham |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 21:33 - Aug 14 by StokieBlue |
Stalin himself said they were 50-100 years behind.
Why take the upper part of the range? It's also quite likely there was a fair amount of propaganda in that statement to get the people onside with the reforms.
For instance the Russians had submarines in 1915 and used them in a joint attack with the British in 1915. Hardly 100 years behind the western powers. In fact they smashed up their own navy in the revolution.
I will admit it's not my strongest subject though so happy to be corrected on any of the above.
SB |
In 1917, 90% of percent of Russians still lived in peasant farming communities. Life in Russia before the revolution was positively medieval compared to us. I believe (although I'm not sure) that they had the largest army of all the countries in WW1, but were completely overrun by the germans despite a huge numbers advantage. Stalin believed they would be invaded again(or this could be propoganda) and said this was the reason for rapid industrialisation. |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:56 - Aug 15 with 1767 views | Superfrans |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:46 - Aug 15 by StokieBlue |
You can take it that way if you wish, prices certainly increased then but they increased by a larger amount under Blair and Brown.
They should not be admonished of blame given they encouraged house buying as much as possible and neither should Thatcher.
SB [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 9:48]
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This sounds like an acknowledgement that a more left wing Government would have been better for the country than the Blair Government. That's what you're saying, right? | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:06 - Aug 15 with 1750 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:56 - Aug 15 by Superfrans |
This sounds like an acknowledgement that a more left wing Government would have been better for the country than the Blair Government. That's what you're saying, right? |
The country did fairly well under Blair and Brown for the majority of there time (the ending wasn't great) but on the specific issue of housing (which I've agreed with you on a lot of points) they certainly adopted a policy of stoking the boom.
I'm not sure how you've gone from an isolated point on housing to a general point on the country being better off with a more left wing government.
Isn't that political point scoring like you accused me of in the other thread?
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:08 - Aug 15 with 1747 views | WeWereZombies |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 09:55 - Aug 15 by bring_back_Wickham |
In 1917, 90% of percent of Russians still lived in peasant farming communities. Life in Russia before the revolution was positively medieval compared to us. I believe (although I'm not sure) that they had the largest army of all the countries in WW1, but were completely overrun by the germans despite a huge numbers advantage. Stalin believed they would be invaded again(or this could be propoganda) and said this was the reason for rapid industrialisation. |
This is all good, however a read of 'Akenfield' will tell you that all was not sweetness and light in Britain (and specifically Suffolk) before the Second World War. The other factor in this debate is that Stalin needed to prepare for a Nazi invasion because he had stopped supporting them. | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:25 - Aug 15 with 1727 views | bring_back_Wickham |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:08 - Aug 15 by WeWereZombies |
This is all good, however a read of 'Akenfield' will tell you that all was not sweetness and light in Britain (and specifically Suffolk) before the Second World War. The other factor in this debate is that Stalin needed to prepare for a Nazi invasion because he had stopped supporting them. |
Agreed, not all was perfect here or in the US. But take the situation in Suffolk, and imagine it in a country spamming half the globe, awful transport links, issues with nationalist groups, a hugely unpopular autocratic leader (the Tsar not Stalin), then you have Russia in 1917. | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:27 - Aug 15 with 1725 views | unbelievablue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:25 - Aug 15 by bring_back_Wickham |
Agreed, not all was perfect here or in the US. But take the situation in Suffolk, and imagine it in a country spamming half the globe, awful transport links, issues with nationalist groups, a hugely unpopular autocratic leader (the Tsar not Stalin), then you have Russia in 1917. |
I'd argue 1913. The landscape changed immeasurably because of the war. |  |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 11:22 - Aug 15 with 1695 views | bring_back_Wickham |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 10:27 - Aug 15 by unbelievablue |
I'd argue 1913. The landscape changed immeasurably because of the war. |
The war definitely made it worse, but some historians argue that the situation was bad enough before the war that the revolution was inevitable. | |
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 11:26 - Aug 15 with 1689 views | StokieBlue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 11:22 - Aug 15 by bring_back_Wickham |
The war definitely made it worse, but some historians argue that the situation was bad enough before the war that the revolution was inevitable. |
I can certainly believe that. Ten minutes walking around the Hermitage or Peterhof Palace any it's plain to see how ridiculously lopsided the wealth was at that time.
Winter Palace (Hermitage):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermitage_Museum
Summer Palace (Peterhof):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peterhof_Palace
Catherine Palace (Amber rooms):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amber_Room
They are all only about 5 miles apart!
SB [Post edited 15 Aug 2017 11:27]
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| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 11:30 - Aug 15 with 1684 views | unbelievablue |
| Is it okay to punch Nazis? on 11:22 - Aug 15 by bring_back_Wickham |
The war definitely made it worse, but some historians argue that the situation was bad enough before the war that the revolution was inevitable. |
I'd argue this distinction...'a revolution' perhaps, but certainly not 'the revolution' which came to pass. | |
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