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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen 13:48 - Jan 12 with 4180 views

bluelagos

is essentially economic to protect trade routes, does that mean Liz and Kwazi should bunker down too?

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:50 - Jan 12 with 3411 views

NthQldITFC

Liz and Kwazi,
Hiding in the khazi,
K-I-S-S-I-N-G

...their arses goodbye!

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:52 - Jan 12 with 3410 views

Kievthegreat

I think the justification is that if you repeatedly fire missiles at civilian shipping and then at military vessels, beware of those on the receiving end coming back with bigger and better missiles (that can actually reach their target).

Also known as the F**k Around, Find Out (FAFO) principle.

Although I do still approve of Liz and Kami-kwasi being kept away from the general population for all our sakes.

[Post edited 12 Jan 13:53]

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:58 - Jan 12 with 3363 views

bluelagos

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:52 - Jan 12 by Kievthegreat

[Post edited 12 Jan 13:53]

Not sure the FAFO principle is one based in international law but I might well be wrong :-)

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:01 - Jan 12 with 3314 views

blueasfook

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:58 - Jan 12 by bluelagos
Not sure the FAFO principle is one based in international law but I might well be wrong :-)

If not, it should be!

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:01 - Jan 12 with 3317 views

Kievthegreat

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:58 - Jan 12 by bluelagos
Not sure the FAFO principle is one based in international law but I might well be wrong :-)

Sometimes it is expressed more on the lines of self defence, but the principle still holds and has for the millennia. If you attack me, I will clap back.

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:04 - Jan 12 with 3290 views

bluelagos

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:01 - Jan 12 by Kievthegreat
Sometimes it is expressed more on the lines of self defence, but the principle still holds and has for the millennia. If you attack me, I will clap back.

Fingers crossed it works then. Cos the risk of things escalating does seem a concern...

Time will tell I guess.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:23 - Jan 12 with 3224 views

Guthrum

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 13:58 - Jan 12 by bluelagos
Not sure the FAFO principle is one based in international law but I might well be wrong :-)

I'd say it is pretty much the foundation of all international law. Someone with a bigger stick making sure people don't upset the apple cart.

The problem comes when the perpetrator has a big stick of their own, or when the people in charge of the stick can't agree how to use it.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:40 - Jan 12 with 3157 views

Kievthegreat

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:04 - Jan 12 by bluelagos
Fingers crossed it works then. Cos the risk of things escalating does seem a concern... Time will tell I guess.

May not end up being a wise decision, but based on the actions of the Houthi, it's 100% justified.

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:42 - Jan 12 with 3146 views

Guthrum

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 14:04 - Jan 12 by bluelagos
Fingers crossed it works then. Cos the risk of things escalating does seem a concern... Time will tell I guess.

The only people who are likely to escalate on behalf of the Houthis are the Iranians. Would they want to go all-in just now (e.g. by closing the Straits of Hormuz)? Don't think that would suit their foreign policy or economic situation currently. That's not to say the Revolutionary Guard won't make threats, but that's likely all it will be.

Hezbollah aren't going to want to sacrifice themselves for the sake of the Yemenis.

The Houthis on their own have very limited resources to carry out an extended and more widespread anti-shipping campaign in the face of combined naval defence backed up with actions like last night. Unlike the previous long-running Saudi-backed campaign (which failed), the US-led group are not trying to destroy Houthi power, just stop them firing at important shipping lanes.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 15:12 - Jan 12 with 3076 views

SuperKieranMcKenna

Iran and their proxies have killed civilian shipping crews in previous attacks near Oman and Persian Gulf. Only the presence of the Royal Navy and other forces have prevented deaths at the hands of the Houthi’s in recent weeks.

Whilst our intervention in the region has been at best questionable in the past, I think keeping shipping crews safe from terrorist attacks is justifiable. We’ve probably not seen the last of the drone and missile attacks though, given the militants have been successfully hiding their hardware from Saudi air strikes in the last few years.

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 16:51 - Jan 12 with 2981 views

BlueBadger

I think that only applies to non-white people.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 17:08 - Jan 12 with 2959 views

GlasgowBlue

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 16:51 - Jan 12 by BlueBadger
I think that only applies to non-white people.

Well the last time I looked at a picture of Kwazi......

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 18:04 - Jan 12 with 2881 views

BlueBadger

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 17:08 - Jan 12 by GlasgowBlue
Well the last time I looked at a picture of Kwazi......

Yeah, that one's on me.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 20:17 - Jan 12 with 2766 views

Mercian

Absolutley justified. The Red Sea/Suez Canal is the most important waterway in the entire world and vital for trade. Without it all maritime trade between Europe and Asia would have to circumvate Africa making the journey a lot longer and a lot more expensive. I would not say my approval of Sunak has gone up but my dis-approval of him has gone down a little. He was perfectly justified in his action. He has done two good things this week. Whatever has the world come too?

[Post edited 12 Jan 20:18]

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 21:09 - Jan 12 with 2716 views

Swansea_Blue

I propose we fire Liz and Kwazi at them. Far more dangerous than a few missiles.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 21:13 - Jan 12 with 2686 views

Kievthegreat

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 21:09 - Jan 12 by Swansea_Blue
I propose we fire Liz and Kwazi at them. Far more dangerous than a few missiles.

Weapons of Mass Destruction are definitely against international law!

