| At what point did many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? 22:55 - Dec 17 with 4259 views | unstableblue |
Its almost like Ashton is living in a parallel universe to, say 30-40% of the fanbase, isn't it?
And certainly that 30-40% are so disconnected from McKenna's drive and the aims and ambition of the players.
Perhaps it's more like 40%.
Look at this from Ashton: "“I am so enthused that we’re only at the end of the beginning. I can’t wait for the training ground to be done, I can’t wait for Tom and the team to design the Cobbold, other plans for around the stadium that we’re looking at, the recruitment team producing, the academy starting to deliver players through.
If we only deliver 70 per cent of the things that we’re talking about, just think where this football club’s going to be. This is the biggest and best football development opportunity that is happening right now in Europe, bar none."
This is a time to be so invested in the club - but the away ends are toxic, and the support for McKenna and the boys is on the floor in that 40%.
Look I get it, we invested heavily, we culled likeable players who had delivered almost beyond their capabilities. We brought in better players, who are still not embraced by fans or knitted together as a unit. The results leave us off second.
You can say the off-field project is somewhat disconnected from the on-field. It's not. McKenna is front and center to the rejuvenation of the club. He is a talented manager, with growth in his abilities.
Where did it go wrong, what was the point when the 40% disconnected?
Was it the Premier League woeful home campaign? those that didn't witness Spurs away, Villa away, Wolves away, Fulham away, Bournemoth away, Everton away... hey even Brentford away.. were left with some early promise against Villa and Fulham at PR, and then a dirge of home drubbings.
Was it because Philogene is an introvert? that O'Shea didn't dominate like Morsy did in League One? Greaves made errors? Hirst is out of form?
It certainly wasn't the wonderful fighting performance against Norwich which seems forgotten.
Clearly it's a lack of an ability to consistently dominate the Championship with a well funded team as a parachute club (yeah cause Parachute clubs are guaranteed success!!), or is it losing the ability to fall on the right side of margins as we did in the Premier League promotion.....
Or is it entitlement and just a fatigued lack of enthusiasm in the fan base?
What we do know is that what makes a successful club is a holy trinity between:
1) Ownership and off-field set-up
2) Manager, coaching staff and players
3) and Fans
Given Portman Road and away atmospheres this season, currently the fans are waiting for the players/manager to wow them again, become likeable, rather than committing themselves. And indeed 40% are actively deriding the project.
Saturday is a MUST win, but its also a MUST support.
COYFB. [Post edited 18 Dec 17:16]
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| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 13:27 - Dec 18 with 517 views | Churchman |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 13:02 - Dec 18 by Funge |
I must confess, I do take issue with your (repeated) assertion that ITFC supporters are 'toxic' - on the contrary, the support the team have had this part 15 months when, let's face it, we've taken some *absolute* shoeings, has been pretty solid.
The worst thing I can say is that the majority of the crowd on matchday is often disinterested, verging on bored - but toxic seems to be, respectfully, hyperbolic.
McK will certainly get offers from elsewhere when he leaves - but bigger than us? I dunno - that ship sailed off to Brighton last summer, with McK being plenty well enough rewarded at the same time.
Comments regarding 'doldrums' are relative to our performances over the past 4 seasons.
To reiterate, you have more optimism, and patience, than I - which is, all told, a good thing. [Post edited 18 Dec 13:03]
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You are probably right in my assertion that ITFC supporters are toxic. Over the top. Especially as the people around me this season (got tired of the miserable barsteward sitting next to me for the last few seasons so moved) seem a good lot and discussions even when it’s not going well are always interesting even if there’s disagreement.
But we do have a percentage of noisy, entitled and frankly ignorant people, a few of whom appear on here only after a poor performance.
I can see somebody like Leeds or even Wolves attracting McKenna. Maybe a Forest. Palace again or Everton? I’m just guessing tbh.
I guess decrepitude and working as I did in project-world resulted in me looking at things the way I do. It doesn’t stop me being very competitive with a hatred of losing, especially my football team. |  | | |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 14:38 - Dec 18 with 473 views | unstableblue |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 08:58 - Dec 18 by ArnieM |
Like it or not it has to come initially from the players on the pitch . If there is intensity (where has that gone ?) and full on up it and at em on the pitch the crowd WILL 100% become more engaged . This is my point about the pedestrain appraoch by us this season , (by and larhe). It doesnt inspire that connection between the players and fans .
