| Lots of little digs at Cook but 09:35 - Feb 20 with 12121 views | Chrisd |
the clearance of the squad was very much needed and he certainly brought in players that had the potential to improve us, which KM is getting out of them now. PC might not have gone about it in the right way, but that squad needed clearing out and freshening up that was something that PC did get right. [Post edited 20 Feb 2022 9:37]
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:38 - Feb 20 with 1933 views | Tangledupin_Blue |
I have been, and remain, very critical of Cook for his abysmal, clueless game management. The number of times we had a decent first half then, as the team crumbled and threw away yet another lead, he just watched along with the rest of us. And his recruitment of incompetent pals, at considerable expense, as 'coaches'.
His post-match interviews were awful; excuses for failure, buck-passing and often hypocritical. His psychological handling of the players equally as bad.
But I accept that the squad needed an overhaul and that he, at least in part, has been responsible for bringing in some decent talent who will take the club forward now that we have someone competent at the helm. |  |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:41 - Feb 20 with 1919 views | theinbetweener |
100% agree. For all of his downfalls on poor tactics, inflexibility and poor professionalism at times, at least he saw the bigger picture of what was actually wrong from the very start, and had the guts to action the much needed demolition. Say what you want but it was needed and has definitely put us in a stronger position long term. KM is a tactical genius and I love him already, but he was certainly dealt better cards when entering the building, than his predecessor. |  | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:45 - Feb 20 with 1911 views | pointofblue |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:38 - Feb 20 by Tangledupin_Blue |
I have been, and remain, very critical of Cook for his abysmal, clueless game management. The number of times we had a decent first half then, as the team crumbled and threw away yet another lead, he just watched along with the rest of us. And his recruitment of incompetent pals, at considerable expense, as 'coaches'.
His post-match interviews were awful; excuses for failure, buck-passing and often hypocritical. His psychological handling of the players equally as bad.
But I accept that the squad needed an overhaul and that he, at least in part, has been responsible for bringing in some decent talent who will take the club forward now that we have someone competent at the helm. |
When Cook took over the apparently awful squad he inherited was two points off the play offs. When McKenna took over, the apparently superb squad had seen us drop ten points back from sixth and Oxford had a game in hand on us. Did we need an overhaul, or just a competent manager to get us over the line? | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:51 - Feb 20 with 1884 views | jayessess |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:20 - Feb 20 by Leaky |
Of those you've listed Parrott & McGuiness were on loan. Downs wanted out probably Dozzell the same. Wilson would have been worth keeping though. |
If we'd finished the season strongly and Cook had built belief and buy in amongst the squad, our Summer could've been very very different. |  |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:58 - Feb 20 with 1862 views | Veggie |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 09:43 - Feb 20 by jayessess |
Isn't the reverse coming to light? The more we get into this season, the more obvious it is that we had the makings of a decent first team already in the building.
Woolfenden, Wilson, McGuinness, KVY, Dozzell, Downes, Edwards, Parrott, Jackson, Norwood. That's 10 outfield players currently in our squad or playing for teams higher in the football league. |
The OP is correct. I doubt KM would have even looked twice at the job if we still had the likes of Chambers, Skuse and Judge as the spine(less) of our team. There’s no way we had the ability in the squad to play the way KM wants to play. |  | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:59 - Feb 20 with 1853 views | Trequartista |
Not sure Jackson's performance yesterday illustrates your point very well. |  |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:14 - Feb 20 with 1811 views | Tangledupin_Blue |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:58 - Feb 20 by Veggie |
The OP is correct. I doubt KM would have even looked twice at the job if we still had the likes of Chambers, Skuse and Judge as the spine(less) of our team. There’s no way we had the ability in the squad to play the way KM wants to play. |
I think that, if we can keep KMac for long enough, he could take us to the PL.
But he probably wouldn't have achieved a 70% winning start with last season's squad. | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:31 - Feb 20 with 1767 views | BlueandTruesince82 |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:14 - Feb 20 by Tangledupin_Blue |
I think that, if we can keep KMac for long enough, he could take us to the PL.
But he probably wouldn't have achieved a 70% winning start with last season's squad. |
Given half oh them are currently doing their best to drop out of l2 I'd agree |  |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:35 - Feb 20 with 1747 views | Hipsterectomy |
I have no problem with Cook and wish him well. I did notice that Chesterfield fans are getting a bit worried he is there more as an unofficial DoF role rather than a manager. The club didn't announce how long he was there, just that it was 'not short term', he hasn't done any media since the 're-joining the club' interview and I read he has only been at training 2 days with them since he joined.
