| Woolfy off? on 09:40 - May 28 with 1683 views | TractorJack |
| Woolfy off? on 09:27 - May 28 by Herbivore |
Burgess' curved ball down the line for Davis or into the inside left channel for Hirst is a very lovely thing, he has massively improved on the ball. I think what Woolf brings is different, he can play that risky 10 yard pass that breaks the press and opens things up for us, or he can break the press himself and carry us 20 yards up the pitch. He's really our only CB capable of doing that. |
Agree I also don't think anyone knows the patterns as well as him when it comes to playing out. He's one of the only players you see consistently instructing others on where to be/pass. |  | |  |
| Woolfy off? on 09:54 - May 28 with 1596 views | ITFC_Forever |
Decent in a three, exposed as a two. |  |
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| Woolfy off? on 10:04 - May 28 with 1530 views | pointofblue |
| Woolfy off? on 08:39 - May 28 by Herbivore |
I think he's more pissed than many of our players that we've not succeeded this season, he made some quite critical comments about how we'd not been good enough mentally over the season. I imagine he's frustrated at having such limited game time having generally played well when he has been given a chance. He's at an age where he doesn't want to be playing 10 games a season, he needs to be first choice somewhere and he'll rightly feel he's good enough to be. O'Shea has been fine but I still feel we look a better team when Woolf plays, he is SO much better on the ball than our other CBs and so much calmer as well and we've needed more of that across the season. There's obviously something there McKenna sees that means he doesn't trust him to be a regular starter in the Prem so it might be that Woolf feels it's time to move on. |
I think the big issue was the loss of Ogbene and then Burns. I thought we looked much better with a back three and using wing backs. Playing Johnson and Godfrey together - which, if Woolfy felt a kick in the stomach at any time, that was probably it - against Manchester City was a huge error in hindsight and I don't think we returned to three at the back afterwards. I wish we had, even if it meant trying Johnson there again. |  |
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| Woolfy off? on 10:13 - May 28 with 1457 views | pointofblue |
| Woolfy off? on 09:54 - May 28 by ITFC_Forever |
Decent in a three, exposed as a two. |
No sure if he's that much worse than O'Shea. Certainly not £15m worse. O'Shea made two horrific errors on Sunday, which he was very lucky to get away with. If it had been Woolfy or Greaves I think more would have been said about them on here. | |
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| Woolfy off? on 10:18 - May 28 with 1410 views | naa |
This is why it's so hard to build a squad ready for the Premier league. Woolfy is a decent Championship defender who can do a job in the Prem, and arguably isn't much worse than O'Shea. But he isn't Prem starter quality and, if you can't keep decent but not brilliant players in your squad then you are going to struggle in the Prem where this season showed how important a deep squad is. | | | |
| Woolfy off? on 10:28 - May 28 with 1353 views | sjg |
| Woolfy off? on 10:18 - May 28 by naa |
This is why it's so hard to build a squad ready for the Premier league. Woolfy is a decent Championship defender who can do a job in the Prem, and arguably isn't much worse than O'Shea. But he isn't Prem starter quality and, if you can't keep decent but not brilliant players in your squad then you are going to struggle in the Prem where this season showed how important a deep squad is. |
Does help if you don’t bin off the players that know exactly how you want to play for some very average ‘Premier League proven’ players | | | |
| Woolfy off? on 10:43 - May 28 with 1288 views | Kieran_Knows |
| Woolfy off? on 08:39 - May 28 by Herbivore |
I think he's more pissed than many of our players that we've not succeeded this season, he made some quite critical comments about how we'd not been good enough mentally over the season. I imagine he's frustrated at having such limited game time having generally played well when he has been given a chance. He's at an age where he doesn't want to be playing 10 games a season, he needs to be first choice somewhere and he'll rightly feel he's good enough to be. O'Shea has been fine but I still feel we look a better team when Woolf plays, he is SO much better on the ball than our other CBs and so much calmer as well and we've needed more of that across the season. There's obviously something there McKenna sees that means he doesn't trust him to be a regular starter in the Prem so it might be that Woolf feels it's time to move on. |
Rightly or wrongly, whichever way is supporters look at it, but having been a mainstay for McKenna for 2 years, KM felt the need to splash £12m (or whatever it was) for O’Shea to ultimately replace him.
