| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:15 - May 17 with 1875 views | Ftnfwest |
Should be fine, I thought demanding the whole country was wiped from the face of the earth was all ok anyway? |  | |  |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:17 - May 17 with 1859 views | giant_stow |
I've got another related question.
What do anti-zionists want to do about Isreali Jews? Pretty sure I'm being dim, but is the idea a jewish state ceases and a secular Jewish/Palestinian one replaces it? Or do the jews just bvgger off somewhere else? [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:21]
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:18 - May 17 with 1853 views | Beckets |
*taps fingers waiting for GB to log on.... |  | | |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:19 - May 17 with 1844 views | Kropotkin123 |
No, technically it isn't. The Israeli nation-state and the Jewish people are not the same.
But often people who are against Israel are anti-Semitic. So it is a tough one.
It's one of those situations where it is a bit odd to me too. People quite willing to argue against Israel, but at the same time completely fine with not condemning (what is it now? 1000s of) rockets being fired into Israel.
I used to wade in a lot on this subject. But I don't trust people with strong feelings on either side. |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:22 - May 17 with 1804 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:15 - May 17 by Ftnfwest |
Should be fine, I thought demanding the whole country was wiped from the face of the earth was all ok anyway? |
I think I need something more definitive to free me up to decide what to think! |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:24 - May 17 with 1782 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:17 - May 17 by giant_stow |
I've got another related question.
What do anti-zionists want to do about Isreali Jews? Pretty sure I'm being dim, but is the idea a jewish state ceases and a secular Jewish/Palestinian one replaces it? Or do the jews just bvgger off somewhere else? [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:21]
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Well if we have to have nation states then that would be what I would want to go with. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:24 - May 17 with 1786 views | factual_blue |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:19 - May 17 by Kropotkin123 |
No, technically it isn't. The Israeli nation-state and the Jewish people are not the same.
But often people who are against Israel are anti-Semitic. So it is a tough one.
It's one of those situations where it is a bit odd to me too. People quite willing to argue against Israel, but at the same time completely fine with not condemning (what is it now? 1000s of) rockets being fired into Israel.
I used to wade in a lot on this subject. But I don't trust people with strong feelings on either side. |
There's no such thing as 'the Jewish people'. There are people of the Jewish religion, just as there are of Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, and countless other religions.
If we are ever able to get rid of outdated and incorrect notions about 'race', the world would be a much better place. |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:30 - May 17 with 1727 views | giant_stow |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:24 - May 17 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Well if we have to have nation states then that would be what I would want to go with. |
The mixed up Palestinian / jewish state?
Given everything that's happenned recently and in WW2, would you feel safe as Jew living in that state?
Just seems impossible, but I repeat I'm probably being dim. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:32 - May 17 with 1701 views | 26_Paz |
Holding that view and peacefully expressing it is fine, it’s not a view I agree with but there is no issue with holding that opinion. If you read the article you have linked it says there were arrests for hate speech and violent protests. I can only assume these protest perhaps got out of hand and some individuals amongst the crowd became violent and began partaking in anti-Semitic hate speech. This would be where the problems arose. |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:33 - May 17 with 1700 views | HARRY10 |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:24 - May 17 by factual_blue |
There's no such thing as 'the Jewish people'. There are people of the Jewish religion, just as there are of Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, and countless other religions.
If we are ever able to get rid of outdated and incorrect notions about 'race', the world would be a much better place. |
If a 'qualifying' parent makes you Jewish in their eyes, but not yours
Are you still Jewish ? |  | | |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:38 - May 17 with 1665 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:24 - May 17 by factual_blue |
There's no such thing as 'the Jewish people'. There are people of the Jewish religion, just as there are of Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, and countless other religions.
If we are ever able to get rid of outdated and incorrect notions about 'race', the world would be a much better place. |
"Anti-Semitic - hostile to or prejudiced against Jewish people."
Neither Bankster nor I have mentioned "race". So not sure why race is being brought up. Or is it in the article? I didn't feel I needed to read the article in order to respond the question.
