| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us 18:43 - Jun 11 with 4504 views | jasondozzell |
It might sound strange, but starting to see the relegation as a positive.
Even though there has been the predictable (and to an extent understandable) panic from us all at the Brentford situation as soon it was clear Frank might be going, I think most of us, in our heart of hearts, expect KM to stay.
I think the way that he spoke a month or so ago, with such clarity about his intentions was notable. He didn't need to be as effusive then as he was or as deliberate.
He's driven and ambitious. We know that and I think he was doing the right thing listening to various approaches from Palace last Feb through to Brighton, Chelsea etc last season and last summer. You'd be disappointed if he wasn't in a way. We have wanted a manager in demand for a long time.
But he's also got real integrity and for all his modern, scientific approach I think hes got a little bit of a footballing romantic in him too and is not averse to sentiment (just look at the number of players he gave minutes to against clubs that meant something to them). I wonder if he sees the backing and support he's had here, especially this season which was tough, and feels that he wants to repay it. He's a winner and whilst I think he still did a very good job this season in extremely difficult circumstances, he won't have liked not achieving the objective. Perhaps he sees it as his turn to repay our loyalty now and stick with the project and get us back up.
The relegation and him staying as I now feel he will binds us together even more and it's part of the story and the growth of him as a manager and us as a club again. It's very rare for people to stay anywhere for long now but KM will make it to 5 years next year here. It just feels like the Robson dynasty sort of thing is possible with KM in a way that seemed out of reach in most of modern football in recent times.
This season has allowed the club and KM to get a feel of the PL and the challenges and we are stronger now for it in so many ways. We've done well financially, the infrastructure continues to improve and we've got a strong squad. But perhaps the best thing is it may have solidified the (already strong) relationship between KM and the club. We've needed him and now he maybe needs us too a bit. Had we stayed up there's no doubt he'd have been in the frame for the biggest jobs.
I don't buy any of the scepticism about this season from some. I think he's a world class coach and the relegation and the build back from it could actually be a really striking part of his journey with us.
[Post edited 11 Jun 18:54]
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:27 - Jun 11 with 3477 views | MattinLondon |
KM is an intelligent guy and so he will learn from the mistakes which might well have been made last season. He will be fully aware where the squad fell short and I expect that he will be highly critical of himself. From this experience he will probably put even more pressure on MA and the scouting team to make identity and recruit the right players.
From a club point of view, relegation is never a positive experience. |  | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:40 - Jun 11 with 3401 views | Swansea_Blue |
Gawd dammit. I got suckered into thinking this wasn’t another McKenna thread.
To play devil’s advocate, had we not been relegated it wouldn’t need to be a discussion point. Although I concede the point about what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. KM’s always talked about the importance of responding positively to setbacks. It’s a big(ish) setbac. It potentially could strengthen bonds, especially if we go up again. It could equally lead to an exodus of players and a tricky mini re-build that may not go the way people hope. |  |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:55 - Jun 11 with 3296 views | jasondozzell |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:27 - Jun 11 by MattinLondon |
KM is an intelligent guy and so he will learn from the mistakes which might well have been made last season. He will be fully aware where the squad fell short and I expect that he will be highly critical of himself. From this experience he will probably put even more pressure on MA and the scouting team to make identity and recruit the right players.
From a club point of view, relegation is never a positive experience. |
No but I think it might help both us and KM in terms of lessons gained and a renewed sense of commitment from both sides. It might be a big part of the KM story and his future here. | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:59 - Jun 11 with 3259 views | jasondozzell |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:40 - Jun 11 by Swansea_Blue |
Gawd dammit. I got suckered into thinking this wasn’t another McKenna thread.
To play devil’s advocate, had we not been relegated it wouldn’t need to be a discussion point. Although I concede the point about what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. KM’s always talked about the importance of responding positively to setbacks. It’s a big(ish) setbac. It potentially could strengthen bonds, especially if we go up again. It could equally lead to an exodus of players and a tricky mini re-build that may not go the way people hope. |
Gotcha! 😁
Fair points. It isn't going to be easy but I really do think he's a very special manager and keeping him with us is huge.