Again, we can argue the toss whether that’s the right decision or not, but that to me indicates that McKenna felt there was something in his game which wouldn’t be up to the required standard in the PL.
As others have mentioned, I think unfortunately even if O’Shea was to leave this summer, McKenna would replace him and ultimately start ahead of Woolfenden in the Championship. |  |
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| Woolfy off? on 10:46 - May 28 with 1259 views | naa |
| Woolfy off? on 10:28 - May 28 by sjg |
Does help if you don’t bin off the players that know exactly how you want to play for some very average ‘Premier League proven’ players |
Sure, but what if Woolfy gets injured or suspended? You still need a decent back-up player to come in. | | | |
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| Woolfy off? on 11:01 - May 28 with 1196 views | pointofblue |
| Woolfy off? on 10:43 - May 28 by Kieran_Knows |
Rightly or wrongly, whichever way is supporters look at it, but having been a mainstay for McKenna for 2 years, KM felt the need to splash £12m (or whatever it was) for O’Shea to ultimately replace him.
Again, we can argue the toss whether that’s the right decision or not, but that to me indicates that McKenna felt there was something in his game which wouldn’t be up to the required standard in the PL.
As others have mentioned, I think unfortunately even if O’Shea was to leave this summer, McKenna would replace him and ultimately start ahead of Woolfenden in the Championship. |
I think it was just the way it goes. To be blunt, McKenna was looking to replace every single player who was with us last year, maybe Davis and Hutchinson aside.
Muric, Johnson, Townsend, O'Shea, Greaves, Phillips, Cajuste, Ogbene, Szmodics, Clarke, Delap
Some of these signings didn't work out as well as expected. Townsend was always going to be back up to Davis, though ironically I thought he was better when he played. You're probably right with your assertion but it's not just Woolfy - it's every single player who got us up last season. As we look to improve they have gone from first teamers to back ups. But the issue is, for the most part, we've spent a lot of money on players who, whilst arguably upgrades, were not quite good enough and instead damaged unity and understanding to a greater extent than their benefit.
Edit: We're to were. [Post edited 28 May 11:36]
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| Woolfy off? on 11:10 - May 28 with 1150 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Woolfy off? on 11:01 - May 28 by pointofblue |
I think it was just the way it goes. To be blunt, McKenna was looking to replace every single player who was with us last year, maybe Davis and Hutchinson aside.
Muric, Johnson, Townsend, O'Shea, Greaves, Phillips, Cajuste, Ogbene, Szmodics, Clarke, Delap
Some of these signings didn't work out as well as expected. Townsend was always going to be back up to Davis, though ironically I thought he was better when he played. You're probably right with your assertion but it's not just Woolfy - it's every single player who got us up last season. As we look to improve they have gone from first teamers to back ups. But the issue is, for the most part, we've spent a lot of money on players who, whilst arguably upgrades, were not quite good enough and instead damaged unity and understanding to a greater extent than their benefit.
Edit: We're to were. [Post edited 28 May 11:36]
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I do not think McKenna was looking to replace every single player who were with us last year - he was looking to replace the fringe players from last year, and improve the depth of the squad.
The result is of course similar, because in many cases it means that the 1st choices from last year become the 2nd choice and fringe players. Sadly that is how you develop and strength a squad - you aim to bring in players who improve on what you have. Whether or not we achieved that is open to debate - in some cases yes, in others not so. We'll go through the same cycle again this summer, allow some to leave with the aim of replacing them with someone better (with some exceptions, such as Delap, where replacing him immediately with someone better will be challenging this summer, due to budgets) | | | |
| Woolfy off? on 11:12 - May 28 with 1141 views | naa |
| Woolfy off? on 11:01 - May 28 by pointofblue |
I think it was just the way it goes. To be blunt, McKenna was looking to replace every single player who was with us last year, maybe Davis and Hutchinson aside.
Muric, Johnson, Townsend, O'Shea, Greaves, Phillips, Cajuste, Ogbene, Szmodics, Clarke, Delap
Some of these signings didn't work out as well as expected. Townsend was always going to be back up to Davis, though ironically I thought he was better when he played. You're probably right with your assertion but it's not just Woolfy - it's every single player who got us up last season. As we look to improve they have gone from first teamers to back ups. But the issue is, for the most part, we've spent a lot of money on players who, whilst arguably upgrades, were not quite good enough and instead damaged unity and understanding to a greater extent than their benefit.