Either way, I didn't mean to infer race. More prejudice against a group of (religious) people. [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:40]
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:39 - May 17 with 1660 views | factual_blue |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:33 - May 17 by HARRY10 |
If a 'qualifying' parent makes you Jewish in their eyes, but not yours
Are you still Jewish ? |
As was (and possibly still is) the case with Catholicism, an infant is deemed to be immediately a member of the faith in question.
Judaism is a religion, like all the others. No more, no less.
For a variety of reasons that go back way, way beyond nazism, people of the Jewish faith have been disliked throughout Christendom. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:42 - May 17 with 1645 views | factual_blue |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:38 - May 17 by Kropotkin123 |
"Anti-Semitic - hostile to or prejudiced against Jewish people."
Neither Bankster nor I have mentioned "race". So not sure why race is being brought up. Or is it in the article? I didn't feel I needed to read the article in order to respond the question.
Either way, I didn't mean to infer race. More prejudice against a group of (religious) people. [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:40]
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That's fine then. One can easily see this all as being about race, when there's no such thing. The supposed set of Jewish physical characteristics are to do with consanguinity rather than anything else.
I'm sure you didn't mean to imply race, and I hope nobody infers it. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:48 - May 17 with 1610 views | BloomBlue |
Depends on how you are calling for it. If those protest as in the article result in attacks on Jewish people because they are 'Jewish' then yes it is racism (Antisemitism). |  | | |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:50 - May 17 with 1601 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:42 - May 17 by factual_blue |
That's fine then. One can easily see this all as being about race, when there's no such thing. The supposed set of Jewish physical characteristics are to do with consanguinity rather than anything else.
I'm sure you didn't mean to imply race, and I hope nobody infers it. |
You reminded me of something. When I was in Jerusalem for a wedding. I went on this tour around the city. There's an "Armenian Quarter". You're not allowed in unless you are Armenian, and to my knowledge, there is only one entrance.
Reason being is when the crusaders went over from Europe to "reclaim the Holy land" or whatever it is they were doing, they killed loads of Armenians. This is despite the fact that the crusaders were Christian and so were the Armenians living there. They were living there peacefully with the other religious groups.
They were only killed due to the perception of what a Christian should look and sound like.
I guess I'm telling this story because you are right. People have ideas of what religious or cultural groups look like and often this ties into perceptions of race. And this shouldn't be overlooked, even if it was tagged onto my comment. [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:52]
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 17:51 - May 17 with 1457 views | ZXBlue |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:38 - May 17 by Kropotkin123 |
"Anti-Semitic - hostile to or prejudiced against Jewish people."
Neither Bankster nor I have mentioned "race". So not sure why race is being brought up. Or is it in the article? I didn't feel I needed to read the article in order to respond the question.
Either way, I didn't mean to infer race. More prejudice against a group of (religious) people. [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:40]
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Because Jews are fairly unique in being identified by both religion and genes- by themselves and by others. | | | |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 17:59 - May 17 with 1427 views | factual_blue |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 17:51 - May 17 by ZXBlue |
Because Jews are fairly unique in being identified by both religion and genes- by themselves and by others. |
They're 'identifiable from their genes' because of the consanguinity I've already mentioned.
So far as I'm aware there isn't a gene that confers Jewishness. Unless, of course you're some kind of potty Zionist zealot. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 18:16 - May 17 with 1369 views | Wacko |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:50 - May 17 by Kropotkin123 |
You reminded me of something. When I was in Jerusalem for a wedding. I went on this tour around the city. There's an "Armenian Quarter". You're not allowed in unless you are Armenian, and to my knowledge, there is only one entrance.
Reason being is when the crusaders went over from Europe to "reclaim the Holy land" or whatever it is they were doing, they killed loads of Armenians. This is despite the fact that the crusaders were Christian and so were the Armenians living there. They were living there peacefully with the other religious groups.
They were only killed due to the perception of what a Christian should look and sound like.
