| Squad as it stands 10:05 - May 18 with 9808 views | itfcjoe |
GK (3) - Walton, Hladky, Hayes
RB (2) - Clarke, Donacien
LB (2) - Davis, Leigh
CB (4) - Woolfenden, Burgess, Edmundson, Ndaba, Baggott*
CM (6) - Morsy, Evans, Ball, Camara, El Mizouni, Harper, Humphreys*
W/AM (6) - Burns, Chaplin, Harness, Jackson, Edwards, Broadhead
ST (4) - Ladapo, Ahadme, Pigott, Yengi
That makes us at 27 - which is the squad limit, plus 2 youngsters in Baggott and Humphreys
It doesn't include any of the out of contract players, most notably Luongo
So we really are in a 1 in, 1 out position....because I think we can safely say Harper and Pigott will play no part for us next season
Likely that all of Ndaba, Ahadme, Yengi and El Miz fall into that category too.
But does feel we will be right up against that 25 man limit - even if those 4 don't play, we will need to lose a couple more out as well
[Post edited 18 May 2023 10:06]
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| Squad as it stands on 15:20 - May 18 with 1641 views | itfcjoe |
| Squad as it stands on 15:15 - May 18 by ScotBlue |
Might have missed it and living up here in Scotland completely plausible, but not seen KVY mentioned in the "Squad". Is he out of contract this year. For my thoughts I would think he will be moved on anyway. I'm not sure we will see a massive turnover of players. This squad is easily good enough to hold their own in the Championship. If the right option comes available realistically anywhere that upgrades the current incumbent and has the value of their "asset" increasing then I can see us going for them, in the same way as Clarke and Broadhead being bought in during Jan. I think the Jan window may be more interesting as we will be able to gauge where we are and it may be the case as with this year that the powers that be go all in if there is a possibility of getting into the promotion battle. |
I've not included any of the out of contract players for now:
Coleman
KVY
Keogh
Aluko
Penney
Luongo | |
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| Squad as it stands on 15:22 - May 18 with 1614 views | Vaughan8 |
| Squad as it stands on 15:18 - May 18 by jayessess |
I keep seeing the phrase "I'd be very surprised if we kept..." used in connection with players we have still under contract. It's very puzzling to me. Any under contract player that contributed to this season is probably likelier than not to still be here when the Window closes.
There's some where there's a possibility, even a strong possibility, that they'll be surplus to requirements. But I don't think there's anyone who would be a big surprise if they're still in the squad. Why would anyone be surprised to see Marcus Harness still here, when we paid a big fee for him, gave him a 4-year contract less than a year ago, then picked him in every matchday squad he was available for? |
Agreed. Our plan was to go up. These players brought in i'm sure were with a view of them being able to play in the championship.
Players like Harness started well and faded a bit in the second half, but he had an injury and unfortunately Broadhead was so good.
Personally I don't think many of the players in the majority of the squads are going to leave unless they want to for first team football AND we receive money we want for them. |  | | |
| Squad as it stands on 15:24 - May 18 with 1612 views | DanTheMan |
| Squad as it stands on 15:18 - May 18 by jayessess |
I keep seeing the phrase "I'd be very surprised if we kept..." used in connection with players we have still under contract. It's very puzzling to me. Any under contract player that contributed to this season is probably likelier than not to still be here when the Window closes.
There's some where there's a possibility, even a strong possibility, that they'll be surplus to requirements. But I don't think there's anyone who would be a big surprise if they're still in the squad. Why would anyone be surprised to see Marcus Harness still here, when we paid a big fee for him, gave him a 4-year contract less than a year ago, then picked him in every matchday squad he was available for? |
I certainly wouldn't be surprised if we kept Harness (and he's ahead of other players in that position) but at the same time, I genuinely think he was struggling for the second half of the season.
It's the same with someone like Edwards. He's versatile and can do a job but he never truly shone at League One. Are we going to want to keep him around or cash in? |  |
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| Squad as it stands on 15:25 - May 18 with 1600 views | Herbivore |
| Squad as it stands on 14:46 - May 18 by jayessess |
My prediction, as it stands.
We'll look to upgrade the first team, then see who is surplus to requirements once we've done that, rather than signing many fringe players.
