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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 14:56 - Jan 6 by J2BLUE
NATO is now a theory. if Russia attack Estonia, Latvia or Lithuania the US are not going to honour their commitments are they? Let's be realistic. And if the US don't help the whole thing goes out the window. Hungary will immediately say they are out. One by one other nations will rule out intervening and will fall back to a new European defence pact without the weaker nations where they all pinky swear that NEXT TIME when it's an important country we will definitely intervene.
This is just a prediction if Russia attacks a NATO country. I am not even criticising Europe. I keep seeing people criticising Europe for not doing enough. I assume they want a military response but how many calling for it want to go and fight? Or are people just happy sending our actual army to fight and die as long as we don't get conscripted?
NATO is essentially an extension of the US military, without the US it's toothless. I still find it astonishing that Trump has been allowed to trample all over it in the way that he has. Why do the US need to claim Greenland for its own? Denmark, as a member of NATO, won't and couldn't do anything without US approval anyway.
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:06 - Jan 6 with 1072 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 15:51 - Jan 6 by BloomBlue
They will do nothing. If Europe miltary attacked America, 1, they dont have the power to hurt America. Europe has spent the last 10 years reducing spending on miltary, letting the Yanks fund NATO. 2, If Europe did, you can bet Russia would use the opportunity to also attack the parts of Europe they want back.
Sanctions are pointless, Europe needs the US market.
So the world will wag its finger and say that's naughty of you.
China will they say, well if you can do that we will take Taiwan. Its at that point Trump will either say OK or the peace president with start WW3.
The United States is not the only nation to fund NATO, European nations already put in U$4.6 billion per annum whilst in addition to having member nation defence spending upwards of 2.5%. The most likely cost to European nations in a full scale conflict would be in loss of life, and we saw where the majority of that cost was borne in the last two World Wars...
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:06 - Jan 6 by Blueschev
NATO is essentially an extension of the US military, without the US it's toothless. I still find it astonishing that Trump has been allowed to trample all over it in the way that he has. Why do the US need to claim Greenland for its own? Denmark, as a member of NATO, won't and couldn't do anything without US approval anyway.
There has never been a Secretary-General of NATO from the United States, the idea that it is an extension of the United States military is well off kilter.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 13:52 - Jan 6 by Cheltenham_Blue
I think if there was an Nato build up in Greenland to defend their interests that would probably be the trigger for officials and the US military to start turning against Trump.
The idea of Trump leading the US to war against its own allies, could trigger a attempt at an impeachment or at the worst end, could trigger a civil war.
Fair point. It seems there is still plenty of pushback from some quarters in the states. A day doesn’t go by without some judge overruling him. Hopefully there are enough people to keep his worst excesses in check.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 13:59 - Jan 6 by eirannach_gorm
I'd imagine Denmark might have something to say about that. America already have a base in Greenland and you shouldn't really sh1t on your own doorstep. Not sure Greenlanders ( or Canadians ) are up for joining the expanding kingdom of Trumpland.
And it’s not as if the US can’t do pretty much what they want in Greenland already. Denmark has always turned a blind eye. They conveniently ignored it when the US wanted to store nuclear material there. Bases anre not a problem, nor naval patrols. Apparently the US can prospect for natural resources too (mining them might be a different issue, I’m not sure).
I struggle to unwrap the motivation. There’s a part that’s very obviously about Trump wanting to enrich himself and his inner circle and donors. But that’s overlaid by an almost childlike response to not being able to get what he wants. It’s very bizarre. He really is the smallest of men.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 15:45 - Jan 6 by Mercian
I think Trump is no longer in control. He obviously is on the decline both physically and metally and the so called "Yes Men" he appointed are anything but. I can imagine Miller, Rubio and Graham stroking his ego: "We love you and think you are amazing Mr President, give us the go ahead to invade X, Y or Z and we will take care of the rest Sir. The American people will love you for it and you said it yourself, Greenlanders and Canadians overwhealmingly want their lands to become part of The Land of The Free." If JD Vance thought that evoking The 25th Ammendment would suit his needs he would do so today but it doesn't. Trump is becoming more of a figurehead every hour.
[Post edited 6 Jan 15:48]
That could well be the case. I don’t think they’d manage without him though. None of them hold attention of the media like Trump and I can’t see the MAGA cult lasting beyond him. Once he’s gone, I can see it all come crashing down pretty quickly. Hopefully!
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:48 - Jan 6 by Swansea_Blue
That could well be the case. I don’t think they’d manage without him though. None of them hold attention of the media like Trump and I can’t see the MAGA cult lasting beyond him. Once he’s gone, I can see it all come crashing down pretty quickly. Hopefully!
