| Liam Delap 16:58 - Apr 24 with 7788 views | _clive_baker_ |
Ole Ole.
I've resigned myself to losing him in the summer and still think that's most likely, but are we sure this £30m clause is legit?. Ashton said we're 'very very very well protected' (3 x very's no less) with regards to his contract. I'm not sure £30m would meet that definition.
McKenna has said twice now in recent pressers that's its possible Delap stays here. I guess its possible the clause exists and he still decides to stay, and I wouldn't necessarily expect him to come out and say he's off, but we seem to be taking the £30m figure as gospel from the media when as far as I know nobody has officially confirmed it? |  | | |  |
| Liam Delap on 06:47 - Apr 25 with 1417 views | Horsham |
| Liam Delap on 00:29 - Apr 25 by ReusersTown |
The most confusing and hopeful part of it all from my perspective is Ashton's statement 2 weeks before the apparent £30 mill clause reveal. I just don't understand why he would have emphasized how well we are protected if that clause existed. What does he have to gain from that, he would know that spinning such a low fee wouldn't be possible. |
You’re right the messaging from the club both from KMac and especially Ashton isn’t consistent with the news story on the release clause. They could very easily have not stressed how well protected we are and not said about Delap potentially not leaving and I don’t really see what they gain by doing so if we’re not well protected and Delap is definitely leaving. |  | | |
| Liam Delap on 07:05 - Apr 25 with 1383 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Liam Delap on 19:49 - Apr 24 by HighgateBlue |
(a) if it's last year, I know nothing of Liam Delap. I trust Kieran, but he might be a flop, much like any number of our other signings might be. Apart from Kalvin Phillips. He's bound to be brilliant.
(b) those were not the terms of the deal. There were three (maybe 4) important differences:
1) we paid a huge transfer fee. He wasn't free.
2) we had to pay his wages. He wasn't free.
3) we weren't guaranteed £10m profit, or even a penny recouped on the transfer fee.
4) I'm not even certain the profit will be £10m given the reported sell on clause in City's favour.
If he'd got injured or been rubbish, that would be huge money down the drain. It was a risk. The rewards of him being half decent should have been ours. And if he was stellar (as turned out to be the case), then the rewards should have been bigger.
You can perfectly well say "It's April 2025. We've had Delap for a season, he's scored some great goals and been wonderful, and we make £10m profit on him, come on, that's not bad business." And that's a respectable argument.
But it's not the same as saying that the deal that was actually done was good AT THE TIME, i.e. when nobody knew whether Delap would be either awesome, out of his depth, somewhere in between, or injured.
None of us knows exactly what the clause says, and that's part of the problem. Nor do we know what other suitors Delap had, at what price, or what terms might have been available. It is possible that Ashton got the best deal possible.
However, to have to accept 50% of what he's realistically worth, AND give some of that to City leaves us with a percentage return (and more importantly an absolute cash return) that seems inadequate given quite how much better Delap has turned out to be than anyone could reasonably have hoped.
Plus, the most frustrating thing about this is that it's not powerful City that have got one over on us, it's Delap. As it's being reported, this is not a matching deal in City's favour, or an option to buy in City's favour. It's an option in /Delap's/ favour to require that he be released from his contract if we are relegated and receive a bid of a certain amount (said to be £30m). That seems a very advantageous clause for a young unproven player to have negotiated in circumstances where the clause was bad for BOTH clubs involved in the deal (Town obviously would prefer it not to exist, and City's sell on fee will be depressed by the £30m depressed sale price).
