| Compare and contrast with Britain 12:34 - Apr 27 with 2512 views | factual_blue |
This is from a friend in NZ.
How is your lockdown going? We've had an extra 5 days at level 4 then we go to level 3 tomorrow. I've been going to work as normal as our place is classed as essential although there isn't much admin to do. It's been good to catch up on my work. [name removed] has been in a couple of days as his work place prepares to begin click and collect. Under level 3 businesses can open so long as they can keep the 2 metre distance from customers. We are down to less than 10 new cases a day. I think the death toll is up to around 14. They've all been elderly apart from 2 in their 60's but they had existing health problems. It seems the new cases are still related to overseas travel or to clusters from some rest homes. A dementia ward has been particularly hard hit. New arrivals are put in quarantine for 14 days. We had our Anzac Day on Saturday (like your armistice day). Very poignant this year. We were asked to stand at our gates in silence at dawn. We could hear the last post being played way off in the distance. Last year they 'monday-ised' Anzac Day so we get the Monday off work if the day falls in the weekend. I don't agree with that...but I'll take the day off today Lol. I've stayed away from the news a bit as some of the reporting has been getting me a bit riled up, but I think I'm ok now. How is the UK doing?
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 12:51 - Apr 27 with 1857 views | gordon |
One of the worst moments so far in the press conferences that I've seen was when Jonathan Van-Tam was asked why we are letting people coming in to the country freely.
He replied that, well, the problem is that people might not be displaying symptoms, so they might fly in to Heathrow just after catching the disease, and they don't have a fever yet so we don't detect that they have the disease, they drive home, and a couple of days later they're symptomatic and infecting people.
The journalist who asked the question (and presumably none of the other journalists) realised that this is precisely what quarantine periods address really effectively, and the answer was nonsensical.
It was (for me, anyway) a really, really profoundly dreadful moment - an 'expert' in a position of authority says something daft and ill-informed, and those whose job it is to hold authority to account nod along without the acuity to challenge.
Then when there is a 'process' question over a missed email or a Prime Minister off sick, those same journalists are rolling around like pigs in sh*t. |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 12:57 - Apr 27 with 1834 views | factual_blue |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 12:51 - Apr 27 by gordon |
One of the worst moments so far in the press conferences that I've seen was when Jonathan Van-Tam was asked why we are letting people coming in to the country freely.
He replied that, well, the problem is that people might not be displaying symptoms, so they might fly in to Heathrow just after catching the disease, and they don't have a fever yet so we don't detect that they have the disease, they drive home, and a couple of days later they're symptomatic and infecting people.
The journalist who asked the question (and presumably none of the other journalists) realised that this is precisely what quarantine periods address really effectively, and the answer was nonsensical.
It was (for me, anyway) a really, really profoundly dreadful moment - an 'expert' in a position of authority says something daft and ill-informed, and those whose job it is to hold authority to account nod along without the acuity to challenge.
Then when there is a 'process' question over a missed email or a Prime Minister off sick, those same journalists are rolling around like pigs in sh*t. |
I would suspect that he gave a 'feeble' answer rather than the correct one, which would be that 'the immigration policy is a political decision'. His job, as a Civil Servant is to advise on policy and process, and then to implement the Government's decision and promote government policy.
Dr Phil Hammond (writing as MD in Private Eye) says the only justification for the attitude towards people arriving in the country is that the Government is going for 'herd immunity' by the back door. | |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 13:03 - Apr 27 with 1808 views | gordon |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 12:57 - Apr 27 by factual_blue |
I would suspect that he gave a 'feeble' answer rather than the correct one, which would be that 'the immigration policy is a political decision'. His job, as a Civil Servant is to advise on policy and process, and then to implement the Government's decision and promote government policy.
Dr Phil Hammond (writing as MD in Private Eye) says the only justification for the attitude towards people arriving in the country is that the Government is going for 'herd immunity' by the back door. |
I think they're in a really tough situation now, where lots of the policies that they really have to implement now are a tacit acceptance that they got it wrong at the start.
