| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs 17:05 - Sep 3 with 7984 views | Digger77 |
Glad I won't have to take up that fight with the school now!
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:06 - Sep 4 with 1639 views | GlasgowBlue |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 17:08 - Sep 3 by Nthsuffolkblue |
Fight with the school? The school would administer them to those students whose parent/guardians had signed their consent forms. How is that a "fight" with the school?
It is noteworthy that the JCVI advise that the small risk of the jabs is possibly worth it for the overall benefit to the vulnerable while the Government's advisers have yet to decide whether to consider the risk to the vulnerable in society as the overwhelming consideration.
EDITED as misrepresented what I had been led to believe the Government's position to be. [Post edited 3 Sep 2021 20:22]
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Your edit still incorrect. The JVCI have advised against giving the jab to 12 to 15 year olds. The advisors to the 3 devolved governments and the UK government are minded to over rule this advise. |  |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:35 - Sep 4 with 1611 views | vapour_trail |
The rush to demonise anyone who is cautious about having something stuck into the arm of their kids on this thread is pathetic.
And as dangerous as the anti-vax brigade in terms of ensuring successful delivery of the vaccination programme. |  |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:49 - Sep 4 with 1592 views | Bluefish |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:35 - Sep 4 by vapour_trail |
The rush to demonise anyone who is cautious about having something stuck into the arm of their kids on this thread is pathetic.
And as dangerous as the anti-vax brigade in terms of ensuring successful delivery of the vaccination programme. |
Not really no. We all have vaccines throughout our lives and we have certain levels of expectation of decency is stopping disease or illness from each other.
The bit I won't ever understand is when the vaccine proves to be a disaster and wipes out 70% of the world what are the remaining cranks going to do to survive? Could get nasty |  |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:55 - Sep 4 with 1585 views | m14_blue |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:35 - Sep 4 by vapour_trail |
The rush to demonise anyone who is cautious about having something stuck into the arm of their kids on this thread is pathetic.
And as dangerous as the anti-vax brigade in terms of ensuring successful delivery of the vaccination programme. |
In fairness, the OP has got exactly the reaction he was hoping for. | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 09:22 - Sep 4 with 1562 views | borge |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 20:37 - Sep 3 by Lightworker |
The ONLY grounds to consider for a medical intervention are medical grounds. If the benefit to the patient does not outweigh the risk then you don't do it. Clearly the JCVI have concluded that is the case. I find it rather strange that people on here seem to think they know better. If Boris overules the JCVI then he is an idiot. |
Boris is an idiot, but that is irrelevant to this debate.
The news this morning suggests the government will go ahead with vaccinating 12 to 15 year olds and as a father of an 11 year old (12 in November) and a 9 year old, I will very willingly give permission for them to get jabbed when the time comes.
Even if the risk of adverse reactions was equal to the risk that they face from COVID I would still give permission because this is not simply about the COVID risk to any individual child. This is about the continued ongoing risk to society, not just here but everywhere.
If COVID is allowed to continue bubbling along in a cohort that is generally asymptomatic, we will simply be creating a breeding ground for new variations, with COVID rates never reaching a point where we can be confident it is under control. Some of these variants may be significantly more harmful, not just to older and/or those more vulnerable to current variants, but to the very kids that the vaccine cynics are trying to 'protect' (including the OP's).
It's a cliche to say it, but......where would we be today if previous generations had thought in this way? | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 09:52 - Sep 4 with 1533 views | GlasgowBlue |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:35 - Sep 4 by vapour_trail |
The rush to demonise anyone who is cautious about having something stuck into the arm of their kids on this thread is pathetic.
And as dangerous as the anti-vax brigade in terms of ensuring successful delivery of the vaccination programme. |
That’s a fair comment. You and I are old enough and ugly enough to weigh up the benefits of getting the vaccine but when it comes to our kids I think it’s only natural to at least have a healthy conversation about it.
That’s not an anti vax stance, I don’t have any time for anti Vaxxers.