We can't know for certain, but I think the next few years are going to be thrilling under him just as the first few were. | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 20:48 - Jun 11 with 3047 views | blue_curacao |
I reckon you must be a bit of a football romantic yourself. Me too, love it  |  | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 20:49 - Jun 11 with 3038 views | jasondozzell |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 20:48 - Jun 11 by blue_curacao |
I reckon you must be a bit of a football romantic yourself. Me too, love it |
Yep, definitely! 😁 It's the only way to be... | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:05 - Jun 11 with 2958 views | DavoIPB |
No we will lose our best players, lost a lot of money and believe amongst players. Could have kept a half decent squad together. If we don't go straight back up we will start to struggle. | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:09 - Jun 11 with 2946 views | Trequartista |
No.
I mean I like your post, and I hope it all comes true, but bottom line, the club's ambition to establish itself in the Premier League takes priority over who the manager is, was and will be. [Post edited 11 Jun 21:10]
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:16 - Jun 11 with 2890 views | jasondozzell |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:05 - Jun 11 by DavoIPB |
No we will lose our best players, lost a lot of money and believe amongst players. Could have kept a half decent squad together. If we don't go straight back up we will start to struggle. |
The glass half full take... | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:25 - Jun 11 with 2823 views | jasondozzell |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:09 - Jun 11 by Trequartista |
No.
I mean I like your post, and I hope it all comes true, but bottom line, the club's ambition to establish itself in the Premier League takes priority over who the manager is, was and will be. [Post edited 11 Jun 21:10]
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Yeah, can't deny that, but that's the club.
But for a supporter, I'm not too bothered about the narrow 'Premier League TM' idea of success. Of course we want to be at the top table and competing but it's the way you do it I reckon.
It wouldn't have happened because it was impossible, but say we'd sacked KM last season, installed a mercenary rent a coach type and somehow inexplicably stayed up it wouldn't have felt good at all. | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:25 - Jun 11 with 2820 views | TractorWood |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 19:27 - Jun 11 by MattinLondon |
KM is an intelligent guy and so he will learn from the mistakes which might well have been made last season. He will be fully aware where the squad fell short and I expect that he will be highly critical of himself. From this experience he will probably put even more pressure on MA and the scouting team to make identity and recruit the right players.
From a club point of view, relegation is never a positive experience. |
I agree.
Only seed of doubt for me comes from the Philogene signing as he clearly learnt nothing by January. |  |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:02 - Jun 12 with 2344 views | Blue_In_Boston |
I cannot accept your description of world class coach.
Throughout the season Leif was pushed so far forward on the left that teams were getting in time after time. It was there for everyone to see, apart from our manager apparently.
If you watch a world class manager they act immediately, and I'm talking mid-game. | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:12 - Jun 12 with 2300 views | cbower |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:25 - Jun 11 by TractorWood |
I agree.
Only seed of doubt for me comes from the Philogene signing as he clearly learnt nothing by January. |
That signing certainly added nothing that was needed to help stave off relegation and was just jot what we needed short term. As a lonv term investment? We will have to keep our fingers crossed. |  |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:18 - Jun 12 with 2261 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:25 - Jun 11 by TractorWood |
I agree.
Only seed of doubt for me comes from the Philogene signing as he clearly learnt nothing by January. |
I think a lot of people are going to look complete tits next season re Philogene. | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:20 - Jun 12 with 2278 views | blueasfook |
"But he's also got real integrity"
His ass was practically in the manager's chair at Palace by all accounts. Whatever made him back out at the last minute is unknown but the fact it got that far doesn't shout "integrity" to me. |  |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:29 - Jun 12 with 2168 views | Trequartista |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:25 - Jun 11 by jasondozzell |
Yeah, can't deny that, but that's the club.
