| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? 14:30 - Nov 28 with 7577 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
Just to confirm, I do think all animals should live in humane conditions, and should be killed in the least painful or traumatic way possible. However...
Reading the earlier thread got me thinking, what happens in an idealistic vegan world? What happens if we all became strict vegans?
We wouldnt eat meat, dairy, eggs, or even wear wool or any other animal byproducts.
No product = No animal. Cows, sheep, pigs etc will not be kept as pets after all.
So in a vegan world, no more cows, sheep, chickens, pigs etc etc, extrapolate that for many more animals.
No more lambs jumping in the fields, no more cows chewing the cud. These animals wont have the opportunity to enjoy a simple life.
And as for countryside management, the lovely green fields will be overgrown.
Surely a vegan world in theory deprives billions of future animals the opportunity of a life?
They are a dangerous bunch, Attenborough needs to forget about plastics and concentrate on vegans!! ;-)
Discuss.... |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:32 - Nov 28 with 2779 views | BrixtonBlue |
Do we need these threads every day, deliberately designed to wind Callis up? Haven't you got anything better to do? |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:33 - Nov 28 with 2771 views | Kieran_Knows |
Here we go again.
10 pager incoming. |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:35 - Nov 28 with 2763 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:32 - Nov 28 by BrixtonBlue |
Do we need these threads every day, deliberately designed to wind Callis up? Haven't you got anything better to do? |
Dont get me wrong.
Its not a wind up. It was a genuine question / discussion point. Does that ideology lead to the extinction of many types of animal?
I've no idea who may or may not be vegans on this forum, so certainly not aiming it at anyone.
Maybe I could tone down the language. | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:36 - Nov 28 with 2764 views | Clapham_Junction |
If we all became vegan, millions of hectares of land would no longer be needed for farming and could be rewilded, which would allow billions of animals to thrive, including non-domesticated of farm animals. I'd guess that as part of the process, some farm animals would also be released into the wild and become natural populations like the Exmoor ponies. |  | | |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:38 - Nov 28 with 2747 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:36 - Nov 28 by Clapham_Junction |
If we all became vegan, millions of hectares of land would no longer be needed for farming and could be rewilded, which would allow billions of animals to thrive, including non-domesticated of farm animals. I'd guess that as part of the process, some farm animals would also be released into the wild and become natural populations like the Exmoor ponies. |
Interesting response, I hadn't thought of that potential outcome.
I'm not sure that theory would work in practice, but interesting point.
Although I would think a large proportion of those hectares would be needed to meet the increased demand of cereal and vegetable crops. [Post edited 28 Nov 2018 14:40]
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:40 - Nov 28 with 2731 views | Ryorry |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:36 - Nov 28 by Clapham_Junction |
If we all became vegan, millions of hectares of land would no longer be needed for farming and could be rewilded, which would allow billions of animals to thrive, including non-domesticated of farm animals. I'd guess that as part of the process, some farm animals would also be released into the wild and become natural populations like the Exmoor ponies. |
I believe that despite living a wild life, Exmoor ponies are actually owned by local farmers & looked after, I think theres an annual round-up for worming etc? |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:42 - Nov 28 with 2714 views | J2BLUE |
I'm not sure the chicken locked in a barn with 30,000 other chickens with barely enough room to move before being stunned, hung upside down and killed would be too concerned if it didn't get to live its simple life.
In fact, this whole 'denying them a life' argument is rather odd. Do we apply the same logic to animals bred for experimentation who are then killed when the experiment is over? I think they'd rather not live. |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:43 - Nov 28 with 2704 views | SpruceMoose |
I'd die of culinary misery. That is my only concern. |  |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 14:44 - Nov 28 with 2701 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:42 - Nov 28 by J2BLUE |
I'm not sure the chicken locked in a barn with 30,000 other chickens with barely enough room to move before being stunned, hung upside down and killed would be too concerned if it didn't get to live its simple life.
In fact, this whole 'denying them a life' argument is rather odd. Do we apply the same logic to animals bred for experimentation who are then killed when the experiment is over? I think they'd rather not live. |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:45 - Nov 28 with 2700 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:42 - Nov 28 by J2BLUE |
I'm not sure the chicken locked in a barn with 30,000 other chickens with barely enough room to move before being stunned, hung upside down and killed would be too concerned if it didn't get to live its simple life.
In fact, this whole 'denying them a life' argument is rather odd. Do we apply the same logic to animals bred for experimentation who are then killed when the experiment is over? I think they'd rather not live. |
Re your first paragraph... I fully agree, as per the first para in my original post.
I think your response relates more to treating animals humanely, which I fully agree with. ;-) | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:45 - Nov 28 with 2698 views | J2BLUE |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:38 - Nov 28 by Marshalls_Mullet |
Interesting response, I hadn't thought of that potential outcome.
I'm not sure that theory would work in practice, but interesting point.
Although I would think a large proportion of those hectares would be needed to meet the increased demand of cereal and vegetable crops. [Post edited 28 Nov 2018 14:40]
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Apparently the current level of crops could feed 15 billion people if we didn't have to feed the animals. That stat is from Conspiracy so might not be entirely accurate but you'd think it could comfortably feed the entire world including the people who currently go hungry. | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:46 - Nov 28 with 2688 views | SpruceMoose |
At this rate we are going to need two additional tabs for the forum to go with 'Football' and 'General'.