I do wonder if his heart isn't in it there and he's just waiting for the right job to move to. |  |
| Walter Smith's Barmy Army |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:37 - Feb 20 with 1724 views | jayessess |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:31 - Feb 20 by BlueandTruesince82 |
Given half oh them are currently doing their best to drop out of l2 I'd agree |
And the other half have moved upwards or are still here. He only had to pick 11 of them every week! | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:44 - Feb 20 with 1711 views | BlueandTruesince82 |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:37 - Feb 20 by jayessess |
And the other half have moved upwards or are still here. He only had to pick 11 of them every week! |
Edwards can't game for Wigan (and was offered a contract)
Downes had pretty much downed tools since Palace came knocking and wanted out
Dozzell had his release clause met.
That leaves Wilson who is yet to actually get promted with Plymouth.
So 3 or the 4 beyond the clubs control really and tbr 4th in the same league.
As for those that remain, kudos for those that chose to keep them around the place.
Rest, L2 merchants who are barely keeping their heads above water. | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:46 - Feb 20 with 1704 views | pointofblue |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:44 - Feb 20 by BlueandTruesince82 |
Edwards can't game for Wigan (and was offered a contract)
Downes had pretty much downed tools since Palace came knocking and wanted out
Dozzell had his release clause met.
That leaves Wilson who is yet to actually get promted with Plymouth.
So 3 or the 4 beyond the clubs control really and tbr 4th in the same league.
As for those that remain, kudos for those that chose to keep them around the place.
Rest, L2 merchants who are barely keeping their heads above water. |
Yet when Cook took over we were two points off the sixth. Compared to this lot who are obviously better in quality and yet… | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:47 - Feb 20 with 1705 views | Veggie |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:44 - Feb 20 by BlueandTruesince82 |
Edwards can't game for Wigan (and was offered a contract)
Downes had pretty much downed tools since Palace came knocking and wanted out
Dozzell had his release clause met.
That leaves Wilson who is yet to actually get promted with Plymouth.
So 3 or the 4 beyond the clubs control really and tbr 4th in the same league.
As for those that remain, kudos for those that chose to keep them around the place.
Rest, L2 merchants who are barely keeping their heads above water. |
He speaks the truth | | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:50 - Feb 20 with 1702 views | theinbetweener |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:37 - Feb 20 by jayessess |
And the other half have moved upwards or are still here. He only had to pick 11 of them every week! |
Clutching a little bit here… you can’t deny that a mass clear out at the end of last season was needed. You only have to look at where Colchester are in L2 to realise that. They took on 7 members of our first team squad and they are battling to stay in the football league. I’m sorry but that says it all to me. With regards to other players, McGuinness was on loan, Parrott was on loan and not exactly torn up trees with MK (3 goals in 28 games?). Wilson was a solid defender but I’d suspect he wouldn’t work in KM’s system as a ball-playing CB - see Burgess.
Who does that leave? Downes, who was desperate to leave and we couldn’t stand in his way. Dozzell, who again would not have fitted into KM’s current setup, and Edwards, a bit-part player for Wigan with 1 goal in 20 games.
Am I missing something? | | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:54 - Feb 20 with 1693 views | Pendejo |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:45 - Feb 20 by pointofblue |
When Cook took over the apparently awful squad he inherited was two points off the play offs. When McKenna took over, the apparently superb squad had seen us drop ten points back from sixth and Oxford had a game in hand on us. Did we need an overhaul, or just a competent manager to get us over the line? |
The Cookie Monster simply not competent without his right hand.
He had a great opportunity and came out of it looking a worse manager than Lamberk. |  |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:56 - Feb 20 with 1683 views | pointofblue |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:44 - Feb 20 by BlueandTruesince82 |
Edwards can't game for Wigan (and was offered a contract)
Downes had pretty much downed tools since Palace came knocking and wanted out
Dozzell had his release clause met.
That leaves Wilson who is yet to actually get promted with Plymouth.
So 3 or the 4 beyond the clubs control really and tbr 4th in the same league.
As for those that remain, kudos for those that chose to keep them around the place.
Rest, L2 merchants who are barely keeping their heads above water. |
Maybe Lambert deserves more credit then he’s got then, considering the position he got the League Two merchants in before he was sacked. | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:56 - Feb 20 with 1682 views | jayessess |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:50 - Feb 20 by theinbetweener |
Clutching a little bit here… you can’t deny that a mass clear out at the end of last season was needed. You only have to look at where Colchester are in L2 to realise that. They took on 7 members of our first team squad and they are battling to stay in the football league. I’m sorry but that says it all to me. With regards to other players, McGuinness was on loan, Parrott was on loan and not exactly torn up trees with MK (3 goals in 28 games?). Wilson was a solid defender but I’d suspect he wouldn’t work in KM’s system as a ball-playing CB - see Burgess.
