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Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:49 - May 17 by Ftnfwest
Var came to the right decision, the ref didn’t
Might be me being wrong so apologies, but didn't they give the ref an option of looking at it again, rather than VAR themselves telling him it was handball?
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:49 - May 17 by Ftnfwest
Var came to the right decision, the ref didn’t
True but the result is that the wrong decision was still reached and it took time out of the game to come to it.
Scrap VAR and let the referees make the mistakes in real time. VAR doesn't make any improvement to the decision-making overall, wastes time and spoils fans' enjoyment of the moment.
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:51 - May 17 by SitfcB
Get rid of it ffs.
It isn't actually VAR fault but the ref who watches that back and somehow thinks that is accidental. Beyond shocking that. If VAR wasn't there he probably gives that as a goal anyway so actually VAR has made no difference here it is the officiating that is so very very poor.
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:50 - May 17 by FrimleyBlue
Might be me being wrong so apologies, but didn't they give the ref an option of looking at it again, rather than VAR themselves telling him it was handball?
Not sure VAR can do that. If Mbeumo scored I think factually they can give handball. As he didn't score and Cunha did it then becomes subjective as to whether the handball is deliberate or not.
The ref got this woefully wrong.
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Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:57 - May 17 with 946 views
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:54 - May 17 by berkstractorboy
Not sure VAR can do that. If Mbeumo scored I think factually they can give handball. As he didn't score and Cunha did it then becomes subjective as to whether the handball is deliberate or not.
The ref got this woefully wrong.
Yes, if the goalscorer handles the ball it is a factual decision which doesn't require the onfield ref to view the screen to disallow it.
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Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:57 - May 17 with 933 views
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:53 - May 17 by berkstractorboy
It isn't actually VAR fault but the ref who watches that back and somehow thinks that is accidental. Beyond shocking that. If VAR wasn't there he probably gives that as a goal anyway so actually VAR has made no difference here it is the officiating that is so very very poor.
Referees make mistakes. VAR officials make mistakes. Referees who view VAR reviews make mistakes.
What is the point of VAR? Because whatever the point is meant to be, it isn't serving that purpose. Further, it is ruining the game. Scrap it.
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:50 - May 17 by FrimleyBlue
Might be me being wrong so apologies, but didn't they give the ref an option of looking at it again, rather than VAR themselves telling him it was handball?
Yes effectively but with the recommendation being handball. Ultimately he has hand balled and gained an advantage which is blatantly clear.
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Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 14:03 - May 17 with 811 views
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:57 - May 17 by Nthsuffolkblue
Referees make mistakes. VAR officials make mistakes. Referees who view VAR reviews make mistakes.
What is the point of VAR? Because whatever the point is meant to be, it isn't serving that purpose. Further, it is ruining the game. Scrap it.
Absolute rubbish every week they get things wrong. Glad they don't do crime watch a white Scandinavian 6ft man would be mistaken for A black 5ft 2 women.
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Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 14:06 - May 17 with 771 views
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 14:03 - May 17 by cressi
Absolute rubbish every week they get things wrong. Glad they don't do crime watch a white Scandinavian 6ft man would be mistaken for A black 5ft 2 women.
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:57 - May 17 by Nthsuffolkblue
Referees make mistakes. VAR officials make mistakes. Referees who view VAR reviews make mistakes.
What is the point of VAR? Because whatever the point is meant to be, it isn't serving that purpose. Further, it is ruining the game. Scrap it.
Looking forward to the Prem are we ...
Apart from loadsadosh and more media coverage for those of us living far from Suffolk, I'm not particularly (tho will probably change my mind if we make a good start & manage to stay up!).
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 14:49 - May 17 by Ryorry
Looking forward to the Prem are we ...
Apart from loadsadosh and more media coverage for those of us living far from Suffolk, I'm not particularly (tho will probably change my mind if we make a good start & manage to stay up!).
I am one who wants us to be competing at the highest level and the standard of footballers we will have playing for us as well as against us is going to be better.
But I don't look forward to VAR nor the inevitable fact we will be losing more games than we win.