He’s always been a political ‘trojan horse’ for the GOP.
He has just lasted much longer than anyone expected,
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:58 - Jan 6 with 954 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:45 - Jan 6 by Swansea_Blue
And it’s not as if the US can’t do pretty much what they want in Greenland already. Denmark has always turned a blind eye. They conveniently ignored it when the US wanted to store nuclear material there. Bases anre not a problem, nor naval patrols. Apparently the US can prospect for natural resources too (mining them might be a different issue, I’m not sure).
I struggle to unwrap the motivation. There’s a part that’s very obviously about Trump wanting to enrich himself and his inner circle and donors. But that’s overlaid by an almost childlike response to not being able to get what he wants. It’s very bizarre. He really is the smallest of men.
That's how I see it too. When you look at the various rationales for his incursions or interventions or lack thereof into world affairs it often seems hard to find one that makes any sense, even from the perspective of a tyrant.
It really does seem to be most like the biggest, loudest baby at the creche demanding to be given the latest toy his eyes have lit upon, before promptly throwing it aside, being sick and screaming for something else.
I don't even think it's really about enrichment, I think it's more just trapped wind.
Good work by Philogene...... GREAT WORK BY PHILOGENE!!!
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:58 - Jan 6 by NthQldITFC
That's how I see it too. When you look at the various rationales for his incursions or interventions or lack thereof into world affairs it often seems hard to find one that makes any sense, even from the perspective of a tyrant.
It really does seem to be most like the biggest, loudest baby at the creche demanding to be given the latest toy his eyes have lit upon, before promptly throwing it aside, being sick and screaming for something else.
I don't even think it's really about enrichment, I think it's more just trapped wind.
And the US used to have thousands of troops there, but voluntarily reduced it.
As you say, this feels more like childlike petulance, based on a lie about Russian and Chinese ships which NATO have confirmed just this week, simply don't exist where he says they do.
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:20 - Jan 6 with 905 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:38 - Jan 6 by Swansea_Blue
Fair point. It seems there is still plenty of pushback from some quarters in the states. A day doesn’t go by without some judge overruling him. Hopefully there are enough people to keep his worst excesses in check.
He just floated cancelling elections and then said this.
Saying the quiet things out loud again
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:21 - Jan 6 with 896 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:05 - Jan 6 by ElderGrizzly
And the US used to have thousands of troops there, but voluntarily reduced it.
As you say, this feels more like childlike petulance, based on a lie about Russian and Chinese ships which NATO have confirmed just this week, simply don't exist where he says they do.
Trumpy just an enormous egotist and narcissist who so desperate to have a legacy on death. Putting his name above landmark buildings etc and now wanting to be one of the few who have extended USAs territory. Wants his dirty name to go down in history but after death it will all be erased on the truthful release of the fiddler files…. If they don’t go missing of course. Scum.
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:40 - Jan 6 with 858 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:20 - Jan 6 by ElderGrizzly
He just floated cancelling elections and then said this.
Saying the quiet things out loud again
Is it the case that Tr*mp has no conscience whatsoever (yes of course it is) and effectively no self-regulation. So he'll just keep going more and more anti-Democratic, anti-American effectively.
He's had a lot of popular support that has gone along for the ride with him, but you've got to think (hope) that some of that support, at some point soon - if he's talking about cancelling democratic elections, ffs! - will think, "Hang on! This isn't what I believe in, this isn't America".
Good work by Philogene...... GREAT WORK BY PHILOGENE!!!
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:40 - Jan 6 by NthQldITFC
Is it the case that Tr*mp has no conscience whatsoever (yes of course it is) and effectively no self-regulation. So he'll just keep going more and more anti-Democratic, anti-American effectively.
He's had a lot of popular support that has gone along for the ride with him, but you've got to think (hope) that some of that support, at some point soon - if he's talking about cancelling democratic elections, ffs! - will think, "Hang on! This isn't what I believe in, this isn't America".
"you've got to think (hope) that some of that support, at some point soon - if he's talking about cancelling democratic elections, ffs! - will think, "Hang on! This isn't what I believe in, this isn't America"
That's certainly what should happen, but it feels like the entire GOP has been indoctrinated, and the Democrats, again, can't get their sh*t together.
My god America is desperate for a centrist party. They would sweep in unopposed
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:40 - Jan 6 by NthQldITFC
Is it the case that Tr*mp has no conscience whatsoever (yes of course it is) and effectively no self-regulation. So he'll just keep going more and more anti-Democratic, anti-American effectively.