Who does that leave? Downes, who was desperate to leave and we couldn’t stand in his way. Dozzell, who again would not have fitted into KM’s current setup, and Edwards, a bit-part player for Wigan with 1 goal in 20 games.
Am I missing something? |
A mass clearout became necessary because Cook failed and threw the players under the bus to mask his failure.
If you fail to get anything out of a group of players and as a consequence the good ones leave and you sling the rest out, I don't see why you should get any credit for that happening.
Credit for then rebuilding the squad goes to the firefighters of Arizona and their generosity not Cook, ffs. [Post edited 20 Feb 2022 13:03]
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:56 - Feb 20 with 1682 views | jeera |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 11:58 - Feb 20 by Veggie |
The OP is correct. I doubt KM would have even looked twice at the job if we still had the likes of Chambers, Skuse and Judge as the spine(less) of our team. There’s no way we had the ability in the squad to play the way KM wants to play. |
But surely the suggestion isn't that he would have needed to.
All that squad needed to do was get us promoted that year, not this, and as has been pointed out a zillion times we were on the edge of the play-offs.
Some of that aging team would not have played in the Championship the following year had we managed to get through, nor would they have necessarily been here still had we not.
The point is the timing of his actions was damaging. Publicly making it clear most would be on the way out was terrible management, as bad as it gets.
So yes, as others have also pointed out, he had begun to turn on his new squad too.
Seriously, there is no supportive argument to be had, not really. |  |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:02 - Feb 20 with 1665 views | theinbetweener |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:56 - Feb 20 by pointofblue |
Maybe Lambert deserves more credit then he’s got then, considering the position he got the League Two merchants in before he was sacked. |
Maybe he does. But it doesn’t change the fact that a mass clear out would still have been needed long term. Say if we did somehow get promoted last season, how on Earth would that squad have been able to survive in the Championship? We’re a thousand times better off now than we were this time last season, regardless of league position/points gap to playoffs. We finally have a solid platform to build upon. | | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:04 - Feb 20 with 1658 views | PJH |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:56 - Feb 20 by pointofblue |
Maybe Lambert deserves more credit then he’s got then, considering the position he got the League Two merchants in before he was sacked. |
I think what ever angle you look at it from, Lambert was a better manager of ITFC than Cook was and Lambert was a huge failure so I am not sure exactly what that makes Cook. |  | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:12 - Feb 20 with 1618 views | jeera |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:02 - Feb 20 by theinbetweener |
Maybe he does. But it doesn’t change the fact that a mass clear out would still have been needed long term. Say if we did somehow get promoted last season, how on Earth would that squad have been able to survive in the Championship? We’re a thousand times better off now than we were this time last season, regardless of league position/points gap to playoffs. We finally have a solid platform to build upon. |
"how on Earth would that squad have been able to survive in the Championship?"
Unless there's some rule a club isn't allowed to make transfers when promoted to the Championship, I can't be alone in finding this line confusing. | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:14 - Feb 20 with 1615 views | theinbetweener |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:56 - Feb 20 by jayessess |
A mass clearout became necessary because Cook failed and threw the players under the bus to mask his failure.
If you fail to get anything out of a group of players and as a consequence the good ones leave and you sling the rest out, I don't see why you should get any credit for that happening.
Credit for then rebuilding the squad goes to the firefighters of Arizona and their generosity not Cook, ffs. [Post edited 20 Feb 2022 13:03]
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Are you happier with the squad we have now, than the one we had this time last year? | | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:18 - Feb 20 with 1601 views | theinbetweener |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:12 - Feb 20 by jeera |
"how on Earth would that squad have been able to survive in the Championship?"
Unless there's some rule a club isn't allowed to make transfers when promoted to the Championship, I can't be alone in finding this line confusing. |
But it still would have needed the complete squad overhaul, which is what this post is about isn’t it? | | | |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:29 - Feb 20 with 1573 views | jayessess |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:14 - Feb 20 by theinbetweener |
Are you happier with the squad we have now, than the one we had this time last year? |
I'm happier with this year's squad (although not across the board, I think it's illogical to believe most of our midfielders are better than Downes and Dozzell, for instance). But I give managers much much more credit for improving players than I do for spending someone else's money. | |
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| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 13:31 - Feb 20 with 1557 views | BlueandTruesince82 |
| Lots of little digs at Cook but on 12:46 - Feb 20 by pointofblue |
Yet when Cook took over we were two points off the sixth. Compared to this lot who are obviously better in quality and yet… |
They were in free fall though weren't they.. 2 game dead cat bounce when Lambert left but otherwise we had been awful.....let's remember we had been top (just like we had been the previous year) and this a squad most of whom had played together for years.
Compared to this lot who have only known each other 5 mind and yet.....already look like more a unit then than the other lot ever did. | |
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