So if it's as reported, I don't think Ashton has done brilliantly. But without Delap, this season would have been so much worse, and we've made a profit that's probably similar to an entirely year's season ticket income. Worse things happen at sea. |
"Nor do we know what other suitors Delap had"
We do. He was literally in the offcies of Southampton. Ashton had two choices, take it or leave it. People complaining now are doing so with the benefit of hindsight. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Liam Delap on 07:16 - Apr 25 with 1366 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Liam Delap on 00:07 - Apr 25 by PhilTWTD |
I don't see it. Chelsea and Man U favourites as it stands, from what I gather. See no reason why LD would want to stay here next year. Don't see him getting a place in the World Cup squad if he's playing in the Championship. |
Realistically I don't see him getting a place in the World Cup squad anyway. He's great, but he's still too raw IMO.
And maybe, with McKenna's reputation and what Delap's experienced himself, he thinks his development has been and will be better here.
Perhaps his development had been stalling at Man City (he hadn't scored many on loan in the Champ and several people thought £15m was a huge gamble). Maybe his devlopment has come on leaps and bounds since joining us, he wants more of that, and he's still young so is in no rush to a big club's bench. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Liam Delap on 07:29 - Apr 25 with 1343 views | Horsham |
| Liam Delap on 07:16 - Apr 25 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Realistically I don't see him getting a place in the World Cup squad anyway. He's great, but he's still too raw IMO.
And maybe, with McKenna's reputation and what Delap's experienced himself, he thinks his development has been and will be better here.
Perhaps his development had been stalling at Man City (he hadn't scored many on loan in the Champ and several people thought £15m was a huge gamble). Maybe his devlopment has come on leaps and bounds since joining us, he wants more of that, and he's still young so is in no rush to a big club's bench. |
If he scores 15-20 goals for a Brighton, Bournemouth Brentford etc I think he’d comfortably force his way into the conversation for the World Cup squad.
If we keep him I think we’ll have done something truly incredible. | | | |
| Liam Delap on 07:54 - Apr 25 with 1282 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Liam Delap on 07:29 - Apr 25 by Horsham |
If he scores 15-20 goals for a Brighton, Bournemouth Brentford etc I think he’d comfortably force his way into the conversation for the World Cup squad.
If we keep him I think we’ll have done something truly incredible. |
That's a lot of big ifs... if any of them buy him and if he were to get those goals (and persumably, therefore, if he develops as well with these clubs as with us, and if he starts regularly). I'm dealing in what we know rather than ifs. But yes I still agree we'd have done something truly incredible to keep him. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Liam Delap on 08:04 - Apr 25 with 1257 views | Herbivore |
| Liam Delap on 07:29 - Apr 25 by Horsham |
If he scores 15-20 goals for a Brighton, Bournemouth Brentford etc I think he’d comfortably force his way into the conversation for the World Cup squad.
If we keep him I think we’ll have done something truly incredible. |
I don't think he even needs a season that good to be honest. This season only Palmer and Watkins as Englishmen have more Prem goals than him. Obviously Kane will still be around next year and he and Watkins look fairly nailed on for the squad but we'll want a third striking option and Delap is already close to being given a chance to show what he can do as that third option. A few pundits thought he might make Tuchel's first squad. Another solid season in double figures and he's got a good chance of making the squad. He absolutely doesn't have a chance if he stays with us and plays in the Championship. |  |
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| Liam Delap on 08:22 - Apr 25 with 1234 views | Kieran_Knows |
| Liam Delap on 00:29 - Apr 25 by ReusersTown |
The most confusing and hopeful part of it all from my perspective is Ashton's statement 2 weeks before the apparent £30 mill clause reveal. I just don't understand why he would have emphasized how well we are protected if that clause existed. What does he have to gain from that, he would know that spinning such a low fee wouldn't be possible. |
I’m not really sure why people get so hung up on what Ashton says really. He’s hardly going to come out and say ‘sorry all, but we negotiated a pretty cr4p deal for Delap last summer as we didn’t think he’d have the sort of impact he has done’. |  |
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| Liam Delap on 08:26 - Apr 25 with 1218 views | Herbivore |
| Liam Delap on 08:22 - Apr 25 by Kieran_Knows |
I’m not really sure why people get so hung up on what Ashton says really. He’s hardly going to come out and say ‘sorry all, but we negotiated a pretty cr4p deal for Delap last summer as we didn’t think he’d have the sort of impact he has done’. |
I guess he'd argue that a deal that doubles our money in a year if we go down is us being protected. | |
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| Liam Delap on 08:44 - Apr 25 with 1157 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Liam Delap on 08:04 - Apr 25 by Herbivore |
I don't think he even needs a season that good to be honest. This season only Palmer and Watkins as Englishmen have more Prem goals than him. Obviously Kane will still be around next year and he and Watkins look fairly nailed on for the squad but we'll want a third striking option and Delap is already close to being given a chance to show what he can do as that third option. A few pundits thought he might make Tuchel's first squad. Another solid season in double figures and he's got a good chance of making the squad. He absolutely doesn't have a chance if he stays with us and plays in the Championship. |
Although it's rare, players at the top of the Championship have indeed made the England squad. "Another solid season in double figures" is quite an assumption too. He could just as easily find himself on a Prem bench devloping/learning and not getting much game time ahead of more established Prem strikers, in which case he also has little chance of making the England squad anyway.