Edit: We're to were. [Post edited 28 May 11:36]
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Your last point is the key.
We were more than the sum of our parts as a well drilled team. We never looked anything like that this year.
Others have said they think last year's team would beat this year's and I agree completely. We've looked disjointed from the start. Hopefully they will begin to look like a team again next season. | | | |
| Woolfy off? on 12:16 - May 28 with 1018 views | PioneerBlue |
| Woolfy off? on 11:01 - May 28 by pointofblue |
I think it was just the way it goes. To be blunt, McKenna was looking to replace every single player who was with us last year, maybe Davis and Hutchinson aside.
Muric, Johnson, Townsend, O'Shea, Greaves, Phillips, Cajuste, Ogbene, Szmodics, Clarke, Delap
Some of these signings didn't work out as well as expected. Townsend was always going to be back up to Davis, though ironically I thought he was better when he played. You're probably right with your assertion but it's not just Woolfy - it's every single player who got us up last season. As we look to improve they have gone from first teamers to back ups. But the issue is, for the most part, we've spent a lot of money on players who, whilst arguably upgrades, were not quite good enough and instead damaged unity and understanding to a greater extent than their benefit.
Edit: We're to were. [Post edited 28 May 11:36]
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The only part of that I would take issue with is the changes damaged unity. I don’t know either of us are positioned to assert that. I take the point the familiarity might have been missing but they didn’t look like a disunited team, a team not capable and at times yes, not functioning at the level necessary yes.
Disunity implies players that don’t like each other, may be there was a bit of that for certain individuals, it would be a surprise if a relegation didn’t create some strong reactions at times, but I’m sure would be resolved quickly now the season is done, if indeed it was the case. | |
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| Woolfy off? on 12:21 - May 28 with 1001 views | sjg |
| Woolfy off? on 11:10 - May 28 by SuffolkPunchFC |
I do not think McKenna was looking to replace every single player who were with us last year - he was looking to replace the fringe players from last year, and improve the depth of the squad.
The result is of course similar, because in many cases it means that the 1st choices from last year become the 2nd choice and fringe players. Sadly that is how you develop and strength a squad - you aim to bring in players who improve on what you have. Whether or not we achieved that is open to debate - in some cases yes, in others not so. We'll go through the same cycle again this summer, allow some to leave with the aim of replacing them with someone better (with some exceptions, such as Delap, where replacing him immediately with someone better will be challenging this summer, due to budgets) |
Which players from last year do you not think we looked to replace? Omari and Davis per the comment you replied to is right to me, maybe Axel as well. I think the only reason Morsy wasn't replaced was that Phillips was disappointing, everyone else was replaced | | | |
| Woolfy off? on 12:29 - May 28 with 964 views | pointofblue |
| Woolfy off? on 12:21 - May 28 by sjg |
Which players from last year do you not think we looked to replace? Omari and Davis per the comment you replied to is right to me, maybe Axel as well. I think the only reason Morsy wasn't replaced was that Phillips was disappointing, everyone else was replaced |
I think the intention was for Johnson to replace Tuanzebe, or at least share the role. | |
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| Woolfy off? on 12:34 - May 28 with 955 views | SuffolkPunchFC |
| Woolfy off? on 12:21 - May 28 by sjg |
Which players from last year do you not think we looked to replace? Omari and Davis per the comment you replied to is right to me, maybe Axel as well. I think the only reason Morsy wasn't replaced was that Phillips was disappointing, everyone else was replaced |
I think you misinterpreted my reply - I'm referring to the entire squad, not the first choice starters. 'Replace' for me is 'move on from the club'. I'm saying the plan was to move most of the starters from the Championship season (bar a very few as you noted) to be 2nd choices.
As we know, it didn't really work out that way, but I suspect that was the overall goal. | | | |
| Woolfy off? on 12:52 - May 28 with 869 views | Reus30 |
He looked really decent in the games he played at this level. It would be an incredible shame to lose him.
Not going to read too much into posts and body language at the LOH.