I think we'll make 5 signings:
An experienced centre back capable of playing on the left side of defence.
A centre midfielder who's athletic, capable of driving forward with the ball, is a threat running into the box.
A right-winger who can job share with Wes Burns 60/30
A centre forward in George Hirst's mould.
An inside-forward/shadow striker who can job share with Nathan Broadhead 60/30 and be an alternative to the other 2 strikers.
Ndaba, Baggott and Ahadme will get further loans. Harper, Pigott and Yengi will move on permanently.
Hladky will stay on as Number 2. El Mizouni will be so good in pre-season that he'll force his way into the first team squad. Humphreys will be kept around too.
Once we've done all that, we'll have 26 seniors - 3 GKs, 4 full backs, 4 centre backs, 6 centre midfielders, 6 attacking midfielders, 3 forwards - and we'll look to get rid of 1 out of Harness, Jackson and Edwards. |
That would leave us very bloated in the middle of the park though, even without offering Luongo a deal. We'd have Morsy, new signing, Camara, Evans, Ball, El Miz, and Humphreys all vying for two slots and a spot on the bench. Seven players feels too many. I'm struggling to see a way in for El Miz to be honest, his best hope is he impresses hugely in training before we've signed another CM and he effectively becomes that new CM signing for next season, but I think that's unlikely in the current set up. [Post edited 18 May 2023 15:26]
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| Squad as it stands on 15:28 - May 18 with 1578 views | PhilTWTD |
| Squad as it stands on 13:25 - May 18 by Asa |
I could see it being something like
GK (3) - Walton, Hladky, NEW GK (Veteran backup)
RB (2) - Clarke, Donacien
LB (2) - Davis, Leigh
CB (4) - Woolfenden, Burgess, NEW LCB, NEW RCB,
CM (6) - Morsy, Ball, Camara, Humphreys, NEW CM, NEW CM (Luongo)
W/AM (6) - Burns, Chaplin, Jackson, Edwards, Broadhead, NEW W, NEW AM
ST (4) - Ladapo, NEW CF
Would not be surprised if we lost Harness, Evans, Edmundson and brought in 7-8 that were seen as upgrades on what we have right now on the basis that the best players will win out.
Normally you'd be against ripping up a promoted squad and the camaraderie, but we brought in 4 in January and yet again got the right talent and characters, so cannot see why we wouldn't have a big list of those likely to fit the bill this time around.
Someone posted something about a combined Town and Norwich XI which I thought was interesting as I got as far as Walton, Davis, Morsy, Luongo (possibly), Chaplin (possibly) and Broadhead at best. That's half our best players improving a squad that finished mid-table.
If we want to go up again in the next year or two, and that will be the ambition, I expect we will be utterly ruthless again and end up with 18 that sees our current 11 as potentially the weakest of that new 18, in the same way Donacien, Harness, Humphries (different I know) were effectly upgraded 4 months ago despite us being right in the mix. |
I'd expect Hladky to move on for first-team football. Veteran back-up certainly possible but on a different note wonder whether we'd be interested in Luke Southwood, who has just been released by Reading after impressive season at Cheltenham. |  | | |
| Squad as it stands on 15:45 - May 18 with 1497 views | jayessess |
| Squad as it stands on 15:24 - May 18 by DanTheMan |
I certainly wouldn't be surprised if we kept Harness (and he's ahead of other players in that position) but at the same time, I genuinely think he was struggling for the second half of the season.
It's the same with someone like Edwards. He's versatile and can do a job but he never truly shone at League One. Are we going to want to keep him around or cash in? |
Think it's tough to see us getting the kind of deal we'd want for either player really. Hull only got £200k for Malik Wilks last Summer and he'd scored a ton of goals in League One not very long ago.
Would we take that sort of fee for Harness or Edwards? I doubt it. Harness we wouldn't take that kind of hit, Edwards we might as well loan out for a season as take that kind of fee. |  |
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| Squad as it stands on 15:52 - May 18 with 1490 views | nodge_blue |
Did we have 3 goal keepers in our squad this year? Can't we have 2 and emergency loan one of needed?
I think if offers cames in for a couple in that squad then we will accept them.
