| Is democracy dying 13:04 - Jun 22 with 1143 views | nodge_blue |
The churn of PMs cannot be that they are all incompetent ,but maybe a reflection that the country is becoming almost impossible to govern with the amount of debt we have and therefore constrained spending, coupled with polarised politics and lack of true consensus.
On top of that politicians are perhaps becoming more ordinary people but less skilled or intellectual. And if we dont attract brilliant minds and brilliant leaders we shouldnt be surprised if we just keep muddling along.
But maybe the day comes when everyone is so apathetic about it that a Trump like figure takes advantage. We seem to have a conveyor belt of people saying the country is broken and i can fix it, only for them not to fix it and lose power within 2 years. Andy B next taxi on the rank. How much longer can this go on?
Maybe im mixing up two arguments with democracy dying and the country in the sh1te, but we know there is history with struggling countries and opportunists.
Today is quite depressing not because im a starmer fan but it feels like a waste of more years and just more rudderless steering of this country's future.
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| Is democracy dying on 14:36 - Jun 22 with 1009 views | Kropotkin123 |
No, we inflicted an economic issue on ourselves with Brexit. This churn is self-inflicted and not replicated everywhere.
It wouldn't be so bad if the middle classes hadn't and weren't continuing to get gutted out through neo-liberalism. This is the bigger issue, and why someone like Trump can come to power in the US, when they haven't had a Brexit type event.
Essentially, as different as they may seem, all the past few leaders are shuffling the same deck, arguing how to optimise a very small percentage of the economy with very little real difference in how to extract money from the economy.
We need to reverse some neo-liberal policies - Eg, meaningful taxation of corporations, that are are getting as big as countries. No two-tier pricing of goods to companies. Eg, Tesco's can't get milk 50p cheaper than an independent company.
If the middle and lower class continue to get excluded from the economy, a trump-like figure will come to power promising to fix things. But system issues have got us here and we need systemic solutions.
Sorry, bit rambling, hopefully the examples help make sense of it. [Post edited 22 Jun 14:38]
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| Is democracy dying on 14:51 - Jun 22 with 945 views | TwoKnightsInIpswich |
The health of British democracy is in a state of visible decline, marked not by a sudden coup, but by the gradual erosion of the unwritten norms and institutional checks that once guaranteed its stability. At the core of this decay is a profound collapse of public trust, driven by an electoral system that leaves a vast majority of voters feeling unrepresented and isolated from the levers of power. When the mechanisms of governance are perceived as a closed loop prioritizing partisan self-interest over the common good, the foundational social contract of a democracy begins to splinter. This systemic disillusionment has created a dangerous vacuum, shifting the political landscape from traditional, deliberative debate toward a fragmented state of hyper-polarization where institutional legitimacy is openly questioned.
This vulnerability is aggressively exploited by a populist political class that operates with a calculated disregard for traditional political ethics, using "bad faith" rhetoric to deliberately undermine expert institutions and public trust for short-term electoral gain. Rather than acting as a corrective force, parts of the British media have actively exacerbated this crisis; driven by commercial pressures that favor conflict and sensationalism, the press often replaces rigorous scrutiny with a superficial model of "both-sides" balance that fails to distinguish fact from engineered disinformation. By amplifying divisive grievances and failing to hold bad-faith actors strictly accountable, this fractured media ecosystem validates populist narratives instead of exposing them. The result is a dangerous spiral of distrust, where the breakdown of moral leadership and the erosion of journalistic gatekeeping leave the public adrift in a post-truth political culture, systematically starving UK democracy of the shared factual reality it requires to survive. |  |
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| Is democracy dying on 14:51 - Jun 22 with 943 views | nodge_blue |
| Is democracy dying on 14:36 - Jun 22 by Kropotkin123 |
No, we inflicted an economic issue on ourselves with Brexit. This churn is self-inflicted and not replicated everywhere.
It wouldn't be so bad if the middle classes hadn't and weren't continuing to get gutted out through neo-liberalism. This is the bigger issue, and why someone like Trump can come to power in the US, when they haven't had a Brexit type event.
Essentially, as different as they may seem, all the past few leaders are shuffling the same deck, arguing how to optimise a very small percentage of the economy with very little real difference in how to extract money from the economy.
We need to reverse some neo-liberal policies - Eg, meaningful taxation of corporations, that are are getting as big as countries. No two-tier pricing of goods to companies. Eg, Tesco's can't get milk 50p cheaper than an independent company.
If the middle and lower class continue to get excluded from the economy, a trump-like figure will come to power promising to fix things. But system issues have got us here and we need systemic solutions.
Sorry, bit rambling, hopefully the examples help make sense of it. [Post edited 22 Jun 14:38]
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I agree that Brexit is still a core issue. It has done economic damage and political damage. I don't think trying to tax American tech companies more would make a meaningful difference. And as we know Trump would just tax us in a vengeance measure.