But for a supporter, I'm not too bothered about the narrow 'Premier League TM' idea of success. Of course we want to be at the top table and competing but it's the way you do it I reckon.
It wouldn't have happened because it was impossible, but say we'd sacked KM last season, installed a mercenary rent a coach type and somehow inexplicably stayed up it wouldn't have felt good at all. |
Mercenary rent a coach type or not, that would have been an outstanding achievement to stay up. It would have got us over a hurdle which we might never get over now, and would have given us some extra financial muscle to buy more established premier league players, and a bigger pool of new managers to choose from if the mercenary moves on. | |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:32 - Jun 12 with 2141 views | blueasfook |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:29 - Jun 12 by Trequartista |
Mercenary rent a coach type or not, that would have been an outstanding achievement to stay up. It would have got us over a hurdle which we might never get over now, and would have given us some extra financial muscle to buy more established premier league players, and a bigger pool of new managers to choose from if the mercenary moves on. |
To be fair though, both Saints and Leicester tried changing manager and it didn't work for them. | |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:32 - Jun 12 with 2137 views | Denny32 |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:20 - Jun 12 by blueasfook |
"But he's also got real integrity"
His ass was practically in the manager's chair at Palace by all accounts. Whatever made him back out at the last minute is unknown but the fact it got that far doesn't shout "integrity" to me. |
How can it be good for us. In the name of Mary and the little Jesus Christ!!.we lose players,we have to regroup and get in more players for the championship and if we go back up ,we then have to start again, and get in more players suited to the Premiership, bearing in mind a lot of the if not all the original championship side from league 1 that got us here ,will be gone, thus leaving a lot more players having to come in and gel and by the time they have gelled, we be at the foot of the table, fighting for survival again !!so it's not like that second time around with completely different squad, we should be starting off beating all around us ..so no its no way helping us for the second time going up..its just like revisiting a bad dream except hopefully we won't wake up sweating and having bad palpation,..lol | | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:34 - Jun 12 with 2117 views | Trequartista |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:32 - Jun 12 by blueasfook |
To be fair though, both Saints and Leicester tried changing manager and it didn't work for them. |
Bit of a different point, I wasn't suggesting we should have sacked McKenna, it was more of a hypothetical argument over whether staying up was more important than a better journey. | |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:34 - Jun 12 with 2098 views | NthQldITFC |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:02 - Jun 12 by Blue_In_Boston |
I cannot accept your description of world class coach.
Throughout the season Leif was pushed so far forward on the left that teams were getting in time after time. It was there for everyone to see, apart from our manager apparently.
If you watch a world class manager they act immediately, and I'm talking mid-game. |
You do, though, have to take into account the context of how the team overall is set up and the cost/benefit balance of having Davis pushed forward and requiring the back line and RM to rotate around to cover - that's how we played, and if you say "just tell him to stay back more" you totally screw up the whole system. You can't just look at one aspect without considering the pros and cons for the whole.
If you honestly think it's something that everyone could see apart from McKenna, well... |  |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:36 - Jun 12 with 2076 views | NthQldITFC |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:18 - Jun 12 by tractorboy1978 |
I think a lot of people are going to look complete tits next season re Philogene. |
Those particular fans won't be so shouty/pointy/stampy next season when the machine starts to roll. | |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:36 - Jun 12 with 2082 views | Churchman |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 21:25 - Jun 11 by jasondozzell |
Yeah, can't deny that, but that's the club.
But for a supporter, I'm not too bothered about the narrow 'Premier League TM' idea of success. Of course we want to be at the top table and competing but it's the way you do it I reckon.
It wouldn't have happened because it was impossible, but say we'd sacked KM last season, installed a mercenary rent a coach type and somehow inexplicably stayed up it wouldn't have felt good at all. |
I agree with this, but not all of your OP.