He's trained with them, so maybe he's been told he's a consideration wherever he is, as long as he's match fit. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Liam Delap on 09:20 - Apr 25 with 1064 views | Herbivore |
| Liam Delap on 08:44 - Apr 25 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Although it's rare, players at the top of the Championship have indeed made the England squad. "Another solid season in double figures" is quite an assumption too. He could just as easily find himself on a Prem bench devloping/learning and not getting much game time ahead of more established Prem strikers, in which case he also has little chance of making the England squad anyway.
He's trained with them, so maybe he's been told he's a consideration wherever he is, as long as he's match fit. |
It's very, very rare for Championship players to get selected for England though. It can happen but in practice it hasn't happened much over the last couple of decades and it'd be a huge gamble for him to stay in the hope he bucks that trend. I don't know why people think he's not going to get much game time if he leaves to be honest, he's going to play plenty wherever he ends up. He's a better player than anyone United or Chelsea have up front, imo, and would be first choice at a lot of other Prem clubs too. With these bigger clubs competing on a number of fronts as well, there's always going to be lots of opportunities for him to play. | |
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| Liam Delap on 09:24 - Apr 25 with 1058 views | PhilTWTD |
| Liam Delap on 07:16 - Apr 25 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Realistically I don't see him getting a place in the World Cup squad anyway. He's great, but he's still too raw IMO.
And maybe, with McKenna's reputation and what Delap's experienced himself, he thinks his development has been and will be better here.
Perhaps his development had been stalling at Man City (he hadn't scored many on loan in the Champ and several people thought £15m was a huge gamble). Maybe his devlopment has come on leaps and bounds since joining us, he wants more of that, and he's still young so is in no rush to a big club's bench. |
I reckon he'll fancy his chances of making it and being in the Championship would all but end any hopes. From what I hear it's a case of picking which of Man U or Chelsea he joins, as it stands at the moment anyway. |  | | |
| Liam Delap on 09:31 - Apr 25 with 1029 views | PhilTWTD |
| Liam Delap on 08:04 - Apr 25 by Herbivore |
I don't think he even needs a season that good to be honest. This season only Palmer and Watkins as Englishmen have more Prem goals than him. Obviously Kane will still be around next year and he and Watkins look fairly nailed on for the squad but we'll want a third striking option and Delap is already close to being given a chance to show what he can do as that third option. A few pundits thought he might make Tuchel's first squad. Another solid season in double figures and he's got a good chance of making the squad. He absolutely doesn't have a chance if he stays with us and plays in the Championship. |
I think the only reason he wasn't in Tuchel's squad was that they wanted him involved with the U21s at the tournament in the summer. | | | |
| Liam Delap on 09:37 - Apr 25 with 1007 views | PhilTWTD |
| Liam Delap on 08:44 - Apr 25 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Although it's rare, players at the top of the Championship have indeed made the England squad. "Another solid season in double figures" is quite an assumption too. He could just as easily find himself on a Prem bench devloping/learning and not getting much game time ahead of more established Prem strikers, in which case he also has little chance of making the England squad anyway.
