| Lets assume that there's no issue 19:48 - Jun 22 with 1805 views | Cheltenham_Blue |
No-one has had a change of heart, and O'Neil is appointed tomorrow morning.
The club appear to be past the point of the manager deciding fully the players who come into the building, but the club give him, or whoever it is, the final say so. I think I am right in saying that we are well down the line with a number of players, but we can't. (won't) finalise until the new manager is in post.
The truth is, in terms of the managers who are available, (and that we could get), we were, and still are in exceptionally slim pickings the ones we would perhaps want, have ruled themselves out as needing a break or recovery time following surgery; (Frank, Rosinior, Knutsen), others available would never be accepted in terms of their tactics, (Dyche); Others are unavailable owing to world cup commitments, (Barry, Poch).
If ever there was a moment for McKenna to step away, he picked the worst possible moment for us to be able to appoint a replacement with any confidence. You could argue that Ashton could have handled it better and acted immediately rather than sending McKenna away to think about his decision for another two weeks, and in that two weeks we could possibly have been more active in sounding out potential replacements who would have World Cup distraction.
But we are where we are. If its O'Neil, then at least we get moving on our targets, however there has been very little movement so far, (only 3 players signed to Premier League clubs), so we either wait, and potentially miss out on the players we have 'a long way down the line', or we go for O'Neil, start the process of upgrading the squad and then if it isn't working come December, then maybe the manager market is better then and we convince Frank to come in. |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 19:52 - Jun 22 with 1741 views | MK1 |
McKenna's health and Family was his priority, not who was available to replace him. Any new manager is a risk, so let's just give Gary O'Neil our full support and time to settle in. |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 19:54 - Jun 22 with 1712 views | WD19 |
I imagine they will (for a few reasons) want the shortest gap possible between the manager announcement and getting a couple of signings in the door, so it wouldn’t surprise me if they drag out the announcement a day or two whilst they pull their finger out on the recruitment side of things. |  | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 19:55 - Jun 22 with 1708 views | FrimleyBlue |
Im dissapointed that KM didnt speak up earlier and announced it after the parade.
Im also wondering are we financially restricted for who we could afford manager wise because we are still paying KMs incredibly high wage. |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:03 - Jun 22 with 1618 views | Wacko |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 19:55 - Jun 22 by FrimleyBlue |
Im dissapointed that KM didnt speak up earlier and announced it after the parade.
Im also wondering are we financially restricted for who we could afford manager wise because we are still paying KMs incredibly high wage. |
Why would we still be paying him? He resigned. Unless I missed something...? |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:05 - Jun 22 with 1583 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:03 - Jun 22 by Wacko |
Why would we still be paying him? He resigned. Unless I missed something...? |
If we allowed him to resign then we wouldnt be able to claim compensation should he get another job. Because we can makes it appear that we are paying him on leave | |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:06 - Jun 22 with 1575 views | MK1 |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 19:55 - Jun 22 by FrimleyBlue |
Im dissapointed that KM didnt speak up earlier and announced it after the parade.
Im also wondering are we financially restricted for who we could afford manager wise because we are still paying KMs incredibly high wage. |
You are over thinking things. McKenna told those who needed to know at the end of the season, it's been reported as so. Just let it go and get behind Gary O'Neil. | |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:08 - Jun 22 with 1546 views | Dubtractor |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:03 - Jun 22 by Wacko |
Why would we still be paying him? He resigned. Unless I missed something...? |
I've seen a few mention that he is effectively on full paid gardening leave, but that just seems inexplicable to me, can't see that being the case at all. |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:09 - Jun 22 with 1534 views | Bent_double |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:03 - Jun 22 by Wacko |
Why would we still be paying him? He resigned. Unless I missed something...? |
Depends on his notice period, maybe it's 12 months, in which case he still gets paid, but is effectively on gardening leave. |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:09 - Jun 22 with 1526 views | Chris_ITFC |
There’s obviously no change of heart. As with every transfer on here, people get impatient, and forget how long legal processes and contracts take. |  |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:09 - Jun 22 with 1514 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:06 - Jun 22 by MK1 |
You are over thinking things. McKenna told those who needed to know at the end of the season, it's been reported as so. Just let it go and get behind Gary O'Neil. |
Why you telling me to let it go. Im replying to the OP. Tell him first lol | |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:11 - Jun 22 with 1491 views | MK1 |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:09 - Jun 22 by FrimleyBlue |
Why you telling me to let it go. Im replying to the OP. Tell him first lol |
Good point well made. | |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:14 - Jun 22 with 1450 views | itfc2021 |
I think that's a bit TOO convenient if I'm honest.