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:53 - May 17 by Nthsuffolkblue
True but the result is that the wrong decision was still reached and it took time out of the game to come to it.
Scrap VAR and let the referees make the mistakes in real time. VAR doesn't make any improvement to the decision-making overall, wastes time and spoils fans' enjoyment of the moment.
VAR is more referees making more wrong decisions and being involved in altering the game.
More people doing more things wrong.
Scrap it apart from Red card reviews and offsides IMHO
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 15:45 - May 17 by MVBlue
VAR is more referees making more wrong decisions and being involved in altering the game.
More people doing more things wrong.
Scrap it apart from Red card reviews and offsides IMHO
Even the offsides, I would say only use it where it is so clear that they don't have to draw lines and it is a clear and obvious error.
If you cannot decide the assistant got it wrong immediately without drawing the lines, let it stay with the on-field decision. I am not convinced the lines are any more accurate - not least because I am not convinced they always freeze the frame at the precise moment they should do!
"VAR gets it wrong as much as refs do" - is patently not true. The problem with VAR is the delay and the uncertainty around goals. Goals = football. They're its USP and what make it the best, most popular sport in the world. You can't f#ck around with goals. If you're going to make them less certain, and start reducing goal joy, you damn sight better do so judiciously and with good reason. Right now, with the current implementation of VAR, anything goes. When it comes to goals, everything is reviewed, and everything is too much.
The solution isn't to scrap VAR and go back to Chelsea vs Ipswich 1975 nonsense: it's to implement it in a way that recognises that referring **everything** is an unacceptable compromise of the enjoyment of a goal in football. I'm not going to restate my case for limited captain challenges again here, but see eg:
VAR is a disgrace. (n/t) by grow_our_own10 May 22:05 While being on-balance a VAR advocate, I do get the criticism that it compromises goal joy. Everything being reviewed is too much. You're never quite sure if a goal has been scored.
Limited captain challenges is the solution. One total or one per half. Ball in net and no challenge signal from captain = goal. Simple. Everyone can see the captain on the pitch, so it's clear. The players know whether there's been an injustice without having to watch a replay, and captain is closer to the ref to quickly raise a challenge than manager. No back-and-forth to the bench, waiting for manager to watch his own replay on a tablet causing further delay.
Right now football is played by 22 professional cheats. Diving used to be criticised by the British as something only continental Europeans did, now we do it as much as anyone. I'd dive too in the current rules. Diving, complaining to the ref, and getting into his head that he's biased pays. You're more likely to get favourable decisions and win. Now imagine a world where a diver, who knows he's dived, asks his captain to challenge. Captain challenge is rejected bc it was a dive. Diver feels an idiot because he has been an idiot. Team has lost a precious challenge. In reality, they won't appeal, and won't dive in the first place especially if they know oppo captain has all-important challenge remaining. Quantity of cheating will reduce massively. Football is improved.
Side-beneift: teams are rewarded for having at least one player with a brain: the captain. Reputation of footballers being thick is reduced. Right now captains' formal responsibilities don't go much beyond calling a coin toss. Players become more central in the process instead of decisions exclusively by faceless bureaucrats sitting in an office somewhere.
[Post edited 17 May 16:30]
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Having VAR is embarassing on 16:35 - May 17 with 510 views
Having VAR is embarassing on 16:25 - May 17 by grow_our_own
"VAR gets it wrong as much as refs do" - is patently not true. The problem with VAR is the delay and the uncertainty around goals. Goals = football. They're its USP and what make it the best, most popular sport in the world. You can't f#ck around with goals. If you're going to make them less certain, and start reducing goal joy, you damn sight better do so judiciously and with good reason. Right now, with the current implementation of VAR, anything goes. When it comes to goals, everything is reviewed, and everything is too much.
The solution isn't to scrap VAR and go back to Chelsea vs Ipswich 1975 nonsense: it's to implement it in a way that recognises that referring **everything** is an unacceptable compromise of the enjoyment of a goal in football. I'm not going to restate my case for limited captain challenges again here, but see eg:
VAR is a disgrace. (n/t) by grow_our_own10 May 22:05 While being on-balance a VAR advocate, I do get the criticism that it compromises goal joy. Everything being reviewed is too much. You're never quite sure if a goal has been scored.