He's trained with them, so maybe he's been told he's a consideration wherever he is, as long as he's match fit. |
Not for a while, I can remember Stuart Pearce and Steve Bull, but none springs to mind more recently. | | | |
| Liam Delap on 09:41 - Apr 25 with 996 views | Herbivore |
| Liam Delap on 09:37 - Apr 25 by PhilTWTD |
Not for a while, I can remember Stuart Pearce and Steve Bull, but none springs to mind more recently. |
I think Michael Gray may have got a call up when Sunderland were in the Championship but not 100% sure. We'd just won promotion when Richard Wright first got called up I think. | |
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| Liam Delap on 09:46 - Apr 25 with 983 views | Garv |
| Liam Delap on 08:04 - Apr 25 by Herbivore |
I don't think he even needs a season that good to be honest. This season only Palmer and Watkins as Englishmen have more Prem goals than him. Obviously Kane will still be around next year and he and Watkins look fairly nailed on for the squad but we'll want a third striking option and Delap is already close to being given a chance to show what he can do as that third option. A few pundits thought he might make Tuchel's first squad. Another solid season in double figures and he's got a good chance of making the squad. He absolutely doesn't have a chance if he stays with us and plays in the Championship. |
Even Kane will be getting on at that stage.
He should have made way a couple of times for Watkins during the Euros last summer, so two years on from then who knows what the situation will be.
Always possible a young hot shot comes through in the next year but barring that I think Delap should be nailed on as long as he continues in the same vein as current. Solanke probably still in with a shot Delap has had a better season this year.
I always want Delap to go now. He's got no business being in the Championship and imagine if he, for whatever reason, had a terrible season or got a massive injury. He deserves to test himself at a big club. |  |
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| Liam Delap on 09:47 - Apr 25 with 988 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Liam Delap on 00:29 - Apr 25 by ReusersTown |
The most confusing and hopeful part of it all from my perspective is Ashton's statement 2 weeks before the apparent £30 mill clause reveal. I just don't understand why he would have emphasized how well we are protected if that clause existed. What does he have to gain from that, he would know that spinning such a low fee wouldn't be possible. |
That’s it for me. IF it exists as reported then I don’t see a world where he stays. He’ll have dozens of options including some of Europe’s biggest clubs vs championship Ipswich. Common sense tells you he goes.
The comments from MA and KM have me wondering if the clause is as clear cut as has been reported though. IF it is I just don’t see any hope he stays and therefore I’m surprised by the comments. | | | |
| Liam Delap on 09:48 - Apr 25 with 979 views | PhilTWTD |
| Liam Delap on 09:41 - Apr 25 by Herbivore |
I think Michael Gray may have got a call up when Sunderland were in the Championship but not 100% sure. We'd just won promotion when Richard Wright first got called up I think. |
Was trying to remember whether he or Kieron got calls prior to their caps, and they may have done. | | | |
| Liam Delap on 10:00 - Apr 25 with 941 views | Herbivore |
| Liam Delap on 09:48 - Apr 25 by PhilTWTD |
Was trying to remember whether he or Kieron got calls prior to their caps, and they may have done. |
I have a recollection of them being invited to train with the senior squad but not officially called up. Wright got his first cap in the summer of 2000 just after we'd won the play offs. | |
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| Liam Delap on 10:00 - Apr 25 with 942 views | tcblue |
None of us can look at this critically as we're all fans and won't be able to take all of that emotion attachment for our team out of it, but Liam won't want to play Championship football, won't need to, and therefore will go in the summer. |  | | |
| Liam Delap on 10:32 - Apr 25 with 862 views | ReusersTown |
| Liam Delap on 08:22 - Apr 25 by Kieran_Knows |
I’m not really sure why people get so hung up on what Ashton says really. He’s hardly going to come out and say ‘sorry all, but we negotiated a pretty cr4p deal for Delap last summer as we didn’t think he’d have the sort of impact he has done’. |