I would have another EU referendum and scrap the pension triple lock to start. | |
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| Is democracy dying on 15:11 - Jun 22 with 897 views | nodge_blue |
| Is democracy dying on 14:51 - Jun 22 by TwoKnightsInIpswich |
The health of British democracy is in a state of visible decline, marked not by a sudden coup, but by the gradual erosion of the unwritten norms and institutional checks that once guaranteed its stability. At the core of this decay is a profound collapse of public trust, driven by an electoral system that leaves a vast majority of voters feeling unrepresented and isolated from the levers of power. When the mechanisms of governance are perceived as a closed loop prioritizing partisan self-interest over the common good, the foundational social contract of a democracy begins to splinter. This systemic disillusionment has created a dangerous vacuum, shifting the political landscape from traditional, deliberative debate toward a fragmented state of hyper-polarization where institutional legitimacy is openly questioned.
This vulnerability is aggressively exploited by a populist political class that operates with a calculated disregard for traditional political ethics, using "bad faith" rhetoric to deliberately undermine expert institutions and public trust for short-term electoral gain. Rather than acting as a corrective force, parts of the British media have actively exacerbated this crisis; driven by commercial pressures that favor conflict and sensationalism, the press often replaces rigorous scrutiny with a superficial model of "both-sides" balance that fails to distinguish fact from engineered disinformation. By amplifying divisive grievances and failing to hold bad-faith actors strictly accountable, this fractured media ecosystem validates populist narratives instead of exposing them. The result is a dangerous spiral of distrust, where the breakdown of moral leadership and the erosion of journalistic gatekeeping leave the public adrift in a post-truth political culture, systematically starving UK democracy of the shared factual reality it requires to survive. |
I think we belittle our politicans too quickly. Who in their right mind would love sports fans routinely singing that you are a w@nker. Or being a chancellor that is brought to tears.
We desperately need a period where things go well. | |
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| Is democracy dying on 15:13 - Jun 22 with 890 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Is democracy dying on 14:51 - Jun 22 by nodge_blue |
I agree that Brexit is still a core issue. It has done economic damage and political damage. I don't think trying to tax American tech companies more would make a meaningful difference. And as we know Trump would just tax us in a vengeance measure.
I would have another EU referendum and scrap the pension triple lock to start. |
Trump won't be there for ever, we can't make policy based on him for our long-term future.
We aren't taxing them more, they are getting taxed less, or not at all. We need to tax them at parity and stop giving them competitive advantages over small businesses. They already have the advantage of scale. It is unfair on small businesses to tax them at the highest rate, when big corporations aren't getting taxed.
It would make a meaningful difference over decades, just as it has over the decades since we allowed this changes. If it would make no difference, then Trump wouldn't care.
Facts demonstrate neo-liberalism has concentrated wealth in fewer and fewer people's and companies hands. It is a negative for society. | |
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| Is democracy dying on 16:03 - Jun 22 with 800 views | J2BLUE |
I feel Reform are inevitable.
Burnham is coming in with lots of fanfare that Starmer never has but it's setting him up for an even bigger fall.
Perhaps it's not the country that has broken but the system? We need PR. Sick of politicians putting the party first. Sick of them all telling us in that trained tone they have what we want. Funnily enough, it's never what the public at large actually want.
Some people may like their local MP but anyone in politics to do good won't get very far. |  | | |
| Is democracy dying on 16:35 - Jun 22 with 753 views | Meadowlark |
| Is democracy dying on 14:51 - Jun 22 by TwoKnightsInIpswich |
The health of British democracy is in a state of visible decline, marked not by a sudden coup, but by the gradual erosion of the unwritten norms and institutional checks that once guaranteed its stability. At the core of this decay is a profound collapse of public trust, driven by an electoral system that leaves a vast majority of voters feeling unrepresented and isolated from the levers of power. When the mechanisms of governance are perceived as a closed loop prioritizing partisan self-interest over the common good, the foundational social contract of a democracy begins to splinter. This systemic disillusionment has created a dangerous vacuum, shifting the political landscape from traditional, deliberative debate toward a fragmented state of hyper-polarization where institutional legitimacy is openly questioned.
This vulnerability is aggressively exploited by a populist political class that operates with a calculated disregard for traditional political ethics, using "bad faith" rhetoric to deliberately undermine expert institutions and public trust for short-term electoral gain. Rather than acting as a corrective force, parts of the British media have actively exacerbated this crisis; driven by commercial pressures that favor conflict and sensationalism, the press often replaces rigorous scrutiny with a superficial model of "both-sides" balance that fails to distinguish fact from engineered disinformation. By amplifying divisive grievances and failing to hold bad-faith actors strictly accountable, this fractured media ecosystem validates populist narratives instead of exposing them. The result is a dangerous spiral of distrust, where the breakdown of moral leadership and the erosion of journalistic gatekeeping leave the public adrift in a post-truth political culture, systematically starving UK democracy of the shared factual reality it requires to survive. |
You took the words right out of my mouth..... |  | | |
| Is democracy dying on 16:38 - Jun 22 with 736 views | chicoazul |
This is all only slightly abnormal? The average tenure of a PM is 4 years if you carve out thatcher Blair and the lettuce. It’s a bit unusual to have what will it be, 7 in ten years but not super weird. People need to stop blaming the electorate and accept that tenures like Blair are extreme outliers. |  |
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| Is democracy dying on 16:39 - Jun 22 with 742 views | MattinLondon |
Democracy isn’t dying but truth is on life-support. |  | | |
| Is democracy dying on 16:56 - Jun 22 with 715 views | bluelagos |
We live in s democracy?