I guess I'm telling this story because you are right. People have ideas of what religious or cultural groups look like and often this ties into perceptions of race. And this shouldn't be overlooked, even if it was tagged onto my comment. [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:52]
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This is exactly what happened when Ethiopian Jews turned up in Israel, and proceeded to be racially abused by other Israelis:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-32813056
The bigger irony being that the Ethiopian Jewish community is one of the oldest in the world. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 18:42 - May 17 with 1331 views | Ryorry |
Well my instinctive reaction to this thread was to start replying with "Jeezus" or "Christ" or similar epithet, which is kinda interesting from a linguistic/philosophic/historical viewpoint .. but I'll leave that out now!
Anyway, what I mainly wanted to say was " ***** ", the state of this planet & some of the humans on it. It's ridiculous. From space, Earth is a small blue dot which has no borders but does have about 8 billion of us humans desperately clinging on to it, some of whom are wasting their lives by trying to knock off others, purely because of imaginary constructs. Doh.
#LiveAndLetLive
#PeaceNotWar |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 18:50 - May 17 with 1297 views | J2BLUE |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 18:42 - May 17 by Ryorry |
Well my instinctive reaction to this thread was to start replying with "Jeezus" or "Christ" or similar epithet, which is kinda interesting from a linguistic/philosophic/historical viewpoint .. but I'll leave that out now!
Anyway, what I mainly wanted to say was " ***** ", the state of this planet & some of the humans on it. It's ridiculous. From space, Earth is a small blue dot which has no borders but does have about 8 billion of us humans desperately clinging on to it, some of whom are wasting their lives by trying to knock off others, purely because of imaginary constructs. Doh.
#LiveAndLetLive
#PeaceNotWar |
Are you suggesting there shouldn't be borders? Genuinely asking. |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 19:01 - May 17 with 1237 views | Darth_Koont |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:15 - May 17 by Ftnfwest |
Should be fine, I thought demanding the whole country was wiped from the face of the earth was all ok anyway? |
That’s never been fine.
But as the recent incarnation of the Israeli government and the far-right settlers have now destroyed the chances of a two state solution, then a multicultural, multi-faith Israel is becoming the only option. It won’t be a Jewish state per se but be a haven for both Jews and Muslims.
There’s a strange hope in that inevitability. |  |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 19:03 - May 17 with 1225 views | Darth_Koont |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 16:17 - May 17 by giant_stow |
I've got another related question.
What do anti-zionists want to do about Isreali Jews? Pretty sure I'm being dim, but is the idea a jewish state ceases and a secular Jewish/Palestinian one replaces it? Or do the jews just bvgger off somewhere else? [Post edited 17 May 2021 16:21]
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See above. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 19:21 - May 17 with 1186 views | ZXBlue |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 17:59 - May 17 by factual_blue |
They're 'identifiable from their genes' because of the consanguinity I've already mentioned.
So far as I'm aware there isn't a gene that confers Jewishness. Unless, of course you're some kind of potty Zionist zealot. |
You seem to miss the point.
Many jewish people consider themselves to be, if not a race, then certainly something more than just a religion.
The whole concept makes little sense to me, but that's besides the point. [Post edited 17 May 2021 19:22]
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 19:36 - May 17 with 1137 views | Ryorry |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 18:50 - May 17 by J2BLUE |
Are you suggesting there shouldn't be borders? Genuinely asking. |
Yes.
We need to act together globally particularly right now from points of view of pandemics/vaccinations currnt & future; and climate change, if humans as a species are to survive on this planet.
Will never happen of course - speaking generally, we're too stupid & selfish. | |
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| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 20:26 - May 17 with 1056 views | J2BLUE |
| Antisemitism clarification please.... on 19:36 - May 17 by Ryorry |
Yes.
We need to act together globally particularly right now from points of view of pandemics/vaccinations currnt & future; and climate change, if humans as a species are to survive on this planet.
Will never happen of course - speaking generally, we're too stupid & selfish. |
So we would need a one world government? Not sure how that would work without organisation at national level? | |
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