The idea that McKenna leaving has somehow left us with no viable options feels like a stretch to me. Every club appointing a manager tells supporters the market is THIN and there aren't many candidates. Then six months later somebody appoints a bloke hardly anyone was talking about and suddenly he's the next big thing . It happens all the time.
I also think people are giving Ashton a bit of a FREE pass here. If McKenna was genuinely considering leaving for weeks, and if the club knew there was a realistic possibility of it happening, then surely contingency planning should have already been underway . That's literally part of the job and its what good operators do.
The bit I do agree with is that we're probably alot further down the line with recruitment than people realise. It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if alot of the groundwork is already done and they're simply waiting for the new manager to officially sign off on things . Thats probably the MOST likely explanation.
Where I disagree is the suggestion we should appoint O'Neil now and then maybe replace him in December if somebody better becomes available. That's not a STRATEGY , that's just crossing your fingers and hoping something turns up later. It feels backwards to me.
If the club genuinely believes O'Neil is the right man, then appoint him because he's the right man. If they don't, then waiting six months for Frank or somebody else is just delaying the same decision. Thats the bit that doesnt make much sense to me and it wouldnt exactly fill you with CONFIDENCE either.
The reality is every managerial appointment carries RISK. McKenna carried risk. O'Neil carries risk. Frank would carry risk. People talk about some of these names as though they're guaranteed success when football has a funny way of making smart people look silly . We've all seen that before.
I actually think the more INTERESTING question is how much influence the manager even has now. If we're moving towards a model where Ashton and recruitment are driving alot of the decisions, then perhaps the appointment matters slightly less than people think. Not less IMPORTANT obviously, but less than it did 15 or 20 years ago.
The other thing that gets overlooked is timing. If O'Neil comes in tomorrow and suddenly 4 or 5 targets start moving through the door, people will quickly forget all this noise. Football supporters are VERY results driven and always have been . Winning games tends to solve most arguements.
Ultimately if Ashton believes O'Neil is the best available candidate then he has to own that decision. What I don't buy is this idea that McKenna has somehow left us in an impossible position . Clubs bigger than Ipswich lose managers every summer and still manage to function. Thats not me being critical, its just REALITY.
We all loved what McKenna achieved here and he deserves HUGE credit for that. But if one manager leaving leaves the entire football club unable to make decisions, then thats probably an organisational problem rather than a managerial one . Theres a reason well-run clubs build structures that can survive people leaving.
And honestly , if the choice is spend another month waiting for some mythical PERFECT candiidate or get moving now with recruitment and pre-season planning, I'd probably choose the latter . Definately not ideal maybe..., but football clubs rarely get ideal situations anyway. | | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:15 - Jun 22 with 1433 views | BloomBlue |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:05 - Jun 22 by FrimleyBlue |
If we allowed him to resign then we wouldnt be able to claim compensation should he get another job. Because we can makes it appear that we are paying him on leave |
You can resign and not receive an income and still be covered by the contract - it happens a lot. So yes if we're not paying him and he moved to another club then we would still receive payment. |  | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:41 - Jun 22 with 1231 views | Dubtractor |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:15 - Jun 22 by BloomBlue |
You can resign and not receive an income and still be covered by the contract - it happens a lot. So yes if we're not paying him and he moved to another club then we would still receive payment. |
You can do pretty much anything you want as long as both parties agree to it in a contract. | |
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:45 - Jun 22 with 1165 views | J2BLUE |
Do you think Ashton just sat around twiddling his thumbs for a couple of weeks and didn't do anything until McKenna confirmed he was off?