At the beginning of this debate back in January I was very much in favour of making vaccinations Mandatory, but after seeing footage of the police throwing non vaccinated people out of restaurants I’m getting quite uncomfortable about the divide that seems to be creeping in. [Post edited 4 Sep 2021 9:54]
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 09:58 - Sep 4 with 1521 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:35 - Sep 4 by vapour_trail |
The rush to demonise anyone who is cautious about having something stuck into the arm of their kids on this thread is pathetic.
And as dangerous as the anti-vax brigade in terms of ensuring successful delivery of the vaccination programme. |
Yeah but apparently they are all remainers and therefore right about everything. Stunning self awareness fails from a few, or maybe just pissed! |  |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:02 - Sep 4 with 1509 views | Bluefish |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 09:58 - Sep 4 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Yeah but apparently they are all remainers and therefore right about everything. Stunning self awareness fails from a few, or maybe just pissed! |
I'm not saying I'm right but I've never been wrong | |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:04 - Sep 4 with 1512 views | Lightworker |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 21:25 - Sep 3 by Nthsuffolkblue |
That is not true. Vaccination programmes have persisted until the eradication of many diseases and not stopped at the point at which the disease prevalence is lower than the possible effect of side-effects.
The JCVI have also provided wider context to their marginal call that direct benefit is no higher than the potential risk. |
I stand by my statement. You do not give a medical intervention to a patient when the risk benefit ratio is against the patient, it is simply unethical.
With regards to eradicating disease, I believe the only disease that has ever been completely eradicated by vaccination is Smallpox and is is widely accepted that we are unlikey to ever eradicate Covid through vaccines or otherwise. Does that mean we shouldn't try? Absolutely not, but only when we can be sure that the vaccines will not do more harm than good to the age groups least affected by the disease. |  | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:15 - Sep 4 with 1498 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 09:52 - Sep 4 by GlasgowBlue |
That’s a fair comment. You and I are old enough and ugly enough to weigh up the benefits of getting the vaccine but when it comes to our kids I think it’s only natural to at least have a healthy conversation about it.
That’s not an anti vax stance, I don’t have any time for anti Vaxxers.
At the beginning of this debate back in January I was very much in favour of making vaccinations Mandatory, but after seeing footage of the police throwing non vaccinated people out of restaurants I’m getting quite uncomfortable about the divide that seems to be creeping in. [Post edited 4 Sep 2021 9:54]
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Not going well is it.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/04/care-workers-in-england-leaving- | |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:17 - Sep 4 with 1493 views | Lightworker |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 21:37 - Sep 3 by Swansea_Blue |
Not my area of expertise, but it takes 2 minutes to find results from phase III trials for different vaccines being published since the end of 2020. They were needed for approvals for use.
Also there’s an explainer here on why monitoring is ongoing (specifically referencing the US trial you quote, although I’m not sure what the relevance is to us when we’ve also undertaken our own trials): https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-vaccine-monitoring-idUSKBN2AC2G3. |
I accept your point here and to a degree stand corrected, although technically some trials and monitoring is still ongoing so I was partially correct.
Although it is true that its quite normal for ongoing monitoring of vaccines to continue it is also true that the initial trials normally take place over a much longer timeframe than has been the case with the Covid vaccines (which is understandable given the urgency). | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:19 - Sep 4 with 1489 views | Lightworker |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 21:39 - Sep 3 by Nthsuffolkblue |
1 out of 3 of his corrections being correct is ... oh well.
Must admit I am not sure where Badger gets his 1 in 100 death rate from. Possibly among hospital admissions rather than infections. |
I make it 2 out of 3, and as they say, that ain't bad!  | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:44 - Sep 4 with 1459 views | Digger77 |
I think it would be better if there was a massive drive to make 12-15 year olds healthier generally, as being overweight is a big factor for covid.
Why hasn't there been more encouragement for the fat to lose weight? We are even bribing people with free takeaway to get jabbed ffs! | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 15:05 - Sep 4 with 1336 views | Ryorry |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 17:52 - Sep 4 with 1258 views | Digger77 |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 15:05 - Sep 4 by Ryorry |
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How many of the children are classed as vulnerable / at risk? How many vaccinated children were there?
