| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... 11:50 - Dec 6 with 4023 views | itfcjoe |
...Manning has managed 24 at MK Dons |  |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 15:34 - Dec 6 with 548 views | PrideOfTheEast |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 11:54 - Dec 6 by benrhyddingblue |
He also had 120+ games in charge of Ayr United before Colchester! |
Manning has managed 30 odd in Belgium too. |  | | |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 15:49 - Dec 6 with 517 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 14:49 - Dec 6 by tractorboy1978 |
I think where we differ is that I was struggling to see Cook turning it around. Since Wycombe (which should have been and I thought was a turning point) it's been really dire. We've got one struggled win in 5 cup games against 3 bottom 8 L2 sides + an U21 side and one struggled win in 4 league games - against the team rock bottom of the league.
Hopefully we get some sort of bounce over the next couple of games and it kickstarts our season. Whilst McGreal wouldn't be anyone's first choice, as interim managers go he's good and someone with managerial experience in competitive first team games. His in game management cannot be any worse than Cook's was here. [Post edited 6 Dec 2021 14:50]
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I'm not convinced Cook would have turned it around but I think it's much less likely a new guy with new ideas and no players he knows or were chosen by him is going to have auto promotion form from day 1! |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 15:54 - Dec 6 with 508 views | jayessess |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 15:49 - Dec 6 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I'm not convinced Cook would have turned it around but I think it's much less likely a new guy with new ideas and no players he knows or were chosen by him is going to have auto promotion form from day 1! |
We'll see, but I'd say statistically the likelihood is the other way round. In the immediate term, same manager makes for same performances, new manager makes for something else. |  |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:08 - Dec 6 with 494 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 15:54 - Dec 6 by jayessess |
We'll see, but I'd say statistically the likelihood is the other way round. In the immediate term, same manager makes for same performances, new manager makes for something else. |
Cook had started an improved spell, then we'd had a dip again. But he'd been working with his players all along and they will have had his ideas drilled into them, so perhaps they'd improve again, particularly with a few additions in Jan. I said all along not every transfer was going to work, so giving Cook a second window to fix a few things might have got us back on track.
Now we're starting at square one again. I'd obviously be delighted to see them take to the new manager's ideas and be able to implement them immediately, but I'm far from convinced that will be anymore likely than hoping Cook comes good. We have John McGreal for a few games it seems - I'll be amazed if that will work out immediately which leaves the new manager (if it's not him) coming into a dead season (according to several on here who said we need 2 points a game from now on).
We shall see. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:12 - Dec 6 with 488 views | jayessess |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:08 - Dec 6 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Cook had started an improved spell, then we'd had a dip again. But he'd been working with his players all along and they will have had his ideas drilled into them, so perhaps they'd improve again, particularly with a few additions in Jan. I said all along not every transfer was going to work, so giving Cook a second window to fix a few things might have got us back on track.
Now we're starting at square one again. I'd obviously be delighted to see them take to the new manager's ideas and be able to implement them immediately, but I'm far from convinced that will be anymore likely than hoping Cook comes good. We have John McGreal for a few games it seems - I'll be amazed if that will work out immediately which leaves the new manager (if it's not him) coming into a dead season (according to several on here who said we need 2 points a game from now on).
We shall see. |
If they're good ideas and they're drilled into the players, then surely McGreal will just run with them? Maybe tweak a few things he's noticed are obviously wrong. | |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:20 - Dec 6 with 471 views | Herbivore |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 15:54 - Dec 6 by jayessess |
We'll see, but I'd say statistically the likelihood is the other way round. In the immediate term, same manager makes for same performances, new manager makes for something else. |
This is it, and this will have been at the heart of the decision to sack Cook. At this point the season is still just about alive but there's increasingly little margin for error because of our poor first 20 games. The board will have considered whether there was a realistic chance of Cook getting the team in the kind of form needed consistently in order to make the top 6 and they've concluded that there wasn't. We'll never know for certain but it's hard to argue against that conclusion on recent performances and results. Whilst it won't be easy for a new manager to come in and get us playing the way we need to play to get to the top 6, there is a chance especially with a very talented group of players for this level. That's why they've chosen to twist rather than stick. |  |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:23 - Dec 6 with 459 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:12 - Dec 6 by jayessess |
If they're good ideas and they're drilled into the players, then surely McGreal will just run with them? Maybe tweak a few things he's noticed are obviously wrong. |
Who knows what McGreal will do? It's all a bit unknown now. It's not like he has the greatest pedigree. At the stage when lambert was sacked, if Cook and McGreal were the two options I doubt there'd be many calling for John.
Those calling for Cook to be sacked (or close to it) have got their wish. And a few (not you) are gleefully telling me it's proof I got it wrong again. Well that rather depends what happens next now. I doubt for many the first part of their wish was to get John McGreal! | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:33 - Dec 6 with 434 views | tractorboy1978 |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:23 - Dec 6 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Who knows what McGreal will do? It's all a bit unknown now. It's not like he has the greatest pedigree. At the stage when lambert was sacked, if Cook and McGreal were the two options I doubt there'd be many calling for John.