Moving players on though if they don't want to leave will be very hard. They've fought so long to be a championship player I wouldn't blame them so wanting to stay. |  |
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| Squad as it stands on 15:53 - May 18 with 1489 views | PhilTWTD |
| Squad as it stands on 15:52 - May 18 by nodge_blue |
Did we have 3 goal keepers in our squad this year? Can't we have 2 and emergency loan one of needed?
I think if offers cames in for a couple in that squad then we will accept them.
Moving players on though if they don't want to leave will be very hard. They've fought so long to be a championship player I wouldn't blame them so wanting to stay. |
Goalkeepers didn't count as members of the squad in League One but do in the Championship. Not sure the EFL is that lenient on allowing emergency keepers. Realistically, we're going to need three.
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
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| Squad as it stands on 15:59 - May 18 with 1467 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Squad as it stands on 15:45 - May 18 by jayessess |
Think it's tough to see us getting the kind of deal we'd want for either player really. Hull only got £200k for Malik Wilks last Summer and he'd scored a ton of goals in League One not very long ago.
Would we take that sort of fee for Harness or Edwards? I doubt it. Harness we wouldn't take that kind of hit, Edwards we might as well loan out for a season as take that kind of fee. |
As highlighted in this thread, I suspect we are going to want to level up and bring in 6-8 players. I'd think 2 of Jackson, Harness and Edwards are going to go. If players aren't going to make the 25 then they are going to go one way or another. [Post edited 18 May 2023 16:00]
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| Squad as it stands on 16:05 - May 18 with 1442 views | jayessess |
| Squad as it stands on 15:52 - May 18 by nodge_blue |
Did we have 3 goal keepers in our squad this year? Can't we have 2 and emergency loan one of needed?
I think if offers cames in for a couple in that squad then we will accept them.
Moving players on though if they don't want to leave will be very hard. They've fought so long to be a championship player I wouldn't blame them so wanting to stay. |
We had 3 senior keepers on our books (Walton, Hladky, Hayes) but League One has different rules, smaller squads (22 not 25) but keepers aren't counted.
Quite a lot of Championship clubs only registered two senior keepers. Sheffield United, Sunderland, Preston, Birmingham, Cardiff, Coventry, Reading, Wigan (2 goalkeepers total), QPR, Rotherham and Burnley (2 seniors keeper and an U21). Bristol City only registered 1! (Their backup was 20). | |
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| Squad as it stands on 16:12 - May 18 with 1416 views | BiGDonnie |
| Squad as it stands on 15:28 - May 18 by PhilTWTD |
I'd expect Hladky to move on for first-team football. Veteran back-up certainly possible but on a different note wonder whether we'd be interested in Luke Southwood, who has just been released by Reading after impressive season at Cheltenham. |
What's Mike Salmon up to these days? |  |
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| Squad as it stands on 16:39 - May 18 with 1345 views | jayessess |
| Squad as it stands on 15:59 - May 18 by tractorboy1978 |
As highlighted in this thread, I suspect we are going to want to level up and bring in 6-8 players. I'd think 2 of Jackson, Harness and Edwards are going to go. If players aren't going to make the 25 then they are going to go one way or another. [Post edited 18 May 2023 16:00]
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We're down 3 forwards on last season's squad strength already (TJJ, Hirst, Aluko), so we're off to recruit 5 (maybe 6!) forwards this Summer? Can't see that as a great use of our resources, tbh. | |
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| Squad as it stands on 17:06 - May 18 with 1319 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Squad as it stands on 16:39 - May 18 by jayessess |
We're down 3 forwards on last season's squad strength already (TJJ, Hirst, Aluko), so we're off to recruit 5 (maybe 6!) forwards this Summer? Can't see that as a great use of our resources, tbh. |
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Hirst, TJJ + 3 other attacking options across the front 4 positions, including a couple of loans of decent PL youngsters. It depends how much we are 'going for it' and wanting to push on I guess. | | | |
| Squad as it stands on 17:26 - May 18 with 1294 views | Vegtablue |
| Squad as it stands on 15:18 - May 18 by jayessess |
I keep seeing the phrase "I'd be very surprised if we kept..." used in connection with players we have still under contract. It's very puzzling to me. Any under contract player that contributed to this season is probably likelier than not to still be here when the Window closes.