'Vegan Bickering' and 'Brexit Outrage'. | |
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"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:47 - Nov 28 with 2687 views | Ace_High1 |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:36 - Nov 28 by Clapham_Junction |
If we all became vegan, millions of hectares of land would no longer be needed for farming and could be rewilded, which would allow billions of animals to thrive, including non-domesticated of farm animals. I'd guess that as part of the process, some farm animals would also be released into the wild and become natural populations like the Exmoor ponies. |
Even better than that lets get rid of all green spaces and just build houses.
Save the animals and remove homelessness - hallelujah |  | | |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 with 2682 views | BlueBadger |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:43 - Nov 28 by SpruceMoose |
I'd die of culinary misery. That is my only concern. |
Alright Sprucers, in Red Dead Redemption I've just shot something called a 'legendary moose'. I hope you get better soon. |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 with 2681 views | Keno |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:33 - Nov 28 by Kieran_Knows |
Here we go again.
10 pager incoming. |
Dont think think it will have the legs for that
He probably needed to post it on a non match day
wasted opportunity |  |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 with 2680 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:45 - Nov 28 by J2BLUE |
Apparently the current level of crops could feed 15 billion people if we didn't have to feed the animals. That stat is from Conspiracy so might not be entirely accurate but you'd think it could comfortably feed the entire world including the people who currently go hungry. |
Interesting, although I'd want to see how that figure was arrived at. | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 with 2674 views | Clapham_Junction |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:38 - Nov 28 by Marshalls_Mullet |
Interesting response, I hadn't thought of that potential outcome.
I'm not sure that theory would work in practice, but interesting point.
Although I would think a large proportion of those hectares would be needed to meet the increased demand of cereal and vegetable crops. [Post edited 28 Nov 2018 14:40]
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With regards to your last point, the answer is almost certainly none. A huge amount of cereals are grown to feed to animals, which is a highly inefficient way of creating food. If anything, I would guess that society going 100% vegan would mean we probably need less arable land as well as none of the pasture. | | | |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:50 - Nov 28 with 2658 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:35 - Nov 28 by Marshalls_Mullet |
Dont get me wrong.
Its not a wind up. It was a genuine question / discussion point. Does that ideology lead to the extinction of many types of animal?
I've no idea who may or may not be vegans on this forum, so certainly not aiming it at anyone.
Maybe I could tone down the language. |
"Its not a wind up. It was a genuine question / discussion point."
Yeah right.
Exhibit A;
"They are a dangerous bunch, Attenborough needs to forget about plastics and concentrate on vegans!!" | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:50 - Nov 28 with 2656 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:47 - Nov 28 by Ace_High1 |
Even better than that lets get rid of all green spaces and just build houses.
Save the animals and remove homelessness - hallelujah |
...we are not short of green spaces.
I dont think veganism would remove the NIMBY. | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:51 - Nov 28 with 2652 views | SpruceMoose |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 by BlueBadger |
Alright Sprucers, in Red Dead Redemption I've just shot something called a 'legendary moose'. I hope you get better soon. |
I see you didn't have the nuts to get close and jam some dynamite up my behind, coward. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:52 - Nov 28 with 2640 views | SpruceMoose |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:50 - Nov 28 by BrixtonBlue |
"Its not a wind up. It was a genuine question / discussion point."
Yeah right.
Exhibit A;
"They are a dangerous bunch, Attenborough needs to forget about plastics and concentrate on vegans!!" |
This is some excellent White Knighting. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:56 - Nov 28 with 2615 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 by Clapham_Junction |
With regards to your last point, the answer is almost certainly none. A huge amount of cereals are grown to feed to animals, which is a highly inefficient way of creating food. If anything, I would guess that society going 100% vegan would mean we probably need less arable land as well as none of the pasture. |
Interesting.
Does leave a large question on countryside management. | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:56 - Nov 28 with 2613 views | Clapham_Junction |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:45 - Nov 28 by J2BLUE |
Apparently the current level of crops could feed 15 billion people if we didn't have to feed the animals. That stat is from Conspiracy so might not be entirely accurate but you'd think it could comfortably feed the entire world including the people who currently go hungry. |
It sounds about right. Here's a more reputable source (although from a few years ago) putting the % of global cereals fed to animals at 40%: http://news.cornell.edu/stories/1997/08/us-could-feed-800-million-people-grain-l
Also noteworthy in that article are the relative inefficiencies of protein conversion (54:1 for beef). | | | |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:57 - Nov 28 with 2611 views | Ryorry |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:48 - Nov 28 by Keno |
Dont think think it will have the legs for that
He probably needed to post it on a non match day
wasted opportunity |
On the bright side, the thread's 22 or 23 posts in, in 24 mins! Phil n Gav n Mark n the Hamsters must love vegan threads, and if they help to keep TWTD going, I reckon they're performing a useful social service! (deleted last thread excepted ...) | |
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| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:57 - Nov 28 with 2608 views | TIB |
| Vegans - The biggest threat to the future of animals? on 14:36 - Nov 28 by Clapham_Junction |
If we all became vegan, millions of hectares of land would no longer be needed for farming and could be rewilded, which would allow billions of animals to thrive, including non-domesticated of farm animals. I'd guess that as part of the process, some farm animals would also be released into the wild and become natural populations like the Exmoor ponies. |
A nice thought but I really can't see that being the outcome...more likely housing and other types of buildings. |  |
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