Those calling for Cook to be sacked (or close to it) have got their wish. And a few (not you) are gleefully telling me it's proof I got it wrong again. Well that rather depends what happens next now. I doubt for many the first part of their wish was to get John McGreal! |
Honestly speaking we can't really judge McGreal either way. Taking on one of the best, if not the best squad in a division and getting them playing is a totally different situation to the one he found himself in at Colchester, where on the face of it his win % is pretty average but he did a reasonable job in the circumstances.
Our next full time appointment will not have a better CV than Paul Cook but we've got a history of employing managers with a good CV that do not deliver. We need to become that club that appoints a decent coach/manager on their way up. | | | |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:35 - Dec 6 with 431 views | jayessess |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:23 - Dec 6 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Who knows what McGreal will do? It's all a bit unknown now. It's not like he has the greatest pedigree. At the stage when lambert was sacked, if Cook and McGreal were the two options I doubt there'd be many calling for John.
Those calling for Cook to be sacked (or close to it) have got their wish. And a few (not you) are gleefully telling me it's proof I got it wrong again. Well that rather depends what happens next now. I doubt for many the first part of their wish was to get John McGreal! |
Certainly does. John McGreal certainly wouldn't have been on my wish list, but people surprise you in football, so who knows.
Other than that, I guess I'm content that the club has stopped deluding itself that the path to long-term success is paved with short-term failure. | |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:40 - Dec 6 with 413 views | Herbivore |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 16:35 - Dec 6 by jayessess |
Certainly does. John McGreal certainly wouldn't have been on my wish list, but people surprise you in football, so who knows.
Other than that, I guess I'm content that the club has stopped deluding itself that the path to long-term success is paved with short-term failure. |
If anything the Evans era should have taught us that past track record is no guarantee of future performance. His strategy of appointing managers with a promotion (or two) on their CV yielded precisely zero promotions and one humiliating relegation.
On the flip side, who'd have thought that England appointing a manager whose only prior experience was a pretty mediocre stint at Middlesborough would end up yielding a World Cup semi-final and a Euro final in the space of 3 years? Sometimes the right man for the job isn't the one with the best CV on paper. [Post edited 6 Dec 2021 16:43]
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 17:00 - Dec 6 with 388 views | rickw |
I'd hope they look at him - we don't know if it's too early in his career or not, but it would be an bold and exciting call if it is him |  |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 17:22 - Dec 6 with 371 views | jaykay |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 12:03 - Dec 6 by itfcjoe |
At some point we need to take a chance on a manager, and trust the board to identify someone with potential than just looking at past records |
well we only got to look at sir alf and sir bob. both were inexperienced as managers and the rest is glorious history.
then again if went down that route some would find something to blub about |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 17:54 - Dec 6 with 341 views | MalcolmBlue |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 12:12 - Dec 6 by itfcjoe |
Hurst had managed something like 500 games before he came across, he really wasn't the young up and coming manager he was billed at - he'd just had a superb run at Shrewsbury
I think the answer was to lose Cook, and then hope something changes when we get the right man in |
Quite! He’s almost the same age as Lambert |  |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 17:58 - Dec 6 with 334 views | Cotty |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 11:59 - Dec 6 by Herbivore |
I don't get why we're so edgy about going for someone inexperienced but with a lot of potential. It's not like appointing experienced managers has been a hugely successful strategy for us. Take a punt on a gifted coach, let them make a name for themselves here. |
Agreed. And if it doesn't work.... do you know what, we're quite used to that now, we'll live. |  | | |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 18:48 - Dec 6 with 296 views | Herbivore |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 17:58 - Dec 6 by Cotty |
Agreed. And if it doesn't work.... do you know what, we're quite used to that now, we'll live. |
At least it'd be a different flavour of disappointment. | |
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| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 18:58 - Dec 6 with 288 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| George Burley had managed 20 games at Col U before he jumped ship to us... on 12:17 - Dec 6 by clive_baker |
Not for me Clive. I think it depends how the next few weeks goes, arguably if we lose our next few games with McGreal and the season is looking lost, then perhaps there's a case for a longer term lens, give it to Manning with the rest of this season as something of a free hit (deja vu I know). Get his feet under the table, shape his squad in the summer and lets hope he is the real deal. No appointment is risk free, but that would feel like such a coin toss. These owners need a return relatively quickly, so I can't see them going for Manning at this juncture. If / while we're on the coattails of the playoffs I would be nervous about such a rookie, as good as his start to life in management has been. He has 10 wins to his name, he's very raw and this is a big job with big pressures.
Lowe is the standout candidate for me, his style of football, his expereince to date but young(ish) and progressive. I think he's the value bet. |
It really depends what is meant by a "free hit". I think it is unreasonable to expect promotion from here and that is why Cook has been sacked. He had 2 chances to go for promotion and has messed them both up. The remit for the new manager has to be to improve things and at least get close to, if not into, the play offs. The fact that is a massive improvement on where we are now is testament to how poorly Cook has done this season.
If the new manager cannot improve on where we are this season, that would have to be a cause for big concern. They would still get to start next season I am sure, but they would need to get things right quickly. |  |
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