The key moment will be when they get serology data back from the wider population - if as expected, it shows low penetration, they will have got the whole thing massively wrong. | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:32 - Apr 27 with 1705 views | WD19 |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 13:03 - Apr 27 by gordon |
I think they're in a really tough situation now, where lots of the policies that they really have to implement now are a tacit acceptance that they got it wrong at the start.
The key moment will be when they get serology data back from the wider population - if as expected, it shows low penetration, they will have got the whole thing massively wrong. |
I did an antibody test this morning. It was negative, despite me having convinced myself I had had it. Current govt thinking is that levels of having had it are 2-5% |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:37 - Apr 27 with 1691 views | Ace_High1 |
I have to say I am envious of how well NZ and Australia have managed this. They appear from the statistics to have done a great job and looks like domestically they will be open and out and about much sooner than we will.
International visitors is a whole other question but for their own people they have done a great job. Which when it comes to Australia is a surprise as I was over there in December and Morrison was making a mess of the response to the bush fires. |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:37 - Apr 27 with 1694 views | Ftnfwest |
with only 4% of the density of population and a tenth of the international visitors, how on earth do they do it? |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 16:23 - Apr 27 with 1579 views | gordon |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:37 - Apr 27 by Ftnfwest |
with only 4% of the density of population and a tenth of the international visitors, how on earth do they do it? |
It was within our gift to temporarily depress the numbers of international visitors to our country! | | | |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 16:46 - Apr 27 with 1530 views | eireblue |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:37 - Apr 27 by Ftnfwest |
with only 4% of the density of population and a tenth of the international visitors, how on earth do they do it? |
Did they lockdown, perhaps earlier during their outbreak, than other countries, despite having those demographics? |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 16:57 - Apr 27 with 1503 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 12:57 - Apr 27 by factual_blue |
I would suspect that he gave a 'feeble' answer rather than the correct one, which would be that 'the immigration policy is a political decision'. His job, as a Civil Servant is to advise on policy and process, and then to implement the Government's decision and promote government policy.
Dr Phil Hammond (writing as MD in Private Eye) says the only justification for the attitude towards people arriving in the country is that the Government is going for 'herd immunity' by the back door. |
Herd immunity by the back door? Sounds painful. |  |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 17:07 - Apr 27 with 1480 views | linhdi |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 16:23 - Apr 27 by gordon |
It was within our gift to temporarily depress the numbers of international visitors to our country! |
Funny how the one time we actually would have benefited from closing our borders, we utterly failed to do so. |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 17:14 - Apr 27 with 1460 views | StokieBlue |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:32 - Apr 27 by WD19 |
I did an antibody test this morning. It was negative, despite me having convinced myself I had had it. Current govt thinking is that levels of having had it are 2-5% |
Where did you get the test?
They don't seem to have a very good record at the moment.
2-5% doesn't sound impossible given the German study but it's awful if you think of the death rate and the fact we've all been locked away given such a small percentage would have had it.
SB |  |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 17:15 - Apr 27 with 1458 views | Ftnfwest |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 16:46 - Apr 27 by eireblue |
Did they lockdown, perhaps earlier during their outbreak, than other countries, despite having those demographics? |
Maybe, I’m just comparing and contrasting. When you’ve got 10-15 metropolitan boroughs with a third of the NZ population each minimum for a start, it’s a little bit more difficult to manage | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:09 - Apr 27 with 1390 views | eireblue |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 17:15 - Apr 27 by Ftnfwest |
Maybe, I’m just comparing and contrasting. When you’ve got 10-15 metropolitan boroughs with a third of the NZ population each minimum for a start, it’s a little bit more difficult to manage |
Which is a very good reason to plan early, get prepared, and lockdown quickly, otherwise you may end up with a sub-optimal outcome. You are making some very good points here. | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:27 - Apr 27 with 1361 views | Leaky |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 14:37 - Apr 27 by Ace_High1 |
I have to say I am envious of how well NZ and Australia have managed this. They appear from the statistics to have done a great job and looks like domestically they will be open and out and about much sooner than we will.
