| Am I in a minority? 11:29 - May 20 with 2192 views | homer_123 |
Is the whole Spygate 'that' much of a big deal?
I know there are rules now after the Leeds situation but, in the wider scheme of things, it's not like this is new.
Scouts, Coaches, Managers from opposition squads have always watched games and training at Clubs up and down the Country...nothing inherently new here.
It's all a bit of a farce really.
Anyways, might be just me on this one! |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 11:32 - May 20 with 1740 views | SamWhiteUK |
Break the rules, pay the price. F&ck them. If there's not going to be a punishment, might as well not have rules. |  | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 11:32 - May 20 with 1735 views | Guthrum |
That kind of spying is not really a big deal, except that there is this specific rule which they've broken, with the implication of gaining an advantage over others who've stuck to it. |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 11:33 - May 20 with 1729 views | TRUE_BLUE123 |
I cant say I care too much about it tbh, I find it funny more than anything.
That being said it is nice to see some accountability. Break the rules and you get punished, as it should be. |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 11:37 - May 20 with 1669 views | SaleAway |
I must admit, when Leeds got caught doing this, I was surprised that it was a thing, but given that EFL then specified specific limitations on what could be done, and what couldn't, it now has to be enforced, otherwise what's the point of the specific new rule. |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 11:48 - May 20 with 1575 views | franz_tyson |
I'm not convinced its a massive thing.... but then why does a team send out someone to spy? They must think it's gives them an advantage. I just wonder if it's an ego thing for a coach ie they believe they and their tactics are mostly responsible for a result. I still think it's mostly due to the player's being better than the opponents and the coach doing the simple thing of picking the right players and putting them into the right position and doing the basics right. And a jolly good inspirational speech now and again.
Maybe some of these bigger clubs have too many coaches and coaching staff and they have too much time on their hands to spend time down rabbit holes trying to get 0.1% advantage.
Serves them right for being daft. | | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 11:48 - May 20 with 1571 views | LandOfMickyStockwell |
There has to be a punishment for the rule breaking.
Observing is allowed, just not within 72hrs. No such rule in the Prem, so will Town 'spy'? Were they spied upon in 2024/25?
The "is it a big deal" is a question worth answering with respect the disadvantage Boro actually received. The EFL played the first leg knowing the allegations and Southampton's tacit confession. Boro played and lost over two legs. The sporting element of the playoffs satisfied. Kicking Soton out means Hull has no opponent. I'm sure TV spectacle / money plays a part in holding *A* final.
I feel Boro should have protested before the 1st leg asking for the clear 72hrs to prepare. There was time to rearrange the 1st leg after the 2nd and give Boro home advantage in the decider to boot. |  | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:00 - May 20 with 1509 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Am I in a minority? on 11:48 - May 20 by franz_tyson |
I'm not convinced its a massive thing.... but then why does a team send out someone to spy? They must think it's gives them an advantage. I just wonder if it's an ego thing for a coach ie they believe they and their tactics are mostly responsible for a result. I still think it's mostly due to the player's being better than the opponents and the coach doing the simple thing of picking the right players and putting them into the right position and doing the basics right. And a jolly good inspirational speech now and again.
Maybe some of these bigger clubs have too many coaches and coaching staff and they have too much time on their hands to spend time down rabbit holes trying to get 0.1% advantage.
Serves them right for being daft. |
A 0.1% advantage could be all you need though. Football really is a game of fine margins with huge financial rewards at the end of a season. You should be able to train in the knowledge that an opponent isn't listening to/watching your tactical discussions with covert audio visual equipment. I think back to 23/24 and us scoring from a few "off the training ground" set piece routines - Chaplin usually the one popping up in a different position to score. That one goal can be the difference between a point and 3 points. That 3 points can be the difference between promotion/no promotion and relegation or no relegation.
This is why Southampton deserve the book throwing at them. They have broken a rule and cheated. They have stuck two fingers up to the integrity of the competition and the EFL have a mess on their hands now that is impossible to clear up - especially if they have been doing this for all of Eckert's time there. | | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:09 - May 20 with 1453 views | dirtyboy |
If you're telling me they only spied on Oxford, us and Boro, I'm calling you a liar.
They only admitted those as they're the ones they didn't actually win so it downplays the impact.