I cannot agree relegation is a good thing. It never is, even though it was highly likely from the off. My disappointment is deepened by the way in which the team collapsed second half of the season. There were few games where we truly competed and sustaining ourselves in the PL looks further away to me than it did last August. Not least because it’s obvious how far ahead even clubs like Brentford are.
The other factor in relegation is the team being torn apart. McKenna never actually built a team last season. They were a collection of individuals thrown together in a gallant, worthy attempt to stay in there. There are a few players who are loyal/like being at the club but for most it’s a job to them. Easy money? Stepping stone? Agent driven? Who knows but I would bet my back teeth that first decent offer most of last seasons recruits and ignored players like Broadhead, they’ll be agitating for a move. It’s what modern football is.
Kieran McKenna? I like to think he’s all you suggest he might be, but I don’t know the bloke. As for his coaching and management his record speaks for itself. Who better for our club? There’s lots to like and he will have learned loads this season. Let’s face it, like all of us he’s made mistakes.
Perhaps KM really will go to an established PL club. Who knows. If he does, it’ll be understandable and thanks for all you’ve done. Our club will move on. It’s far more important than any individual including him.
This is a picture of a moment in time and by my standards a negative one. It’s not intended to be because if the owners are still committed to the club (a big ‘if’), then it will continue to grow which is what matters to me.
One thing last season shone a light on is how far behind the club is on just about everything including scouting, developing its own players, facilities, infrastructure, possibly medical care, you name it. You have to have a starting point and in many ways this is it.
I’m the first to recognise what state dementor Evans left the club in and how far it has progressed with Gamechanger and the CEO. It’s been beyond my wildest dreams. So big picture terms, it’s very much positive, but it is time to move it forward again and look to the future, given there’s so much to do.
We may start the season well and be all aboard HMS PTL, but in my view, relegation is never anything but a bad thing. |  | | |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:39 - Jun 12 with 2073 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:20 - Jun 12 by blueasfook |
"But he's also got real integrity"
His ass was practically in the manager's chair at Palace by all accounts. Whatever made him back out at the last minute is unknown but the fact it got that far doesn't shout "integrity" to me. |
What a load of waffle that is.
That Palace job would have been a HUGE promotion for him. A chance at the time to work with Eze Olise Mateta Wharton Guehi, I'm sure he did get close, not many managers in his position anywhere in the world would have turned that down and he chose to back out to see out the project here.
Integrity is about more than that as well, and the way KM carries himself and by all accounts treats other people, I would say he absolutely has integrity. |  |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:44 - Jun 12 with 2029 views | blueasfook |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:39 - Jun 12 by TRUE_BLUE123 |
What a load of waffle that is.
That Palace job would have been a HUGE promotion for him. A chance at the time to work with Eze Olise Mateta Wharton Guehi, I'm sure he did get close, not many managers in his position anywhere in the world would have turned that down and he chose to back out to see out the project here.
Integrity is about more than that as well, and the way KM carries himself and by all accounts treats other people, I would say he absolutely has integrity. |
We seem to have different understandings of the word "Integrity". Your definition seems somewhat looser. Integrity in my mind would have been not to even entertain an offer from Palace. Especially bearing in mind we were flying at the time and looking good for promotion anyway. Nobody even knows why he backed out so you can't say for certain it was out of loyalty to us. | |
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| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:51 - Jun 12 with 1972 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
| Relegation this season might be the best thing that's happened to us on 09:44 - Jun 12 by blueasfook |
We seem to have different understandings of the word "Integrity". Your definition seems somewhat looser. Integrity in my mind would have been not to even entertain an offer from Palace. Especially bearing in mind we were flying at the time and looking good for promotion anyway. Nobody even knows why he backed out so you can't say for certain it was out of loyalty to us. |
Yes we do have different definitions for sure.
To suggest that someone doesn't have integrity because they considered taking a massive promotion in there job and a chance to work with some of the best football players on the planet (which he ended up not even taking) is very odd. But there you go. | |
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