He's had a lot of popular support that has gone along for the ride with him, but you've got to think (hope) that some of that support, at some point soon - if he's talking about cancelling democratic elections, ffs! - will think, "Hang on! This isn't what I believe in, this isn't America".
Hope you're right but I wouldn't hold your breath. The MAGA morons voted for him a second time, remember, even after the first 4-year sh*tshow and all the b*llocks he spouted, not to mention trying to overthrow a legitimate election.
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 18:10 - Jan 6 with 791 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 18:02 - Jan 6 by Cheltenham_Blue
"you've got to think (hope) that some of that support, at some point soon - if he's talking about cancelling democratic elections, ffs! - will think, "Hang on! This isn't what I believe in, this isn't America"
That's certainly what should happen, but it feels like the entire GOP has been indoctrinated, and the Democrats, again, can't get their sh*t together.
My god America is desperate for a centrist party. They would sweep in unopposed
Although as I posted elsewhere, less than half of the GOP think that the 'dominate the Western hemisphere' policy is right - depends on wording, I'm sure but that surprised me a little.
Good work by Philogene...... GREAT WORK BY PHILOGENE!!!
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 18:10 - Jan 6 by NthQldITFC
Although as I posted elsewhere, less than half of the GOP think that the 'dominate the Western hemisphere' policy is right - depends on wording, I'm sure but that surprised me a little.
One of Trump's promises was not to get involved in foreign wars. Venezuela and the threats over Greenland are isolating his base.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 17:40 - Jan 6 by NthQldITFC
Is it the case that Tr*mp has no conscience whatsoever (yes of course it is) and effectively no self-regulation. So he'll just keep going more and more anti-Democratic, anti-American effectively.
He's had a lot of popular support that has gone along for the ride with him, but you've got to think (hope) that some of that support, at some point soon - if he's talking about cancelling democratic elections, ffs! - will think, "Hang on! This isn't what I believe in, this isn't America".
He lost MGT recently and I think we all hope that might be the start of some starting to ‘wake up’
However, he’s packed his Government with people who would never be anywhere near their jobs without him. Self-protection at its best
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 18:50 - Jan 6 with 701 views
The US has a checkered history with regards to past activities in Greenland as this Al Jazeera report, over four years old, shows
Anyone who thinks Trumps interest is solely about defending USA needs to think again. It is more about oil & Gas off the west cost of Greenland; about access to rare earth minerals and anything that can be mined.
NATO may be the biggest military grouping but it isn’t the only one involving European militaries. Perhaps it is time for the Joint Expeditionary Force to carry out an exercise in Greenland. Only drawback it is lead by UK and can’t see Starmer doing anything for fear of upsetting the Trumpster.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 18:50 - Jan 6 by Pinewoodblue
The US has a checkered history with regards to past activities in Greenland as this Al Jazeera report, over four years old, shows
Anyone who thinks Trumps interest is solely about defending USA needs to think again. It is more about oil & Gas off the west cost of Greenland; about access to rare earth minerals and anything that can be mined.
NATO may be the biggest military grouping but it isn’t the only one involving European militaries. Perhaps it is time for the Joint Expeditionary Force to carry out an exercise in Greenland. Only drawback it is lead by UK and can’t see Starmer doing anything for fear of upsetting the Trumpster.
If US wants a greater military presence in Greenland, I doubt Denmark would stop that. However, if the aim is to exploit the resources how does that work? At what point do the US amass the technology needed and sail it in? At what point does Denmark militarily attempt to prevent that and to what degree does US militarily oppose that?
As for how much NATO needs US, I think something that is being missed is how much US also needs the West. Trump likes to talk as if the US is so great it needs no one, but it does need allies.
There are so many US assets and citizens very much intertwined with Europe and Europeans in the US. To go to war with Europe would be a disaster for everyone but even Trump must realise that Europe wouldn't just stand aside and let him annex Greenland. There are plenty of measures European nations could take. What would happen to US military bases, equipment and personnel embedded within now-enemy territory? What would happen to US assets in Europe (including many Premier League football clubs and others like ITFC)? What would happen to US citizens in Europe? Of course there are reciprocal costs as well, but that is why Trump isn't going to push it too far. It's simply sabre rattling (in my very inexpert opinion and certainly in my hopes).
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:06 - Jan 6 by WeWereZombies
The United States is not the only nation to fund NATO, European nations already put in U$4.6 billion per annum whilst in addition to having member nation defence spending upwards of 2.5%. The most likely cost to European nations in a full scale conflict would be in loss of life, and we saw where the majority of that cost was borne in the last two World Wars...