International visitors is a whole other question but for their own people they have done a great job. Which when it comes to Australia is a surprise as I was over there in December and Morrison was making a mess of the response to the bush fires. |
Its quite easy they do not have the density of population that UK have. In the UK you have a population that commutes from Doncaster, Bristol & all places between who want to work in London so they can live a 5/6 bedroom house. Just work out the population in London on a Sunday lunch time then compare to lunch time during the week. When they leave London what ever virus they have contracted is then spread to the rest of the country its not rocket science. |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:34 - Apr 27 with 1349 views | monytowbray |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:27 - Apr 27 by Leaky |
Its quite easy they do not have the density of population that UK have. In the UK you have a population that commutes from Doncaster, Bristol & all places between who want to work in London so they can live a 5/6 bedroom house. Just work out the population in London on a Sunday lunch time then compare to lunch time during the week. When they leave London what ever virus they have contracted is then spread to the rest of the country its not rocket science. |
So what you’re saying is based on our demographics we should have locked down sooner? |  |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:37 - Apr 27 with 1345 views | Pecker |
I read that in an Aussie accent. No idea why. |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:49 - Apr 27 with 1318 views | Leaky |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:34 - Apr 27 by monytowbray |
So what you’re saying is based on our demographics we should have locked down sooner? |
No not really, it would appear that lockdown behaviour over the last weekend would suggest its fraying at the edges.
Therefore locking down earlier could mean that "cabin fever " kicks in earlier, I think we may have got it right. I am suggesting that our way of life is contributing to the way Covid-19 is effecting the UK. Similar with New York ,Paris, Milan & Madrid. | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:34 - Apr 27 with 1265 views | monytowbray |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:49 - Apr 27 by Leaky |
No not really, it would appear that lockdown behaviour over the last weekend would suggest its fraying at the edges.
Therefore locking down earlier could mean that "cabin fever " kicks in earlier, I think we may have got it right. I am suggesting that our way of life is contributing to the way Covid-19 is effecting the UK. Similar with New York ,Paris, Milan & Madrid. |
If we locked down earlier we could be opening up by now. See you all in a fortnight. Or whatever it is now. | |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:39 - Apr 27 with 1259 views | eireblue |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 18:49 - Apr 27 by Leaky |
No not really, it would appear that lockdown behaviour over the last weekend would suggest its fraying at the edges.
Therefore locking down earlier could mean that "cabin fever " kicks in earlier, I think we may have got it right. I am suggesting that our way of life is contributing to the way Covid-19 is effecting the UK. Similar with New York ,Paris, Milan & Madrid. |
There is zero evidence for cabin fever kicking in at specific points in time.
There is evidence on exponential growth rates of infection for Covid 19. | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:50 - Apr 27 with 1232 views | Leaky |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:39 - Apr 27 by eireblue |
There is zero evidence for cabin fever kicking in at specific points in time.
There is evidence on exponential growth rates of infection for Covid 19. |
So the increase in car use over the weekend, as shown on the slide shown by the panel on the Downing St. press conference on Sunday doesn't exist. So I suggest your incorrect on your first point. | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:53 - Apr 27 with 1227 views | BloomBlue |
So we should have banned all immigration into the country, where have I heard that demand before? |  | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:55 - Apr 27 with 1222 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:34 - Apr 27 by monytowbray |
If we locked down earlier we could be opening up by now. See you all in a fortnight. Or whatever it is now. |
We locked down before NZ and Australia and we locked down one day after Germany. |  |
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| Compare and contrast with Britain on 20:00 - Apr 27 with 1213 views | longtimefan |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 19:39 - Apr 27 by eireblue |
There is zero evidence for cabin fever kicking in at specific points in time.
There is evidence on exponential growth rates of infection for Covid 19. |
Certainly not cabin fever, but there is a definite trend in the increased use of motor vehicles over the last three to four weeks shown on the first of the daily briefing slides.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attac | | | |
| Compare and contrast with Britain on 20:10 - Apr 27 with 1197 views | Leaky |
So the difference is ? People need space, you can only stay isolated for so long. I'm lucky I live in a rural area with a fair sized garden. I would hate to live in a high rise flat with 2 children. I can see why some people need to break free. | | | |
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