News to me given FPTP has delivered PMs who got less than 50% of the popular vote as long as I can remember.
The voting system serves 2 parties' interests (and may soon serve Reform) and consistently gives us governments that the majority of the population have voted against.
And we were told that it was better than PR as it ensured stable governments. |  |
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| Is democracy dying on 17:25 - Jun 22 with 628 views | BlueBoots |
| Is democracy dying on 16:39 - Jun 22 by MattinLondon |
Democracy isn’t dying but truth is on life-support. |
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| Is democracy dying on 18:04 - Jun 22 with 569 views | Sarge |
What exactly did Keir Starmer do wrong to have led to this? He appears to actually be a decent person unlike his predecessors, he appears to have some principles unlike his predecessors, and as far as I’m aware he hasn’t deviated massively from the mandate he was elected with. Most of what I see is along the lines of ‘but he didn’t sMasH dEr bOaTs’ and frankly people like that who are completely unable to articulate their viewpoints aren’t worth listening to. So to have his own party turn so suddenly is quite a surprise.
I guess it’s mostly about pandering to public opinion, although the thread on defence spending made me realise that actually most of the public don’t know anywhere near as much as they think they do. And if it is about pandering to the public I’d have preferred Labour wait until closer to the election before making a change so any Burnham bounce would fend off Reform |  | | |
| Is democracy dying on 18:31 - Jun 22 with 533 views | EdwardStone |
| Is democracy dying on 14:51 - Jun 22 by TwoKnightsInIpswich |
The health of British democracy is in a state of visible decline, marked not by a sudden coup, but by the gradual erosion of the unwritten norms and institutional checks that once guaranteed its stability. At the core of this decay is a profound collapse of public trust, driven by an electoral system that leaves a vast majority of voters feeling unrepresented and isolated from the levers of power. When the mechanisms of governance are perceived as a closed loop prioritizing partisan self-interest over the common good, the foundational social contract of a democracy begins to splinter. This systemic disillusionment has created a dangerous vacuum, shifting the political landscape from traditional, deliberative debate toward a fragmented state of hyper-polarization where institutional legitimacy is openly questioned.
This vulnerability is aggressively exploited by a populist political class that operates with a calculated disregard for traditional political ethics, using "bad faith" rhetoric to deliberately undermine expert institutions and public trust for short-term electoral gain. Rather than acting as a corrective force, parts of the British media have actively exacerbated this crisis; driven by commercial pressures that favor conflict and sensationalism, the press often replaces rigorous scrutiny with a superficial model of "both-sides" balance that fails to distinguish fact from engineered disinformation. By amplifying divisive grievances and failing to hold bad-faith actors strictly accountable, this fractured media ecosystem validates populist narratives instead of exposing them. The result is a dangerous spiral of distrust, where the breakdown of moral leadership and the erosion of journalistic gatekeeping leave the public adrift in a post-truth political culture, systematically starving UK democracy of the shared factual reality it requires to survive. |
I can think of a few things that could re set UK politics that Burnham could start first thing tomorrow
STV P R voting as a matter of priority
New Parliamentary building with a horseshoe shaped chamber , maye Birmingham, Manchester or somewhere else non-London..... with the Righties on the right, middle in the middle and Lefties on the left
Firing squad at dawn for news-makers/reporters such as Mason C and Kuenssberg L [Post edited 22 Jun 18:44]
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| Is democracy dying on 19:27 - Jun 22 with 465 views | naa |
There's also the fact that politics now is judged even more on personality than previously. People just didn't like Starmer, no idea why, he's always seemed an honourable person to me.
Two years to fix 14 years of decline with Brexit in place was impossible but the world doesn't wait anymore. It's a shame.
Most people who didn't like him couldn't tell you a single policy he'd put in place except possibly the short lived heating support payment and the farm tax (which I doubt they could explain to you in any way).
It's the world we live in. I can't see Burnham being given much more time but I hope he will be. | | | |
| Is democracy dying on 21:43 - Jun 22 with 391 views | armchaircritic59 |
You could say the country is " Running towards adversity " but not in a good way. Mind you it has been for a long while, so nothing new there. We need a completely new way of running the country and ditch political parties. Not going to happen of course, so I'll continue watching them destroying everything until I get out, one way or another! |  | | |
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