In 1982 (Falklands War period) GDP defence spend was 5%. By Gulf War 1 in 1991 it was down to 3.8%. It’s now down to just over 2% with an empty promise to bump it up to 2.5 by 2027. Whoopee. That’ll make Trump and Putin tremble.
We are just not serious about it. I get that in a £3.5tn economy that there will be priorities including party politics to satisfy, but defence just is not important to the politicians either now or to the ghastly criminals that preceded them.
We live in an age of might is right yet U.K. politicians are still thinking old world order, peace dividend and fobbing off responsibility for its defence on the US like a parasite despite knowing what Putin, Xi, and Trump are and will do. Crazy.
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 20:01 - Jan 6 with 572 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 18:50 - Jan 6 by Pinewoodblue
The US has a checkered history with regards to past activities in Greenland as this Al Jazeera report, over four years old, shows
Anyone who thinks Trumps interest is solely about defending USA needs to think again. It is more about oil & Gas off the west cost of Greenland; about access to rare earth minerals and anything that can be mined.
NATO may be the biggest military grouping but it isn’t the only one involving European militaries. Perhaps it is time for the Joint Expeditionary Force to carry out an exercise in Greenland. Only drawback it is lead by UK and can’t see Starmer doing anything for fear of upsetting the Trumpster.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 19:17 - Jan 6 by Nthsuffolkblue
If US wants a greater military presence in Greenland, I doubt Denmark would stop that. However, if the aim is to exploit the resources how does that work? At what point do the US amass the technology needed and sail it in? At what point does Denmark militarily attempt to prevent that and to what degree does US militarily oppose that?
As for how much NATO needs US, I think something that is being missed is how much US also needs the West. Trump likes to talk as if the US is so great it needs no one, but it does need allies.
There are so many US assets and citizens very much intertwined with Europe and Europeans in the US. To go to war with Europe would be a disaster for everyone but even Trump must realise that Europe wouldn't just stand aside and let him annex Greenland. There are plenty of measures European nations could take. What would happen to US military bases, equipment and personnel embedded within now-enemy territory? What would happen to US assets in Europe (including many Premier League football clubs and others like ITFC)? What would happen to US citizens in Europe? Of course there are reciprocal costs as well, but that is why Trump isn't going to push it too far. It's simply sabre rattling (in my very inexpert opinion and certainly in my hopes).
There are two Russian threats to US, missiles fired direct from Russia and missiles fired from submarines anywhere in the Atlantic.
US couldn’t monitor the Greenland - Iceland -UK gap routes for Russian subs without the support they receive from European partners.
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 16:17 - Jan 6 by WeWereZombies
There has never been a Secretary-General of NATO from the United States, the idea that it is an extension of the United States military is well off kilter.
[Post edited 6 Jan 16:56]
From an operations p.o.v the Supreme Allied Commander Europe, head of NATO's Allied Command Operations has always been an American so the US still has plenty of clout within NATO.
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 22:24 - Jan 6 with 472 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 15:22 - Jan 6 by NthQldITFC
What right does the USA have to assert control over Hawaii? What right does the USA have to assert control over Alaska? What is the basis of their territorial claims? What is their basis of having Hawaii and Alaska as states of the USA?
Imperial Russia sold Alaska to the US as it was surplus to requirements as few Russian settled there. Straightforward enough cash transaction. 10 thousand fur traders and 50 thousand indigenous people were never going to have a say in it. Hawaii was a more dirty affair when the US muscled in and overthrew the local monarchy , but the US wanting control of the Pacific with interests in Philippines etc needed Hawaii as as a half way staging post. Strategically the US needed it and were never going worry about the rights of an indigenous population.
[Post edited 6 Jan 22:34]
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"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 22:42 - Jan 6 with 450 views
"Trump aide says no-one would fight US over Greenland" on 14:03 - Jan 6 by DJR
There is a contradiction at the heart of the supposed reason (security) for acquiring Greenland, and that is that Trump obviously doesn't consider Russia to be a military threat to the US given his approach in relation to Putin and Ukraine.
And it's a bit fanciful to think that Greenland lies within the Chinese sphere of influence.
In any event, if security were an issue, the 1951 agreement between Denmark and the US would enable the US to strengthen its presences in Greenland.
As it is, according to a recent Danish article, 150 US service members are stationed at its main base in Greenland, after the US significantly reduced its presence from 6000 personnel during the Cold War.
[Post edited 6 Jan 14:06]
Given the expectation that the outer fringes of the Arctic will be ice free one day which will allow open up navigation for trade purposes and future potential oil/gas extraction, I think the US want to firm up their influence there in response to Russia's interest and maritime and naval investment there. taking over Greenland would conveniently serve that purpose.
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