Having spoken to other parents from the school today, I'm really not alone with my concerns with this. | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 20:25 - Sep 4 with 1182 views | factual_blue |
It wouldn't be anything to do with the school, but never mind. |  |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 21:56 - Sep 4 with 1146 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 10:04 - Sep 4 by Lightworker |
I stand by my statement. You do not give a medical intervention to a patient when the risk benefit ratio is against the patient, it is simply unethical.
With regards to eradicating disease, I believe the only disease that has ever been completely eradicated by vaccination is Smallpox and is is widely accepted that we are unlikey to ever eradicate Covid through vaccines or otherwise. Does that mean we shouldn't try? Absolutely not, but only when we can be sure that the vaccines will not do more harm than good to the age groups least affected by the disease. |
This is not medical intervention.
The JCVI have not stated the risk to benefit ratio is against the "patient". They have stated that there is no clearly measurable benefit over risk to the individual. |  |
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 00:52 - Sep 5 with 1092 views | Eireannach_gorm |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 17:52 - Sep 4 by Digger77 |
How many of the children are classed as vulnerable / at risk? How many vaccinated children were there?
Having spoken to other parents from the school today, I'm really not alone with my concerns with this. |
What is your thoughts on the MMR vaccination?
You have every right to be concerned about your children's welfare but how different is the Covid-19 vaccine to the above? |  | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 16:34 - Sep 13 with 882 views | borge |
Looks like you might have to have that 'fight' Digger.
I know that once my 11 year old turns 12 in November she will be very keen to get it - she is very keen to do her bit and I certainly won't be discouraging her. | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 16:45 - Sep 13 with 858 views | Digger77 |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 16:34 - Sep 13 by borge |
Looks like you might have to have that 'fight' Digger.
I know that once my 11 year old turns 12 in November she will be very keen to get it - she is very keen to do her bit and I certainly won't be discouraging her. |
Having spoken to the school leadership team last week, all jabs will need the consent of the parents.
No activities will be restricted for anyone not jabbed.
The school were great actually. No fights necessary! | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 16:54 - Sep 13 with 832 views | Digger77 |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 00:52 - Sep 5 by Eireannach_gorm |
What is your thoughts on the MMR vaccination?
You have every right to be concerned about your children's welfare but how different is the Covid-19 vaccine to the above? |
My kids had the MMR. Im not antivax.
Very different in the way its engineered I believe. And it wasn't on trial when my kids had it.
Sorry for the delay! | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 01:30 - Sep 14 with 689 views | Kropotkin123 |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 20:37 - Sep 3 by Lightworker |
The ONLY grounds to consider for a medical intervention are medical grounds. If the benefit to the patient does not outweigh the risk then you don't do it. Clearly the JCVI have concluded that is the case. I find it rather strange that people on here seem to think they know better. If Boris overules the JCVI then he is an idiot. |
To be clear, are you calling the OP an idiot for saying they would argue with the school if the JCVI hadn't currently supported their position? [Post edited 14 Sep 2021 1:32]
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| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 06:30 - Sep 14 with 642 views | Lightworker |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 01:30 - Sep 14 by Kropotkin123 |
To be clear, are you calling the OP an idiot for saying they would argue with the school if the JCVI hadn't currently supported their position? [Post edited 14 Sep 2021 1:32]
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No I said nothing of the sort. Happy to help. | | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 07:55 - Sep 14 with 603 views | witchdoctor |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 19:04 - Sep 3 by BlueBadger |
I suspect that 52% of Digger and Norfolkblue's concerns are Very Real ones. |
couldn’t help yourself could you?..🙄 |  | | |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 08:00 - Sep 14 with 596 views | witchdoctor |
| 12 - 15 year olds not recommended Covid jabs on 21:55 - Sep 3 by Bluefish |
The dole pays more than their jobs? |
yep….you as well..🙄 | | | |
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