I know we spent the money and gave it a good go. Part of me wishes we gave the championship X1 a good run out in the Prem with a sprinkle of quality and depth instead of signing a whole new first team plus. We might have ended up on less points but we will never know, the spirit we had last year has certainly gone regardless.
Hindsight I guess. I feel as though this is going to be another long summer of sighs. It's always sad when players and staff on this journey from L1 to Prem leave. If Woolfy or Cam or Chappers or Broady, I will be pretty gutted. |  | | |
| Woolfy off? on 12:57 - May 28 with 841 views | Kieran_Knows |
| Woolfy off? on 12:21 - May 28 by sjg |
Which players from last year do you not think we looked to replace? Omari and Davis per the comment you replied to is right to me, maybe Axel as well. I think the only reason Morsy wasn't replaced was that Phillips was disappointing, everyone else was replaced |
Whether people choose to believe me not that, no problem. But I heard that only 2 players were ‘safe’ last summer in terms of their spots within the team - Morsy & Davis. Every other position was there to be upgraded on. | |
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| Woolfy off? on 12:58 - May 28 with 834 views | gsoly |
| Woolfy off? on 12:52 - May 28 by Reus30 |
He looked really decent in the games he played at this level. It would be an incredible shame to lose him.
Not going to read too much into posts and body language at the LOH.
I know we spent the money and gave it a good go. Part of me wishes we gave the championship X1 a good run out in the Prem with a sprinkle of quality and depth instead of signing a whole new first team plus. We might have ended up on less points but we will never know, the spirit we had last year has certainly gone regardless.
Hindsight I guess. I feel as though this is going to be another long summer of sighs. It's always sad when players and staff on this journey from L1 to Prem leave. If Woolfy or Cam or Chappers or Broady, I will be pretty gutted. |
Whatever route we’d gone this season, the spirit would have been lost. You think that spirit would have survived being beaten every week? And there’s a reason why some of those L1/Champ boys have looked good — because they’ve been fresh. Play them week-in, week-out, you’d have seen fatigue that they didn't have to contend with so much. It’s a romantic notion but would never have been a reality. |  | | |
| Woolfy off? on 13:26 - May 28 with 737 views | pointofblue |
| Woolfy off? on 12:57 - May 28 by Kieran_Knows |
Whether people choose to believe me not that, no problem. But I heard that only 2 players were ‘safe’ last summer in terms of their spots within the team - Morsy & Davis. Every other position was there to be upgraded on. |
I'm sorry of surprised about Morsy as surely Phillips on paper was seen as an upgrade in terms of his ceiling and experience? Perhaps we didn't think we'd have a chance, and were happy to go with Morsy until the opportunity presented itself. | |
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| Woolfy off? on 17:31 - May 28 with 487 views | Ryorry |
| Woolfy off? on 12:58 - May 28 by gsoly |
Whatever route we’d gone this season, the spirit would have been lost. You think that spirit would have survived being beaten every week? And there’s a reason why some of those L1/Champ boys have looked good — because they’ve been fresh. Play them week-in, week-out, you’d have seen fatigue that they didn't have to contend with so much. It’s a romantic notion but would never have been a reality. |
Maybe we wouldn't have been beaten every week?!
Anyway, as I've said so many times previously that I'm starting to bore even myself with it now, it was injuries that primarily scuppered us (ten first choice starters out one week, with no recognised LB, was posted on here today).
Of course our recruitment/squad/upping to the Prem were factors in that which meant we were particularly vulnerable, but even so, I think our training methods/Sports Science dept. really need to do a rigorous assessment of last season. |  |
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| Woolfy off? on 18:39 - May 28 with 374 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Woolfy off? on 16:36 - May 26 by Chris_ITFC |
If it’s reliant on O’Shea leaving, I wouldn’t say that’s “very unlikely”.
He’s proven he’s more than good enough for Championship level (him and Greaves are a top 6 pairing on paper), with £20m in the bank from O’Shea to invest elsewhere. |
I’d be very surprised if O’Shea and Greaves are both still here next season. And absolutely gutted if Woolfie leaves. He’ll be a Rolls Royce of a player for us next year and just the sort of quality you need in team that’s looking for promotion.
Hopefully there’s nothing to see here. |  |
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