I bet it's part of their DNA and 'what they do' and there's plenty they've done it to and why do it if there's nothing to be gained?
May seem harsh, but it's cheating and there's a rule (or two) against it. |  | | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 12:14 - May 20 with 1413 views | Ryorry |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:00 - May 20 by tractorboy1978 |
A 0.1% advantage could be all you need though. Football really is a game of fine margins with huge financial rewards at the end of a season. You should be able to train in the knowledge that an opponent isn't listening to/watching your tactical discussions with covert audio visual equipment. I think back to 23/24 and us scoring from a few "off the training ground" set piece routines - Chaplin usually the one popping up in a different position to score. That one goal can be the difference between a point and 3 points. That 3 points can be the difference between promotion/no promotion and relegation or no relegation.
This is why Southampton deserve the book throwing at them. They have broken a rule and cheated. They have stuck two fingers up to the integrity of the competition and the EFL have a mess on their hands now that is impossible to clear up - especially if they have been doing this for all of Eckert's time there. |
There also likely to be some advantage in knowing which players are fully fit, which are carrying a knock, and what stage returnees from injury are at - which obviously affects starting line-ups/benches and therefore with some clubs, potential formations and tactics.
Opposition coaches then have more of a clue when it comes to picking their own starters, benches, formation and tactics. |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 12:37 - May 20 with 1324 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
I know what you mean. But its simple, don't break the rules.
The EFL made it clear that its not acceptable with the Leeds case. |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 12:56 - May 20 with 1239 views | homer_123 |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:09 - May 20 by dirtyboy |
If you're telling me they only spied on Oxford, us and Boro, I'm calling you a liar.
They only admitted those as they're the ones they didn't actually win so it downplays the impact.
I bet it's part of their DNA and 'what they do' and there's plenty they've done it to and why do it if there's nothing to be gained?
May seem harsh, but it's cheating and there's a rule (or two) against it. |
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| Am I in a minority? on 12:57 - May 20 with 1232 views | homer_123 |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:37 - May 20 by Marshalls_Mullet |
I know what you mean. But its simple, don't break the rules.
The EFL made it clear that its not acceptable with the Leeds case. |
Yeah, get that entirely.
Just feels as if it's being blown out of proportion. | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:04 - May 20 with 1173 views | Basuco |
They broke the rules, they made attempts to hide their rule breaking, they knew they were breaking the rules but thought they would either not be caught or just have to pay a small fine. This now sets a precedent and sends a strong message to the entire EFL, flout the rules and you will be punished. Southampton have misjudged the EFL, as did I, never thought for one moment they would be expelled from the playoff final. Will they refund fans for the playoff semi game? Will sponsors decide they do not want to be associated with cheating? I feel they deserve to be expelled, but as many have said I really feel for the fans, not for the club. |  | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:06 - May 20 with 1163 views | Illinoisblue |
Would you feel that way if they’d beaten us to 2nd place? |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:07 - May 20 with 1141 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:57 - May 20 by homer_123 |
Yeah, get that entirely.
Just feels as if it's being blown out of proportion. |
I know what you mean, not sure what the alternative is though?!
A fine could just be seen as a promotion tax. | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 with 1105 views | tiptreeblue |
The fact that when they spied against us at Eastleigh, the person wore an Eastleigh shirt, in my eyes proving they knew they were breaking the law | | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 with 1101 views | JakeITFC |
I think it had to result in a sporting penalty and once it involved the playoffs it had to therefore have an impact on Southampton's performance in them (either giving Boro a result in the first game or kick Southampton out, both which achieve the same outcome).
The fact is that there is a rule in place means that an implied advantage of the team spying is tacit within the that law. If the powers that be decide that such a rule has to exist then I don't really see how Southampton have a leg to stand on. |  | | |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 with 1103 views | bartyg |
| Am I in a minority? on 12:56 - May 20 by homer_123 |
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Reckon you should make another thread about it so you truly get your message across. |  |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 with 1105 views | homer_123 |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:06 - May 20 by Illinoisblue |
Would you feel that way if they’d beaten us to 2nd place? |
I think my standpoint would be similar.
Teams watching each other is common place and yes, I understand the 72 hour rule. This is significantly more widespread than people realise.