Phil has said O'Neil was likely top of the list from the start. It's not like pre season has begun and we are now starting the process. It wouldn't surprise me if they are holding off on the announcement to coincide with a couple of signings just to sweeten it a bit. |  | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 22:27 - Jun 22 with 857 views | bsw72 |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:05 - Jun 22 by FrimleyBlue |
If we allowed him to resign then we wouldnt be able to claim compensation should he get another job. Because we can makes it appear that we are paying him on leave |
That’s nonsense, under current UK employment law, an employer is not legally required to pay you a salary during the post-termination non-compete period, the fact he resigned further weakens his legal position. |  | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 22:36 - Jun 22 with 815 views | bsw72 |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 20:09 - Jun 22 by Bent_double |
Depends on his notice period, maybe it's 12 months, in which case he still gets paid, but is effectively on gardening leave. |
I doubt there was any significant notice period in a 4 year contract extension. Fixed term sports contracts are structured very differently to standard employment terms and are much more built around performance and loyalty bonuses.
I’m pretty sure that the terms in KMs contract meant if a club came in for him while under contract they would have to pay the £8m compensation. As KMs contract was to summer 2028, I imagine there was already a 12 month non compete clause written into the terms in case of resignation. | | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 22:43 - Jun 22 with 768 views | Trequartista |
I'm not keen on O'Neil at all and I think lots of fans are not inspired by this appointment and will probably be on his back in a way they weren't with McKenna two years ago if results aren't forthcoming.
But for me although O'Neil is a downgrade, I'd still rather have O'Neil with a competitive squad than McKenna with an uncompetitive (2024/25) squad. No-one would have got that squad of mostly Championship stars safe from relegation, if we can "do a Sunderland" as far as recruitment is concerned, I will be backing the manager all the way to try and keep us up. [Post edited 22 Jun 22:43]
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| Lets assume that there's no issue on 23:24 - Jun 22 with 628 views | darkhorse28 |
Even Salford have appointed a global, elite manager, with a great, progressive style profile, who’s had more success than many of the managers linked with us.
SALFORD.
It’s Ashtons biggest role to ensure he has global reach, networks, and contingencies consisting of dozens and dozens of world class elite options, that depending on the variables of the situation, some of which would be available.
It should be a moving feast of names and conversations.
McKenna agreed to leave us TWO years ago.., and Ashton is on record as saying if we’d stayed in the EFL (probably due to the £5 million salary) McKenna would be gone!
Sadly. It looks every inch like the names mentioned were EFL candidates.., or that level.., these aren’t names that are elite and world class, which when you’re EPL two years out of three, you have the status and resources to attract.
I don’t mind GON.., but it is a failure of Ashton.., it’s bizarre we expect more. He’s 35 years in the game and never at this level, that’s for a good reason.
He isn’t at the level. And he’s out SO much energy in to making sure he’s the only football exec voice in the room…, he’s our ceiling.
And this appointment shows in real time what that ceiling looks like, as does the last two years recruitment when even a struggling Leeds and Sunderland have sailed past us, and our huge waste and inability to find quality and value in the market.
Ashton is now 100% where we are as a club.
I can’t see that a) changing or b) being even close to good enough.
As poor as McKenna likely was at recruitment too, he was a fantastic coach, and Ashton might well be exposed as being carried this last three years.
I don’t mind GON though, he’s better than many are giving him credit for, better than McKenna at this level; and that’s the reality of levels.
He won’t get the time McKenna would have or the support which will be a shame; so fingers crossed for a quick start. | | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 23:33 - Jun 22 with 615 views | peterleeblue |
My concern about this (and I could post this on any new mgr thread) is that I don't understand that we are working through who is available.
Assuming we have upped our game in player recruitment and we are now about to see some value signings from abroad can the same be said for our "oven Ready" pot of potential wannabe premiership managers from the continent in the mould of Regis le Bris.
It was Regis le who on his appointment but he has proved to be a total scholar of the game and a high level manager able to work with players up and down the levels. He has taken to the premier league like a duck to water. He cant be the only one out there.
O Neil is hardly outside the box and at best probably has an 18 month - 2 year shelf life. Needs must I suppose! |  | | |
| Lets assume that there's no issue on 23:37 - Jun 22 with 600 views | Hugoagogo_Reborn |
I think the Cobbolds would have done the same. It's hard to argue with that gentlemanly behavior, even if it has left us a bit up the creek with no paddle.
I'd rather we stuck to the principles that made this club as great as it is, than take a more ruthless approach.and just be some generic Champ/Prem yo-yo club with no soul.
Any good employee will leave a gaping hole when they decide to move on. At least we didn't have to sack a manager for poor performance. |  |
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