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 21:28 - Jan 12 with 2647 views

bluelagos

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 21:09 - Jan 12 by Swansea_Blue
I propose we fire Liz and Kwazi at them. Far more dangerous than a few missiles.

Finally a use for them. Go forth and spread your influence .

After the middle east we could send em to North Korea too.

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 22:43 - Jan 12 with 2577 views

Ryorry

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 20:17 - Jan 12 by Mercian

[Post edited 12 Jan 20:18]

Why do the UK always have to act as world police though? (along with the USA obvs). Where's the UN? Where's the Parliamentary debate, let alone agreement? Why so often Tory Govts.? (OK, I'll answer the last one - cos it's often a gift to them when they're struggling in the polls & a General Election is looming).

Not in my name (again).


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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 22:54 - Jan 12 with 2545 views

SuperKieranMcKenna

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 22:43 - Jan 12 by Ryorry
Why do the UK always have to act as world police though? (along with the USA obvs). Where's the UN? Where's the Parliamentary debate, let alone agreement? Why so often Tory Govts.? (OK, I'll answer the last one - cos it's often a gift to them when they're struggling in the polls & a General Election is looming). Not in my name (again).

Because humanitarian work aside the U.N. is a waste of space. The security council demanded an end to the Houthi attacks, which of course they simply ignored. If the security members put military action to a vote Russia would just veto it anyway.

They probably should have put it to parliament, but the indications are Labour would have backed it anyway. They are precision strikes on terrorist targets and their weapons, no indication of any civilian casualties. Yemen is in civil war with the Houthis controlling the capital and western coast - therefore any action against them would have to come externally. As I say these proxy groups have killed civilians before so it’s imperative they are stopped, or at least have their capabilities diminished.

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:09 - Jan 12 with 2514 views

Kievthegreat

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 22:43 - Jan 12 by Ryorry
Why do the UK always have to act as world police though? (along with the USA obvs). Where's the UN? Where's the Parliamentary debate, let alone agreement? Why so often Tory Govts.? (OK, I'll answer the last one - cos it's often a gift to them when they're struggling in the polls & a General Election is looming). Not in my name (again).

Seem to be straying into tinfoil territory. I doubt there will be any significant impact on polls.

So why has action been taken? There's a multinational assortment of military vessels escorting commercial vessels with countries across the spectrum from US/NATO to China. Those ships in addition to commercial shipping have been on the end of concerted attacks.

Attacking the terrorist group attempting to murder civilians while also threatening would seem to be a pretty easy call.

As for parliament? They should recall parliament so the government can update the house, but agreement is not necessary. Plus the fact Starmer was briefed in advance and has not criticised makes me believe there would be general agreement.

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:12 - Jan 12 with 2504 views

BanksterDebtSlave

Couldn't the ships just go the long way around?

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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:38 - Jan 12 with 2453 views

Ryorry

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 22:54 - Jan 12 by SuperKieranMcKenna

Good explainer, thanks 👍


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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:45 - Jan 12 with 2442 views

Ryorry

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:09 - Jan 12 by Kievthegreat

Re "no significant impact on polls" - I was a relatively young lass during the Falklands war; iirc it had a very significant impact indeed on how M. Thatcher fared.

And why don't France, Germany, other European countries join in with the USA strikes then - why does it always have to be the UK?

[Post edited 12 Jan 23:52]


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So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 00:06 - Jan 13 with 2404 views

SuperKieranMcKenna

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:45 - Jan 12 by Ryorry
Re "no significant impact on polls" - I was a relatively young lass during the Falklands war; iirc it had a very significant impact indeed on how M. Thatcher fared. And why don't France, Germany, other European countries join in with the USA strikes then - why does it always have to be the UK? [Post edited 12 Jan 23:52]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/01/12/france-refuse-sign-statement-s

Good explainer here on various European countries stances on the air strikes. Some directly backed the air strikes carried out by the US and UK. It’s worth pointing out most of these do not have the capability to project military power away from Europe (i.e small navies or no aircraft carriers) so logistically it would be impossible for them to be directly involved. As well as naval power (with guided missiles), the UK also has a base in Cyprus and its thought some of the aircraft involved may have flown from there.

France is probably the only other European power that could have carried out strikes but are working on mediation between Hamas and Israel and did not want to impact those talks (Hamas and the Houthi’s are both Iranian backed militants).

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 00:22 - Jan 13 with 2390 views

Kievthegreat

So given the justification made for bombing Yemen on 23:45 - Jan 12 by Ryorry
Re "no significant impact on polls" - I was a relatively young lass during the Falklands war; iirc it had a very significant impact indeed on how M. Thatcher fared. And why don't France, Germany, other European countries join in with the USA strikes then - why does it always have to be the UK? [Post edited 12 Jan 23:52]

Is there likely to be anywhere near the same boost? Doubtful. The action has been extremely limited and is hardly likely to develop past airstrikes. This isn't a war against a military dictatorships that was invading and subjugating British citizens*. It's limited airstrikes against an insurgent group. There won't be a victory parade to rally around and will likely fall down the news agenda like Syria and Libya did before.

As for "why don't France, Germany, other European countries join in", the strikes were also supported by Canada, Australia, Bahrain and (that famously not European country) the Netherlands. Also the 2 most significant interventions of recent times, Syria and Libya both involved France heavily. If anything France is more involved as "world police" when you consider their interventions in African civil wars amongst their former colonies.

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