There's some where there's a possibility, even a strong possibility, that they'll be surplus to requirements. But I don't think there's anyone who would be a big surprise if they're still in the squad. Why would anyone be surprised to see Marcus Harness still here, when we paid a big fee for him, gave him a 4-year contract less than a year ago, then picked him in every matchday squad he was available for? |
I think there's something to be said for avoiding the sunk cost fallacy. If a player is brought in and found unable to meet the required standard, finding a temporary or permanent home is the right decision when it's financially viable to replace them with better.
I don't put forward this applies to Harness (I agree with Dan honestly!) and would be surprised if McKenna decides he isn't part of the 25 next season. Like you say, he was signed to play a part at this level.
If we remove those who didn't contribute last season from Joe's OP, excluding the goalkeepers and the hopefully-not-terminally-injured Camara, we come to 21 seniors. Luongo, Hirst and JJ would take us to 24. So I understand why there would be a feeling of big surprise if all our under contract contributors remain, as it would mean either passing on players many of us felt were part of the future, or making very few new additions (potentially just one). That would leave us one position stronger in what is by all accounts a more challenging league.
*Two positions stronger if we chose to drop a keeper. [Post edited 18 May 2023 17:31]
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| Squad as it stands on 17:36 - May 18 with 1285 views | jayessess |
| Squad as it stands on 17:06 - May 18 by tractorboy1978 |
I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Hirst, TJJ + 3 other attacking options across the front 4 positions, including a couple of loans of decent PL youngsters. It depends how much we are 'going for it' and wanting to push on I guess. |
I would.
Hirst, Broadhead, Chaplin, Burns as a front four would be two big money new signings and our two most recent POTS. Hard to imagine that we're immediately looking to upgrade 2 or 3 of those.
Which really leaves the next rank of players and habitually replacing in-contract squad players is expensive, time-consuming and usually leaves you with little better than you already had. Replacing them with loanees is doubly expensive, time-consuming, short-termist and sometimes just a total bust, Louie Barry style.
Also the more players you have to integrate the less likely you are to "push on" in the short term. | |
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| Squad as it stands on 19:55 - May 18 with 1173 views | le2blue |
| Squad as it stands on 16:12 - May 18 by BiGDonnie |
What's Mike Salmon up to these days? |
What is Bart up to? Still lives in Ipswich and has been number two at Millwall. |  | | |
| Squad as it stands on 20:31 - May 18 with 1143 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Squad as it stands on 17:36 - May 18 by jayessess |
I would.
Hirst, Broadhead, Chaplin, Burns as a front four would be two big money new signings and our two most recent POTS. Hard to imagine that we're immediately looking to upgrade 2 or 3 of those.
Which really leaves the next rank of players and habitually replacing in-contract squad players is expensive, time-consuming and usually leaves you with little better than you already had. Replacing them with loanees is doubly expensive, time-consuming, short-termist and sometimes just a total bust, Louie Barry style.
Also the more players you have to integrate the less likely you are to "push on" in the short term. |
With the 5 subs rule now you are looking at using 8 players in those positions most weeks though, plus I suspect we will see more rotation than we saw at the back end of last season. The drop off between Harness/Broadhead and Burns/Jackson was stark at L1 level, it’s going to be bigger in the Championship. If we have aspirations of pushing for a top 6 spot and sustaining a promotion push next season I think we are going to see a couple of upgrades come in personally.
They will look to improve the squad and it’ll be up to Burns, Chaplin, Broadhead to perform well enough to earn their place as starters rather than assuming they go into next season as first choice! [Post edited 18 May 2023 20:44]
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| Squad as it stands on 20:44 - May 18 with 1124 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Squad as it stands on 19:55 - May 18 by le2blue |
What is Bart up to? Still lives in Ipswich and has been number two at Millwall. |
Son also plays for town doesn't he? |  |
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| Squad as it stands on 20:58 - May 18 with 1115 views | Herbivore |
| Squad as it stands on 20:44 - May 18 by FrimleyBlue |
Son also plays for town doesn't he? |
No mate, he plays for Spurs. | |
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| Squad as it stands on 21:10 - May 18 with 1092 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Squad as it stands on 20:58 - May 18 by Herbivore |
No mate, he plays for Spurs. |
You nearly had me there. | |
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