The last home game , we didnt really up the anti until the seconda half ( This is a classic patterne by us )... when they did, the crowd were at it . But first half , it was quite . Yes the SBR tried to get up enthusiasm but it reflects to intesnity and drive they are seeing on the pitch . Downvote me all you want, (usual individuals) but that is the simple fact of the matter. |
I think you’ve answered the point and question in my post.
It’s the player performances and energy this season that is perhaps the root cause, with an element of the new batch of players accessibility and likability.
I think some fans around me just haven’t connected with some of the new players. | |
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| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 15:45 - Dec 18 with 434 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
Considering that we had a significantly bad Premier League campaign, from a results perspective, I'd say our fans are a long way from being as divested as fans of many other clubs who have been through similar.
I think you are confusing "jittery" and "tetchy" with "divested". |  | | |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 15:59 - Dec 18 with 416 views | MattinLondon |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 12:45 - Dec 18 by jasondozzell |
We could lose to Wednesday and get promoted.
We could beat Wednesday and not be promoted.
It's the Championship. |
To win promotion a team needs points and as we’re playing chase-up we need points to come from teams like Wednesday. It’s a must-win game. |  | | |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 16:01 - Dec 18 with 415 views | HighgateBlue |
For my part, I think we've underachieved on the pitch this season, and I find that frustrating. I am not backward about coming forward when I think it is reasonable to point out that we have underachieved.
However, that comes from a place of wanting Town to do well, and wanting to support them no matter what. Ashton's only sins for me are (a) being a bit David Brent, and (b) making himself Chairman. The latter doesn't sit well with me, and the former is just a bit of a laugh really. I think he's done a really good job.
As regards the stadium plans in particular, I am in favour of the plans that he outlines. I think it is not unreasonable for fans to be really wary about stadium investment and development, given what happened on the pitch (a) when the Pioneer was built and players were sold, and (b) when we were in the Prem under Burley playing in a stadium under development. Historically it has all gone wrong when we've tried to remodel the ground. Lessons need to be learned in order to guard against that. But so much of what Ashton says makes sense.
The one good thing about Evans was how he left us - writing off debt and ensuring that our new owners were fit and decent. The new owners haven't let us down yet, and whilst they are in it for the megabucks, they do deserve our continued respect and support in investing in the club's infrastructure. Again, they do it out of self interest, but it is the opposite of asset-stripping. They are spending pounds where they could cut corners and get away with not investing. And that deserves support in my view. Even if it all goes wrong, and they slink off stage left, there will be aspects of the club that they have improved for the long term.
Also FWIW I think Ashton's comments on season ticket holders not taking up their seats strike the right balance and are fair enough.
So whilst I would definitely qualify as being called a "moaner" or whatever else, as regards some on-field output and transfer dealings, I really don't think that that translates directly to a particular attitude about the bigger picture and the future of the club.
It takes balls to set out an optimistic vision, and it leaves one open to criticism or fun-poking. But I think the club hierarchy deserves support, and enthusiasm from us supporters as regards the long term investment and optimism that they are showing.
As regards on-field matters, I am 100% anti-entitlement. We have a great club with a great history, but when we were in League 1, we didn't have any entitlement to get promoted just because we are Ipswich. And likewise, we have no entitlement to be in the top 6 this season. The reason why I am frustrated by our achievements is purely and simply because with our budget we should be doing better. I totally understand, and give massive credit for, the fact that our budget is only massive because of the huge successes of the first couple of years of Gamechanger, Ashton and McKenna. |  | | |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 16:02 - Dec 18 with 414 views | MattinLondon |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 13:19 - Dec 18 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I understand we ought to. We ought to have beaten Maidstone at home but we didn't. It's not a good look but funny things happen in football. None of which makes Saturday a must-win. |
Maidstone was in the FA Cup and in the grand scheme of things losing to them, even at the time, didn’t matter. It was embarrassing but on the whole, it didn’t matter.