Ummm because he's the CEO and one of the few people who knows what the deal is? He wouldn't say that no, but why would he be actively bigging up the deal If he knows that's not the case, he'd just be setting himself up for a fall, and I'd give him more credit that to make that mistake. | | | |
| Liam Delap on 10:36 - Apr 25 with 849 views | ReusersTown |
| Liam Delap on 09:24 - Apr 25 by PhilTWTD |
I reckon he'll fancy his chances of making it and being in the Championship would all but end any hopes. From what I hear it's a case of picking which of Man U or Chelsea he joins, as it stands at the moment anyway. |
It would be a different context to the usual Championship call up would be the caveat there though. Having already shown what he can do in the Prem, following that up with bags of goals in the Championship may well do him more favours than more time on a big club bench. Not that I think he would be bench warming looking at Chelsea & Man Utd's current options. [Post edited 25 Apr 10:36]
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| Liam Delap on 10:50 - Apr 25 with 812 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Liam Delap on 09:20 - Apr 25 by Herbivore |
It's very, very rare for Championship players to get selected for England though. It can happen but in practice it hasn't happened much over the last couple of decades and it'd be a huge gamble for him to stay in the hope he bucks that trend. I don't know why people think he's not going to get much game time if he leaves to be honest, he's going to play plenty wherever he ends up. He's a better player than anyone United or Chelsea have up front, imo, and would be first choice at a lot of other Prem clubs too. With these bigger clubs competing on a number of fronts as well, there's always going to be lots of opportunities for him to play. |
I'm not saying he won't get much game time, I'm saying there's a much greater chance he won't compared to Ipswich. Man U and Chelsea can both go out and buy a proven striker, and keep developing Delap. He's great but raw and young. I can't see a top team like them relying on him (like Ipswich would).
I'm playing devil's avocado/clutching at straws somewhat, but as Joe's post above shows, a world where he stays isn't totally bonkers. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Liam Delap on 10:59 - Apr 25 with 774 views | N2_Blue |
| Liam Delap on 00:07 - Apr 25 by PhilTWTD |
I don't see it. Chelsea and Man U favourites as it stands, from what I gather. See no reason why LD would want to stay here next year. Don't see him getting a place in the World Cup squad if he's playing in the Championship. |
Quite.
Anyone thinking there is a chance of Delap being here next season are living in cloud cuckoo land. The player could easily become England's number 9 for the next tournament and iwith his talent has an incredible career ahead of him. He's just not going to be kicking a ball around in the Championship next season. It just isn't going to happen. He needs ot be playing at the highest level. He's too good not to be. |  |
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| Liam Delap on 11:04 - Apr 25 with 743 views | Blueschev |
| Liam Delap on 09:37 - Apr 25 by PhilTWTD |
Not for a while, I can remember Stuart Pearce and Steve Bull, but none springs to mind more recently. |
Theo Walcott hadn't played a premier league game when Sven called him up, he'd just left Southampton. |  | | |
| Liam Delap on 11:11 - Apr 25 with 729 views | itfcjoe |
| Liam Delap on 10:59 - Apr 25 by N2_Blue |
Quite.
Anyone thinking there is a chance of Delap being here next season are living in cloud cuckoo land. The player could easily become England's number 9 for the next tournament and iwith his talent has an incredible career ahead of him. He's just not going to be kicking a ball around in the Championship next season. It just isn't going to happen. He needs ot be playing at the highest level. He's too good not to be. |
Whilst that would have been my view yesterday morning, the chances have risen since that point with the comments from McKenna and Ornstein.
It still feels hugely unlikely, but that is a step in the right direction from impossible! |  |
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