There is no doubt every team scouts the opposition - I think we can agree on that, that isn't in question. I would also say that a vast majority do so within the 72 hrs. Knowingly or unknowingly. I'm about as positive as I can be on this (and I include Town as well).
This is one of those areas where the risk of getting caught is low (as evidenced by Soton themselves). Yes, Soton been caught at Boro but have admitted to other instances. No way, were these the only ones. Ergo, you could argue they were unlucky to get caught (or stupid). EDIT - I see Eckhardt has said he didn't know it broke the rules - therefore I am even more confident they were doing it for every match.
I think you can confidently extrapolate that most teams will be doing this to a more or less of a degree and inside the 72 hrs.
This is why I am a bit non-plussed about it and I don't think my views would massively change if we were on the receiving end. [Post edited 20 May 13:13]
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:14 - May 20 with 1086 views | homer_123 |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:07 - May 20 by Marshalls_Mullet |
I know what you mean, not sure what the alternative is though?!
A fine could just be seen as a promotion tax. |
Agreed. I'm not really arguing for the punishment to change as such (my take is Soton will be reinstated) just all feels a little OTT for something pretty common place.
Rules are rules, I get that though. | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:16 - May 20 with 1068 views | homer_123 |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 by bartyg |
Reckon you should make another thread about it so you truly get your message across. |
Is this not the place to share views and opinions on football matters? | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:17 - May 20 with 1048 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 by homer_123 |
I think my standpoint would be similar.
Teams watching each other is common place and yes, I understand the 72 hour rule. This is significantly more widespread than people realise.
There is no doubt every team scouts the opposition - I think we can agree on that, that isn't in question. I would also say that a vast majority do so within the 72 hrs. Knowingly or unknowingly. I'm about as positive as I can be on this (and I include Town as well).
This is one of those areas where the risk of getting caught is low (as evidenced by Soton themselves). Yes, Soton been caught at Boro but have admitted to other instances. No way, were these the only ones. Ergo, you could argue they were unlucky to get caught (or stupid). EDIT - I see Eckhardt has said he didn't know it broke the rules - therefore I am even more confident they were doing it for every match.
I think you can confidently extrapolate that most teams will be doing this to a more or less of a degree and inside the 72 hrs.
This is why I am a bit non-plussed about it and I don't think my views would massively change if we were on the receiving end. [Post edited 20 May 13:13]
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Are other teams sending a spy to opposition training grounds with high-tech audio visual equipment and filming sessions? News to me. [Post edited 20 May 13:17]
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:17 - May 20 with 1045 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:14 - May 20 by homer_123 |
Agreed. I'm not really arguing for the punishment to change as such (my take is Soton will be reinstated) just all feels a little OTT for something pretty common place.
Rules are rules, I get that though. |
I don't think breaking the 72 hour rule is common place.
I'm sure they regret it. | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:17 - May 20 with 1038 views | Illinoisblue |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:12 - May 20 by homer_123 |
I think my standpoint would be similar.
Teams watching each other is common place and yes, I understand the 72 hour rule. This is significantly more widespread than people realise.
There is no doubt every team scouts the opposition - I think we can agree on that, that isn't in question. I would also say that a vast majority do so within the 72 hrs. Knowingly or unknowingly. I'm about as positive as I can be on this (and I include Town as well).
This is one of those areas where the risk of getting caught is low (as evidenced by Soton themselves). Yes, Soton been caught at Boro but have admitted to other instances. No way, were these the only ones. Ergo, you could argue they were unlucky to get caught (or stupid). EDIT - I see Eckhardt has said he didn't know it broke the rules - therefore I am even more confident they were doing it for every match.
I think you can confidently extrapolate that most teams will be doing this to a more or less of a degree and inside the 72 hrs.
This is why I am a bit non-plussed about it and I don't think my views would massively change if we were on the receiving end. [Post edited 20 May 13:13]
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There’s a big difference between legitimate scouting and dodgy spying hiding behind trees and dressing up in other teams’ kits. You really think spying is widespread? | |
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| Am I in a minority? on 13:20 - May 20 with 955 views | homer_123 |
| Am I in a minority? on 13:17 - May 20 by Marshalls_Mullet |
I don't think breaking the 72 hour rule is common place.
I'm sure they regret it. |
I'm not so sure.
I suspect they regret getting caught as much as the act itself! | |
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