Wednesday are a poor team, we need to start winning and so Saturday is a must win match. A failure to beat god awful teams is why we are playing catch-up. | | | |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 16:27 - Dec 18 with 390 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 16:02 - Dec 18 by MattinLondon |
Maidstone was in the FA Cup and in the grand scheme of things losing to them, even at the time, didn’t matter. It was embarrassing but on the whole, it didn’t matter.
Wednesday are a poor team, we need to start winning and so Saturday is a must win match. A failure to beat god awful teams is why we are playing catch-up. |
I was making a point that the better team doesn't always win. |  |
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| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 16:32 - Dec 18 with 380 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 15:59 - Dec 18 by MattinLondon |
To win promotion a team needs points and as we’re playing chase-up we need points to come from teams like Wednesday. It’s a must-win game. |
No. We don't get more points for beating Wednesday than anyone else. In the home games v Charlton and Cov, if you were told you'd beat one 3-0 and lose 3-0 to the other, you wouldn't have had Charlton down as the loss and Cov as the win. But whichever way round it happens, the points are still the same.
If we suffered a shock loss on Saturday but then won the next 5, people would be wailing for a week but would soon be happy in a few more.
We're also not even at the half way stage of the season.
It's not a must-win game. | |
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| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 17:33 - Dec 18 with 348 views | Cafe_Newman |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 15:59 - Dec 18 by MattinLondon |
To win promotion a team needs points and as we’re playing chase-up we need points to come from teams like Wednesday. It’s a must-win game. |
If we're playing "chase-up", surely it's more important to beat Coventry than Wednesday.
Ipswich beat Coventry. Coventry beat Charlton. Charlton beat Ipswich.
Charlton GD +1 points 3
Ipswich GD 0 points 3
Coventry GD -1 points 3
If we'd lost to Coventry, but beaten Charlton:
Coventry 6 points
Ipswich 3 points
Charlton 0 points
Moral of the story, all wins earn you 3 points, but wins against your promotion rivals are more important. Hence the stupid expression "it's a six-pointer". |  | | |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 20:19 - Dec 18 with 307 views | Garv |
| At one point did so many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 07:41 - Dec 18 by unstableblue |
Look the 30-40% is a bit arbitrary - it’s based on posts on this forum, people’s reactions around me where I sit in Portman Road, and those around me at away games.
Now I think about it, perhaps it’s fairly accurate. Have you been in an away end this season - even for a win/draw? What % of the town fan base do you think are currently invested in McKenna his team and hence the project? |
I went to Blackburn, the second time.
The mood was fairly glum, but it wasn't toxic. I think 90% are still behind McKenna, it that simply means whether they still want him in charge. |  |
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| At what point did many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 21:05 - Dec 18 with 283 views | Mullet |
If only you were this passionate about calling out fans when we had a decent manager and our backs against the wall.
The hypocrisy is astounding.
There are plenty of clubs who would have had large chunks of fans hounding out McKenna after the combination of this and last season. This smug, patronising routine you like to trot out would be hilarious if it wasn't so tedious and divisive.
We've massively underachieved in the past few months and the only area that comes down to is McKenna's remit. He's still got the chance and grace to get that right, but the constant need to hold a pissing contest whilst wagging the fingers on your free hand is ridiculous. |  |
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| At what point did many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 10:03 - Dec 19 with 156 views | waveneyblue |
| At what point did many Town fans get divested in the rejuvenation of the club? on 21:05 - Dec 18 by Mullet |
If only you were this passionate about calling out fans when we had a decent manager and our backs against the wall.
The hypocrisy is astounding.
There are plenty of clubs who would have had large chunks of fans hounding out McKenna after the combination of this and last season. This smug, patronising routine you like to trot out would be hilarious if it wasn't so tedious and divisive.
We've massively underachieved in the past few months and the only area that comes down to is McKenna's remit. He's still got the chance and grace to get that right, but the constant need to hold a pissing contest whilst wagging the fingers on your free hand is ridiculous. |
Yeah, that's you told.....
That Smug, patronising routine you like to trot out - awful stuff. (Self awareness rating - minus eleventy billion) |  | | |
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