Limited captain challenges is the solution. One total or one per half. Ball in net and no challenge signal from captain = goal. Simple. Everyone can see the captain on the pitch, so it's clear. The players know whether there's been an injustice without having to watch a replay, and captain is closer to the ref to quickly raise a challenge than manager. No back-and-forth to the bench, waiting for manager to watch his own replay on a tablet causing further delay.
Right now football is played by 22 professional cheats. Diving used to be criticised by the British as something only continental Europeans did, now we do it as much as anyone. I'd dive too in the current rules. Diving, complaining to the ref, and getting into his head that he's biased pays. You're more likely to get favourable decisions and win. Now imagine a world where a diver, who knows he's dived, asks his captain to challenge. Captain challenge is rejected bc it was a dive. Diver feels an idiot because he has been an idiot. Team has lost a precious challenge. In reality, they won't appeal, and won't dive in the first place especially if they know oppo captain has all-important challenge remaining. Quantity of cheating will reduce massively. Football is improved.
Side-beneift: teams are rewarded for having at least one player with a brain: the captain. Reputation of footballers being thick is reduced. Right now captains' formal responsibilities don't go much beyond calling a coin toss. Players become more central in the process instead of decisions exclusively by faceless bureaucrats sitting in an office somewhere.
[Post edited 17 May 16:30]
Thing is, how much did not having VAR ruin football?
Sure it caused conversations in pubs etc after the game, managers moaned etc etc
But imo whilst VAR most of the time gets things correct, it's still ruining the the spectacle of the sport.
Having VAR is embarassing on 16:35 - May 17 by FrimleyBlue
Thing is, how much did not having VAR ruin football?
Sure it caused conversations in pubs etc after the game, managers moaned etc etc
But imo whilst VAR most of the time gets things correct, it's still ruining the the spectacle of the sport.
"ruining the the spectacle of the sport" - I wouldn't go as far as "ruin", but it definitely compromises the spectacle. IMO not to the extent that it warrants scrapping VAR completely and return to the days of outrageous dives, hand of god, and ghost goals, but definitely needs to be used more judiciously. The players know when there's been an injustice without having to watch 15 replays. Let them (via captains) make the initial call whether to invoke it.
[Post edited 17 May 17:02]
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Having VAR is embarassing on 16:46 - May 17 with 482 views
Having VAR is embarassing on 16:45 - May 17 by grow_our_own
"ruining the the spectacle of the sport" - I wouldn't go as far as "ruin", but it definitely compromises the spectacle. IMO not to the extent that it warrants scrapping VAR completely and return to the days of outrageous dives, hand of god, and ghost goals, but definitely needs to be used more judiciously. The players know when there's been an injustice without having to watch 15 replays. Let them (via captains) make the initial call whether to invoke it.
[Post edited 17 May 17:02]
I personally feel it does ruin it, i know for me when im watching it, anytime a goal is scored, i'm waiting to see what VAR might have seen before i think ooo goal.
Var embarrassing again (n/t) on 13:53 - May 17 by Nthsuffolkblue
True but the result is that the wrong decision was still reached and it took time out of the game to come to it.
Scrap VAR and let the referees make the mistakes in real time. VAR doesn't make any improvement to the decision-making overall, wastes time and spoils fans' enjoyment of the moment.
It’s increased correct decisions quite significantly apparently, from about 82% accuracy before to about 96% now. Whether all the time delays are worth that ~14% increase in accuracy is another matter of course. But it definitely ‘works’. As long as the only metric of success is increased accuracy.
Having VAR is embarassing on 16:46 - May 17 by FrimleyBlue
I personally feel it does ruin it, i know for me when im watching it, anytime a goal is scored, i'm waiting to see what VAR might have seen before i think ooo goal.
With limited captain challenges you'll always know instantly. No whistle + no captain signal = goal.
[Post edited 17 May 17:05]
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Having VAR is embarassing on 17:07 - May 17 with 449 views
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